Word. And... is this going to stop you and I from scouting our own talent and using them like I have for 15 years? There's hardly any girls I got from an LA agent on www.POVPorn.com - out of 225 of them. I do use agents, don't get me wrong, but I will not behave according to anyone's rules that came after me. I built this fucking ship with the longshormen of the industry 15 years ago. Myspace aint gonna obey any union rules and if you can spell a porn star's name then you can find her or him and book them on myspace anyways.

I find talent - shoot them, and then send them home or send them to an agent. If they don't want girls from me then I'll just make more money shooting them myself and sending them home, or working them around to the Non-Union players. Anyone want any talent you can't find all over the internet on everyone's website??? I think I'll start a REBEL agency for all the producers not in the UNION. Who wants a fresh one?

Read my post - I am available. Wanna fresh one? Check out www.POVPorn.com - see anyone you like?

with a union there could be set prices...

business ethics = hard working driven person who manages and grows his business 24/7.

For once we agree 100% on something.

This is my price list:

$$$ Between me and the girl - Hand Job or Blow Job depending on how bad I need the content or update and how slow the industry is. This price has nothing to do with how pretty the girl is - that should have already been established when you looked in the mirror and decided to be a model. You better be pretty and do a good job or the shoot is over and you get on the bus home.

$$$ Between me & the girl - Full Sex Scene. See above for terms and conditions. Don't like it? I didn't even ask you so why negotiate with me. I don't care how great you think you are or actually are - I can go into ANY STRIP CLUB IN THE USA AND FIND A HOTTER GIRL TO DO IT FOR THIS PRICE. Take it or leave it I shoot every single day.

$100-$200 more for anal.

I was going to put my price above but that's none of anyone's business - the point is... that it's my money and my fucking price and I shoot every single day. PERIOD. Don't like it? Go tell your union agent to FORCE PEOPLE TO HIRE YOU!!! But, I'm no-one's bitch boy.

So what Mike. Everyone in SFV talks.
They can plan all they want... THey pull somthing and no one will work with them...

Why do you worry about such little things these days?

apparently you need to look up the word "ethics" in the dictionary

try wikipedia

50% of the people here today wont be around by next summer... :2 cents:

yup. you can't play a game of football on a field with a bunch of ruffian juveniles that throw sand in your face to win the game. since i started to throw sand back in my own little ways away from the boards, the field got a little more level.

in this case it appears to be unity for evil and control though. infighting would be the end of any alliances that could actually get put together would be my guess.

doesn't affect us down south..

Alien...who's worried brudda. Im havin fun with this one. Nothing better than finding out about a top secret conspiracy to rule the porn world and splashing it all over the SFV.

Word is Derek and Joel are both in major damage control mode right now LOL

Fun times indeed maybe I will get another death threat....I have quite the collection LOL

Mad love for ya JP, but that is actually work ethics you describe. No argument there. He is driven. But business ethics, cant say. If he follows through, then he has no ethics.

If they want to unionize then unionize the talent and act as union stewards.

Sinclair

Now thats a true statement by the Mike South I am used to reading:)

gotta love craigslist and onemodelplace

I can't see all of the agents coming together and working on a project where they try and bait producers into hiring models "behind their back".

Most of the girls who work for agencies have more loyalty to the producers, as we are the ones who pay them, than their own agents.

They are seriously underestimating the "me first" attitude of the models, there are very few models that would be willing to do this.

If any model tried to set up a producer I can assure you that the word would get out quick and she would be the one who ends up getting "black balled."

That's what I've been talking about since day 1 in this business.

But that will never happen and there's plenty of fish in the sea.

You go see a movie because Tom Hanks is in it... you buy a porno because you wonder what it would be like to fuck that girl you've never seen before.

Rare exceptions to this rule enough to warent a union of the top 2% of the talent. By the time they realize thier value - and they realize that they are the cream on top - they start thier own website or production company. Welcome to free Enterprise! That's why I've told every single girl I've ever discovered to start her own site. Most choose the $$$ and try a site later when they are already too over-exposed. Can't say I didn't try.

A whore union?

:1orglaugh

You can't herd cats my friend. They have no care nor consideration of the present let alone the future post consequence.

:2 cents::)

i am a pornographer, not a writer.
but anyone with a halfbrain (or better) knew what i meant...

'When I use a word,' Humpty Dumpty said, in a rather scornful tone,' it means just what I choose it to mean, neither more nor less.'

'The question is,' said Alice, 'whether you can make words mean so many different things.'

'The question is,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'which is to be master - that's all.'

Now that is a point taken. :thumbsup

If you think you cant heard cats -- think again. Its the talent agents that actually do. How do you guys think talent gets to the set on time, with the right clothing and with their IDs ?? Its usually an agent calling and reminding her. Obviously there are a fair percentage of performers that are responsible and do not need the babysitting approach, but without agents, there would be a lot of wasted time and money.

Hate them, love them. It doesnt matter. They are upstream from all the producers. Without talent, nothing gets done in this industry.

Hi Mike!!!!!!!!!!!!!

First class idea :thumbsup

Not sure how many models you have hired from agencies, but my experience over some 38 years is different. I've had models from agencies 3 hours late ( and the agency gets pissed because I send them back un-used ) I've had girls no show, turn up un-prepared . I've had them turn up with absolutely zero information about the shoot. Ive had them drive to the wrong address even though we supply detailed e-mails / maps and confirmation by phone.

Personally I like working with Derek, Type 9, Gold Star, Foxmodels. But I'm using less and less agency talent and more and more from scouts who know what models I need. I find I have less hassle this way and I get fresh faces before they saturate the market.

There's an 'only' missing from that sentence...

think this is at AVN now

Ya AVN just ran a story but obviously didn't credit me.

What they ran was a press release that the trade association put together today quickly to counter my story.

Be interesting to see where this will go from here...and to AVN...come on guys thats fucking lame. You didn't even run the real story

no way. your old best buddy "fish" wouldn't do something like that to you. there must be some kind of mistake.

Odds are slim to none and none is waaaay the fuck in the lead on anything like this ever happening.

yer a funny guy OP, anyone who really knows anything about avn knows Fish is no longer involved in the day to day operation.

that would be Dan Miller and like the avn of old they avoid anything that might make the industry look bad, particularly their advertisers.

I always say that it is the one transmitting a communication who have the responsibility to make sure the communication (that being written words, sound or visual) is properly understood by the receiver.

In this case it appears i used the wrong word, Sinclair hit it right on the nose.
I meant work ethics, obviously.

But i do want to add that everything is relative, and in this case if the measure is business ethics in the adult industry (affiliates included) then LA Direct and Derek ranks up there in the top 33%. But that may say more about the industry than about Derek...

reads like an act of war.

the only way for an Association to work is for it's members to follow the rules. I don't know about LA but over here they're all scumbags. And would stab each other in the back for a nickel.

God for you for making this public .. the shear anger of the non attending or non invited agencies should break this little group up fast enough

:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thumbsup:thum bsup:thumbsup

:thumbsup So fuckin right!

if they had the models welfare at heart they would start with that. a unionized talent would automatically regulate them and them only

Whats up ? Dinner soon ?

now that's funny :)

Anytime amigo.

Good times.

I beg to differ about talent agents being "upstream" from producers. They need business and producers need talent and it's a symbiotic relationship. And in any case, I as a producer can largely get along without them to a great extent since I cast a lot of my own talent and work with a lot of individual people who aren't agents to refer talent to me.

I also work with a lot of agents and appreciate the convenience and have a good business relationship with many of them. But no one would be able to dictate terms of any kind to me, on scenes rates or anything else. Most of the the fresh talent has more loyalty to me as a producer quite frankly than their agents whom they often bounce between different ones several times. Especially since I may use a single model many times for multiple projects. Some of my favorite local models have become friends of mine and have filmed for me over two dozen times over the course of a year and in almost any case, they were happy to get whatever fair rates I set for them.

I doubt anything will come of this story anyway. The trend of ever escalating talent rates the last several years has reached its peak. I think that producers who actually have steady work going forward in time are going to gain in power relative to both the agencies and the talent as more companies cut back on filming or go out of business. Matter of fact I think that I have already seen this happening.

an interesting read Jim, the price of models as been artificially inflated for some time now.

'if everyone has an apple tree in the back yard why is the price of apples so high?'

wonder how it's gonna shake out..?

a client of mine thinks that all but the larger more established producers will be edgedout along with most of the agencies.. we're seeing it now with pay sites I think... the bigger players are buying up the 'small fish'