I would not gloat if I was on the left regarding this issue. It still has to get 60 votes in the Senate, they don't have the votes there. They would have to go with a nuclear option and that would make the Senate a war zone for many years.

I know polls are a snap shot in time, but for months now, the polls all say the American people don't want this at all. It's funny!, that no one on the left said anyone who was protesting against Bush's policies were paid to be there.

The left does not understand that they have lost the independents on this issuse. As many have said, if the Democrats try and ram this through. They are done as a party for years to come. The independents are finally seeing the the Democrats are truly for big government.

This does not let the Republicans off the hook here, they fucked! up big time. I would wait to see how this plays, you have to remember, that most blue dog Democrats won in Red states. They push this through they are done.

Who ever is on the left is not paying attention, this will be a revist of the 1994 elections. You have wokeing up the middle of the country and if you continue this, you will never get them back.

Whoever thinks that you can compete against an entity (the government), who can print their own money and not worry about making a profit, is smoking some good shit!.

If you are talking to me, I appreciate his candor.

If you don't know your own limitations, a lot is lost in life. :2 cents:

When people consistently get material facts wrong, then claim to predict the future, well everyone is an expert on the Internet.

:1orglaugh

No actually it doesn't need 60 votes, it only needs 51 using budget reconcilation.
Facts are pesky things.

Ok, lets go with the proposed healthcare plan then when it does not work we will see who was right. Balls in your court. Push it through and live with the consequences. Either way I am covered and have no worries for me.

NO wrong again, it needs 60 votes in the Senate. If they only get 51, any piece of the passed legislation can be voted out in another bill. This is why they need to get 60, man there is a reason they always want the 60 and this is the reason for it.

OH!, and I forgot that 60 votes in needed to stop debate. Which means this or any other bill can still be fillibustered. Remember you guy's can't count on Kennedy or even Byrd. Byrd is actually against this process of high jacking the Senate.

So you really only have if you add up all the real votes in the Senate, about 54 votes. You won't get any southern Democrats to vote for this. To be honest I am for things to be passed by 51 votes, but you must not remember that Bush had more than 51 Republican Senators, but still would not pull the trigger on the nuclear option.

Describe the "proposed plan," you must know something that President Obama and Congress do not.

There is no single "plan."

There are a number of different proposals in the House and Senate, but nothing has come out of Bacus' committee in the Senate yet.

As a result your scenario breaks down at several different points, if the "ball's in my court" it's only due to "service fault."

If you want to go ahead and dig through the proposed plans and see who is covered and who is not you will see that all of the proposals do not cover every US citizen and legal resident alien. All I am saying is make sure everyone is covered or rework what we have and make it affordable. Either is fine with me but having a system that leaves people without healthcare is not acceptable.

It's all Bush's fault

I was reading about this today. If the republicans go through with this it could define the direction of their party for many years. If this happens and the democrats pass a health care reform bill and the republicans do nothing but say they are against it, and it turns out to be decent, it will further crush the republican party. If they are right and the bill passes and it sucks they will use it as fodder and firepower to go after Obama in 2012. It will be interesting to see if they have the spine to actually go through with this over the coming weeks.

i almost forgot why I dont hardly ever post in here, 99.5% democratic no matter how idiotic the idea we are talking about is. You're preaching to the choir guys n gals, that's all you're doing :-) I for one will enjoy the demise and the coming irrelevance of this horrible President.

a Nazi (because I question!)

oh yea i burn flags too

It is just the reversal of the party in power. When the republicans had the power they had an attitude that came off like anyone who didn't agree with them was not a patriot and hated the country. Now they are out and the democrats are in and if you don't agree with them you are a Nazi or a fascist.

Still, to me, anyone who assumes that Obama is done and that he will be a terrible president and that they know how the story ends 8 months into a 4 year term comes off as arrogant and ignorant.

HAHA This should get good

You have the Obama talking points down very well. Nice work. :1orglaugh

Hey now!

Lotsa ifs

Chuck Grassley embodies the reason why democrats cant get mired down trying to appease the republicans on this. He was in the inner circle claiming to fight for things his party wanted, then during the recess he spouts off about pulling the plug on grandma, and how he's had his finger in the dike and he's proud of slowing down the process. He wants to be able to claim this as an honor down the line if what he hopes will happen, happens. Namely, nothing being done. Who needs support from a jerkoff like that? It's just a game to some of these lifers.

He and his ilk simply do not want change at all. Too many fucking corporate lobbyists buying our freedoms away! The Dems will have to go it alone on this one... assuming they can unite among themselves.

The GOP fat cats promote the unfounded fear that the govt will get between people and their healthcare, but right now it is the insurance companies that are already between the people and their healthcare, and as long as they have no competition nothing will change, and healthcare costs will just continue to skyrocket.

Well written and spot on!

Actually last time I went to the DMV I was in and out in 15 mins the time before that took about 25 mins and it was very croweded. This is in Daytona Beach, not some little hick town.

Six days a week my socialist US govt paid mailman shows up at my mail box and delivers my mail. Hell most of the time it's within the same 30 mins time window each day. He does this at an amazingly cheap price of 42 cents a letter I think it is.

USP/Fedex on the other hand I never know when they will show up and typically waiting hours for a package. These guys are also more expensive than shipping packages via the US post office.

Last time I went to the emergency room in a "private for profit hospital" I had been in a car wreck. There was literally less than 5 people in the waiting room and it took them over 45 mins just to do the first check up to make sure I had to neck injuries.

They slapped me in a neck brace that they charge $125 for and sent me back to the waiting room for another 2 and a half hours. I finally get called in to only wait another hour and a half to have the doc check me in for less than 5 mins before he told me I was ok and gave me a prescription.

This cost about 1200 bucks..

The last time I saw a private Doc. It took 30 days to arrange my appointment using Athena heath insurance. When I got there, the insurance company gave the doc's office the wrong client ID number and they refused to see me because they wouldn't get paid.

This required me to make another appointment which took another 30 days. Second attempt had the same problem as the first. The nurse told me the HMO's use this tactic as a way to get out of paying and to hope the patient gives up.

Luckily after 30 mins on the phone we got it sorted and they saw me. The doctor gives me two prescriptions that I needed. When I went to get the prescriptions filled the HMO would only pay for one of them and denied me the more expensive medication that the "Doc" thought I needed.

Yes please by all means give me the evil socialist govt health care system, because it damn sure can't be any worse that what we already "PAY" for.

Not to mention Medicare and VA hospitals are govt run and pretty damn good in this country. You only saw trhe problems with the VA hospital that hit the news a year or so back "AFTER" Dick Chaney let private contractors run it..

Finally, someone answers these assholes the way they deserve. With open contempt for their idiocy, yet with civility and to applause.

Oh fucking shit that is awesome.. I'd vote for him... :1orglaugh

Barney Frank is a funny GAY JEWISH REP from Boston. He did great in that town hall :)

For sure. It is a big risk, big reward situation for both parties. If they decide not to work together and a bill passes with no republican support chances are one party will be a big winner and one will be a big loser. It could take a couple of years to see which is which.

Or longer.

Yay Obama, gimme gimme gimme...

Does anyone see a good reason why Congress and the Senate are exempt from the health bill?

I think if within 2-3 years we don't see that the bill is out and out bad it will greatly benefit the democrats (at least in the short term). If within a few years it is obvious that the bill sucks it will benefit the republicans. But you are correct it could take 10+ years before we know the true long term effect of the bill.

Oh trust me if it goes in favor of the Dems and the Republicans bash it.. it still wont stop the Republicans from claiming it was because of them we all got health care. They have the tendency to make shit up, for what ever sounds good at the moment.

FYI you just described both parties...

I would assume if it ends up going sour the democrats will blame the republicans for sabotaging the whole thing.

hahah.. the DMV runs so "smoothly" in Washington State that they had to contract it out to private companies.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Cash4Clunkers is going pretty well, this health care thing should be a breeze. :thumbsup

Obama is a pussy, he'll back down to Republicans.

Over the past 10 years, I've been in and out of the DMV (now the MVC in Joisey) within in hour for anything I've ever needed in NJ and NY. :2 cents:

forgot : bankrupted war ...