Amazing what bad information does especially with video attached of something not even related to what your talking about. Everyone knows the video, doesnt matter that it was not h1n1 flu shots that caused it though.

i will walk backwards to the clinic to get one. i don't care.

Right now the swine flu is killing a few dozen people daily.

Meanwhile, with regards to the ruined young lady... chances of the vaccine having anything to do with that are slim to none. Ten days between vaccination and onset of the original symptoms rules out most possible reactions to materials in the vaccine.

The thing that makes me chuckle the most is people thinking the 1:1,000,000 chance of a bad reaction from the vaccine means it's not worth the risk COMPLETELY failing to realise that you've got a MUCH higher chance of permanent neurological side effects from the flu... and I don't mean death.

Vaccine = Something trying to help you that has freak rare side effects that happen any time you do anything to the body. I don't want to scare you.. but even just puncturing your skin with an empty sterile syringe is going to have some rare mortality rate if millions of people did it.

Flu = Something indisputedly actively trying to kill you AND has "side effects" such as neuologic complications including seizures, meningitis, encephalitis, encephalopathy, Reye syndrome, paresis, movement disorders, cranial nerve palsies, aphasia, blah blah blah.

You idiots, every time you have a cold you run the risk of only being able to walk backwards or developing some rare condition or whatever.
Most dangerous part of getting a flu shot is probably hanging around all the wheezing sick fucks in the waiting room. Maybe we've lost the ability to weigh risk mathematically.. or quantitively..or we're so caught up in stupid belief systems we prefer "fate" even if your chances are much much worse.. More likely, people like being ignorant.

not yet, im still here...

Hell no. A worldwide vaccin for a questionable flu (its just like any other flu its not more severe or anything) and people voluntarely get a nice shot of that shit in their body, trusting the huge corporations and governments who are behind it: thats the last thing you should do! People are fucking stupid.

People don't trust what they don't understand. They don't understand basic math, therefore they don't trust statistics :2 cents:

I'm buying a shotgun...

How dare you call anyone fucking stupid after posting "its just like any other flu"?
You are aware it has species jumped right? Notice how that places it into the more unique category of the flu. But ah never mind, I really do not care what others take or not take.

aha :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

Bump for more idiots with conspiracy theories to chime in.

a lot of people around me are getting sick, but only for 24-48 hours

does the swine flu last much longer than this?

ugh everyone i know is trying to talk me into taking it

I won't be getting it, my 2 kids have H1N1 now as it is, the boy is fine and he has asthma- he was taking the tamiflu and that made him so sick, throwing up and everything. The younger girl is still sick after 5 days but not as bad, now its just runny nose. There is over 33% of kids absent from school right now, by the time the vaccine is offered here (nov 3rd) and takes 10 days after the needle to be affective, most people will probably be sick.

Smurfette

Thats the funny part about this whole thing. By the time everybody gets the shot, flu season will have peaked already.

Two members of my family who live in Canada have swine flu. Last I heard one of them was pretty sick with it and he also has underlying health issues so his family are super worried. Hope they're ok.

60 minutes special on the swine flu vaccine deaths...


http://www.personalgrowthcourses.net..._flu_vaccine_1

i admitted i wasn't 100% sure...

in any case, however, video or not, i will hold off for the time being. fair?

Really? Enlighten me. How would one go about weighing the risks? What data do we have? What information can we use to determine whether we should choose option A or option B. You can't weigh out the risks without data to work with lol

I have honestly NO fucking way of determining if I, as an individual, would have a stronger likelihood of dying from swine or the vaccine. How the fuck am I suppose to weight the risks?

It's called gut feeling. I will observe the 'weather', I will analyze the data as it comes, then I will make a "calculated" decision based on what information is released over the coming months. For now? I wait.

I don't think that's being ignorant.

...and last time I checked, basic math required variables or inputs to solve a formula...

http://www.phac-aspc.gc.ca/alert-ale...llance-eng.php

ummm, based on those stats, why would you even consider getting a shot ?

two of my cousins kids have now got the h1n1

one has taken tamiflu already i guess the other will soon

i think they will be ok

so? that doesnt make it more deadly than other flus. Alot of weak people die from other flus all the time and you dont hear shit from that, only the cases who allegedly have had swine flu. Its good old overhyped scare tactic news. Believe all you want and round yourself up with the other sheep but im not falling for it.

i heard on the news this morning that something like 51 new cases were confirmed in ottawa in the past 24 hours alone! this is getting scary. yeah sure, most people recover and are fine but you never know if you may be one of the unlucky ones or if you might spread it to someone with a compromised immune system and possibly cost them their life. i have to say i am rethinking the vaccine.

I don't buy into all the media hype. I could care less about me getting it. I need to know if I should get my daughter vaccinated.

My doctor recommends it, that's all I need to make my decision.

It's rather comforting to know that the 1976 vaccination problem is the worst you guys can come up with - since that must mean that vaccinations really are quite safe.

US deaths from the 1918 spanish flu: 500,000
US deaths from 57/58 asian flu: 65,000
US yearly deaths from seasonal flu: 35,000
US deaths from 68/69 HK flu: 32,000
US swine flu deaths so far this year: 1,500
US yearly deaths from choking on food: 744
US yearly deaths from accidental discharge of firearms: 700
US yearly deaths from peanut allergy: 100
US yearly deaths from contact with hot tap-water: 55
US yearly deaths from lightning: 50
US yearly deaths from being bitten or crushed by non-venomous reptiles: 31
US confirmed deaths from 1976 vaccine: 25

My prediction: hot tap-water is next on the list of evil conspiracies to fight.

I salute you. The gene pool needs to be cleaned a bit. Like you, I am concerned with long TERME implications.

Did I say it makes it more deadly? No I said it makes it different.
Did I say I support the vaccine for everyone, again no.

Call me sheep, whatever. At least I can fucking read and understand a simple fucking paragraph of English. Now take your pansy ass assumptions and proceed to shove them up your ass.

I do not care who takes it or does not take it. Unless you happen to be someone in the medical profession that I may run into - then yes I fucking care.
I primarily post in such threads to point out assorted fallacies from either side.

Then again I clearly remember many people spouting the very same shit when the AIDS virus was announced. Yes there have been way to many chicken little news stories. I just tell people to research stuff themselves and have a actual understanding of how such viruses work before mouthing off.

Apparently you did not watch the video. And 1500 deaths and I am going to risk injecting that shit into my body? lol And I would love to see where you pulled the 55 deaths a year from hot tap water number. Please give us your official reference on that one.

Btw you didn't mention how many were disabled due to the 76 vaccines, unless of course you are cool with being debilitated all of your life?

Also it is now claimed that over 300 have died from gbs that is directly related to getting the vaccine in 1976 and later. 4000 people total were disabled for life.


Why have the normal seasonal flu rates not diminished greatly?

For every 200,000 vaccinations you would save roughly 1 life due to the swine flu..

Whats the cost on 200,000 vaccinations? Roughly 5 million dollars.

The seasonal flu vaccine saves maybe 1% of people that would of died without it. 1%.

Lets give it 10% even. That would mean for every 200,000 vaccinations 20 people might live that would not of.

Governments total death prediction from swine flu is 75,000. How many people die a year from Cancer in the U.S ?

Around 500,000 closer to 600,000.

Kind of puts it in perspective.

So even at a 10% rate per 200,000 vaccines would you gamble your life, quality of life on a even 10 in 200,000 chance that it will do you any good?

You have a 40 times greater chance to be struck by lightning than the swine flu vaccine actually saving your life.

Do you smoke? 440,000 deaths per year attributed in the U.S. due to Smoking.

This is interesting..

http://bajiggity.com/swineflu.jpg

including ukraine it is not looking good ...

i mean http://www.google.com/search?q=ukraine+flu

1500 deaths, yes. And that number will rise as the epidemic spreads. It still won't be a very big risk for most people, but the risk of the flu is far, far greater than that of the vaccine.

But I would strongly advise against injecting the 1976 vaccine into your body, since medicine has moved on. I would also advise against getting a prosthetic hip from 30 years ago. Medicine advances, you know.

As for the deaths from hot tap water:
http://www.nsc.org/research/odds.aspx

Consider the fact that not all claims are actual proven cases, and that GBS has a full recovery rate of 70%-80% within a year, the flawed vaccine from 30 years ago still has a far lower risk than the current swine flu.

And the 1976 vaccine is not what people are getting now.

It is also claimed that the earth will end in 2012. Claims aren't facts, and looking at empirical data is far more useful than believing anything you want to believe:
http://jama.ama-assn.org/cgi/ijlink?...esid=110/2/105

Flu rates? Do you mean infection rates, complication rates, hospitalization rates, mortality rates?

Bullshit. The mortality rate is around 0.1%, or 1:1000 - comparable to a typical seasonal flu. Assuming a (really low) prevention rate of 50% in those vaccinated and a (low) infection rate of 10% among the entire population, that would yield one life saved for every 20k vaccinations. In reality however, the prevention rate is quite a bit higher, and the infection rate might well turn out to be a lot higher.

Medicine is expensive. Those who feel they aren't worth that much money should definitely avoid vaccinations.

You suck at statistics.

Puts what in perspective? This isn't a choice between dying from either cancer or from the flu.

Drunk driving kills fewer people than cancer, too. Doesn't make it a good idea.

Again, you suck at statistics.

Apart from that, you suck at gambling.

Vaccinations have a small risk of saving your life and a very, very small risk of causing you harm. The risk of saving your life, while small, is many times bigger than the risk of causing you harm.

Do you understand the concept of relative risk at all?

Nonsense. Which should be obvious if you consider the number of deaths from swine flu, the number of people among those that would have been saved by a vaccination, and the number of people that get struck by lightning.

Like I said, you suck at statistics.

Smoking is bad. Swine flu is far safer. Vaccinations are even safer than that. What's your point?

Do you even realize that your lines of reasoning contradict each other?

Swine flu is a small risk, vaccination is a far smaller risk that reduces the small risk from swine flu a great deal.

• It would be rational to consider the risks of both swine flu and vaccination too small to care about, and not get the shot.
  
• It would be rational to consider the risks of swine flu large enough to care about but not the risk of vaccination, and get the shot.
  
• It would be rational to consider both the risk of swine flu and the risk of vaccination large enough to care about, and get the shot.
  
• What is NOT rational is considering the risk of swine flu too small to care about and the risk of vaccination enough to care about.

Enjoy your irrationality :2 cents:

Link no longer valid. This page might be better...
http://www.squidoo.com/oddsdying
About half-way down the page in the "Fire & Heat" category

"(Chances of dying by) Contact with hot tap-water 1 in 88,335"

:1orglaugh i think you need a vacation, lately all your posts sound like this. Take some time off and calm down, serious suggestion. You can thank me later :thumbsup

Heh. What are the odds of the site being entirely revamped within hours after me posting the link?

Anyway, new data from the same source:
http://www.nsc.org/news_resources/in...of%20Dying.pdf

Apparently, 2006 was a safer year than 2000 when it comes to deaths from contact with hot tap water... just 32.

Nationmaster still has the old number, 55:
http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/mo...-hot-tap-water

too bad it didn't go to 745 a certain year .... :)

Don't forget who would have taken over...