interesting that you suggest Islam wouldn't exist without liberalism..

To be honest, the only time I have ever heard Christian church bells tolling to call people to church was in the movies.

In the real world they are mostly acting as a clock.

I guess my city is outside of the real world, then.



They have this stuff every day over here...

Why do you insist on building something in a country that doesn't want you? This is intolerance, as you only see the option of building minarets, regardless of the local population's opinions. As you claim you have the right to build them, they also have the right to live without them in their area ... And since it's their country, and not yours, why do you think your right should prevail? You can always go in another country or in a Muslim country to pray ... for example in Saudi Arabia where they don't allow building churches ... Religion were always a major source of war and violence throughout history, and they will be the same as long as they will exist. When you insist for a religion, you're asking for future trouble.

lol, how can you say church bells ringing aren't religious? the clue is in the fact that a church is ringing them. as far as never having heard a call to prayer, there was a minaret right near the beach i was staying at in turkey on holiday. so yes i've heard it lots of times, in fact it sounded quite mystical on holiday, but i wouldn't want to live next door to it.

well i don't know where you live but in the UK they ring every sunday morning to get people to church.

Liberalism have nothing to do with Religions or non Religious movements, revise Your library about it and come back

Saudi Arabia governed with kind of nuts trend called "Vahabism" these mofos even wanted to remove Prophet Mohammed's Cemetery, so i wouldn't call Saudi Arabia as a proper country, but, in Turkiye There are Churches and Government even helping them to be restored.

Ummmm... I never said that, YOU did. I said, now keep up here... "Bells ringing aren't specific to religion..." The town I used to live in the only bells I heard were those ringing hourly from the COURT HOUSE. The town I NOW live I hear no bells at all. Just because you hear a fucking bell ringing doesn't mean it HAS RELIGIOUS MEANING TO IT. However hearing the adhan shouted out 5 times a day can only be just that and annoying to boot. I abhor organized religion but I would rather listen to church bells, that are melodious, than to some garble garble.

wow, this thread has stayed up much longer than I anticipated. I guess a lot of us have strong feelings about this issue :P

someone can say the otherwise, but it doesn't mean i have a right to remove "church bells"...

I dont see much of this freedom for Christians building churches in muslim countries, so yes, thank you as its a good decision. Who the fuck would not want to respect democracy anyway? Our country=our rules. End of case.

What kind of democracy is voting for an anti democratic action?

i will prove You which Muslim country has freedom for Christians in a while, wait a bit, but, can You tell me how 2 false makes one true? :2 cents:

then i feel like in a movie every saturday at 6 pm and every sunday at noon :winkwink:

they are just about 50 meter from my window :Oh crap

too bad it's only in german, but maybe you can get it translated. article from today...

http://www.spiegel.de/politik/auslan...664761,00.html

by the way what has your fantasy book you blindly follow has to say about being exposed to naked girls with their cunts and tits out on a daily basis?

Haha, Turkey can't even comply with basic human rights you dumb mother fucker.

Interesting. What religion only has church services at 6 PM on Saturday and noon Sunday?

You are saying that to whom? to MaDalton or to me?

what You mean i didn't get it.

was this Your best?

that article says things are in Turkiye is changing slovely but steadyly to the positive way, isn't it?

lutherian evangelists would be my guess - church doesn't look pompous enough to be catholic.
but i'm not a specialist on who has which service at what time. i only care that they wake me up on sundays :disgust

i still prefer that over someone shouting allah akhbar in my ear though

well, if you see it this way: yes

but it also said that it is still far from perfect outside of Istanbul and that christian church communities are not accepted as religion but have to exist as association instead. and that they have many problems in their daily life.

i'll break it down to something easier: if you point with one finger at someone else, three fingers point at yourself.

or: nobodies perfect

:winkwink:

Democracy
 

How anyone can say that this is not democratic. Actually it is, because people there voted. At least they have some brain and try to avoid something like this:


https://youtube.com/watch?v=hCKZ0ApGf70

http://www.wvwnews.net/story.php?id=3532

You are talking like Every place is perfect but, people in Turkiye are searching for Christians to Random shot.

this is untrue, afew events like that happened here, but those were something rare and i would look for something else instead of extremists behind these sad event.

we Muslims, Christians Jews lived together for many centuries without any matter, someone just trying to make it up otherwise.

Here in our University there are so many people from different cultures and religions, i never saw anybody discriminated Christians, thats mostly media hype, nothing more.

You can also check these out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categor...ches_in_Turkey
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...gues_in_Turkey

My place is not the best maybe but, clean enough for the religion tolerance, at least nobody makes a referendum to unplug church bells.

if afew douches does makes a bad example, it doesn't mean they can picture the whole community and can wipe out this tolerance thing which comes from so many centuries ago.


[QUOTE=MaDalton;16605195you are somewhat right - if they are born here it's somehow also their country. but with no proper language skills and refusing to accept laws and culture I cannot see it that way.

Those who did adapt: for sure, no problem with them. I also have turkish and kurdish friends who live and talk like germans - but of course still are muslims. but in those families also the daughters are treated as human beings - including the right to have boyfriends, wear what they want and do whatever they like. because everything else i consider unacceptable in a modern western society[/QUOTE]


i already told i agree with You on that, they need to adapt, but i don't think they have to give their own values up, it should be respected as how You respect Aimish, Cathlics or Mormons as long as they don't respect others.

i would acctually reply that part within details, but i m too lazy to do it right now :2cents::

then asking Uncle Sam to not support these kind of radical organizations is more reasonable then stopping people from doing their basic needs :2 cents:

"as long as they don't harm others" would be, sorry for the confusing post