you mean you won't print that post out and tape it to your wall?

obviously people that kill themselves with guns would more than likely have found another way to do it even if there were no guns around. i wasnt suggesting his dad having a shotgun was the reason he did what he did... just that this was the reason i dont like guns. and even if it just 5% of people would not have killed themselves otherwise, is that not a viable argument against having guns in the house?

i just have a hard time with the argument that guns make people feel safer.

people that defend gun rights because they think it is their right to own guns i can relate more to. i agree that people should be able to own them constitutionally, but i would argue against the fact that having guns in the house makes you actually safer.

i dunno, i just wish they would all go away or at the very least make the punishment very severe for anyone caught with a gun without a license. do you know what the average punishment is for someone caught with an illegal gun is?

depends from state to state, city to city

Whenever I'm at home I have a gun close by at all times and feel safer because of it. I don't expect a home invasion, I'm just protecting myself since they do happen. Also I don't expect my house to catch fire but I have a couple of fire extinguishers here too just in case. I'd rather be safe than sorry.


- 38 percent of assaults and 60 percent of rapes occur during home invasions.
- One in five homes undergoes a home invasion or break-in.
- There are more than 8,000 home invasions every day in North America.
- 50 percent of home invasions involve the use of a weapon; the most common weapons used are knives or other cutting instruments.
- In 48 percent of home invasions, victims sustain physical injuries.
- Victims age 60 or older make up 17 percent of home invasion victims.
- In 68 percent of home invasions, victims and the accused are strangers; in 11 percent of these cases, victims and the accused are friends, business associates, or family.

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

After coming home earlier this year and finding burglars in my house that had a gun, yeah I keep a gun nearby now.

I had a break-in at an apartment I was in once, they got off with some jewelry and my Kirby vacuum cleaner, they're fucking expensive
They couldn't do anything with my safe, they tried. I had a clean glass jar with a couple bucks in it, they took the money and left perfect print on the glass jar, which is why it was clean

They were scared away by a neighbor that pointed a gun at them

Exactly! 150 to 220 is a huge move. Most people would divide the number of crimes by the number of people for a incindence per 10k people or whatever but yeah math does not lie.

Crime is DOWN!

66.31 crimes per 10k in 1989
45.45 crimes per 10k in 2008

Remember this includes property crimes not just violent. The reduction in violent crime is higher.

no, that was just violent crimes and from 1960, the crime rate is up
but it's still no where near the 50% that Kennesaw experinced

Kennessaw passed the bill in 1982 according to the thing you posted. That was the height of crime. they are not clear on what crime went down 50% but nationwide violent crime went down 50% and total crime went down about 33% nationwide.

My point was that maybe the gun law had shit all to do with it.

except that nationwide violent crime didn't go down 50%

hell between 2000 and 2008 it's up, even though it's on a down slide right now, go ahead and look at the FBI stats