Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls (Post 16892992)

Im not cherry picking lol. Im just saying what the independent CBO has said about the plans.

The CBO has said that Obamas plan would raise the premiums EVEN MORE than they are being raised now. And the republican plan would LOWER premiums.

You have yet to say what you like about the Obama plan so much.

Originally Posted by EscortBiz (Post 16893048)

there is no way any health plan will work as far as lowering cost as long as we do not address the issue of health insurance fraud.

go to almost any doctor today for anything and he will have you do one or several of the following

take a sleep study - insurance pays 5000- 7000 dollars doctor gets 2000 kicked back

take an mri - 1000-4000 doctor gets about 20%

get a ct-scan done (ct scan is different than a MRI)- 1000+ doctor gets 20%

get you on some sort of pill cycle (usually expensive pills, depression, pain etc) doctor gets all types of returns if he pushes certain pills

I GUARANTEE YOU if you go to a doctor tomorrow someone you do not have a long history with, and you say you have any sort of minor problem, he will dish out one of the above

then you have the lawyers who cook up these crazy lawsuits, and in turn the doctors have to spend huge amounts of money on malpractice insurance and in turn they bill you more.

its important to understand why insurance is so expensive and why doctors just cant focus on their work, its hard to focus if you are scared all day and night about a upcoming lawsuit or you are meeting with insurance investigators all day.

I dont know a solution, but my point is that one first has to understand what is causing the problem

Originally Posted by kane (Post 16893061)

Here is the difference. The GOP plan would only increase the number of insured by around 3 million. That still leaves 28 million without coverage. The democrat plan would cover almost all of the 31 million uninsured. So comparing the plans is not all that fair. It is like saying you spend less on groceries buying for a family of 2 than someone who buys for a family of 20.

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls (Post 16893067)

The CBO says the dem plan would only cover 2% of the uninsured.

Originally Posted by BFT3K (Post 16893071)

Tomorrow Obama will quote CBO numbers over and over, SUPPORTING his plan.

Come back then, to tell us all how the CBO numbers are meaningless.

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls (Post 16893067)

The CBO says the dem plan would only cover 2% of the uninsured.

Originally Posted by BFT3K (Post 16893071)

Tomorrow Obama will quote CBO numbers over and over, SUPPORTING his plan.

Come back then, to tell us all how the CBO numbers are meaningless.

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls (Post 16893073)

What do you like about the dem plan?

Originally Posted by BFT3K (Post 16893083)

One of the things I like is that health insurance, like car insurance, will be mandatory.

This change is imperative in order to afford care for those who have pre-existing conditions, and it will cut back on bankruptcies.

Originally Posted by kane (Post 16893076)

This is directly from the article you linked above:

"The CBO found that under the Republican plan, insurance coverage would increase by about 3 million and that the percentage of insured non-elderly adults would remain at about 83 percent after ten years. The House bill would increase coverage to an additional 36 million people, raising the number of insured to 96 percent."

I'm no expert, but that seems to me like the house plan (meaning the democrats) insures about 12 times as many people and cover 96% of the people in the country.

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls (Post 16893085)

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Originally Posted by kane (Post 16893076)

This is directly from the article you linked above:

"The CBO found that under the Republican plan, insurance coverage would increase by about 3 million and that the percentage of insured non-elderly adults would remain at about 83 percent after ten years. The House bill would increase coverage to an additional 36 million people, raising the number of insured to 96 percent."

I'm no expert, but that seems to me like the house plan (meaning the democrats) insures about 12 times as many people and cover 96% of the people in the country.

Originally Posted by joshgirls (Post 16893084)

its really pointless to discuss CBO numbers to make an idea. their numbers are historically wildly inaccurate due to unexpected events & subsequent changes in administrations/public policies.

Originally Posted by BFT3K (Post 16893090)

Do you want people to accept you as you are, or do you want them to like you?

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls (Post 16893094)

There are conflicting reports.

Agreed

Originally Posted by BFT3K (Post 16893098)

WTF?! You are the one quoting CBO numbers!

Ridiculous!

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls (Post 16893094)

Agreed

Originally Posted by joshgirls (Post 16893106)

you agree, but you are using CBO to assert the republican plan is better?

i think our current system is a capitalist model, with a government component which knows no boundries in terms of spending money. it should be no suprise to anyone that the most profitable companies in the USA are health insurers & drug makers. they make their money charging as much as possible, & hold monopolies in the markets they control. if they could make more money insuring all people, they would. instead, they make the most money by kicking more & more of our people out of the system. So our system is great for wall street & the health executives, but a disaster for the people. Its just too bad the republicans are sluts to these wealthy winners instead of going the road of teddy roosevelt & busting these healthcare trusts that are strangling this nation. All the dems do is throw more government at the problem. either way we're fucked.

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls (Post 16893094)

There are conflicting reports.



Agreed

Originally Posted by joshgirls (Post 16893123)

the health care fiasco is but a small example of a greater problem, which is that wealthy special interests run the government & now capitalism has become perverted. from retail, to health care, oil companies, food companies, hollywood studios, even porn, companies are consolidating into giant corporations that destroy competition & make greater earnings by reducing customer value. its great if your in the top 2% richest in the country. the other 98% are on a sinking ship.

Originally Posted by BFT3K (Post 16893130)

Originally Posted by IllTestYourGirls (Post 16892961)

So I guess the question is why do the Dems want to raise premiums and raise our debt and raise our budget gaps?

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/op...-69270747.html



What do you like so much about the Dem plan that you are willing to raise premiums and our debt?

Originally Posted by directfiesta (Post 16893166)

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...amid-criticis/

:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh

Have some of this, guys :

http://scrapetv.com/News/News%20Page...2/vaseline.jpg

:)

Originally Posted by baddog (Post 16893209)

There is no question that the Republicans have no plan. They do not want a plan. I can not say that I really comprehend [how they justify] why not. Pisses me off.

I mean, if Obama says "come let's talk about it in front of everyone", and the only response is, "it's a setup," something is fucked up.

Originally Posted by BFT3K (Post 16892910)

Fuck You Douche Bag!

Just because the gop and fox noise continue to repeat lies, does not make it so!

Guess who won the election, running heavily on Health Care Reform?!

That's what the majority of American people want, you fucking totally retarded douche bag!

Originally Posted by Sausage (Post 16893236)

I don't know if many of you have paid attention to what Obamacare actually does .. it would actually be quite good for the Insurance companies and doesn't really solve much at all.

I identify very well with the conservative side of politics, though to deny your people health care is just disgusting. A government should provide education, protection (police, fire, military), sanitation services, at least basic health care and several other basic services. A healthy population works better and is more productive.

Originally Posted by BFT3K (Post 16893262)

Good points, and to be clear, I would like a single payer plan and/or a public option and/or medicare for all.

If the current plan has any chance whatsoever, it is through a simple majority vote, through reconciliation.

At that point why the fuck is Obama selling out so fucking far to the right, and the insurance companies?

I like Obama, and I am 100% behind healthcare reform, but I don't worship him. He was the better option at the time.

If he grows a pair, maybe he'll get re-elected, but if he plays so far to the center right that he loses his base, he has no chance. He will not win any support from the right, no matter what he does - even if it is exactly what they claim they want him to do.

Originally Posted by joshgirls (Post 16893106)

you agree, but you are using CBO to assert the republican plan is better?

i think our current system is a capitalist model, with a government component which knows no boundries in terms of spending money. it should be no suprise to anyone that the most profitable companies in the USA are health insurers & drug makers. they make their money charging as much as possible, & hold monopolies in the markets they control. if they could make more money insuring all people, they would. instead, they make the most money by kicking more & more of our people out of the system. So our system is great for wall street & the health executives, but a disaster for the people. Its just too bad the republicans are sluts to these wealthy winners instead of going the road of teddy roosevelt & busting these healthcare trusts that are strangling this nation. All the dems do is throw more government at the problem. either way we're fucked.

Originally Posted by directfiesta (Post 16893149)

Anthem Blue Cross dramatically raising rates for Californians with individual health policies
Policyholders are incensed over rate hikes of as much as 39%, which they say come on top of similar increases last year. State insurance regulators say they'll investigate.
February 04, 2010|By Duke Helfand

California's largest for-profit health insurer is moving to dramatically raise rates for customers with individual policies, setting off a furor among policyholders and prompting state insurance regulators to investigate.

Anthem Blue Cross is telling many of its approximately 800,000 customers who buy individual coverage -- people not covered by group rates -- that its prices will go up March 1 and may be adjusted "more frequently" than its typical yearly increases.

http://articles.latimes.com/2010/feb...hem5-2010feb05

Key words ; 39 % - Individual policies ....

37th on the list ... better then i toought... Next year : 42nd... and going down ...

Now, lets get THE DEMON ( :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh ) throw a few insults and how he always backs his saying with links to subtabtial articles ( like he did here up to now ... lol ... ).