Hey, yet another smart guy in the 1% intelligent population on GFY.

It is very hard to beat an incumbent president. It is almost impossible to do if he is popular and doing a decent job. If 2012 rolls around and the economy is looking decent, the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan are going well and he has made some front with health care and some of the other things he has promised, he will win easily. It won't matter who the republicans nominate and I wouldn't be shocked to see some of the bigger names sit it out.

However, if the economy is still in the crapper and not looking like it is improving and things aren't going well in Iraq and Afghanistan, he could be vulnerable. However, to beat him the republicans will have to find a top notch candidate and right now they can't even agree on what being a conservative really is.

Owned....

Ron Paul 2012. You're right that Obama would win ONLY because the Republicans are having a problem finding a candidate. But as it stands right now, Obama has virtually no chance of being re-elected, if polls are to be believed that is.

im not sure what limits private sector corruption has. look at the mortgage derivatives disaster. if the feds didnt bail out the street, the banking system had the potential to collapse & freeze up the entire economy from top to bottom. in smaller sectors like making pens, no biggie, but banks, health care, oil, the corruption in these industries is really killing the consumer.

Lets start with the printing press. Lets start with the subprime mortgage failure. I agree the private sector didn't help it at all, but it was the government that unleashed hell. Personally, as someone who follows the Austrian School of Economics, I would rather have Wall Street and everyone who should have failed, fail. The bailouts only increased the destruction of the imminent collapse.

Private for-profit health care is out to make money. It is business. It is out to make as much money as it can, to satisfy it's shareholders, at the cost of the average Joe.

Without competition, and without restraints, these powers are not interested in you....

If they are allowed to drop sick people to save a buck, they will.

If they are allowed to double or triple their rates every year, they will.

If they are allowed to deny clients for any reason whatsoever, they will.

I can go on, but you get the idea.

In the end, healthcare should be a right, and if government has any purpose at all, it is to protect it's people, and this includes the health of its people.

I don't hear guys like you bitching about the defense budget, which blows all other government budgets out of the water.

Too bad the big corps have managed to brainwash so many, and convince them to vote and fight against their own best interests.

If you're going to preach your hilarious liberal bullshit, at least try backing some of it up so it doesn't seem like an immature rant.

Why do I bother?

You really are a retarded child.

You cease to amaze me.

ideally, wall street should have been allowed to die. but practically speaking, no politician has the ballsack to tell wall street to suck it, because the public will blame washington for doing nothing while their bank burns down. Both parties united to bail out the street, so the repubs, who idealogically should have said no, went along with it.

a huge reason republicans dont take on entitlement spending is because the public demands everything from the government. solve all lifes problems, & dont tax me too much. only the tea party really wants to kill the entitlement dragon.

I think I speak for everybody when I say nobody cares about your borderline retarded rants.


Btw, I'm pretty sure it's "You never cease to amaze me." But nobody expects common sense from a blubbering idiot such as yourself.

I'm a republican but I don't always agree with their policies. I think they should come up with a better alternative to Obamacare, rather than just say "no no no no". But that's the way the game is played. The Democrats are just as guilty. However, if you really want to argue public sector vs. private sector in terms of overall destruction, I'll be more than happy to put up a case for the government destroying our economy far more than the private sector ever could.

The #1 cause of bankruptcies in the US is from medical bills, from people who have inadequate or no coverage at all.

Even people WITH medical coverage still file for bankruptcy because they didn't get the proper coverage.


If you have a pre-existing condition one way to get coverage is to get a job at big company that offers group health insurance. You will not only get covered but get it a LOT cheaper than if you were to try on your own.

Health insurance is as expensive as you want it to be, at least the premiums part. It all comes down to the plan you want. Depending on your deductible, co-insurance, max out of pocket, co-pay, life time max, etc etc. If you want a $0 deductible policy for a family of 5 you going to be paying serious money. If you up your exposure on your deductible and co-insurance / max out of pocket then you can make your premiums as low as you want. You just need to save or have the money on hand in the event you go to the doctor a lot or for something major.

If you are POOR you have free health care, its called Medicade.

If you are OLD (over 65) you qualify for medicare, which helps with a lot of the costs if you can't afford to have your own health care.

Children up to age 19 who are uninsured get health insurance coverage through each state.

There is already a LOT of govt run health care in the US.

You also need to analyze the poplulation of the "uninsured" to see how many of them A. Make 3x more than the poverity level but choose not buy health insurance because a nice car was more important to them, B. are illegal aliens, C. are not insured but qualify for a govt health program but never signed up, D. Do not qualify for govt health insurance, can not get it through their work, make very little money and can not afford it.

IMO we need health care reform, but don't think govt run is the way to go. Look at Social Security, Medicade, etc... all govt run programs that are in serious trouble. Tort reform would be a good start. It would be nice to get the costs down for everyone...

I know the full quote you ignorant moron.

You are so dumb, you don't even know when you are being insulted.

I have as much chance of winning the presidential election as Ron Paul does. The reason I say that is I firmly believe that Paul really doesn't want to be president and will never carry out a campaign that could give him a legit chance of winning.

That said, according to Gallup http://www.gallup.com/poll/113980/ga...-approval.aspx Obama currently has a 51% job approval rating. Sure, on some things he rates lower and on other things higher, but overall that is decent.

Look back at 2004. I would have never thought that Bush would get re-elected. The economy was not doing well, we were marred in an unnecessary war in Iraq that was/still is costing billions not to mention many lives and he had pretty much turned all the good will of the world against us. Yet, he still won. Sure, Kerry was not a great candidate, but he wasn't horrible either.

Here is a Gallup poll showing if the election were held today how the votes would go down
http://www.pollingreport.com/2012.htm

It shows Obama winning against a generic candidate by a few points. When matched up against specific candidates he beats them all by double digits.

Obviously this is without those people even campaigning, so it might be closer than that, but then again it may not. Once people get to know the candidates a little more they very well may not like them at all. Which is why it is so hard to be an incumbent. At least with the incumbent you know what you are getting, you have take a leap of faith with the new candidate. As much as people say they want change in this country, most people really don't.

Add in that the country is still not happy with republicans and it makes it an uphill battle for them. I think they have gotten cocky. They won an election in Mass and won a few governor's seats and they think the country is ready to hand them over the reins again.

i totally agree with you there. the law is all powerful &, well, just look at iran. but whats happening today is that the healthcare system is broken. in the past, our government fought for the little guy (my favorite repub is teddy) & broke up the steel trust, the oil trust, these trusts were killing competition & engaged in predatory pricing. a similar racket is happening in health care, but the government is powerless to do anything to stop it. the dems have huge majorities but still cant pass reform. i know the repubs argue the reform consisting of more government is the problem. Its just a shame they can't break their addiction to special interest money & take on these big companies. theres really no excuse for the way the repubs are in bed with big corporations. they are so in bed they will sell out their own idealogy (bailouts) to make them happy. If the repubs can't recognize there is a role some goverment can play in solving problems, then we need a third party.

The thing I have always loved about the republicans is that they argue for smaller government and say that more government is never the answer. Yet they don't ever seem to actually shrink the government when they are in power, in most cases they actually grow it. Hell, Bush added an entire new branch onto the government.

Has anyone talked about what would happen IF Obama did get his plan put through?

This country / govt is so far upsidedown right now and in debt, plunging into debt deeper and deeper everyday. How are they going to be able to afford to give free health care to everyone, or most people?

((( Raise taxes ))) It's the only thing they can do. The majority of federal revenue is from income taxes. So how are they going to pay for "FREE" health care... raise income taxes. So you were paying "x" a month for your private health care, now the government raises income taxes and you are paying more in taxes a year then you were for health insurance and it is substandard to what you had before. But hey, you got "FREE" health insurance. It's not going to be just the rich that will have income taxes go up, its going to be the middle class too. We are already in a huge hole, throw in "free health care" and they going to be raising taxes on middle class too, to try to pay for all of this.

(Note) Nothing is free for most of us. You pay for it one way or the other. That person who wasn't paying for heath insurance before anyway, and doesn't make much money, then it will be a great deal for him. But for the rest of us, we will have worst coverage and at the end of the day we will be paying more for it.

They need to find a better way to make health care affordable other than charging us more one place to give us something for free some where else. It doesn't add up.

exactly. i dont know what to call todays republican party. they dont cut any spending, they support stimulus spending at home (while opposing it on fox news). its disgraceful. i was a happy republican in 2001 but ever since the Iraq war, the prescription drug law & the runaway debt, I feel betrayed & the party is not republican by any definition of the word.

by all media accounts, obamacare does very little to control costs. i am really perlexed what the point of the bill is, other than to create more government bureacracy & provide coverage for all. This really isnt the best moment for universal government care. breaking up insurance monopolies, tort reform, regulating profit margins at insurance co.s & reducing medicare/medicaid fraud would go a long way, plus there would be more insured because coverage would be more affordable. too bad the repubs offer only small potatoes.

Hundred countries with better health care than the US :)

No shit? Almost every debt increase in the past decade has been during 8 of those 10 years in which it was a Republican administration? I did not know that...

Sorry, was still early in reading the thread but that was too hilarious to pass up.

The problema with Obama is the heavy focus on health care reform when the economy is a bigger issue. People need food, water and shelter most of all, and unfortunately need money for all 3 of those things, with shelter being the big problem people are facing. They need jobs to get that money too. He'll watch tons of people start living on the street because of no job and no money to pay their mortgage but hey, they'll get health care!

lol ... like you do ? with your comments ... right kiddo ...:helpme

Once again, there's a reason your stupid ass is ignored. The same goes with BFT3K. You two are hilarious morons even on a forum full of morons. You're amusing though:)


And Josh/Kane, you both make good points. The central issue is debt. The Obama administration is involved in deficit spending of epic proportions. For some reason they foolishly believe in the Keynesian theory of "spending towards recovery". What that's doing is making it worse for us and our future children once the collapse hits. Adding another trillion dollars is not the answer, nor is Obamacare.

It would be nice if your IQ reached the triple digits. Then you wouldn't spend your time embarrassing yourself in your own threads.

You ever wonder what life would be like if you had gotten enough oxygen at birth?

No, but I often wonder how many moronic human beings wouldn't be here if abortions were 100% legal :)

But #1 in hot blondes:)

Well, they do it all the time already.

Are you trying to insinuate that private health care is not a for-profit business? What's liberal about that statement? They do drop sick people and refuse coverage and that's very well documented. We've had to switch insurance companies every year for the past 4 because they wanted to raise our group rate by double digits. I've been denied benefits and I know too many people who have also been denied benefits to think I'm just the minority there. And I'm a healthy and fit 31-year-old!

How much have we spent on the "war" in Iraq? How much does the private health care sector spend on campaigns to convince people public health care is evil?

This isn't liberal drivel. These are the facts of what people are dealing with every single day.

Wait what? Where did you get my "insinuations"? And I can reverse what you're saying. "How much time has public sector spent on campaigns to convince people that private health care is evil and money hungry?"

Why were you denied coverage if you are healthy and 31 years old? Are you talking about the group you were in being denied, or you individually. I don't see why you, individually would be denied if you are healthy and young. If your group keeps getting denied you most likely are better off on your own and not part of the group.

LOL that is funny. Bush was president from 2000 - 2008. Since Obama has been in the debt still keeps going up and if he gets the health care that he wants the debt will sky rocket up.

You people in this thread spend more times insulting each other instead of debating the topics. :(

That's because certain individuals are incompetent and lack the ability to bring concrete evidence into the discussion, instead electing to appeal to emotions.

It's safe to say that in 1 year, Obama has surpassed Bush's 8 years of deficit spending.

Using facts to debate this demon idiot is totally pointless.

Best to just ignore him, or simply treat him as a punching bag troll, as I often do for fun.

He has nothing to do with he adult industry, and shouldn't even be allowed to be here, so you can say whatever you want to him, it won't effect your business.

The Demon is saddled with a terrible pre-existing condition. Unfortunately there is still no vaccine for inherent stupidity.

Go through this thread from the beginning. My points are ignored by your side, and instead, you guys just throw out more crap.

As I've stated many times before - you don't give a shit what I have to say, so why should I give a shit what you have to say?

If you think Bush/Cheney were good for the US, and you think our healthcare is fine, then there is no fucking way in hell we are ever going to agree.

I didn't know I was on a side, what side am I on? I don't like republicans or democrats. I could give a shit about the "sides" or parties. I look at the issues.

usa! usa! usa!

Amen to that. It's hilarious how the left always stays left and the right always stays right.


And BFT3K, keep typing. I think I might be the only one purposely not ignoring you, only for the fact that your stupidity is humorous.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100225/..._care_overhaul