Originally Posted by Far-L (Post 17352790)

The sad part is that if that is all you are going to do to address the problem is insult me then there is probably a good reason why the copyright infringement revolution has hurt your business so much. :2 cents:

Originally Posted by Far-L (Post 17352790)

The sad part is that if that is all you are going to do to address the problem is insult me then there is probably a good reason why the tube revolution has hurt your business so much. :2 cents:

Originally Posted by Half man, Half Amazing (Post 17352806)

Fixed for ya!

Originally Posted by Half man, Half Amazing (Post 17352925)

So Far-L, would you do business with The Pirate Bay? After all, there's no proof anyone working there uploaded a single torrent file. And they aren't required to comply with DMCA laws since it's a US law.

So by the rationale you've laid out to us, there should be nothing stopping you from seeing any problem with the ethics of The Pirate Bay.

Here's the thing man, you're entitled to do business with whomever you want. We can criticize you for it, but at the end of the day it's your decision to make as a business owner. Where I think you really insulted the intelligence of a lot of people is when you started down the path of "show me evidence" that Brazzers has ever done anything wrong. You're taking pages out of the Jules Denial Jordan playbook there.

Stick to your guns on your decision to do business with them, but don't come in here defending Brazzers like they're squeaky clean.

Originally Posted by ProG (Post 17352878)

What are you doing to address the problem? If you can't beat them join them?

Originally Posted by Far-L (Post 17353029)

Tell me how much you pay month to month on legal to address IP issues? If it is more than we do then I will bow to your efforts and give praise. But if we spend more then you should just bend over and kiss my ass... :1orglaugh

Originally Posted by erooup (Post 17353123)

Who said "don't answer the question you were asked, but they question you wish they have asked"?

McNamara mentioned it in "The Fog of War", but I forgot the original source.

Originally Posted by Far-L (Post 17353308)

Sounds like something Kissinger would've said...

Originally Posted by will76 (Post 17353306)

seriously, fuck you and your "i am better than everyone" attitude because you spend this or that. Bottom line is everyone knows what you are doing here and no on agrees with you.

Your argument that " well they take down the stolen content when we ask " is just fucking lame.

They know there is stolen content on their site. They do NOTHING to stop it (key word being STOP it). They could put safe guards in place to prevent it from happening. If someone produced a homemade clip it would be easy for them to prove they owned it. For the studious and companies like yourself it would be easy for you to prove to them you own the content.

However those sites don't give a fuck, they dont care to control what content ends up on their site and they could give a fuck if there is stolen content or not. Them taking down a video when you ask is a laugh. Wow so IF you find your stolen content on their site they will take it down. Then the next day it is back up again. Then you have to find it again and ask again, then they take it down again. Oh look a couple days later it is back again, etc... its a fucking joke, being played on you. You are the monkey they are making jump through the hoop. And makes it even worst is that you convinced yourself that what they are doing is OK, because you don't do business with bad guys so you trying to convince us and everyone else that Porn Hub is a good site to do business with :1orglaugh

Look at the responses here, it isn't like I am off in left field. Everyone disagrees with you even other program owners like yourself. Stop making excuses for them. What you are doing is like sucking their dick with the lights off and because you can't see its a guy you are trying to tell everyone you are not gay.

BTW, you have avoided the question of " how did all of the content get their in the first place if the site owner didn't go steal it". Asked about 3 or 4 times, you avoided it every time.

Originally Posted by will76 (Post 17353306)

seriously, fuck you and your "i am better than everyone" attitude because you spend this or that. Bottom line is everyone knows what you are doing here and no on agrees with you.

Originally Posted by Half man, Half Amazing (Post 17352764)

Far-L:

How is it possible that the day that ExtremeTube.com opened there were already thousands of vids on there? Thousands of copyrighted un-licensed vids just magically appeared before the site was even open to the public?

You should have read my Connecting the Dots article where I showed that the VERY FIRST member to be signed up to PornHub had uploaded a few 100 videos and made comments on other people's profile representing himself as an admin for the site. That not good enough proof to you? After I pointed out all these shady things, Brazzers...errr Pornhub quickly went and changed their tube site. All the while they were denying they owned these sites...if they were so legit then why were they trying to deceive people?

Ok, how about this...Brazzers running a tube site WITHIN their members area of Brazzers.com so you as a copyright holder would have no idea your content was being stolen unless you yourself became a member of Brazzers. This also gave them a nice way of adding value to their memberships..."why sign up for Homegrown...by being a member of Brazzers you can upload all the Homegrown content you want just keep it on the downlow"

You're doing business with the biggest copyright infringers our industry has ever known. You're judged by the company you keep. Go ahead and make your money with them, just know that they're making 10 times that by using your stolen content. Content with the table scraps? Your choice.

"In a July 19, 2005 e-mail to YouTube co-founders Chad Hurley and Jawed Karim, YouTube co-founder Steve Chen wrote: 'jawed, please stop putting stolen videos on the site. We?re going to have a tough time defending the fact that we?re not liable for the copyrighted material on the site because we didn?t put it up when one of the co-founders is blatantly stealing content from other sites and trying to get everyone to see it.'"

"Chen twice wrote that 80 percent of user traffic depended on pirated videos. He opposed removing infringing videos on the ground that 'if you remove the potential copyright infringements... site traffic and virality will drop to maybe 20 percent of what it is.' Karim proposed they 'just remove the obviously copyright infringing stuff.' But Chen again insisted that even if they removed only such obviously infringing clips, site traffic would drop at least 80 percent. ('if [we] remove all that content[,] we go from 100,000 views a day down to about 20,000 views or maybe even lower')."

"In response to YouTube co-founder Chad Hurley?s August 9, 2005 e-mail, YouTube co-founder Steve Chen stated: 'but we should just keep that stuff on the site. I really don?t see what will happen. what? someone from cnn sees it? he happens to be someone with power? he happens to want to take it down right away. he get in touch with cnn legal. 2 weeks later, we get a cease & desist letter. we take the video down.'"

Originally Posted by Far-L (Post 17353354)

Cut me a break. The only reason you feel threatened by me saying to prove you put your money where your mouth is because you actually haven't done anything other than bitch about stuff and you haven't actually done much to really do anything about this at all other than preach to the choir.

I have already answered your question - I said I don't know and I don't believe your version of events based on hearsay and I showed you the Bing example to give one potential example of how to start with content.

Now, calm down and try to remain professional. Just because I disagree with you is no need to get so piqued. If you stick to the topic maybe people will actually learn something - whether you or I are right or wrong. Reduce it to name calling and swearing and all you do is reduce this to idiotic childishness. :2 cents:

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude (Post 17348326)

As much as I appreciate your kind offer Nathan/Fabian, I do not wish to in any way appear to be perceived as being bought off with an expenses-paid trip to the AVN show. I assure you that I can easily afford to travel there on my own funds, if I so wish to.

How about instead, you respond here forthrightly, and 100% honestly, in public, to some questions which I and others have posed, such as:

1) Who are your partners/investors in Manwin?

2) What is your plan (besides hiding behind the ridiculous provisions of the DMCA safe harbor provisions, which hopefully will be changed soon) for ensuring that your Manwin company, and known/suspected associates/entities/properties (such as Brazzers, JuggCash, KeezMovies, PornHub, Xtube, ExtremeTube, Tube8, MovieBox, Sex In Your City, etc), quit screwing over the rest of the industry by seemingly engaging in allowing obvious non-copyright holders/employees to post long scenes (or any scenes for that matter) of videos which they have no copyright to on any of your sites?

3) What role, if any, do Stephane Manos (Man) or hahahahahahaha (oops, forgot, for some reason O-u-i-s-s-a-m, without hyphens, appears as hahahahahahaha on GFY) Youseff (Sef) play in Manwin's current operations?

4) Does Virage Media Limited still exist? If not, when did it cease to exist, and why? Are the former Virage Media Ltd properties now part of Manwin?

5) When did Manwin come into existence, and who are the partners/investors?

6) When did Manwin acquire Mansef? In March or July, or whatever date?

7) Is Bob Rice still a part of your Manwin operation? If not, when did he leave?

8) What business relationship/association(s) have you, or any companies associated with you, (such as Virage Media or HQtube and Xtube) had with Envisionext/Stan Fiskin?

9) What business relationship, if any, do you have with Jain Shaileshkumar (aka Sam Jain) or Bjorn Daniel Sundin (aka Daniel)? Some people here seem to think there is a money connection somehow.

10) Would you consider contributing some of Manwin's profits to an industry-wide anti-copyright/anti-piracy effort?

I have other straightforward questions, but I will save them for now. If you can straightforwardly answer the questions above, I will refrain from posing any additional questions, since I do not wish to cause you or your family any personal embarrassment, nor possible legal issues.

I assure you that I am not attempting in any way to destroy you or your reputation, as you maudlinly claim (I suspect, in some way to gain sympathy/pity).

I'm simply asking questions which I perceive that you have repeatedly ducked, dodged, and otherwise parried from.

None of the information I have posted is personal (even if you or anyone else chooses to take it personally).

Most, if not all, of the info I have posted about, came from easily accessible public sources on the internet, such as LinkedIn, and Google searches of your name, your nicks, and your various company names, plus names of people associated (or said to possibly be associated) with you.

I assure you that I have not hacked into anything that is private or otherwise secure information. That is outside of my nature/proclivity, and skill-set.

If you wish to be perceived as a respectable member of the adult industry (and I know many already do respect you for some of your past achievements - some of which I respect as well), by answering forthrightly, the simple questions which I have posed here, and prove yourself to sincerely and aggressively stand against content/copyright piracy (not just for your own content, but for the entire industry), then you may be surprised to find a strong ally in me.

Respectfully yours,

ADG

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude (Post 17350857)

http://30daysout.files.wordpress.com...g_crickets.jpg

It should be around 8am in Deutschland now. Rise and shine Mr. Manwin Managing Partner (is every partner at Manwin as "silent" as you are? Pardon the pun).

You are not doing much of a job representing your company when you go on a forum and ask people to trust you, but then refuse to respond to simple questions posed to you.

You indicated the obvious, that given their legal problems and perceptions within the adult industry, Mansef/Manwin needs to make changes and improve it's image within the industry, and change it's practices (one of which was lying).

I'm giving you an opportunity right here to do that...

Your forthright answers to the ten questions posed above would be greatly appreciated...

ADG

Originally Posted by ProG (Post 17352636)

Fabian were you involved with PornGraph? Just curious...

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude (Post 17354274)

What is/was PornGraph, and what could it possibly have to do with Nathan / Fabian Thylmann?

ADG

Originally Posted by Far-L (Post 17352523)

The difference here though Steve, to use your analogy, if you stole my car, which is a Model H, a Homegrown Cruiser with turbo power content and painted with our logos, and you drive it around until I get it back, you just did some solid advertising for us. I don't consider the content to be "trashed and crashed" because it went on the tube freeway. On the contrary, the more exposure, while it may have caused a dent or two, provided us with critical feedback to improve our design, generated tons of branding that elevated our organics, and created opportunities to find more distributors.

We tackled this problem from the beginning with carrot and stick. Work with us and get the carrot. Don't work with us and get the stick. People have been stealing our content since before most people here were even old enough to use a computer. We have been up against this problem since day one; now, instead of spending all our money on attorneys to fight it to a phyrric finish, we chose to try and work with people first. Most people I see just complaining, railing, and otherwise getting nowhere. We turned a negative into a positive, an enemy into an ally, and learned how to work with the situation. That doesn't make us evil. You of all people should get this.

Originally Posted by will76 (Post 17354791)

Fabian started with Nats right? Then I think the next question was, what was John's involvement with Porngraph? I don't remember the details posted here but there was a lot of accusations and speculation with porngraph and john.

I can't talk about John though, if I do he will run to the mods to try to get me banned.

Do your digging young jedi, you might find some good dirt on both of them. :2 cents:

Here is a good start for you http://www.gfy.com/fucking-around-and-business-discussion/275929-porngraph-installs-trojans.html

Originally Posted by bdjerk (Post 17354913)

almost worth the trip to florida to watch the festivities.

Originally Posted by JFK (Post 17355376)

you really think, anything is going to happen ? ;)

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude (Post 17355390)

Nathan /Fabian is going to be there, right?

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5IOsliFxM3...BootLicker.jpg

I predict much BROmance, and that many drinks will be purchased...

ADG

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude (Post 17355320)

Interesting read - thanks for the link.

If I read correctly, I was surprised that John Albright never posted in that epic thread to defend himself or explain his position.

Originally Posted by Far-L (Post 17353006)

Anyway, I feel like I am in the midst of the same deluge Shap went through on this score a couple years back.

Originally Posted by topnotch, standup guy (Post 17356108)

Yeah, I wonder why that is?

http://www.missiontolearn.com/wp-con...2/well-duh.jpg

Originally Posted by fris (Post 17355113)

doesnt change the fact it was stolen, even if it made you money, its called theft, so by your thoughts its ok if you steal something as long as you give it back when you find out.

So we can steal millions of dollars until we find it missing.

Originally Posted by fris (Post 17355113)

doesnt change the fact it was stolen, even if it made you money, its called theft, so by your thoughts its ok if you steal something as long as you give it back when you find out.

So we can steal millions of dollars until we find it missing.

:1orglaugh

Originally Posted by bdjerk (Post 17355130)

Far-L needs more acid.