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Nothing is going to change. This whole move is nothing more than smoke and mirrors. They should have brought in Bob Rice, he would have had GFY sucking the nut out of his cock in a matter of seconds, but he's busy with Solo Converts right now and all the programs they have going under that umbrella, which are rumored to be not paying affiliates. I love this business. Crooks, cons and crybabies at every corner. I guess I'd fall into the crybaby category because I'm here in this thread wasting my time. :1orglaugh :thumbsup Meanwhile Mansuck or whatever they are called now have made a few hundred thousand dollars with stolen content. |
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And no, the review site comment is NOT a "cheap excuse" I've had several program owners come to me asking me how to protect their content and then tell me that they are afraid to do it because of review sites. And I don't give a shit what you or anybodies theories are on the pioneers of this online business. The FACT is you can NOT compete when your entire site is ripped and offered for free everywhere. I don't know what marketing classes all of you have taken that think that somehow you can just work harder and give better customer service...when YOUR PRODUCT IS AVAILABLE FOR FREE AND EVERYBODY IN THE WORLD KNOWS IT. Come on man. |
By the way Keith, I'm not trying to be an asshole to you. I still value your friendship. I'm just debating this, so please don't take anything personal that I'm saying. I just think you're not seeing things from the perspective of site owners who are trying to weigh several things at once in their judgments and decisions
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My point is, they are stealing your product to gain an unfair business advantage. I don't argue that. BUT, what I do argue is, most people prefer to mope and whine instead of doing something about it. Let's say you are right and protecting their content is beyond everyone's means/technical ability. What is to stop them from adding additional benefits and features to their site to start offering more to the surfer - things that can't be so easily stolen. The web is moving towards that direction full blast anyhow, so aside from combating piracy it's just good business sense. Interactivity is the key and 99% of adult sites lack that feature. That's my entire point; if they spent half the time they do bitching, in improving their product by adding interactivity, they would see their business grow not be killed. |
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And yeah, if Brazzers paysite was just so damn exceptional (and in many ways it is) that nobody could compete with it and everybody in the world wanted to join it...then that analogy would be perfect. But Walmart doesn't come to town and put things in it's store that are exclusively licensed to others and give it away for free. For instance Walmart doesn't steal Midas brake pads and give them away for free (which would put Midas out of business) and they don't go to Guitar Center, steal a bunch of guitars and give them all away for free. This isn't Walmart. This isn't even competing. This is theft and the destruction of the entire paysite/affiliate business model. |
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But not all of them can do that. How can sites that are built on paid-for content be interactive for instance? And if everybody starts doing what I'm doing and stops buying content...well then there is another sector of the business that is going to go down (content sellers) Or sites like Twistys for instance? How does Shap get girls to be interactive when he pays photographers to do all the shooting? Maybe those kinds of sites are going to have to change in MAJOR ways (again what happens to content providers?) or maybe they are going to become extinct. I don't know. |
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the sad thing is, half of the people taking shots at this guy for actually treating this business LIKE A BUSINESS, are most likely emailing him asking him if he wants to buy their business.
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You are right, sites in those situations are going to have a hard time changing their business model and may die off. IMO that would have happened eventually, though, as porn surfers WILL be seeking out sites that do more than show them videos and pics. The outbreak of tubes stealing everyone's traffic only serves to speed up that day (perhaps making it arrive years sooner than it would have otherwise). |
congrats nathan .. that's a huge acquisition
good for your future acquisition ! |
Robbie,
although I do not expect that I can in anyway influence your thoughts on this, I do think I need to at least comment on a few things you have written. There are tubes which I am sure do what you describe, ie actively stealing content and uploading it themself. However, our tubes, do not do this but I do not expect you to believe me. There are roughly 10 other tubes which are around our size (thousands that are smaller) which use a similar model to ours. If we would turn off our tubes, nothing will change since the others will simply pickup our traffic and you start back at zero. If we do changes to them as I have said we will, we might get others to follow, either way, our traffic can be used well by companies in our industry already today and it will likely be even better once we are done with all planned changes. You say people have to protect their content, it hurts reviews on review sites, and such things. People can not make sure their content is not put up for free anywhere, its too difficult to fight and thus nobody can make any money anymore. You do realize that we operate two of the biggest paysite networks in this industry, releasing multiple exclusive scenes each single day. Just because we run multiple tube sites does not mean we do not face the same problems everyone else faces with free content. On the contrary, our scenes are very popular, we release DVDs which adds another layer of attack next to online content, and we have to send out DMCA notices constantly. The business is changing, we decided to go the route its been taking in every industry, not only ours, that has to do with digital media, instead of sticking our head in the sand and complaining that DMCA exists. It simply does, and until its changed we need to live with it. In terms of Walmart, although I agree that Varius' analogy does not fit perfectly, neither does yours (for the reasons I explained above). But, please get more informed about Walmart's business practices, as well as those of rival mega-retail chains like the Metro Group. When they open a store in a city, they do not just open a really big store, they also FORCE major brands to sell them their products for dirt cheap so they can resell them for dirt cheap too, undercutting everyone else in the market and dumping the products below dealer prices. Of course they do not steal products from other stores and then give them away for free, but neither do we... |
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Hell. I like Bosco, and I think Brazzers has some of the best big tit paysites in the world But my point in this thread wasn't to attack you. But to explain to others who make flippant remarks that pornhub didn't hurt a lot of people. And it will continue to hurt a lot of people. No matter what you try to do with it. It's a big ass monster that quite frankly I don't think you or anybody can figure out how to properly monetize for an extended period of time. Like I said before NOBODY can compete with Free. Not even pornhub itself. So don't think I'm on some kind of crusade against you. I'm not. I did what I had to do a couple of years back to make sure my paysite didn't become another victim. Once I took action and it worked...I stopped being angry. Now the affiliate in me hates you guys. My tgps had 1.2 million uniques in 2007. I'm lucky to have a couple of friends stop by them now. Nobody is reading blogs, surfers don't go to freesites EXCEPT to see if there is anything new to steal that they haven't gotten yet. I did find it funny that you were kinda acting like you don't know anything about anything. That kinda came off like an insult to people. Anyway, you got nothing to convince me of one way or another. I've seen with my own two eyes from both the perspective of a paysite owner and an affiliate. Brazzers paysites are some of the very best in the world. Pornhub is a huge cancer. Your gonna change pornhub? I'm just saying the only changes that would be beneficial long term to paysite sales would be the very changes that would take your traffic down to nothing. There IS nothing you can do. If you actually did kill pornhub and decide to become a paysite oriented company again...somebody else would just take your place. |
Nathan, if you're serious as you say you are, then you see you have an opportunity, which I suspected is part of the reason you made this purchase, and why you made this public posting in the first place.
I think the industry as a whole has adapted to tubes, and the tubes themselves have adapted through either necessity or market position. The two seem somewhat ready to play together (industry vs tubes). Tube sites can now claim near legitimacy, by ushering in a new era of sanity and self control, and cement themselves as the free porn dispensers of these here internets. From rebels to noble leaders. I can't think of a decent analogy, but you get the picture. I think you have a rare (and strange...) opportunity to further legitimize tubes by helping to shut down the competition to the tubes, which is what's truly killing everybody. The pirate forums. Ze torrentz. Da rapidsharingg. What can you do? They're hurting you, and if they could be shut down, the tubes will reign fries supreme. Will the dark knight eschew his past and ride for the glory of the king and country? |
Robbie,
good that we understand eachother. I agree, it is not easy to change our tubes without hurting the, which is why we are doing it carefully. I do however disagree that the tubes are impossible to compete with or make money from. Our tubes also obviously took traffic away from a lot of people. But last time I checked, thats free market economy. If someone manages to produce a legal website which takes revenue away from us, I would be the last one to go and complain to them, instead of trying to figure out a way to beat them at their game. The thing that mostly annoys me about some people on GFY is that they seem to think I have to be sorry or ashamed of having a very professionally run corporation and a very good team of highly qualified people. Good old GFY... |
Socks,
tell me a way to get rid of sites like pornbb, torrents and such, and I'll be all over it... I think there are not many ways if any to do so. |
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Still some people fail to see through his stonewalling refusal to answer simple questions. Whatever happened to performing due diligence to know who is behind the company you are considering to do business with (and not just a single mouthpiece)? I swear, you guys would have loved Bernie Maddoff... :upsidedow It's like sheep being led to a slaughter (the sheep are content to eat the food that is fed to them, and it temporarily fattens them up, but only too late do they realize their ultimate fate): http://www.smh.com.au/ffximage/2007/..._470x311,0.jpg This industry never ceases to amaze me... :1orglaugh :helpme :disgust ADG |
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ADG,
you are an analytical genius... well, wait... sorry, you THINK you are an analytical genius. Yet you fail to realize, there actually are people making money in this industry. Good money... there is actually more to adult entertainment than GFY shockingly enough. Just because you have never heard of me or have not noticed me, does not mean I do not exist... The best people in this industry stay below the radar usually... So, again, believe me or not, this is how it is. You know whats the best about all of this? I could not care less if you believe me or not, since we are not doing business together (And of course you will reply with a grand remark like us of course never doing business in the future either since I'm a fraud anyway...)... The people that know me, the people that know Manwin and the people that do business with us or potentially would, those are the ones that believe me and that's all I will ever need. |
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Oh, I'm so hurt that you had to resort to trying to appear condescending towards me, while avoiding to answer the straightforward questions which I posed to you. That's the mark of a great Managing Partner or whatever you want people to believe you are... :1orglaugh :upsidedow http://www.coastalfloridarealestate....%20of%20oz.jpg ADG |
congrats
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ADG,
you do not want to trust me, like you claimed before.. you want to stir up shit because its fun... thats totally fine by me.. stir all you want, as I said, I could not care less.. ;) I have told you the Managing Partner explanation before.. translations obviously suck, I could not care less what some website defines "Managing Partner" to mean, I care how "Geschäftsführender Gesellschafter" is translated from german to english. Then your question about who is on the board of directors, seriously.. do you ask this to everyone? How is this any of your friggin business.. but you know, I won't make you look it up in public records: me and top level management is on the board... Again, something you will claim is all lies obviously, or will twist with some other hilarious remark trying to make me look stupid... have fun... |
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You have the influence to make such an alliance useful and beneficial, and clearly this industry needs something positive to happen. Perhaps offering an alternative in lieu of dealing with sites like pornbb would go a long way to mend bridges you seem to be intent on mending. If that's worth time and money to you, then spend it in a way that shows the rest of us that you're part of the solution going forward. This happens all the time on the world stage, and governments band together to villify, starve and hopefully eliminate their enemies. The other governments will agree to join in the parade, as long as their own needs are met in the deal. I see pornbb is sending traffic to programs like Bang Bros, Haze Cash, Program 3, etc. You could swing a deal with these companies to increase their visibility on your network of sites, in return for a harder line approach to advertising on piracy sites such as PornBB. Furthermore it's no loss to you, as those are good programs anyways that you'll make sales with. Just provide an attractive alternative for these networks to side with instead of the "bad guys" that are clearly spoiling things for the lot of us. If a network such as yours teamed up with the likes of RK, AFF, BangBros etc and actually took a stand together against these sites, things would clearly look brighter the day after. Plus you guys are so big that any positive change for the industry as a whole should benefit you the most, as you have a large percentage of that pie already for yourself. Carlos Slim who was at one point the wealthiest man in the world over the past year or two has said that being wealthy is a responsibility. A person like him must put his money to work, or the world suffers. He said that his businesses are like owning an apple orchard, in that he must try to sell all his apples every year, and never sell a tree. He also doesn't like to give money away, as he'd rather put it to use and make more with it, which he believes helps more than simply giving. Right now trees are free, apples are everywhere, and soon enough people won't even want an apple! |
Fabian, now that you guys are the new owners, will you start allowing rightful content owners to upload watermarked clips for free to your site?
if you really are interested in helping the industry out, this would be a great way to show that.. i dont think anyone would have a problem with some of their content being uploded if they were getting credit.. . |
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Socks,
in an ideal world, your approach might work. But I, and many others, have expressed the concern that there will always be some companies in this industry who will take advantage of this kind of an alliance. If RK et al stops advertising on pornbb, someone else will. It would be nice if this kind of an approach worked, and maybe it should be tried, but I think it will in the end not make a difference. I think we need to find an approach which allows everyone to make money although things are offered for free, and I am relatively sure that something will eventually be thought of that provides everyone with just that... Especially on the web, its hard to revert evolution. Also, do not forget, the nature of the web being hard to control is why we all like it. It gives us the freedom to develop our sites without having to really worry heavily about some specific country making what we do illegal... Something to think about... |
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The better the content, the more exposure it gets since people will be watching it more... |
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Every time i tried to upload my content in the past with watermarks, it was always rejected. I look forward to uploading some content and reporting back on the success... . |
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eMail me and I will get you setup on Monday. |
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You do quite well at that all by yourself (Managing Partner of what you say is a non-partnership, LOL). Although, this may be a more accurate description of your position: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5IOsliFxM3...BootLicker.jpg From what I have heard, you are just a lackey for Daniel and Sam - This Sam and Dan., whom you so far claim no knowledge of. Oh, and congrats on getting LickMyBalls banned - for a poser (OPM) millionaire you come across to me as a sniveling rat... :321GFY I guess that is why you did not respond to this post: Quote:
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The fact is, money can be quite seductive, and it sometimes skews people's perspective. If the honest content producing companies in this industry truly waged war against piracy, I doubt that we would be in the current predicament we are in. Unfortunately, too often, cynicism and greed defeats ethics. None of this affects me too much as a small independent producer with tons of marketing experience. I still spend over $100,000+ a year doing what I love, shooting content, and manage to make a profit at it. I may not be the biggest player in the industry, but I still do well, and I do not cheat or steal from anyone. :thumbsup ADG |
less than 48 hours before the faggian breakdown and he starts openly asking to suck members dicks on here
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how can you guys use say fuckyoucash content for months and months and profit by sending clicks to brazzers tour using the content you dont have the rights to, which is paid for by other companies, until we "find out" and only then is the content either removed or link codes are added, doesnt mistake the fact that you profited of something that isnt yours. how is this going to "change" while you own the "new" company. please dont give me the excuse about user submitted uploads. |
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Pornhub took traffic and sales away from a lot of people because it was started with stolen content. Answer me this one simple question. How did pornhub open from day one with content on the site. The first "member" found the site, noticed it was empty and then went to porn sites and "user submitted" the site full of stolen content. :upsidedow We ALL know that at the very least the initial bulk of videos were stolen and put there by site owners, all the way up to the point when they started working out deals with studios and buying from people. Where you with them then? Doesn't sound like it. But don't make it sound like Pornhub is just some shining example of a free market economy working. Bullshit, its more like a mob operation that eventually tries to go legit. |
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What if i had a user submitted tube they logged into brazzers took all your hd videos and uploaded them to my tube? I then used your content to be as big as you. (this will never happen just making a point) Well when you send a dmca it would be taken down so that makes my site legal as far as US law goes and like every other tube 2 weeks later its back up. We can rise and repeate the process. You can come here and say that pornhub was all user submitted content but we all know that it was not. Like Robbie says it very well may be now but from day one it was all staff. You know it i know it hell everyone knows it. So if the business started on stealing YOUR shit then goes legit after destrying all the competition and you would you still be the last one to complain or the first? |
lots of now successful affiliate programs started with stealing their content. i hope people are paying attention to who is sucking chode on this dude too. see the ones who are blowing him, and don't forget them.
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for a post that was meant to offer transparency, there is a surprising lack of it... don't u think?
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ADG,
Regarding your claims in your last posts, you are simply wrong and falling for disinformation prepared to try to destroy my image. I do not know why, but I am guessing being jelous is a bitch... This is the one and only comment to those baseless accusations. If you were not in the us, I would just sue you for even accusing me of such, sadly in a us court it is not as easy to do so as in Germany... Sucks for me. I will simply let my actions speak for themselves over the next few months and we will talk again then... Fris, sorry that I have to say so, but that is how DMCA works. DMCA is a bit more complicated than you think though and there is reasons why it exists which make perfect sense. Do our tubes use a loophole in DMCA? No, I do not think it's a loophole, it's a type of site which many people might not like. I have acquired the sites relatively recently and can not comment about things in the past, but I have said over and over again in this thread that we have plans to change certain aspects of them. I can not reveal details, but I am relatively sure most people complaining here currently will stop doing so. Interestingly enough, DMCA becomes even more important once the site is changed, but I might explain that once we are at that stage. Famous, again, I can not comment on things that happened before the acquisition, what happened or did not happen then has nothing to do with manwin. In general though, your comment with brazzers, we have to send dmca notices to websites all the time, just like everyone else. You do not see us complain. We buy ads on many of them too actually. The tubes are currently something that exists and we have to live with, why would we not try to make money with them. If we do not, someone else will. |
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That's just how it is, this is a business and it's run like any other. |
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you're not protecting trade secrets here bro... there are no 'limits to transparency'... ask every publicly traded company on the stock market. you're not publicly traded, but you're the one that claimed transparency was necessary for survival. so with that statement, you've told everyone reading that you wish to be open, honest and TRANSPARENT but now... there are limits to the information you're willing to divulge. THAT immediately waves red flags bro... i'm sure you can figure that out for yourself. if you actually backed up |
Not sure why everyone is so quick to the pitch forks.
While I'm not familiar with who the players at Virage / Manwin are, I know that the sale happened. This isn't a smoke and mirrors sale, ownership has changed hands. Any buyer in the program market can tell you this. That being said, I know for a fact that when buying a company and retaining the operational staff, last thing on your mind is changing all the company letterhead. Acquisition space is a fast action, hit them hard and see returns game. I'm sure they are all looking for ways to increase the bottom line, or integrate their more profitable business methods. I know first hand that Pornhub network of tubes have all been quietly working very hard with original content owners to further monetize the content directly and get the tubes to what they could have always been, a real traffic source for content owners to earn with. ( As long as DMCA is the loop hole, I'd take 50% of something , over 100% of nothing ) I'd say that when a guy like Fabian comes out and gives a direct line of contact, people with problems should use it. |
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You have destroyed your image here by yourself by hiding who your associates are (or as the government may more likely call them, co-conspirators). If the people in your company were such fine upstanding citizens, then why would they have anything to hide? Cockroaches run away from light. Stick to what you do best lackey: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5IOsliFxM3...BootLicker.jpg ADG |
Call me crazy but a man who can afford to drop over 100 million dollars on a criminal enterprise would not be wasting his time on GFY in such a useless conversation.
I'm calling shenanigans. |
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hahaha is a baller. A real one. And notice he doesn't waste his time here feeding trolls and those who oppose him. Real ballers don't do that. Too busy ballin'. |
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