Originally Posted by seanchai (Post 17468910)

I'm not going to get into this too much, or debate it too much as frankly, it seems that most of the people having a whine are the ones who don't really have that much to lose.

Are we going to stop piracy doing this? Absolutely not. There will always be piracy and there will always be people looking to get the content for free, these people will NEVER buy. This is an inevitable part of any business that creates a content that can be ripped off.
The problem is when potential buyers find it easier to steal content than to buy it. These lawsuits are just part of our overall strategy to go after content thieves and hopefully drive them further underground, so that those potential buyers, find it easier to go to the actual websites rather than take the risk of stealing or jumping through loops to steal it. We have other initiatives going on against the uploaders, this is specific to bit torrent downloaders.

What does Grooby hope to accomplish from this? Both a new potential revenue stream and the threat of what may happen, if you continue to poach our content.

Let's see what happens when 100 people get a legal notice stating our intention to sue, and publicize the legal action we're taking against them for downloading illegally:
"SHEMALE-MIDGET-DEEP-ANAL-FUCK-ORGY.WMV", before being so negative about the outcome. If it fails, nothing ventured, nothing gained but at least we're trying to work at this and we will find a solution instead of sitting around whining about the profits dropping.

Originally Posted by Jon Oso (Post 17467399)

Hey now. :disgust

Originally Posted by chronig (Post 17468689)

:uhoh I have no idea what the fuck you are trying to say here

Originally Posted by dyna mo (Post 17470410)

robbie, have any of the settlements you've received so far been from the 3 job working moms of 16 year olds?

Originally Posted by JimmyStephans (Post 17468398)

I have to chime in here and talk a bit about the money involved.

In 2009 I spent around $25,000.00 to take down the pirate site known as WorldPlagiates.com / WP-Board.com

You can read my long ass blog about it here:

http://wp-board.com/

Just like some people are saying in this thread -- I was told it was a money losing deal and a waste of time.

Wrong -- it was a hugely successful investment!

In the first 9 months after the board shut down and I got all the records and logs I settled with the traders for $147,500.00 in various cases ranging from as little as $250.00 to as high as $25,000.00.

This -- my friends -- was done with total legal bills of about $1000.00. Correct, almost no lawyer involvement at all, except the drafting of a settlement agreement template, and him taking a call or two from media types.

That in and of itself makes it profitable to go after people if you have a way to absolutely prove what they did.

It would surprise you who some of the assholes are stealing stuff and / or posting to boards. In the WP settlements we had a lawyer from Orlando, a real estate investor from Boston, and many others. Three of the guys took just 1-3 days to pay me $25,000.00 each... they clearly had the money to join hundreds of sites, but selected to steal and be sort of covert.

But, thats not the end of the profit story...

My main website slowly started increasing the average number of subscribers over the next few months (June 2009 to October 2009). In October 2009 it set its all time record for the total number of paid subscribers at one time. It did that in the "bad economy" that has seen many programs shut down, or people leave the business.

The only reason my 8 year old site would be growing at that time would be because they wanted the style of content I have and couldn't get it for free on the WP board. There is no other reason my site grew in that time period.

My September and October 2009 daily subscriber average was about 550 above what it had been for many, many months prior to taking down WP. That means a bit over $16,000.00 each of those two months / about $33,000.00 total that I attribute to taking down the WP boards.

But the story doesn't end there.... I don't only sell memberships. I also offer DVDs, and sales for them went up a bunch in that same time frame.

Plus -- as all businessmen that use "long term thinking" would know -- its not just getting them to pay once that counts, its getting them to pay month after month after month.

My average daily subscribers is up around 250 for each of the last 14 months (since taking down WP) when compared to the 14 months prior to that. This means of course -- once they couldn't get content for free, they paid and many of them (the new customers / former WP downloaders) decided to stay.

The WP cases are not done. I've waited months for a certain lawyer to get his act in gear after major medical issues and it hasn't happened. Just last week we changed lawyers and expect to file suits in October against the last 12 guys that have money, but selected not to settle. More income for me!

There is one HUGE difference between going after a music trader like the RIIA did, and going after a person trading pretty girl images or videos, gay images or videos, TS videos or images, etc. Nude, Non-Nude, Hardcore or super Softcore... Doesn't matter.

It is much harder for the defendant to explain to his wife, children, co-workers and others that he was trading these materials.

Telling the wife that he just downloaded a song or two might be OK.

Telling the wife he illegally downloaded GBs of photos and videos of Jordan Capri is an entirely different story.

I had one guy call me within 2 days of posting his name online and FedEx me a cashier's check for $25,000.00 just to get his name off the WP blog before his family found out.

The embarrassment factor puts Steve and his legal team in a strong position. I read the entire suit and various affidavits and such and they are in a great position to make this a winning / profitable venture!


Jimmy

Originally Posted by Dirty Dane (Post 17468736)

Maybe the ones who settle fast also are afraid to buy? They do not want their wife or bank to see their creditcard statement and email spam, instead they download free?

Pirates do not deserve that privacy but paying customers do. This industry also have to take that seriously because one thing leads to another. A bad circle can't be broken by creating it. I'm really amazed by all the spam I get after doing test signups :)

Originally Posted by TheMaster (Post 17470066)

The result of this will be lawsuits against single moms working 3 jobs, who's 16 yo son wanted to see Jordan Capri naked and you won't be one step further to solving the problem (as examples in music industry have shown us).

GO AFTER THE SUPPLY (also a far smaller number of people), as long as someone is (easily) providing it people will take it, it's the same approach that let US prisons be full with drug users and has this done anything to temper drug use?

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17470874)

Now, first of all, obviously I will get stupid replies because of who I am

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17470874)

please do not forget that I am one of the biggest content owners on the web, not only the 5000 or so Mofos and Brazzers scenes, but I also own the rights to over 160000 amateur clips (yes, 160 thousand)...

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17470874)

I can basically completely understand why Steve et al are doing this. It seems like a great way to make some extra cash from the assholes out there pirating the content.

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17470874)

My fear is two fold:
1) Just like was mentioned here, this WILL result in families being fucked because their son downloaded porn from some torrent. (It happened in the RIAA cases often enough)

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17470874)

2) We all know our industry... and the shady characters in it...

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17470874)

Robbie,

what you do is different compared to what lightspeed and such are doing! Please do not mix shit up... YOU are tagging content so you know who UPLOADED it in the first place after ripping it from your sites!!! This is _NOT_ what lightspeed et al are doing!!

At least the articles and everything in this thread scream they are not.. What they are doing is suing people that DOWNLOADED it from torrents.

Now, first of all, obviously I will get stupid replies because of who I am, but I will give you my opinion anyway... when reading it, please do not forget that I am one of the biggest content owners on the web, not only the 5000 or so Mofos and Brazzers scenes, but I also own the rights to over 160000 amateur clips (yes, 160 thousand)...

I can basically completely understand why Steve et al are doing this. It seems like a great way to make some extra cash from the assholes out there pirating the content. Point taken.

My fear is two fold:
1) Just like was mentioned here, this WILL result in families being fucked because their son downloaded porn from some torrent. (It happened in the RIAA cases often enough)
2) We all know our industry... and the shady characters in it... how long until some site owner figures out, that its much easier to extort $500 from canceled members by filing false lawsuits than it is to make them retain for $500 worth of rebills?

I can see the headlines already... let's just hope this does not work that well that people are deciding that its much easier to make money by suing people for "pirated content" than it is to actually run a site...

Originally Posted by crazytrini85 (Post 17470939)

160k on top of everything you pricks have stolen.... which is probably double that of what you actually own. That's a big fucking library of content. :thumbsup



I had to read this part like 7 times. Incredible statement coming from one of the biggest pirate companies online. I like you. You have big balls. :thumbsup



What about the families you helped ruin while creating a place online where everyone can get porn for free, crushing a lot of the little guys? You don't like you fucked people up and caused many to lose money?



Again, had to read that a few times. :1orglaugh :thumbsup

Did you have a brain fart and totally forget what company you just bought? That company is partly responsible for the piracy issues today. You guys are one of the biggest pirates online shy of a few torrents. YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM.

But I love that you post here and act like you're just one of the guys. For that, I do like you and respect the fact that you came up and could afford to buy this company, even if I don't agree with its business practices.

Originally Posted by will76 (Post 17470433)

That's awesome.

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 17470406)

TheMaster, we all have tried that. The tubes and bit torrents can't be "taken down" as the laws are written archaically and favor them. Don't you think we would have nailed them a long time ago?

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 17470406)

As far as "suing hard working Americans" ... BULLSHIT

What is being done is nailing fucking assholes who put up the content for free and destroy the porn business.

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 17470406)

I am a "hard working American" and I'm going to make my money. Fuck a thief.

The current DMCA laws leave us no choice in how to approach this. Legally we can't touch the torrent sites or tube sites or any pirate site as long as they accept us sending them a dmca to take down a video.

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 17470406)

And yeah, it would be a lot better it you could just write them and ask them to take ALL your stuff down and please never post it again.

But that isn't how it works. You have to ask them to take down each video individually. And they just put it right back up again an hour later. And you have to write them again, and again, and again.

Now multiply that by a thousand tubes and torrents.

You keep posting about this like you have some sort of agenda. Well, so do I. My agenda is to nail every fucking person that steals from me.

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17470967)

I have absolutely no problem with suing the people that upload the content, be my guest...

Originally Posted by will76 (Post 17470442)

I think you are confused, this is against the people who are uploading porn, not downloading it. The people uploading it is the supply. If the uploaders stop then the site is empty and there is nothing to download. I don't believe they are sueing people who downloaded (watched) it, just the people who got it from their site (or other people who was a member of their site) and then decided to upload it and give away something they stole.

Originally Posted by SteveLightspeed (Post 17470976)

Great, so will you provide me with the IPs of the people that uploaded my content to your tube sites?

Actions speak louder than words. :2 cents:

Steve Lightspeed

Originally Posted by TheMaster (Post 17470986)

I hope you're right, but the article says:

Quote:
targeting bit torrent users who allegedly downloaded their works.
The trio of federal lawsuits, all filed by Chicago attorney John Steele, name hundreds of unnamed surfers who may have downloaded a rainbow assortment of films, from solo girl to tranny content, within the past two weeks.

Originally Posted by SteveLightspeed (Post 17471001)

I think its more accurate to say we are going after people SHARING our copyrighted work.

Originally Posted by SteveLightspeed (Post 17471001)

I think its more accurate to say we are going after people SHARING our copyrighted work.

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17470997)

Steve,

We can provide what we store if we legally are allowed to provide it, I am no lawyer so I can not say what is required, but as far as I know a subpoena is, even under DMCA law data can not be given out until its subpoena'd.

This might sound stupid to you, but that's how it is. Obviously we provide you with the data we are legally allowed and/or required to give.

Originally Posted by SteveLightspeed (Post 17471015)

Since tubes use the DMCA law claiming they are HOSTS, I would expect you should have to keep logs of people who upload to your sites. Thanks for the ideas, subpoenas will be forthcoming. :thumbsup

Steve Lightspeed

Originally Posted by TheMaster (Post 17470975)

then at least make their lives difficult as hell: flood their hosts with DMCA notices, some will even immediately block the content. You might not be able to bring down the biggest ones, but a lot if not most of medium sized ones will cave.

Also stop letting them be affiliates, sponsors have been turning a blind eye to this for years.
Over the years I've contacted a ton of the sponsors who's members area content was put on sites by their own affiliates, at least 50% of the time nothing was done. Even Playboy Legal didn't suspend an affiliate who had basicully put the whole Cyber Club member's area online.



look I'm just saying that's how they'll spin it
and yes I agree if they would sue the guys who put up all this content, it would be great, but randomly (that's what's in the article says) suing people who downloaded it, no.
Go after the ones who are sharing a whole bunch of content, not the one who downloaded some of the content and don't share it after they downloaded it



okay, say they sent the DMCA notices, why don't they sue them after the torrent site didn't take down the torrent, I search Tawnee Stone on isohunt for instance, some stuff has been on there for 200-300 days



sent the DMCA to their hosts, much more effective (Paris from Play With Paris is doing it this way)

no agenda, just goes against my perception of fairness, going after little consumers, because you can't or won't go after the big providers, hell no, go after the pirates, we've heard enough horror stories about when RIAA did this

and again: clean up your affiliates

Originally Posted by tony299 (Post 17471046)

if someone is stealing then they arent a consumer.

Originally Posted by TheMaster (Post 17471020)

To make it very clear where I stand: as an affiliate who follows the rules (maybe I'm stupid for doing this), I would love nothing more for sponsors to clean up the abuse within & have the big fights.
But going after little people, I've no interest in that, because it won't help my conversions, it seems unfair when the big guys stay safe, and it'll just result in horror stories about the industry.

Originally Posted by TheMaster (Post 17471156)

really??? you can't mean such an idiot thing right? (or do you really buy the nonsense RIAA is peddling)

you're claiming that people who download music, movies, porn, ... without paying never pay for content? I seem to remember Harvard research claiming that big music downloaders for instance also buy more music than most people.
Also reality prooves you wrong: most people have a mix of things they paid for and things they didn't pay for.

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17470874)

I can see the headlines already... let's just hope this does not work that well that people are deciding that its much easier to make money by suing people for "pirated content" than it is to actually run a site...

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 17470967)

I do not particularly like it when someone calls me a thief since I have not stolen anything ever in my life...

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 17471164)

I understand what you're saying...but you also have to understand that there ARE millions and millions of people stealing out there..

Originally Posted by DamianJ (Post 17471181)

That's exactly what I thought when I read this Fabian. Why bother making a site, when you can just blackmail people into giving you some cash.

Innocent until proven guilty? Fuck that shit, let's just extort some money from some people someone allegedly downloaded a file that may or may not be copyrighted. After all, this isn't about proof, it's about scaring some potential customers into giving you hush money.

More at http://www.adultmarketing.co.uk/2010...wer-to-piracy/