all traffic is good traffic if you know what you are doing. :2 cents:

What they said.

people only sell thier traffic when they can't convert it, simple as that. I have always done fairly well on my sites converting the traffic sent out and guess what, i have never sold traffic to traffic holder or anyone like that in 11 years. Bought traffic is good for building trades and thats about it.

I find it amazing that you can't spend a few hundred on 3-4 of the traffic sellers with good reputations and determine which one gives you the best roi if any. If I'm looking to buy some advertising for my offline business, I can't get a breakeven guarantee from the billboard company or the tv/radio ad spot.

Steve, back in the early 2000's did you have someone else handling all the traffic for Lightspeed? Some of your questions and concerns in this thread are ones I would have expected to hear from you back in 2001.

this is kinda hard to do these days steve, years ago ya, but not now

I get 10000s daily from google, very targeted, VERY targeted

some days it does good, others nothing, it isnt the same guys everyday on the sites, hard to tell if tomorrow there will be 1 - 10 - 100 guys with their CC in hand ready to pay.

hope that makes sence, very tierd lol

Great thread

Traffic providers that provide a break even guarantee please post here.
You will get lots of biz

lol :thumbsup:1orglaugh

Buying traffic is equivalent to buying an advertisement. Due to its nature the guarantees you can get from a traffic broker are limited to the amount of hits, traffic source and visitor's region/location. These few guarantees you just read are more than what most media shops offer through traditional ad placement sources like tv, radio and print.

A reputable and experienced traffic broker in most cases can tell upfront if your service or product will turn profitability given his rates and traffic sources. I would take this as the reason behind the lack of interest.

try some traffic services, i think it is better

hope you like torrent traffic steve.

break even guarantee?

hunh??? :upsidedow:warning

Why would they do that?? You not going to get any takers.


If you don't want to take risks with traffic, that is why you have affiliates. Which is one thing that program owners take for granted with affiliates... The program owner never loses money on the deal (revshare). The affiliate takes all of the risk, can lose money on the traffic deal but the program owner always wins (revshare). A lot of programs forget this until it comes time for them to venture into the world of traffic on their own. (not pointing fingers at you steve). Just about every time I do good from a traffic deal I strike out on one and lose money.

First of all traffic sellers do just that, sell. They typically don't become affiliates or do "guarantees" which is a partnership, aka affiliate. Secondly, I doubt you are going to find any of them give a guarantee when it comes down to more of how well *you* convert their traffic. If your site doesn't do well converting they not going to take the hit for it.

I could send traffic to you and make $10 I could send traffic to someone else and make $30. It depends more on YOUR product, not the traffic broker. The sites that convert the best can afford to pay the most for traffic. There is a pretty good chance that the traffic broker could sell the traffic to someone else and make more straight up then partnering with you.

I want Steve's deal :1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh:1orglaugh Like i mentioned in my previous post, I can't tell you how many thousands of dollars I lost on traffic buys. But I have also made lots of money too. Its hit or miss. Hell sometimes I have to go through several bad deals to find one gem. It sounds like you have never purchased traffic before.


you sell a membership to a picture and video membership site. What incentive do people have to rebill? Especially since the majority of your content is on tube sites for free. You product is more of an issue here, not the traffic broker.


Steve, not to sound harsh but I am convinced you have never purchased traffic before. "extend the offer till you break even" doesn't happen. If I send you joins and you paying me 50% revshare but your members keeping cancelling and no one rebills, can I contact you and say "Hey Steve, I spent $1,000 to send you traffic and I only made back $800 and everyone cancelled, if you increased my % to 80% then I would make my $1,000 back, deal???" I'm guessing you wouldn't do that.

wrong. people sell traffic because they can typically sell it for more than *THEY* can make from it. People focus on different things. Some choose to focus just on traffic, and spend all of they time buying and selling it and not trying to work with 1000 different programs to find out which is the best to send it to, what promos work the best, etc. Most affiliates learn to do both, generate traffic and learn what converts best. Traffic brokers typically don't care or don't have skill at the conversion part.

ALSO, when program owners buy traffic their profit margin is a lot better than affiliates. For example, an affiliate buys traffic and make 50% rev share with a particular company, and can lose a few bucks on the deal where as the company owner can pay more, and still profit because of the margins. So in that case the traffic broker can make more selling it then if he was to use it himself as an affiliate. And then the fact that some programs can convert and monetize the traffic better than other programs can cause those programs to pay even more for it.

Well said Howard.

Steve you have a way of starting great threads that encourage discussion.

nope, because there is profit in pay $500 and making $500. it's a loss after expenses

A break even guarantee ... that's funny :)

I could understand a quality test, but good traffic sources are gold, and they definitely aren't going to need to chase anyone with a break even guarantee. 3/4 of the traffic buying game is finding the places that convert, the rest you put down to lessons.

I don't know what is worst, this thread or the one about the next LightSpeed superstar that was made last week.

Steve you are out of touch. I would tell you to lean on others you know for help but chances are most of the bros are out of touch too. If they are not, no one is going to take the time needed to really help you out. You going to need to pay someone to help you man. Spend some money and hire the best person you know to try to help you get your company back on track. It's obvious you care, and you want to put the time, effort and money to building it back up. Put the "12 years" and millions you made in the past behind you, put you ego in check, let some people more in touch with the environment today and that knows how to make money in today's market help you and listen to them. Don't take offense to that and feel the need to be defensive, this is the best advice someone can give you. Things change fast on here, 12 years on the net is a lifetime, you can't keep doing the same thing forever, you have to make changes.

btw, if you focus on making your site more profitable, then you can afford to pay affiliates more, and thus you will attract tons of affiliates and have all the traffic you could ever want with no risk to you. (THAT is the key to everything for you).

would the same concept apply to "consulting services"?

the local appliance store has a big sale this weekend on stoves and fridges...
they buy a full page ad in the local paper...quite a few people show up for the sale but not many buy stoves or fridges...
now, is it the papers fault for having the wrong people read the ad or the stores fault for not closing the sale?

absolutely. Are you not familiar with how consultants work??? It's not uncommon for bigger companies online and offline to use consultants. Are you saying all consultants should start/run their own company instead of consulting for other companies?

like a violin

#100 (Page 3)

You know I always said the same until recently. We got so many pages we could probably make tons on but which we are not since we don't have the time to monitize it properly.

So what do we do, waste it or sell it? We sell it! Since a week now kind of as a test http://users.ero-advertising.com/buy...d=52633&days=7

So Steve, you know how we used to do with you --> http://users.ero-advertising.com/buy...d=52633&days=7

Its up to you to convert the traffic though :2 cents:

Converting traffic takes time, skills etc. It makes perfect sense for some people (especially those with larger networks) to sell some of their traffic.

Let's say your main interracial sponsor's conversion ratio's dropped below a certain point and you are busy working on a new project and just don't have the time right now to research and evaluate other interracial sponsors. In that case it would make perfect sense to redirect your interracial banner clicks to a traffic broker until you have the time to research other interracial sponsors.

Let's say your main lesbian sponsors converts great on US traffic but doesn't convert German traffic. In that case it makes sense to send your German traffic to another lesbian sponsor, one that is able to convert German traffic. And it might also make sense to send your mobile lesbian traffic to yet another sponsor.... It might even make sense to send your lesbian traffic coming from one traffic source to a revshare link and lesbian traffic coming from another traffic source to a PPS link.

Getting the most of our your traffic takes a lot of time and effort and some times it makes more sense to sell (some of) your traffic for a lower (but guaranteed) price than investing more time and earning more as an affiliate.

If (($income-from-affiliate-programs - $opportunity-cost-of-earning-income-from-affiliate-programs - $income-from-selling-traffic) < $a-certain-level){ print "it makes sense to sell productive traffic"; }

I disagree. How much money people are able to make from their traffic depends on the amount of work (time, effort, employees) they are willing to invest in converting that traffic. Most people who sell traffic, sell it for less than they would be able to make from it if they invested the right amount of work into it, but they accept a lower, but guaranteed, amount in exchange for having to invest less work into it.


Exactly, different people are good at different things. Some people are good at writing descriptions. Some people are good at design work. Some people are good at seeing the bigger picture and analyzing traffic and understanding how niche A traffic might also be interested in niche B but not in niche C. Some people are good at managing other people. Some people are good at creating nice A landing pages but suck at making niche D landing pages. Some people are good at seo. some ....


The main problem here is the fact that a lot of webmasters don't understand what they are doing. The common misconception is that traffic = sales. If the traffic doesn't convert it must be bad traffic and if someone is selling his traffic it must be because his traffic is bad. The reality is that making money requires hard work. Generating traffic requires work. Coming up with new ways to generate traffic requires work. Getting the most money out of your traffic requires more work than getting less money out of your traffic. Increasing your profit margins from 20% to 70% requires a certain amount of work. Increasing your profit margins from 70% to 95% requires even more work. So it might be more interesting to operate a business at a 70% profit margin instead of at a 95% profit margin, if you can invest the amount of work you would other wise invest to increase your profit margin from 70% to 95% in another business.

btw: same thing applies to people buying traffic.

Investing a certain amount of money buying traffic makes perfect sense because the fact that you don't need to invest a certain amount of work generating traffic yourself, means you can invest more work in converting traffic.

It all depends on what your goals and your weak and strong points are.

There's a no quick and easy way to get rich.

I know trafficshnop traffic is good quality traffic!

i would stand behind my traffic to that level if you would stand behind your product to that level

if you changed your affiliate program to guarrentee that pay out as much money as any best converting sponsor for all traffic sources.

in other words if your site converts 1:1000 and some other teen sponsor converts 1:100 for a traffic source, you would add 9 extra signups in fees to the affiliate check and take the lose, becaue your product offering was substandard.

once you got your house in order so that those loses were managable,
once you have proven that your product is not going to negatively undermine the traffic source, i would be willing to stand as a gateway between traffic source.(i will take the loss)

i know who to get lots of traffic from torrents, tubes, etc.
your sites are just not designed to convert well with that traffic.

Stupid thread. Say you want more affiliates and cut the bullshit.

Its called "backlinks" and its related to this thing called SEO, dipshit

I don't think there is such a thing as good or bad traffic, nor good or bad products, it's more about finding a match between a traffic and a product.

Steve you can let affiliates take the risk, let them give a try to your products risking the few days or hours of traffic they send to test. Or you can take the risk on your side, prepaying for traffic to find a few sellers on who you're going to convert more than the average because their traffic likes your products. most long time sellers will do efforts to meet you in the middle if things go bad, but therre is no such thing as a garanty because nobody can guess which traffic is going to work on which product. I had my products do great on one site and poor on the other and I could hardly tell why.

Don't ask for guarrentee but ask to test. Stay away from sellers asking 4 figures to start and refuse to do a few hundreds bucks test. Spend a few hundreds on various sources where you get clear info about where the traffic comes from, select the ones you'd surf as a fan of your products, be ready to not break even 7 times out of ten (think as it's your research budget) and go big with the few ones were you found that good match.

As for the whales, if you feel their traffic really fit, I found that a prepaid five or six figures check on higher percentage revshare makes their heads turn.

Once again, you're either wait hopping they'll take the risk or risk your money to try to make money now. Last but not least, when an affiliate is risking his traffic on your products, he give or take hopes to make his money back with 50-60% of revshare, where on your side you can afford to go up to almost 90% given your productions costs are paid for and your bandwidth is not killing you.

my 2cc, good luck with your new girl :)

obviously you missed the whole point.

you actually proved my point, to my comment " people sell traffic because they can typically sell it for more than *THEY* can make from it. "

sure "if" they had the time, "if" they had the skill, "if" they had the employees... lots of "if"s. Time is also money, so if they spend a lot of time to make a little more with their traffic they still NET less. And some of them don't have the time, staff, skill etc. therefore they can sell it for more money then they could make from using it themselves. Whether it was by their choice because they chose to spend the time buying/generating/selling traffic because they were better at that or because they didn't have the skill to convert it. It does take skill to convert traffic. What ever the reason is it doesn't matter, especially as an AFFILIATE, they can usually sell it for more then they can make from it. If for nothing else, a program OWNER has much better profit margins then an AFFILIATE. Can't expect traffic brokers to go start their own sites so they can have the same profit margins as owners so they can make more from their traffic. Everyone can't do everything and be good at everything.

well, id like my consultants to be successful above all (im not implying you are not)

when i started on gfy you were running teamclickcash and i guess making 1mil./yr, which was very impressive and i was like, how can i do that?

but now that sales are down throughout the industry, with nearly every business taking steps to stop it, change, adapt, etc, with typically fruitless results

what on your recent resume can show us that you can do any better than business owners like steve have been trying, other than you think you know how to, that l hear in all the threads you post in, what have you done lately?

a picture of something that shows you are successful would suffice, i figure if you can figure out how to live good on your own, you have figured out how to monetize websites

car, house, something that would show your advice should stand out above the average gfy yapper, would shut me up right away

Good analogy :thumbsup

Although you forgot to say that there had previously been articles in the same paper saying how everything in the appliance store was available for free from another source.

show "us"? who are you? are you looking for consulting services?

Sorry I am not jumping through your hoops just to please you for shit and giggles. If someone serious has questions they can contact me directly.

I've offered to provide consulting for serious people here with a money back guarantee. That's all you need to know. If you don't like what I provide you don't pay for it. No one is going to find a better deal than that.

I stand behind my optimization and targetting quality of my traffic that I've only sent traffic on an affiliate basis because I'm willing to take the risk of unprofitable campaigns. I know most traffic sellers don't operate this way, but with great risk comes great reward and I do spend an enormous amount of time/resources to optimize my traffic to death. Good luck finding sellers though that feel the same way though :)
WG

What point? People buy traffic either for feeder traffic, or to make sales with it. People that sell traffic are most often selling it for far more than its worth. It has zero to do with seo. Not sure why you think buying/renewing 100s of domains, setting them up on multiple servers, their own class c's, setting up sites on each of them, building backlinks to all of them daily and then offering backlinks to others when they can just "do it themselves" is somehow an analogy that makes sense. It's a very expensive and time intensive endeavor. A person could use your moronic reasoning and ask why anyone pays for anything at all.

Read all my posts in this thread. In my reply to your post, I used sarcasm to point out the fact that if your logic (being that people sell traffic because it is worth less than what they are asking for it or that they can't convert it) is applied to other products (like hardlinks), it would make those products appear worthless or overpriced as well.

"People buy traffic either for feeder traffic, or to make sales with it." This is incorrect. There are a lot more ways to USE bought traffic. Personally, I've been buying traffic every month for almost 5 years now and all I can say is: I'm not in the business of throwing away money.

"Those who cannot attack the thought, instead attack the thinker." -- Paul Valery

That being said, if you carefully reread my other posts in this thread, you'll see that I tried to explain one of the basic principles of economics: devision of labour. Once you understand that, you'll understand why some people sell designs, why some people run paysites, why some people sell content, why some people sell hosting, why some people sell traffic,...

Let's rephrase things: Given the amount of work (time/effort/money/skill) the traffic seller is able (or willing) to invest to turn the traffic in to money, selling his traffic might be the most profitable option for him. This however tells us nothing about the (potential) value of the traffic to the buyer. It tells us nothing about whether or not it's possible to convert the traffic.

So I'd say we agree for the most part.