Should I leave the adult content business? (pics and vids)
 

It has been over two weeks since I posted about finding a program where I can focus on producing a few great sites. I want to thank everyone for their kind words and for all the responses from various owners/content managers.

I received about 20 inquiries the first few days and about 10 of them still expressed interest even after I told them my rates. I had no idea I would receive such a warm response and had I expected this I would have just emailed program owners individually instead of posting on the boards.

Obviously I could have handled the negotiations better but since there were a few people saying they were ready to begin ordering scenes I got a little flustered and asked for decisions from a few other program owners who were kind of sitting on the fence or busy with other matters at the time. I may have turned 1 or 2 of you off by my sense of urgency. I sincerely apologize to you if this is the case.

My problem is that the 2 people who said they were ready to order scenes from me are MIA. Now I am back to square one.

So let's try this again and this time I will be very specific about what I have to offer as well as my costs/rates.

My rate for a standard b/g scene is $2,900. Why this amount? Well let's take a look at my out of pocket costs:

Female talent is $900-$1,000 in Los Angeles plus you have the agency fee of $100

Male talent is $500 to $600 for someone really good

Make up is $150 for someone who can make these girls look attractive.

My location fees are $200-$400. (and this is dirt cheap)

I also don't just show up with a Vx2100, a couple of shop lights from home depot, and a cheap camera with on-camera flash. I show up with $25,000 in photo/video/lighting equipment.

So lets say that wear and tear on my equipment is $200 per day. This is insanely low since even a little wear/damage to any of my equipment can cost several hundred to fix. And anyone who challenges this charge can kiss my ass because it shows they have never actually been part of any real production in their lives.

Plus you have some other minute costs that do add up to a figure worth including. A little bit of munchies on set are needed as well as lube, wipes, enemas, douches, some wardrobe/props, pro tape stock, and Fed-Ex add up. Lets put that figure at $100 per scene.

So let's say my costs per scene add up to about $2,300.

So for $600 (similar to what the male talent gets paid) I book the scenes, make up artist, location. I set everything up myself (no money for assistant). I shoot both stills and video. I take 100% of the risk so if the scene does not go down I may have to pay a kill fee to one of the talent. ( I am not like most producers where I will just substitute anyone with a heart beat). I pay the talent, do all legal paperwork and interviews, break down, clean up the location. Then I do a rough edit because most porn editors are not used to working with people who set up their shots (most directors shoot on full auto mode). I also pic out the best stills and do some retouching.

Now, of course I COULD start taking things out of my production. I could skip the make up artist but then the model would look like hell. I could use a cheap cheesy echo-filled studio but then you would not have the nice lighting, sound, look, and energy that a decent location provides. I could use cheap equipment but then the quality of picture/lighting would not be as good. I could use cheaper male talent but then he might not be able to get wood or cum when needed.

I could also get costs down by shooting 5 scenes a day and also trick the girls into doing lots of extra mini-scenes but then the quality goes way down because I would not have time to set every shot up so that it looks the way I want it to.

So for $2,900 you get a scene that will stand out in the sea of mass-produced content and perhaps that will be the deciding factor in whether a surfer joins your site instead of the other 1,000 sites in the similar niche.
You also get an extremely loyal guy who will bust his ass to constantly deliver the best product available. I will also help promote your sites and create all kinds of extra cool promo content.

I am giving this one more shot. If courting the web titans does not work out then I have meetings later this month with two of the biggest DVD companies. If nobody is willing to pay this budget then I am going back to mainstream production where 90% of porn producers would be laughed off the set.

I have a $20,000 HD camera on order and need to pay that bill so no time to sit idle and hope one of you comes around eventually.

BTW, my video samples are nowhere near the quality I am able to produce. I have had to tone down my style in order to comply with customer wishes.

So if you are interested and ready to being ordering scenes before Febuary 20th (the date I start my meetings with the DVD companies) then email me at [email protected]

Thank you!
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Here are a few links video samples and below are some of my recent photos.
B/G video samples
http://www.expovids.com/samples/interracial_comp.wmv
Lesbian video samples
http://www.expovids.com/samples/lesbian_comp.wmv
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/lsample.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/carli_sample_1.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/carli_sample_2.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/cari_sample_2.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/Austyn2.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/DSC_0118.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/naomi.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/interracial.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/5.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/8.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/6.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/102.jpg
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http://www.expovids.com/samplepics/99.jpg

Hot stuff.. looking good. That Latina is a stunner!

Every single one of those chicks are smoking hot, and amazing shots. Great work.

Looks good...hotttt!

thanks man, I will hit you up for any coding I might need in the future :thumbsup

wow, amazing pics and hot girls.

Wow! Those videos are great!!! :thumbsup

Did that chick really squirt on your camera like that, or was there some sort of barrier inbetween?

I would been screaming like a wild banshee f*cking if someone got my camera all wet like that - you sir, are a true professional videographer. <tips hat>

Best of luck in finding work...you definitely have the chops, now you just need the hook-up...

ADG Webmaster

You definitely shouldn't leave the content business. I promote interracial.com especially and I really noticed the quality of the stuff you shot.

Maybe it's a matter of having face-to-face meetings and doing more networking. Have you been to any shows?

Your work is very good. I am wondering, however, where you found a white guy with a black cock.

There may be a niche there....

Thanks for your kind words. I water-proofed my camera before that scene.:pimp

That figures...she made me want to wax my surfboard - SURFS UP!!!

People with programs should check out the videos - the stills are very good, but the video is totally awesome...

ADG Webmaster

you will never find a program that is willing to pay $2,900 per b/g scene on an ongoing basis. just the brutal facts of life in this industry for a content shooter.

did these clients you had stop buying because of the price and find somebody to shoot cheaper?

Mutt,

Thanks for posting in my thread:thumbsup

I am on good terms with them but do not want to comment on any former client's business.

BTW, I have worked on movies for DVD companies with larger budgets when you break the costs down per scene. I was not the producer/director on those.

that's not it at all - it's just prices, they all want a Mercedes for the price of a Ford.

and no doubt interracial.com bought some stuff off him exactly because they know affiliates would be impressed and start promoting - once that is done there's no reason for them to keep spending the $2,900 per scene cuz they've already hooked the affiliates into believing. order 10 scenes of the good stuff to impress then go get 100 DVD's for 100-200 dollars a pop and nobody is the wiser. maybe they found a much cheaper shooter to shoot exclusives for them cheaper. there are ways to cut corners where you can sell for less $2,900 and make a modest profit - get rid of the location cost, the makeup cost, shoot multiple scenes in a day, use male talent that works for 200 bucks rather than 500 dollars etc

it's an expensive proposition to run exclusive content sites - 4 shoots a month x $2-3,000 each - the great programs like NastyDollars, Bangbros, FTVGirls, Twistys, DDGirls, etc do it week in week out, month in month out, year in year out.

most of those guys shooting for the DVD companies have it almost as rough - they are given bigger budgets than web companies will pay for but the studios expect alot - not just vanilla B/G - they want B/B/G and G/G/B - that adds to the talent costs - they want anal, DP, DAP, all that shit and that adds to the cost of talent. they want locations and makeup and wardrobe to be done nice - the pretty girl stills sets .
the high end of the gonzo DVD game has a budget of $25,000 for five scenes - and i'm not sure how many these days when all DVD companies sales are down are giving their directors $25,000 budgets.

you are best off trying to do a deal with a good gonzo studio - cuz no web company is going to meet your price. one possibility is trying to retain the DVD rights to what you shoot - so the web company gets high quality exclusive content for their price and you get to sell the same stuff to a DVD company - i thought this would work but the DVD companies I talked to insisted that they also have web rights.

if you have possibilities in mainstream production - go for that. i think alot of mainstream production guys moonlight in the porn biz.

Greg, what you are experiencing is nothing new in the adult business. When my contract was over with Twistys, I had lots of interest from programs wanting me to do some projects for them. Everything was fine until we started talking about rates and then....same as you - they went MIA. They don't return emails and they never explained why they cut off communications. Luckily that wasn't the case for all those that contacted me but it was the case for a few big names in the biz. It's very disappointing to build a rapport with some big names in this business only to have them totally ignore you after a few email exchanges....but that's the nature of the beast!

All I can tell you is that your work is much better than average and if a program owner doesn't want to dish out extra money to get the "good shit"...fuck'm. There are other programs out there who understand and appreciate what it takes to make good content and they will pay you for it. They are few and far between....but they do exist. You may have to put up with bullshit from 20 program owners to find one that appreciates quality and your skills....but don't give up.

It's been my experience that some of the biggest and most successful programs are the ones that don't want to spend anything on content. Aside from a few large programs, most of my work is now coming from smaller programs that appreciate what I have to offer and don't mind paying for it. You only need a couple of good customers to make a great living so don't give your shit away. I was telling a friend the other night that I could shoot 5 days a week if I would cut my rate in half but I would rather shoot 2 days a week and keep my rates where they are. Work smarter....not harder :thumbsup

Mutt is a good man and he knows a lot about the business but you can't listen to people when they tell you that no one will pay this and that for your material. If I listened to everyone telling me that I charge too much...I'd be working my ass off 5 days a week and barely making it. Your content is top notch and I know how hard you work to put out a great product. You take pride in your work and it shows. There are guys out there who will pay you for your work and take good care of you - you just have to find them. It's not easy but it is possible :thumbsup

Your costs all seemed in order for what you were saying. And btw - you do great work. Your Lorena pics are great. She's such a great model... I love working with her. The only thing I thought was completely out of line was the $200 a day equipment wear and tear. I guess since I'm challenging that charge I can kiss your ass, but it's not gonna make you any more right. That would mean for every 10 shoots I could get a brand new vx2100! Every 2 1/2 shots for a new centry optics shoot thru wide angle. Every 3 or 4 shoots I could be buying extra lights. Maybe I just take better care of my equipment... Am I crazy???? Hell, I even have 2 TRV900's back from 98 that have only needed $500 in repair in 9 years. Like I said, all your other fees are straight on (although I agree with Mutt on the things you could lose to save money and get more clients), and your content is great, so I'm not trying to flame you at all.... Just can't see $200 worth of wear and tear per shoot on my equipment (or anyone elses).

The program owner who snaps me up will see I am a good investment. I am going to promote the hell out of the site, the conversions will be better, the retention will be better, more affilates will sign up to promote the sites.

I have spent some time on various surfer forums and even though my scenes account for a small percentage of the number of scenes on those sites it is my scenes that are being discussed.

Mr Marcus even complained to me one time about how they are talking about my scenes on his website. :1orglaugh :1orglaugh

Perhaps people are getting fucking sick of all the badly shot content. I just watched a video of Amy Reid and the "director" did not even have the brains to have her tits hanging out while she was giving the blowjob.

Imagine paying $2k for a girl with the best tits in the history of planet earth and not having them exposed and flopping around during the entire tease and blowjob scene. Content like that is TOTAL SHIT and I consider it a waste of money. Pay a little more money and get something good.

I could make a hell of a lot more money if I went the mass-produced route but I got into content production because I love the feedback I get from people who enjoy my work. I highly doubt anyone will ever remember that Amy Reid scene that other guy shot except for the fact the "director" managed to fuck up a scene with an extremely hot girl.

This guy may have a good point. I would refrain from showing the client an itemized list of your costs for a shoot. They don't need to know how much you paid for snacks, water, video tape, paper towels, trash bags, baby wipes or wear and tear on your camera and lighting gear. Just tell them what your day rate is to produce that top-notch shit that they want and go from there.

Thanks for your compliment:thumbsup Yeah, Lorena is a cool chick to work with for sure.

Thanks for your advice Mutt, I respect your opinions and knowledge. :thumbsup

Mutt is suggesting here things that you can do to cut your cost but the problem is that this is exactly what everybody else is doing to cut their costs. I could cut the cost of my hair/makeup artist and my 2 assistants and shoot all my stuff in a motel 6 and could be shooting 7 days a week but that's not the kind of stuff that I want to do. I want to shoot high-quality content. Stuff that takes time, effort and skills to shoot. I don't want my shit looking like everyone elses and I don't want to compete with everyone else for the clients dollar. The only way to separate yourself from the pack is to do the things that they are NOT doing. Get a good hair/makeup artist, shoot in a nice location and take some pride in what your doing. Your not one of those videgraphers who only shoots for money - you shoot because you love shooting and it's important to you to put out some good shit. :thumbsup

Yeah but what about batteries for the vibrators? Girls keep stealing them and that costs lots of dough :1orglaugh

awesome pics! love the sites too ...

Couldn't a shooter retain the DVD rights for him/herself and partner to push out the DVD's himself? Although more web companies are compiling their scenes and going web-->DVD, if a web company wants to get scenes at a lower rate, isn't this feasible?

Well it's not as if he has a proper paysite, so he should actually be happy they're talking about his scenes with you. :winkwink:

amazing content

I know!!!!!! I thought rechargeable batteries would be so much cheaper till 4 or 5 sets left my house. Now I get those cheap ass, only gonna work for the scene batteries.

$500-600 for male talent? have the rates gone up that much in the last 3-4 years? last time I was out in LA the good guys got $400 TOPS, and the new guys or ok looking guys got $100-200

way the fuck up - all the top guys want and are getting as much as the girls in many cases. it's the male talent who makes a scene go - especially with newer girls - so the good male talent is in demand and the price goes up.
$400 these days gets you the mid level guys.

Thanks Batts, I always read your threads because you often have great pics of little hotties :thumbsup

holy shit man...I have to say that is great for the guys though, back when we were there, there were guys doing 3-2 scenes a day just because their were only getting $150-250 per scene, when the girls would get upwards of $800-1200, it was nuts

Thanks, I gotta give a lot of the credit for my pics to Dean Capture. Prior to knowing him I gotta admit I was terrified of taking stills. I had no problem shooting video but as soon as you put a still camea in my hands and a model in front of me I lost all confidence. Of course I am not in Dean's league at all and maybe I never get there but I am a hell of a lot further along just because of the confidence I received by knowing him.

Not only is he an amazing talent but a class act as well.

Never thought I'd see the day when male talent got paid the same as female talent. Interesting thread.

That first pic is insanely hot. Nice looking content.

If you are a decent looking guy with a big dick and can keep wood then you have no problem getting $700 per scene. And you can do 2 scenes a day on a regular basis.

Sascha, Scott Nails, Christian, and lots of other guys do that all week long. And some of these guys also come with a booking fee unless you were working with them prior to them being represented by an agent.

Hey guys.

I don't want to write any long coments, Dean and Mutt has already said what there is to say...

Greg you do great stuff, and you should be paid for it...many ppl think that we charge to much without thinking about our costs, and we will probably have some more hard times before ppl realise that good content costs money, but it also attract more members to their paysites.

A lot has happend since the new 2257 rules, and a lot of providers has closed down their shops, but hang in there...you will make it.

" if you pay with peanuts, then you get monkeys"...:thumbsup

Cheers to all
Michael

You've got some high quality content there...

:)

Wow, thanks Michael. Yeah I know I will be ok, there is one big DVD company head who has already talked to me on the phone and invited me to meet with him before I talk to his head of production.

So if I get a DVD deal I can use that money to show people what I can really do - shoot at similar quality you see on actual films. That RED camera I have on order is going to allow shooting with depth of field, speed changes, rack focus, etc. All this for just a few hundred extra dollars a scene. If these program owners had any clue as to how big of a revolution this is and the opportunites for extra exposure by producing this type of content they would be jumping at the chance.

Imagine your content or promo material being projected onto a massive wall or side of a building. Do ya think that would get some attention and distinguish you from your competition? Do you think that would be worth a few extra hundred a scene?

And what about professional sound? Do you think more people would remember your company name if every breath, every moan, every moment is captured on movie quality sound? The lack of vision in the adult industry is amazing but I know I will find that one person who sees the light.

Are you saying that the guys get PAID to do this? I'm going to ask about this next time I'm at the unemployment office picking up my check.

Do you think that the average internet porn shooter thinks about sound like that? I would say no. Do you think the average internet porn shooter will spend a few thousand dollars on a state-of-the-art mic and a boom stand and sound mixer to get the best sound he could....as you have done? Naaaaa - I think not. That's just one of the things that I mean when I talk about how you have passion for your work. That's one of the things that makes you stand out from the crowd and of course....one of the reasons why you should get more for your vision. Shit man - we should find an investor and kickoff the Greg & Dean Project :winkwink: