CCBill WMS ? The Road Ahead: An Open Letter to our WMS Sponsors & Their Affiliates

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  • RonC
    Confirmed User
    • Jul 2002
    • 236

    #1

    CCBill WMS ? The Road Ahead: An Open Letter to our WMS Sponsors & Their Affiliates

    For years you?ve known CCBill as an organization full of innovation and drive. Our history not only reflects the growth we have achieved, it also (and perhaps more importantly) is marked by the levels of trust you have placed in us. Many have grown right along with us, and we are extremely proud to continue to serve as a solid, steady online payment processor for our valued clients.

    Over the past few months, CCBill has staged the launch of its new affiliate marketing product, Web Marketing Service (WMS). Our intent for this expanded system was, and remains, to further improve the functionality and performance of the affiliate marketing initiatives of our clients and their affiliates, without the added cost of a third party solution.

    In recent weeks, much has been said about WMS. Due to a string of issues, some of the feedback we have received both publicly and directly has been negative and I would like to apologize to our WMS clients and their affiliates who took the time and resources to move over to this new system only to be disappointed in the results.

    With this apology, I would also like to offer clarity into these issues, and share our findings. First and foremost, the core of the product works. While it has had some issues and still does (as with any new product launch), we are confident it functions as intended and will be the future of our affiliate software. The majority of issues seen to date that have been discussed in public forums and in private conversations originated from programs that were converted from our Original Affiliate System to WMS. While these conversion issues did not affect payouts to any new programs and/or affiliates that joined WMS directly, the conversion process was not handled in a manner that we and the market expect from CCBill, and mistakes were made.

    In my mind, it is beyond unfortunate that with this conversion, we did not live up to our historically high Quality Assurance and implementation standards. The bugs and issues that stemmed from the conversion are unacceptable and inexcusable.

    While we have corrected most of the mistakes/bugs and worked with affected clients to credit any funds as appropriate, we have lost the confidence of these users and have decided it is best to re-enable the Original Affiliate System for them, and give them the choice to convert to WMS in the future.

    As of today, we have addressed and resolved a large amount of known WMS issues, and in the weeks and months to come, it will become our mission to work harder and smarter in an effort to regain the trust of our valued clients and their affiliates.

    The first step in this process will be the re-enabling of the Original Affiliate System to each affiliate that previously converted to WMS. On Monday, March 8, 2010, at approximately 11:00 a.m. MST, anyone that had converted will have the Original Affiliate System re-enabled. It is important to note that with the re-enabling, all traffic going through WMS is still going to get counted, links will still function, and applicable sales will still be credited.

    Simultaneously with this deployment, we will contact clients that migrated to WMS individually, and begin an extensive evaluation, redesign, and development of the ?WMS Affiliate Conversion Process.? Only after a granular Quality Assurance and testing cycle, will we once again provide the option to convert affiliates from the Original CCBill Affiliate System, over to the feature-rich WMS System.

    These initiatives are not a departure from WMS, or an abandoning of its toolset. The core of the product does function properly and we are committed to making it work for all of our valued clients and their affiliates. Rather, CCBill clients and their affiliates will now have access to both the new feature-rich WMS System and the simplified, tried and true Original CCBill Affiliate System.

    We will allow clients to run both systems in parallel, enabling their affiliates to choose which solution they would like to utilize based on their needs. Correspondingly, in the future we will let affiliates choose if they would like to be converted to WMS, rather than require clients to select one system or the other on behalf of their affiliates.

    It is our belief that WMS will become the system of choice for both clients and their affiliates, due to its enhanced functionalities and features. We believe in the product. However, it will remain up to clients and affiliates to make that choice. And up to us to regain their trust.

    Additional details as to how the re-enabling will work, and what it means to both WMS clients and their affiliates for program settings, payouts, and reporting can now be found within the CCBill Web Admin News area, or by contacting your CCBill Sales or Client Support Representative. Our Client Support Director, Lloyd Briggs, is able to provide additional assistance at [email protected], as is our Corporate Advocate, Paul Kluzak, at [email protected].

    For 12 years, we at CCBill have taken pride in earning your business and trust with unparalleled dedication to our clients, exemplary service and innovative products. We will learn from these conversion mistakes so that today and into the future, we can restore and maintain that trust once again.

    Thanks,

    Ron C.
  • jcsike
    Confirmed User
    • Jan 2006
    • 689

    #2
    dont need to change or replace any links? thats good news =)

    Comment

    • ajapub
      Confirmed User
      • Jun 2001
      • 492

      #3
      CCBill has been good to me :D

      Glad to see you're on top of things!
      Webmasters: Earn up to 75% Commission
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      Comment

      • Phoenix
        BACON BACON BACON
        • Nov 2002
        • 35475

        #4
        ugh you must be letdown, i bet you sunk some serious money into building the wms

        persistence pays is what i always say, your new approach to it will surely be golden

        ccbill for the gold
        Telegram PhoenixBrad
        https://quantads.io

        Comment

        • Redfield
          Registered User
          • Nov 2005
          • 74

          #5
          Originally posted by Phoenix

          ccbill for the gold
          yes, this must have been a very hard decision. but CCBill is about making things right

          kudos to ccbill
          i love apple pie

          Comment

          • MrDeiz
            • May 2008
            • 9802

            #6
            wow

            8 char
            Make money with WEBC$MS
            The only way to still make money in adult

            Comment

            • webmasterchecks
              Confirmed User
              • Oct 2006
              • 1685

              #7
              Ron, i never expected such straightforward and sincere email to come from ccbill, this decision must have been hard but its good you guys seem to be minimizing the impact on your clients for the change.

              After you guys work on wms for a bit, im sure it will come back much stronger.

              Again, a class-act move from CCBill.
              Webmasterchecks Affiliate Payments - fully compatible with nats/mpa3

              Comment

              • DateDoc
                Outside looking in.
                • Feb 2005
                • 14243

                #8
                smart move.

                Comment

                • pornguy
                  Too lazy to set a custom title
                  • Mar 2003
                  • 62910

                  #9
                  CCBill has been and most likely will always be the leader in adult processing. Im not saying that other companies are not good but CCBill has done well for lots of people..

                  Honestly you can trust ccbill. they work hard and help you earn.

                  Got to love a company like that.

                  Ron. Send me some shirts and hats.
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                  Comment

                  • EscortBiz
                    Fuck Checks, CASH only!
                    • May 2002
                    • 19422

                    #10
                    Hi Ron
                    The WMS concept, its tools, features and set is no doubt something that once functioning correct will bring tons of value to program owners and affiliates.

                    But giants like Microsoft and Xerox sometimes release a good thing too early.

                    This news is great and this will make so many program owners and affiliates happy, we just got done testing the roll back to legacy (original system) and we tested it every way possible and knock on wood everything is functioning perfect.

                    The team there Mark, Paul, Doug from accounting, Ray and many others who I didn?t talk to but worked behind the scenes showed they care about their clients and did whatever it took to try to resolve WMS issues and then after that, work on the roll back.

                    For those who look at WMS as some failure, read the words written in the 1920?s by Napoleon Hill:

                    ?There is no such thing as failure, unless it is accepted as such. Every defeat is temporary unless you give up and allow it to become permanent. In fact, temporary defeat often makes us stronger and more capable. Each time we try and fail, we learn something that helps prepare us for eventual success. Only in the classroom is there a single correct answer for every problem. If you try an approach that doesn?t work, try something else. When you view adversity as nothing more than a learning experience, your successes in life will far outnumber your failures.?

                    Thanks!

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                    Comment

                    • TheDA
                      Confirmed User
                      • May 2006
                      • 4665

                      #11
                      Nice move.
                      Sharleen Spiteri - 1989 - In The Ass

                      Comment

                      • seeric
                        ..........
                        • Aug 2004
                        • 41917

                        #12
                        We're all guilty of pushing one thing or the other out too early Ron. Some of the biggest companies in the world do it. It certainly doesn't make me trust CCBill less because of it.

                        I wouldn't let it ruin your day. How you handle the shortcomings of the early released product is what will be remembered.

                        Looks like you're on top of it.

                        Comment

                        • seeric
                          ..........
                          • Aug 2004
                          • 41917

                          #13
                          Originally posted by EscortBiz
                          Hi Ron
                          The WMS concept, its tools, features and set is no doubt something that once functioning correct will bring tons of value to program owners and affiliates.

                          But giants like Microsoft and Xerox sometimes release a good thing too early.

                          This news is great and this will make so many program owners and affiliates happy, we just got done testing the roll back to legacy (original system) and we tested it every way possible and knock on wood everything is functioning perfect.

                          The team there Mark, Paul, Doug from accounting, Ray and many others who I didn?t talk to but worked behind the scenes showed they care about their clients and did whatever it took to try to resolve WMS issues and then after that, work on the roll back.

                          For those who look at WMS as some failure, read the words written in the 1920?s by Napoleon Hill:

                          ?There is no such thing as failure, unless it is accepted as such. Every defeat is temporary unless you give up and allow it to become permanent. In fact, temporary defeat often makes us stronger and more capable. Each time we try and fail, we learn something that helps prepare us for eventual success. Only in the classroom is there a single correct answer for every problem. If you try an approach that doesn?t work, try something else. When you view adversity as nothing more than a learning experience, your successes in life will far outnumber your failures.?

                          Thanks!
                          I love Napolean Hill. Chapter 12 saved my life.

                          Think and grow rich!

                          Comment

                          • babymaker
                            Confirmed User
                            • Jan 2004
                            • 4751

                            #14
                            Nice to see them responding to peoples concerns

                            ICQ 293125596

                            Comment

                            • sextoyking
                              Confirmed User
                              • Dec 2001
                              • 6034

                              #15
                              Hi Ron,

                              Long time no see..

                              Good post and straightforward...

                              Even know your company has put alot of time and resources into Wms - mabey consider talks / purchase if possible of Nats??

                              I only say this as your #1 in billing and they are at the top also.... What competitor could compete or touch you if you offered nats for ccbill clients??

                              Peace

                              Todd
                              ICQ: 52344098
                              --------------------------------------
                              50% Commissions on all Product Sales. http://www.wishing.com/money

                              Comment

                              • mc-nudes
                                Confirmed User
                                • Jun 2008
                                • 191

                                #16
                                "Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts" - Sir Winston Churchill

                                Thank you Ron.


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                                Comment

                                • Varius
                                  Confirmed User
                                  • Jun 2004
                                  • 6890

                                  #17
                                  CCBill is and always has been a great company with some great people, likely the biggest reason it's still in business and thriving, but the WMS was a complete failure. We tried it for very little time before reverting.

                                  If I may make a suggestion, why not do this in stages.

                                  Stage 1: Duplicate your existing system, with new code from the ground up (assuming this is necessary). This will allow you to go forward then without doing "patchwork" to an old system coded many years ago.

                                  Stage 2: Add in new features you have planned for WMS slowly, one by one, to allow testing to be much more prompt. Once resolved, move on to the next feature until after a few months, you will have a brand new, solid product.

                                  At the same time, during Stage 1 you should correct the negatives with your existing Webadmin. It is archaic and many people hate it, especially in regards to the slowness and unreliable way it generates reports. It is "clunky" for lack of a better term and hasn't been ushered into the current day and age while the rest of the company has progressed forward in other areas.

                                  For example, your current system works horribly in Chrome. Chrome is a browser gaining ground and everytime I submit something in Webadmin, I need to re-try usually 4-5 times to get the "CCBill Loading" screen to come up.

                                  No offense meant, but it seems for a good many years now you guys have been "fat and happy" to improve that aspect of the product; with reason I suppose, since few is the competition on your level.

                                  All that aside, perhaps the biggest reason is I also just loving giving Paul K. more work to do
                                  Skype variuscr - Email varius AT gmail

                                  Comment

                                  • epitome
                                    So Fucking Lame
                                    • Jun 2009
                                    • 12156

                                    #18
                                    Our character isn't defined by what happens but rather how we respond to it.

                                    What's important is that your company listened to its customers and reacted accordingly.

                                    I also appreciate that the letter was humble. Far too many companies would have tried to spin it like they had no hand in things not working out how they had hoped.

                                    This is another example of why CCBill is trusted with people's livelihood.

                                    Comment

                                    • Brujah
                                      Beer Money Baron
                                      • Jan 2001
                                      • 22157

                                      #19
                                      Since I know you'll probably be reading these posts, please add an ability to export stats by date range like below. Or even a screen like these to display stats easier, grouped by program

                                      A csv or tsv would be fine.
                                      report #1 (like nats)
                                      datetime, site, clicks, # sales, ratio, $ earned
                                      report #2 (like nats)
                                      referrer url, clicks, sales, ratio

                                      This would probably speed up the backend as we'd have a lot less clicks involved to get the same data that now takes a dozen clicks.

                                      Comment

                                      • SGS
                                        Confirmed User
                                        • Dec 2002
                                        • 5176

                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by Brujah
                                        Since I know you'll probably be reading these posts, please add an ability to export stats by date range like below. Or even a screen like these to display stats easier, grouped by program

                                        A csv or tsv would be fine.
                                        report #1 (like nats)
                                        datetime, site, clicks, # sales, ratio, $ earned
                                        report #2 (like nats)
                                        referrer url, clicks, sales, ratio

                                        This would probably speed up the backend as we'd have a lot less clicks involved to get the same data that now takes a dozen clicks.
                                        Agreed.
                                        See sig...

                                        Comment

                                        • Tanker
                                          Confirmed User
                                          • Nov 2000
                                          • 9287

                                          #21
                                          Awesome to hear this Ron! Thanks for listening to those that needed to be heard!


                                          WMS is definitely has a future in our business. We have already begun working with the Engineers at CCBill to make sure when it is ready CCBTools will work with it.


                                          I know a lot of my clients will be happy to hear this news!

                                          Tanker
                                          ICQ 3427575


                                          CCBTools Now featured in the CCBill.com APP STORE

                                          Comment

                                          • Va2k
                                            I’m still alive barley.
                                            • Oct 2001
                                            • 10060

                                            #22
                                            Wow when I saw that email I fig screw it I am leaving ccbill as a AFF anyways and thought it was something that you were going to force on us, then I read what you wrote and was like WOW, Awesome and thank you.. My faith has been restored sir!

                                            Comment

                                            • Why
                                              MFBA
                                              • Mar 2003
                                              • 7230

                                              #23
                                              IMHO CCBill's stats system has always been the worst to deal with of all the sponsors Ive used in the past decade, i avoid that system like the plague... nothing wrong with CCBill past that, but the stats are slow, difficult to read and require way too much clicking.

                                              start from scratch, get a couple fresh minds in the mix and give them decision making power... oh and a good UI designer would go a long ways as well.

                                              Comment

                                              • Tanker
                                                Confirmed User
                                                • Nov 2000
                                                • 9287

                                                #24
                                                I like my statsremote account pulling my ccbill stats for me its way faster then looking up the data

                                                Tanker
                                                ICQ 3427575


                                                CCBTools Now featured in the CCBill.com APP STORE

                                                Comment

                                                • Kolargol
                                                  Confirmed User
                                                  • Mar 2003
                                                  • 1319

                                                  #25
                                                  I'm glad it will be sorted this way, I am not a big fan of WMS.

                                                  Comment

                                                  • sojproductions
                                                    Confirmed User
                                                    • Aug 2006
                                                    • 2160

                                                    #26
                                                    The old and the new running side by side with the choice to choose either is a great move, i didn't understand why that wasn't available from the off, I for one wasn't going to risk a move in such early stages, I know it will be good in the long run!
                                                    ICQ: 404-159-022

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                                                    Comment

                                                    • JFK
                                                      FUBAR the ORIGINATOR
                                                      • Jan 2002
                                                      • 67369

                                                      #27
                                                      a straight up no bull statement from CCBill, just shows why they are , where they are today

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                                                      Comment

                                                      • tatyana
                                                        DavidNudesWorld hahahahaha
                                                        • Dec 2008
                                                        • 151

                                                        #28
                                                        YEAH! Now I can get back to work. Rather be fighting the economy than a new-born system.
                                                        David & Tatyana Owner & Producer
                                                        DavidNudesWorld.com for all our sites!!
                                                        NATS & CCBill Affiliate Program nats.DavidNudesCash.com

                                                        Comment

                                                        • Finike
                                                          Confirmed User
                                                          • Mar 2005
                                                          • 1581

                                                          #29
                                                          It seems to be the right decision from me to wait until switching to WMS.
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                                                          • B2BwithJoeD
                                                            Confirmed User
                                                            • Apr 2004
                                                            • 1390

                                                            #30
                                                            Europeans Billing Europe!

                                                            Looking forward to seeing you and the entire CCBill Team at ThePhoenixForum.com
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                                                            Comment

                                                            • signupdamnit
                                                              Confirmed User
                                                              • Aug 2007
                                                              • 6697

                                                              #31
                                                              Originally posted by RonC
                                                              We will allow clients to run both systems in parallel, enabling their affiliates to choose which solution they would like to utilize based on their needs. Correspondingly, in the future we will let affiliates choose if they would like to be converted to WMS, rather than require clients to select one system or the other on behalf of their affiliates.
                                                              This is greatly appreciated. Thank you.

                                                              You don't like my posts? Put me on ignore or fuck right off. I'll say what I want.

                                                              Comment

                                                              • gleem
                                                                Confirmed User
                                                                • Jun 2001
                                                                • 5593

                                                                #32
                                                                why reinvent the wheel, just get a copy of nats and have em customize it for ya ;)




                                                                Contact me: \\// E: webmaster /at/ unprofessional.com

                                                                Comment

                                                                • brassmonkey
                                                                  Pay It Forward
                                                                  • Sep 2005
                                                                  • 77385

                                                                  #33
                                                                  Originally posted by gleem
                                                                  why reinvent the wheel, just get a copy of nats and have em customize it for ya ;)
                                                                  yeah right
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                                                                  Comment

                                                                  • WebCashMaker
                                                                    Confirmed User
                                                                    • Feb 2008
                                                                    • 1726

                                                                    #34
                                                                    Thanks Ron for the update.




                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • tatyana
                                                                      DavidNudesWorld hahahahaha
                                                                      • Dec 2008
                                                                      • 151

                                                                      #35
                                                                      SRS document for CCBill

                                                                      David & Tatyana Owner & Producer
                                                                      DavidNudesWorld.com for all our sites!!
                                                                      NATS & CCBill Affiliate Program nats.DavidNudesCash.com

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