Occupy Oakland - Before & After - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

Rochard · 10-26-2011, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _Richard_

so it's the protestors fault the cities are going broke?

what the hell is going on today

In fact it is.

Everyone wants to blame the banks, when the truth is it's the 99% that caused this - anyone who bought a house and sold it for twice what they paid for it four years later, or anyone who bought a house and took out money against it and then defaulted as it all crashed down. It was the greed of the 99% that caused this to happen.

And now they want to camp out in public parks, destroying them, and refuse to clear out so they can be cleaned. Outstanding. Let's force the city to spend millions in police costs, millions in clean up and repair costs, and then later on millions in legal fees defending their actions.

And again, no sense for the 99% to take the blame for their actions. Just blame it on the police.

amateurbfs · 10-26-2011, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _Richard_

so it's the protestors fault the cities are going broke?

what the hell is going on today

Someone has to be their mother.. You would let the trash lay around in your city, say you were a mayor somewhere?

cherrylula · 10-26-2011, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caligari

1)point of pics- because its always "those hippies"
2)does it matter which protest? its the same response everywhere...

If they are going to break the law to protest and make a statement they need to work harder than to just "put up tents" and make some cheesy signs.

Those tree huggers aren't making a difference sleeping in the park.

When they start storming government buildings with torches then I'll pay attention.

Until then, if they're not at least in the streets in public areas holding up signs and think that treading all over nature pissing in the park is protesting, let the cops deal with them.

Those cops are having the time of their lives, "following orders" beating up citizens too. I don't support those job needing assholes either, getting paid to boss people around.

Revolutions didn't begin by putting up tents though, that's for sure. Blood or stfu. lol

Phoenix · 10-26-2011, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

In fact it is.

Everyone wants to blame the banks, when the truth is it's the 99% that caused this - anyone who bought a house and sold it for twice what they paid for it four years later, or anyone who bought a house and took out money against it and then defaulted as it all crashed down. It was the greed of the 99% that caused this to happen.

And now they want to camp out in public parks, destroying them, and refuse to clear out so they can be cleaned. Outstanding. Let's force the city to spend millions in police costs, millions in clean up and repair costs, and then later on millions in legal fees defending their actions.

And again, no sense for the 99% to take the blame for their actions. Just blame it on the police.

hey i sort of agree with you.

however...whoever let the idiots do that are actually at fault

we didn't let idiots here buy 500k homes on a starbucks wage.
however in the usa...you did...and now you wonder what went on
when what really happened is people were playing liars poker with your whole mortgage industry.

don't blame the peons who really never should have been approved for a mortgage in the first place....they are peons.
the reason people make tons of money in high powered jobs is to make the right decision...but instead they line their pockets and steal the light bulbs on the way out the door..lol

DWB · 10-26-2011, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barry-xlovecam

New poll out last night the current US Congress gets a 9% approval rating.

Everyone in Congress should resign with approval ratings that low.

baddog · 10-26-2011, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coup

So much for the first amendment.

How so?

Quote:

Originally Posted by directfiesta

wow .... doing that to ' their own people ' .....

Wow, it is on the Internet so it must be true.

Caligari · 10-26-2011, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cherrylula

If they are going to break the law to protest and make a statement they need to work harder than to just "put up tents" and make some cheesy signs.
Those tree huggers aren't making a difference sleeping in the park.
Until then, if they're not at least in the streets in public areas holding up signs and think that treading all over nature pissing in the park is protesting, let the cops deal with them.

made you look didn't they

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/...141203055.html

and i don't know if you've been to a forest or mountains but public parks are not nature, they are the manicured green space of some city boy's idea of nature. they get trampled and replanted all the time. no big woop.

baddog · 10-26-2011, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caligari

they get trampled and replanted all the time. no big woop.

And who pays for it?

Caligari · 10-26-2011, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baddog

And who pays for it?

in the spectrum of what is going on, worrying about paying for re-sodding and planting some trees is way down on the list.

or should i say "what price democracy?"

stocktrader23 · 10-26-2011, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

In fact it is.

Everyone wants to blame the banks, when the truth is it's the 99% that caused this - anyone who bought a house and sold it for twice what they paid for it four years later, or anyone who bought a house and took out money against it and then defaulted as it all crashed down. It was the greed of the 99% that caused this to happen.

And now they want to camp out in public parks, destroying them, and refuse to clear out so they can be cleaned. Outstanding. Let's force the city to spend millions in police costs, millions in clean up and repair costs, and then later on millions in legal fees defending their actions.

And again, no sense for the 99% to take the blame for their actions. Just blame it on the police.

First of all, there is no need to send cops to a peaceful protest, especially hundreds of them.

Also, you are really misguided on what caused the economy to crash. It is well known that the banks giving those loans were breaking laws to do so, corruption led to the crash. There will always be idiots that fall for this shit, the banks knew better but they pawned off their bad investments on the retirement funds of your friends and family.

The Demon · 10-26-2011, 11:04 AM

So we're to blame the bankers for doing something knowing normal American idiots will fall for it? That's like blaming MTV for releasing terrible reality shows rather than the idiots who choose to watch them. If the majority of people weren't willing to live beyond their means, the banks wouldn't be able to pawn this crap off.. Also, blame the goverment for backing the banks.. But I love the left. It's always somebody else's fault..

Phoenix · 10-26-2011, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

First of all, there is no need to send cops to a peaceful protest, especially hundreds of them.

Also, you are really misguided on what caused the economy to crash. It is well known that the banks giving those loans were breaking laws to do so, corruption led to the crash. There will always be idiots that fall for this shit, the banks knew better but they pawned off their bad investments on the retirement funds of your friends and family.

but but but...some guy wore a uniform of a marine the wrong way
that is what is really important

Rochard · 10-26-2011, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix

hey i sort of agree with you.

however...whoever let the idiots do that are actually at fault

we didn't let idiots here buy 500k homes on a starbucks wage.
however in the usa...you did...and now you wonder what went on
when what really happened is people were playing liars poker with your whole mortgage industry.

don't blame the peons who really never should have been approved for a mortgage in the first place....they are peons.
the reason people make tons of money in high powered jobs is to make the right decision...but instead they line their pockets and steal the light bulbs on the way out the door..lol

But we did let the idiots making Starbucks wages buy $500k houses. We encouraged it. Because it drove the value of everyone's houses up. And when they defaulted, the bank turned around and sold the house again for even more money - more win for us!

They banks did line their pockets with gold. But everyone did. People sold their houses for a huge profit, and others cashed in by taking money out of their houses.

We are all guilty.

baddog · 10-26-2011, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caligari

in the spectrum of what is going on, worrying about paying for re-sodding and planting some trees is way down on the list.

or should i say "what price democracy?"

Appears to me that they are more about anarchy than democracy.

Phoenix · 10-26-2011, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Demon

So we're to blame the bankers for doing something knowing normal American idiots will fall for it? That's like blaming MTV for releasing terrible reality shows rather than the idiots who choose to watch them. If the majority of people weren't willing to live beyond their means, the banks wouldn't be able to pawn this crap off.. Also, blame the goverment for backing the banks.. But I love the left. It's always somebody else's fault..

i personally blame the education system for churning out millions and millions of mouth breathers...but hey what are gonna do?

stocktrader23 · 10-26-2011, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix

but but but...some guy wore a uniform of a marine the wrong way
that is what is really important

Yeah, so disrespectful to stand up for the rights of the citizens you swore to protect when your shirt is unbuttoned and your ribbons are on display so that it's obvious you are a vet and not some crazy dude in camo.

baddog · 10-26-2011, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

We are all guilty.

Speak for yourself. Both of my homes have tons of equity. Not everyone made the same mistakes as you.

stocktrader23 · 10-26-2011, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

But we did let the idiots making Starbucks wages buy $500k houses. We encouraged it. Because it drove the value of everyone's houses up. And when they defaulted, the bank turned around and sold the house again for even more money - more win for us!

They banks did line their pockets with gold. But everyone did. People sold their houses for a huge profit, and others cashed in by taking money out of their houses.

We are all guilty.

No, everyone did not. Millions are losing their homes even though many of the foreclosures are illegal. Millions lost money from their retirement accounts and other investments because banks knowingly pawned off dirty loans on them. The middle class makes less money than they did a handful of years ago and the banks are making more than ever. They knew full well they were raping the economy, it's documented as illegal and now they are trying to make deals so they can't be held responsible.

baddog · 10-26-2011, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

. . . . many of the foreclosures are illegal.

Okay, I will have to plead ignorance. What foreclosures are illegal and what makes them so?

Rochard · 10-26-2011, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

First of all, there is no need to send cops to a peaceful protest, especially hundreds of them.

Really?

The big thing was the protest in Oakland, California, yesterday. I guess it's perfectly acceptable to the citizens of Oakland that their library was off limits because of protesters. (I read constantly and make weekly trips to the library; I'm also well educated and aware of local politics - I know a huge chunk of library costs comes from our town's general fund and I'd be pretty pissed off if I couldn't go to the library later today!) The police needs to be there to ensure the fucking taxpayers can enter the library - You know, the building with the books paid for by tax dollars and open to the public?

They didn't shut down the free way yet - protesters usually shut down the 580 - but they did fuck up a lot of surface streets. Peaceful or not, when you protesters marching down streets with cars you have lots of problems. I did see a car trying to weave through a group of protesters - surely the police was needed to direct traffic there, right?

The police ordered the protestors to leave the park - Frank Ogawa Plaza. The city wants to clean it, which makes sense, but they refused to leave. No problem - No need to call the police. They can just do whatever they fucking want in Frank Ogawa Plaza. They can violate all the city laws they want such as camping over night in a city park, smoking pot in pubic, taking craps in the bushes. No problem. No need to call the police.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

Also, you are really misguided on what caused the economy to crash. It is well known that the banks giving those loans were breaking laws to do so, corruption led to the crash. There will always be idiots that fall for this shit, the banks knew better but they pawned off their bad investments on the retirement funds of your friends and family.

What laws were broken?

I bought a house and lived in it for four years. I sold the house and made a huge profit. No laws were broken by the bank.

My friend here in California bought a house, house went up in value, they refinanced and took that money out - and fueled the economy further by buying themselves a nice new truck, a boat, a jeep, a motorcycle that would make Baddog jelaous, and a pair of ATVs. No laws were broken. Value of the house went up, they refinanced.

The 99% is what caused this. All of us did by our greed. Did the banks make money? Sure did. But so did everyone else.

The Demon · 10-26-2011, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

Really?

The big thing was the protest in Oakland, California, yesterday. I guess it's perfectly acceptable to the citizens of Oakland that their library was off limits because of protesters. (I read constantly and make weekly trips to the library; I'm also well educated and aware of local politics - I know a huge chunk of library costs comes from our town's general fund and I'd be pretty pissed off if I couldn't go to the library later today!) The police needs to be there to ensure the fucking taxpayers can enter the library - You know, the building with the books paid for by tax dollars and open to the public?

They didn't shut down the free way yet - protesters usually shut down the 580 - but they did fuck up a lot of surface streets. Peaceful or not, when you protesters marching down streets with cars you have lots of problems. I did see a car trying to weave through a group of protesters - surely the police was needed to direct traffic there, right?

The police ordered the protestors to leave the park - Frank Ogawa Plaza. The city wants to clean it, which makes sense, but they refused to leave. No problem - No need to call the police. They can just do whatever they fucking want in Frank Ogawa Plaza. They can violate all the city laws they want such as camping over night in a city park, smoking pot in pubic, taking craps in the bushes. No problem. No need to call the police.

What laws were broken?

I bought a house and lived in it for four years. I sold the house and made a huge profit. No laws were broken by the bank.

My friend here in California bought a house, house went up in value, they refinanced and took that money out - and fueled the economy further by buying themselves a nice new truck, a boat, a jeep, a motorcycle that would make Baddog jelaous, and a pair of ATVs. No laws were broken. Value of the house went up, they refinanced.

The 99% is what caused this. All of us did by our greed. Did the banks make money? Sure did. But so did everyone else.

stocktrader23 · 10-26-2011, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baddog

Okay, I will have to plead ignorance. What foreclosures are illegal and what makes them so?

There are problems with mortgage backed securities being sold to multiple people at once, unclear ownership and several other illegal practices that have been called into question around the country, many with litigation ongoing. Not all foreclosures are illegal of course but they are still actively taking peoples homes knowing that they are in the wrong on at least some of them.

Supreme Court casts doubt on Massachusetts foreclosures.

State accuses Bank of America unit of thousands of illegal foreclosures

Banks hoping to settle with states over mortgage abuses and squash future liability.

Quote:

In a February 2011 opinion, Robert E. Grossman, a federal judge on in Long Island, wrote: ?This court does not accept the argument that because MERS may be involved with 50 percent of all residential mortgages in the country, that is reason enough for this court to turn a blind eye to the fact that this process does not comply with the law.?

Quote:

How MERS and its bank owners will fare with the attorneys general is unclear. The early term sheet for the possible settlement said only this: ?Issues relating to the use and performance of MERS are reserved for further discussion.? Those further discussions may be taking place now. It?s a good bet that the banks want a comprehensive release from liability relating to MERS.

US To Sue Big Banks Over Mortgages

Quote:

The Associated Press reports, meanwhile, that counties across the U.S. are discovering that illegal or questionable mortgage paperwork is far more widespread than thought, tainting the deeds of tens of thousands of homes dating to the late 1990s.

More importantly.

Quote:

Already, mortgage papers are being invalidated by courts, insurers are hesitant to write policies, and judges are blocking banks from foreclosing on homes. The findings by various county registers of deeds have also hindered a settlement between the 50 state attorneys general who are investigating big banks and other mortgage lenders over controversial mortgage practices.

Banks should not be actively taking homes from people when their entire process has been called into question, they are facing lawsuits from all angles, many foreclosures are being blocked and others have been found as probably or definitely illegal.

stocktrader23 · 10-26-2011, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

But we did let the idiots making Starbucks wages buy $500k houses. We encouraged it. Because it drove the value of everyone's houses up. And when they defaulted, the bank turned around and sold the house again for even more money - more win for us!

They banks did line their pockets with gold. But everyone did. People sold their houses for a huge profit, and others cashed in by taking money out of their houses.

We are all guilty.

Who the hell is we? Idiots have been applying for loans they couldn't get forever, it was corruption that gave them those loans.

Look, If you decide to loan a crackhead $5000 it is you taking that risk. This on the other hand is like you loaning the crackhead $5000, selling the risk to those in charge of your grandmas retirement fund by lying to them about what they are buying then getting bailed out by the government after you wreck the economy.

Nobody is arguing that these people shouldn't have had the loans, there were and are laws to protect them from being taken advantage of. The banks broke the law and evaporated 20% of our overall net worth, brought the economy to it's knees and are laughing in your face because they are making more money now than ever before in your lifetime and you want to blame homeowners? Jesus man, look around. They are doing the same with college loans and we are still not out of the housing crisis yet. NO GROUP BUT THE TOP 1% have gained in income through this mess, everyone else has lost. There are a damn lot of hardworking people in the middle class that you are saying deserve what they get. No, they do not and the corrupt corporations that did this should have to face the consequences the same as you or I would.

Lykos · 10-26-2011, 12:07 PM

No police in US

Rochard · 10-26-2011, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

Who the hell is we? Idiots have been applying for loans they couldn't get forever, it was corruption that gave them those loans.

We is "everyone".

We all knew what was going on. Everyone - and the adult industry certainly - was enjoying the ride. People were making money hand over fist, taking money out on houses, and spending it on new cars, vacations, porn memberships - which translated into everyone made even more money.

I wasn't an idiot who didn't qualify for a loan; I qualified for ten times larger than what I bought. And when I cashed in on my old house I didn't complain. I didn't go to the bank and give money back saying that my old house wasn't worth twice what I paid for it four years prior. I laughed all the way to the bank. And I spent the money on buying my wife and I each new cars (again) and big parties and vacations.

My friend who cashed out - He sure did qualify for his loan. Him and his wife combined only made $70k a year, but his house was valued at twice what he owed on it. In other words, he bought his house for something like $170k, and five years later it's worth $300k. Bingo - He bought his toys, his motorcyle, jeep, truck, atvs, vacations. (He lost everything btw.)

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

Look, If you decide to loan a crackhead $5000 it is you taking that risk. This on the other hand is like you loaning the crackhead $5000, selling the risk to those in charge of your grandmas retirement fund by lying to them about what they are buying then getting bailed out by the government after you wreck the economy.

No one cared. If the crack defaulted on the loan, the bank turned around and sold the house for 10% more. And everyone made money. On top of that, because the house re-sold for 10% more, the houses on the street went up in value - again.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

Nobody is arguing that these people shouldn't have had the loans, there were and are laws to protect them from being taken advantage of. The banks broke the law and evaporated 20% of our overall net worth, brought the economy to it's knees and are laughing in your face because they are making more money now than ever before in your lifetime and you want to blame homeowners? Jesus man, look around. They are doing the same with college loans and we are still not out of the housing crisis yet. NO GROUP BUT THE TOP 1% have gained in income through this mess, everyone else has lost. There are a damn lot of hardworking people in the middle class that you are saying deserve what they get. No, they do not and the corrupt corporations that did this should have to face the consequences the same as you or I would.

Everyone was making money hand over fist, not just the 1%.

Anyone who sold a home or took money out of their home based on the perceived value of their home is guilty. People sold their houses for a huge profit, and people took money out against their homes - and used that money to further fuel the economy by buying new cars, vacations, toys, computers, cell phone. Our own industry has profited by this too - Everyone had extra pocket money and thought nothing about buying a porn membership.

The 1% is the group hurting the most. Someone here on GFY posted a graph the other day with the amount of money the top 1% makes. It peaked in 2007 - and then started to decline. The more money you make, the more of a hit you take. Ten percent of $100k is $10k, but ten percent of a million bucks is $100k.

Bank Of America - guilty with the rest of us - just took an $8.8 BILLION dollar hit. That's for a single quarter, btw. (Yeah, I know they play their little accounting games but you these fucks are bleeding money.)

The 99% is guilty right along with the banks. We all made money.

Rochard · 10-26-2011, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

There are problems with mortgage backed securities being sold to multiple people at once, unclear ownership and several other illegal practices that have been called into question around the country, many with litigation ongoing. Not all foreclosures are illegal of course but they are still actively taking peoples homes knowing that they are in the wrong on at least some of them.

Supreme Court casts doubt on Massachusetts foreclosures.

State accuses Bank of America unit of thousands of illegal foreclosures

Banks hoping to settle with states over mortgage abuses and squash future liability.

US To Sue Big Banks Over Mortgages

More importantly.

Banks should not be actively taking homes from people when their entire process has been called into question, they are facing lawsuits from all angles, many foreclosures are being blocked and others have been found as probably or definitely illegal.

Yeah, there was a lot of this going on. Doesn't the banks still make money on a foreclosure somehow?

They also had entry level people signing off on foreclosures, and courts that quickly pushed them through.

12clicks · 10-26-2011, 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phoenix

hey i sort of agree with you.

however...whoever let the idiots do that are actually at fault

we didn't let idiots here buy 500k homes on a starbucks wage.
however in the usa...you did...and now you wonder what went on
when what really happened is people were playing liars poker with your whole mortgage industry.

don't blame the peons who really never should have been approved for a mortgage in the first place....they are peons.
the reason people make tons of money in high powered jobs is to make the right decision...but instead they line their pockets and steal the light bulbs on the way out the door..lol

the peons HAD to lie on their application to get a mortgage that put them in over their head.
it was the bottom's greed that hurt them.
No one living on a starbucks wage got a 500k house without lying.

crockett · 10-26-2011, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

So how much is it gonna cost the tax payers to clean up their fucking mess?

This is what the protesters don't understand. Their silly protesting with camping out and war drums is costing cities hundreds of thousands of dollars in police and clean up costs. Wonderful - Our cities are going broke, but let's force them to spend more for utterly no reason.

really? I mean really really?

I guess we should also save this country a lot of money and just install a dictator whom can simply assign all political roles to whom he feels fit. Hell I bet that would save a lot of money..

btw, I'm sure the protestors would be willing to work a deal to pay for the clean up if wall street pays back what it owes as well. Sound fair right?

stocktrader23 · 10-26-2011, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

Bank Of America - guilty with the rest of us - just took an $8.8 BILLION dollar hit. That's for a single quarter, btw. (Yeah, I know they play their little accounting games but you these fucks are bleeding money.)

http://www.charlotteobserver.com/201...er-profit.html

Poor BOA with their 5 billion in profits after being bailed out for wrecking the economy.

And blaming everyone for this mess is retarded. I bought one house which I still own, I bought it to live in. The vast majority of the middle class and lower had fuck all to do with this dirty shit but they are paying the price. Also, even if we went with your logic the poor bank made a couple billion less than they should while 1 in 4 American families couldn't afford food at some point in the last year. Unbelievable man, you need to think about this a little further than "My house went up and everyone was trying to cash in, it's all of our faults!"

mynameisjim · 10-26-2011, 01:20 PM

Just a quick note about whose fault it is for the home loan default issues brought up in this thread.

In that scenario, the banks were the professional entity so the burden of responsibility is on them. The borrower is the lay person.

It's exactly the same if you were to go to a doctor and he prescribes you a deadly combination of medicine. Is it your fault for not reading up on the medicine he prescribed? Of course not, the doctor is a professional and therefore the burden of responsible behavior is on him.

It's been a basic rule of our society that the professional entity in any transaction carries more burden of responsibility than the lay person in that transaction.

If I walk into a local bank and ask for a $1 billion dollar loan and they give it to me. Then when I can't pay it back the bank goes out of business, is that my fault or is that the bank's fault?

Not to mention, the reason the banks were giving out those terrible loans is because they just needed the loans to perpetuate their scam of reselling the loans over and over again.

Phoenix · 10-26-2011, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mynameisjim

Just a quick note about whose fault it is for the home loan default issues brought up in this thread.

In that scenario, the banks were the professional entity so the burden of responsibility is on them. The borrower is the lay person.

It's exactly the same if you were to go to a doctor and he prescribes you a deadly combination of medicine. Is it your fault for not reading up on the medicine he prescribed? Of course not, the doctor is a professional and therefore the burden of responsible behavior is on him.

It's been a basic rule of our society that the professional entity in any transaction carries more burden of responsibility than the lay person in that transaction.

If I walk into a local bank and ask for a $1 billion dollar loan and they give it to me. Then when I can't pay it back the bank goes out of business, is that my fault or is that the bank's fault?

Not to mention, the reason the banks were giving out those terrible loans is because they just needed the loans to perpetuate their scam of reselling the loans over and over again.

that is all well and nice...but this is GFY...and logic is not welcome here ok thanks

L-Pink · 10-26-2011, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by baddog

Okay, I will have to plead ignorance. What foreclosures are illegal and what makes them so?

He's referring to the "paper-work irregularities" with some foreclosure proceedings. Not validity of who owes what.

.

Rochard · 10-26-2011, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crockett

really? I mean really really?

I guess we should also save this country a lot of money and just install a dictator whom can simply assign all political roles to whom he feels fit. Hell I bet that would save a lot of money..

btw, I'm sure the protestors would be willing to work a deal to pay for the clean up if wall street pays back what it owes as well. Sound fair right?

So your okay with five hundred people invading a local park in your city and camping out for an entire month, twenty-four hours a day? Can you imagine the amount of clean up involved? The damage? The health conditions?

Hey, whatever, it's only our tax dollars footing the bill for this crap.

The OWS isn't going to pay for the clean up, the damage, and the over time for the local cops. They raised $500k; The costs alone must be five times that if not more.

Rochard · 10-26-2011, 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

And blaming everyone for this mess is retarded. I bought one house which I still own, I bought it to live in. The vast majority of the middle class and lower had fuck all to do with this dirty shit but they are paying the price. Also, even if we went with your logic the poor bank made a couple billion less than they should while 1 in 4 American families couldn't afford food at some point in the last year. Unbelievable man, you need to think about this a little further than "My house went up and everyone was trying to cash in, it's all of our faults!"

You bought the house you live in. Great. The guy next to you took out $80k and bought himself a new truck with it, and took his wife on that dream vacation. The guy next to him sold his house for twice what he paid for it, bought his wife new tits, bought himself a motorcycle, and then bought another house.

The vast majority of the middle class is what fuels the housing market.

crockett · 10-26-2011, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

So your okay with five hundred people invading a local park in your city and camping out for an entire month, twenty-four hours a day? Can you imagine the amount of clean up involved? The damage? The health conditions?

Hey, whatever, it's only our tax dollars footing the bill for this crap.

The OWS isn't going to pay for the clean up, the damage, and the over time for the local cops. They raised $500k; The costs alone must be five times that if not more.

Ever hear about Hooverville

I'd rather see some protestors living in parks in an attempt to fix what is wrong with the country, than have us return to this same mess in another 10 years and maybe end up with real tent cities on main street like they had in the great depression.

Rochard · 10-26-2011, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mynameisjim

Just a quick note about whose fault it is for the home loan default issues brought up in this thread.

In that scenario, the banks were the professional entity so the burden of responsibility is on them. The borrower is the lay person.

It's exactly the same if you were to go to a doctor and he prescribes you a deadly combination of medicine. Is it your fault for not reading up on the medicine he prescribed? Of course not, the doctor is a professional and therefore the burden of responsible behavior is on him.

It's been a basic rule of our society that the professional entity in any transaction carries more burden of responsibility than the lay person in that transaction.

If I walk into a local bank and ask for a $1 billion dollar loan and they give it to me. Then when I can't pay it back the bank goes out of business, is that my fault or is that the bank's fault?

Not to mention, the reason the banks were giving out those terrible loans is because they just needed the loans to perpetuate their scam of reselling the loans over and over again.

At the end of the day, we are responsible for our own actions.

Odd that you used doctors and medications as an example. My doctor gave me a prescription last week, a power, with instructions to take it orally - it's for my mouth. However, the pharmacist was really surprised, didn't understand why my doctor would prescribe this orally, and seemed uneasy giving it to me. I'm a smart guy, read the label, and it says "if swallowed called poison control. Wait a second - My doctor wants me to take this orally but if I swallow it I might be rushed to the ER? So I called my doctor about it.

The banks did nothing wrong here. People went to the banks, asked for a loan, qualified, and got a loan. Yeah, maybe they shouldn't have qualified for the loan, but banks don't make money if they don't give out loans. And when the banks can't loose, they'll hand out money to any one who is able to sign the loan paperwork.

I went to the bank, obviously qualified for a loan, bought a $220k house. Four years later I sold the house for $550k. What did the bank do wrong?

My buddy qualified for a loan for $170k, five years later the house is now worth $300k, so he refinances the loan and takes money out of the house. He qualifies for the loan because his house is worth more than the loan. What did the bank do wrong?

We are blaming this on the banks and Wall Street. Everyone fucking profited from this. Our industry profited from this too - people had spending cash because the economy, based on the perceived value of the housing marketing, was booming. No matter what industry you worked in, you benefited. Everyone was spending, everyone profited.

And no one one of us said "Oh, this is wrong".

stocktrader23 · 10-26-2011, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

The banks did nothing wrong here. People went to the banks, asked for a loan, qualified, and got a loan. Yeah, maybe they shouldn't have qualified for the loan, but banks don't make money if they don't give out loans. And when the banks can't loose, they'll hand out money to any one who is able to sign the loan paperwork.

This says it all. The banks not only did something wrong it was legally wrong, not just morally. Everyone agrees that the banks broke the damn law, gambled with our future and won while everyone else lost. I don't even hear this line from fanatical conservative Tea Party morons, you need to go look at what's really been going on for the last 10 years.

The Demon · 10-26-2011, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

This says it all. The banks not only did something wrong it was legally wrong, not just morally. Everyone agrees that the banks broke the damn law, gambled with our future and won while everyone else lost. I don't even hear this line from fanatical conservative Tea Party morons, you need to go look at what's really been going on for the last 10 years.

Who is everyone? You? Or is this your idiotic copout on top of the moronic diatribes you keep posting? Furthermore, earlier on you said this:

Quote:

many foreclosures are being blocked and others have been found as probably or definitely illegal.

Which one is it? Probably illegal, definitely illegal, or you have no idea what the hell you're even typing? Typical of the idiotic left bitching, making shit up, and playing the blame game.

pornguy · 10-26-2011, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

They've been pulling these overnight raids / arresting everyone in a few cities now. Some departments will back off, some will escalate... who knows how this will turn out.

All it takes in 1 shot and things could get really ugly.

PornoMonster · 10-26-2011, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

First of all, there is no need to send cops to a peaceful protest, especially hundreds of them.

Also, you are really misguided on what caused the economy to crash. It is well known that the banks giving those loans were breaking laws to do so, corruption led to the crash. There will always be idiots that fall for this shit, the banks knew better but they pawned off their bad investments on the retirement funds of your friends and family.

Peaceful or not it is Illegal, the permit ran out.

I think I will go rob a bank peacefully..

Socks · 10-26-2011, 02:36 PM

The cost of the police presence is a horrible argument. Police forces lobby governments too, mostly to ensure they're able to overhire and swell their ranks.

At a large liquour store near me (owned by the government) they'll have 5 police officers doing "pay duties" (read: double time overtime) all day, standing in the store, doing nothing. There is never a problem at the liquor store here. If there was, they could y'know.. Call the police, who would be there in 5 minutes.

Every time there are construction workers working on the roads here, it's legally mandated that police officers stand there, doing nothing. Usually 2 or 3 of them. "for the safety of the construction crews..."

They do everything they can to get as many hours in as possible, which is why we have a staggering number of regular police officers making SIX FUCKING FIGURES here.

If anything, the protesters are doing the police a favour. If you're mad at that, be mad at the police force. Without the protesters, they're hard at work every day of the year trying to waste our money any way they can anyways.

PornoMonster · 10-26-2011, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

This says it all. The banks not only did something wrong it was legally wrong, not just morally. Everyone agrees that the banks broke the damn law, gambled with our future and won while everyone else lost. I don't even hear this line from fanatical conservative Tea Party morons, you need to go look at what's really been going on for the last 10 years.

I remember the bank coming to my house and giving me Bags of cash, shoving it down my throat.

Now, I do agree that when you go in for a house loan, they "DID" try to give you a bigger one. I went in for a $350K loan, knowing this is what I was able to pay back, they said you are lucky you qualify for $500K, which I knew was Nuts. Same can be said with Car Sales men, and so on. These people are ADULTS, use you brain, are we getting that stupid, that the Gov has to hold our hand for everything?

The real issue should be
Why did people lose the jobs to not be able to pay the mortages back, AND
Why did we bail out the banks, which did not help the people.

PornoMonster · 10-26-2011, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Socks

The cost of the police presence is a horrible argument. Police forces lobby governments too, mostly to ensure they're able to overhire and swell their ranks.

At a large liquour store near me (owned by the government) they'll have 5 police officers doing "pay duties" (read: double time overtime) all day, standing in the store, doing nothing. There is never a problem at the liquor store here. If there was, they could y'know.. Call the police, who would be there in 5 minutes.

Every time there are construction workers working on the roads here, it's legally mandated that police officers stand there, doing nothing. Usually 2 or 3 of them. "for the safety of the construction crews..."

They do everything they can to get as many hours in as possible, which is why we have a staggering number of regular police officers making SIX FUCKING FIGURES here.

If anything, the protesters are doing the police a favour. If you're mad at that, be mad at the police force. Without the protesters, they're hard at work every day of the year trying to waste our money any way they can anyways.

This is in Union strong non right to work states?
We have the police unions here, but we are also a right to work state, so we do not see this here. The police do do private security in uniform, but the business has to pay. The rub, they pay $30 an hour to the police station, that pays the officer half

epitome · 10-26-2011, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mynameisjim

Just a quick note about whose fault it is for the home loan default issues brought up in this thread.

In that scenario, the banks were the professional entity so the burden of responsibility is on them. The borrower is the lay person.

It's exactly the same if you were to go to a doctor and he prescribes you a deadly combination of medicine. Is it your fault for not reading up on the medicine he prescribed? Of course not, the doctor is a professional and therefore the burden of responsible behavior is on him.

It's been a basic rule of our society that the professional entity in any transaction carries more burden of responsibility than the lay person in that transaction.

If I walk into a local bank and ask for a $1 billion dollar loan and they give it to me. Then when I can't pay it back the bank goes out of business, is that my fault or is that the bank's fault?

Not to mention, the reason the banks were giving out those terrible loans is because they just needed the loans to perpetuate their scam of reselling the loans over and over again.

Shhhh, people like to believe it was the banks actually making the loans and not just initially funding them and selling them off to retirement funds while getting paid fees for putting it together and then only servicing it (for more fees) ...making it still look like their loan. Nobody talks about MERS anymore.

There was every incentive for them to push through as much garbage as they could.

To the person who asked if a bank still makes money in a foreclosure the answer is no. They do if they're only servicing the loan as the costs, with their fees on top, is paid for by the owner... or the multiple owners since shitty loans were securitized.

stocktrader23 · 10-26-2011, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Demon

Who is everyone? You? Or is this your idiotic copout on top of the moronic diatribes you keep posting? Furthermore, earlier on you said this:

Which one is it? Probably illegal, definitely illegal, or you have no idea what the hell you're even typing? Typical of the idiotic left bitching, making shit up, and playing the blame game.

Both you dumb sack of shit. Just shut the fuck up, Dave.

Rochard · 10-26-2011, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stocktrader23

This says it all. The banks not only did something wrong it was legally wrong, not just morally. Everyone agrees that the banks broke the damn law, gambled with our future and won while everyone else lost. I don't even hear this line from fanatical conservative Tea Party morons, you need to go look at what's really been going on for the last 10 years.

The bank loaned me $220k to buy a house. I had no problem getting the loan; I was making over $100k a year plus my wife was working. Four years later I sold the house and raked in over $200k in profit. What did the banks do wrong?

stocktrader23 · 10-26-2011, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PornoMonster

I remember the bank coming to my house and giving me Bags of cash, shoving it down my throat.

Now, I do agree that when you go in for a house loan, they "DID" try to give you a bigger one. I went in for a $350K loan, knowing this is what I was able to pay back, they said you are lucky you qualify for $500K, which I knew was Nuts. Same can be said with Car Sales men, and so on. These people are ADULTS, use you brain, are we getting that stupid, that the Gov has to hold our hand for everything?

The real issue should be
Why did people lose the jobs to not be able to pay the mortages back, AND
Why did we bail out the banks, which did not help the people.

Dude seriously, the fact that the banks were doing illegal shit all the way around is not a secret. People are losing jobs because this kind of corruption crippled the economy. Trying to give you a bigger loan than needed is not what I'm talking about, their dirty little secrets are public knowledge at this point so go look it up if you want to know what they were doing wrong.

baddog · 10-26-2011, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jesus H Christ

Finally, seriously? You a marine, upset that fellow Americans are exercising a constitutional right to assemble?

I don't think the right to assemble means what you think it means.

Rochard · 10-26-2011, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jesus H Christ

Finally, seriously? You a marine, upset that fellow Americans are exercising a constitutional right to assemble? - then complain about the cleanup costs? But it's okay for these same broke cities to payout millions in cleanup and police overtime salaries for, I dunno, gay pride parades or St Paddy's day Parade?

You have the right assemble and the right to protest. However, you do not have the right to camp out in the middle of a city park for months at a time, smoke pot, and crap in bushes. There is a huge difference between the right to assemble and violating dozens of city laws.

stocktrader23 · 10-26-2011, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

The bank loaned me $220k to buy a house. I had no problem getting the loan; I was making over $100k a year plus my wife was working. Four years later I sold the house and raked in over $200k in profit. What did the banks do wrong?

What does your mortgage have to do with all of the corruption and illegal practices they were using on other loans? It was dirty through and through and that fact is not even contested at this point. Are we back in 2007 or something?

10-26-2011, 11:04 AM	#61
The Demon Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 7,336	So we're to blame the bankers for doing something knowing normal American idiots will fall for it? That's like blaming MTV for releasing terrible reality shows rather than the idiots who choose to watch them. If the majority of people weren't willing to live beyond their means, the banks wouldn't be able to pawn this crap off.. Also, blame the goverment for backing the banks.. But I love the left. It's always somebody else's fault.. __________________ Greed is Good

10-26-2011, 12:07 PM	#74
Lykos Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: World Posts: 31,017	No police in US __________________

10-26-2011, 01:20 PM	#80
mynameisjim Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,985	Just a quick note about whose fault it is for the home loan default issues brought up in this thread. In that scenario, the banks were the professional entity so the burden of responsibility is on them. The borrower is the lay person. It's exactly the same if you were to go to a doctor and he prescribes you a deadly combination of medicine. Is it your fault for not reading up on the medicine he prescribed? Of course not, the doctor is a professional and therefore the burden of responsible behavior is on him. It's been a basic rule of our society that the professional entity in any transaction carries more burden of responsibility than the lay person in that transaction. If I walk into a local bank and ask for a $1 billion dollar loan and they give it to me. Then when I can't pay it back the bank goes out of business, is that my fault or is that the bank's fault? Not to mention, the reason the banks were giving out those terrible loans is because they just needed the loans to perpetuate their scam of reselling the loans over and over again. __________________ jim (at) amateursconvert . com Amateurs Convert

10-26-2011, 02:36 PM	#91
Socks Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: May 2002 Location: Toronto Posts: 8,478	The cost of the police presence is a horrible argument. Police forces lobby governments too, mostly to ensure they're able to overhire and swell their ranks. At a large liquour store near me (owned by the government) they'll have 5 police officers doing "pay duties" (read: double time overtime) all day, standing in the store, doing nothing. There is never a problem at the liquor store here. If there was, they could y'know.. Call the police, who would be there in 5 minutes. Every time there are construction workers working on the roads here, it's legally mandated that police officers stand there, doing nothing. Usually 2 or 3 of them. "for the safety of the construction crews..." They do everything they can to get as many hours in as possible, which is why we have a staggering number of regular police officers making SIX FUCKING FIGURES here. If anything, the protesters are doing the police a favour. If you're mad at that, be mad at the police force. Without the protesters, they're hard at work every day of the year trying to waste our money any way they can anyways.