Anyone migrated from CCBill to EpochStats?

[BNMedia]

I have just got www.kinkykicks.net approved to process with Epoch and I am going to try them at the top of my cascade at the end of this billing week.
Having had a brief look around my admin panel I quite like the look of their Epochstats affiliate admin. Just wondered if anyone has ever tried migrating their CCBill program to Epoch?
I realise that I could always use both side by side also but having one or the other would keep things simpler.
If any of my affiliates are reading this please do not worry. All existing CCBill links will remain safe.

[DWB]

Epochstats I believe is MPA3.

That doesn't answer your question, but wanted to share that little tidbit in the event you grew out of Epochstats and needed more flexibility.

And just the title of your sig scares me. Not clicking. ;-)

[BNMedia]

Thanks DWB. Yes I recall seeing MPA3 associated with Epochstats. This isn't so bad is it?
Just thinking of ditching my current NATS setup to save costs with the monthly lease.
Just looking at my options that's all

[DamianJ]

Epoch have better stats, and yes is it based on MPA3 but is highly customised, and they have MUCH better throughput.

[BNMedia]

That's the sort of thing I'm hoping to hear. Better throughput has got to be better for everyone!

[lagcam]

Epoch have a lot more payment options for your members also - another area ccbill have dropped the ball.

Be careful which ones you choose though. Some are more risky than others.

[BNMedia]

Definately. They've got me setup with a good page of options at https://wnu.com/secure/services/?api... cevvoi3p76038

I don't recognise anything too risky on there but correct me if I'm wrong!

[OY]

Epochstats Powered by MPA3 is an excellent way to run your affiliate program - and if you contact Lange Palmer at Epoch, I am sure he will assist in moving your program over ther. Import of affiliates, members, and ensure that all old linking codes are tracked 100% once the switch takes place. :-)

[OneWhoKnows]

Seriously, I have no clue why all webmasters are so crazy about CCBill. Epoch has EpochStats which is indeed pwered by MPA3, their stats are more advanced and usability is way better than CCBill's. Plus one of my best friends in this biz always keeps recommending Epoch

Well, have to make that decision this fall probably, when I plan to release my first paysite. A lot of pros for Epoch, but one big con unfortunately - affiliates are crazy for CCBill Tough decision which way to go.

Btw, does EpochStats still have MPA3's promo tool export features built in, or is it only for stats and I'd need an external solution to offer galleries and stuff for my affiliates?

[BNMedia]

Epochstats has a full promo tools feature in the admin panel
It really does look far more superior to CCBill. I'm surprised more haven't made the switch yet!

[SwirlsGirl]

Originally Posted by BNMedia

Definately. They've got me setup with a good page of options at https://wnu.com/secure/services/?api... cevvoi3p76038

I don't recognise anything too risky on there but correct me if I'm wrong!

That is one awesome join form! That form alone has to do "wonders" for join form submissions!

I mean after all if your job is to keep getting hits to your join form and that is what you do... day after day,week after week,month after month....

well maybe its time to address the actual "join form"

It loads soooo fast and is so easy to fill out...simple and efficient

[OY]

Originally Posted by OneWhoKnows

Seriously, I have no clue why all webmasters are so crazy about CCBill. Epoch has EpochStats which is indeed pwered by MPA3, their stats are more advanced and usability is way better than CCBill's. Plus one of my best friends in this biz always keeps recommending Epoch

Well, have to make that decision this fall probably, when I plan to release my first paysite. A lot of pros for Epoch, but one big con unfortunately - affiliates are crazy for CCBill Tough decision which way to go.

Btw, does EpochStats still have MPA3's promo tool export features built in, or is it only for stats and I'd need an external solution to offer galleries and stuff for my affiliates?

They do. Some things pertaining to the ownership of content has to be hosted outside the processor side of the program - but everything should be set from the program itself.

[BNMedia]

Agreed that it's a great join form.
It also has the benefit of
a) being customisable in terms of appearance.
b) loading a mobile compatible form if browsing on a mobile device :-)

Had a pleasant email from an Epoch employee today as a result of this thread offering me assistance if I need it.
At the moment I'm now leaning towards offering the option to affiliates of CCCill program and Epoch program to try and keep everyone happy!

[AmeliaG]

SpookyCash did this back in 2007. I thought affiliates would really like some of the improved functionality, especially the ease of pulling things like referring stats. Wow, how to piss off 6,000 affiliates in one complicated time-consuming step. Eventually ended up doing a CCBill 2.0 option. Some affiliates promote one way and some the other. Lange is fantabulously awesome. Can't say I've noticed Epoch having better throughput though.

In the end, SpookyCash ended up offering affiliates a choice of CCBill or Epoch and just maintaining parallel tools and tours.

[Jel]

Originally Posted by OY

contact Lange Palmer at Epoch

Got an email addy for this person? Thanks

[OY]

Originally Posted by Jel

Got an email addy for this person? Thanks

lange attttt epoch.com or you can contact harmik atttttt epoch.com

[Jel]

Originally Posted by OY

lange attttt epoch.com or you can contact harmik atttttt epoch.com

Cheers

[SGS]

Lange is a star. He even helped us set up (twice) at CCBill too many many years ago.

[BNMedia]

It was Lange who emailed me :-)

[DWB]

Originally Posted by BNMedia

Thanks DWB. Yes I recall seeing MPA3 associated with Epochstats. This isn't so bad is it?

Not at all. As an affiliate I'd choose MPA3 stats over the current CCbill affiliates stats any day of the week.

[BNMedia]

Well as this billing week draws to a close tomorrow is the day I switch Epoch to the top for all my type-in traffic. Ironically over the last couple of days I've had the best CCBill sales in weeks!

[Mutt]

in a month i'll have my own results to settle the 'Epoch has better throughput' debate for myself.

today CCBILL is winning.

[CHMOD]

Originally Posted by Mutt

in a month i'll have my own results to settle the 'Epoch has better throughput' debate for myself.

today CCBILL is winning.

Not related to the thread but can't help it: The girl in your gif is really hot!!

[BNMedia]

Just gone live with my new join form at http://www.kinkykicks.net/join.php
I've bypassed NATS completely for this setup primary payment options athe top which will go to Epoch but added options below for CCBill and Verotel.
Hope this looks OK?
I'm feeling a little nervous now as the last tow days have been a lot better than average for CCBill sales

Affiliate traffic will still go to a NATS join form processing http://join.kinkykicks.net/signup/si...MC4wLjA&step=2

I've not decided yet whether to keep NATS fully or scrap it completely in favour of Epochstats and maybe Sliiing. Will see how this goes and try and make the right decision this week!

[signupdamnit]

Originally Posted by BNMedia

Just gone live with my new join form at http://www.kinkykicks.net/join.php
I've bypassed NATS completely for this setup primary payment options athe top which will go to Epoch but added options below for CCBill and Verotel.
Hope this looks OK?
I'm feeling a little nervous now as the last tow days have been a lot better than average for CCBill sales

Affiliate traffic will still go to a NATS join form processing http://join.kinkykicks.net/signup/si...MC4wLjA&step=2

I've not decided yet whether to keep NATS fully or scrap it completely in favour of Epochstats and maybe Sliiing. Will see how this goes and try and make the right decision this week!

Well the only problem appears to be that now cookies set by your affiliates appear to be worthless so it's like you don't have cookies. Either they buy then and now or the affiliate gets no credit. Two cases to check:

Case A:

1. Customer clicks Nats link.
2. Customer decides not to signup.
3. Customer comes back in as a typein three hours later and joins. (Epoch join comes up)

Case B:

1. Customer clicks CCBill link.
2. Customer decides not to signup.
3. Customer comes back in as a typein three hours later and joins. (Epoch join comes up)

To give affiliates credit for ccbill with epoch I know that the link must go through ccbill's cascading. I also tried Case A right now and it went to epoch without cascading first through ccbill and it seemed to bypass Nats entiely.

So unless I am mistaken you aren't giving me any credit now unless customers buy right away. Not good from my point of view if so.

To fix it you have to change some things around like use nats to direct returning surfers to go through the ccbill cascade or otherwise set up a special cookie and where detected send them to the right primary processor.

My apologies if I am wrong on something but this is how I understand it. I just wanted to make sure you were aware of this and what looks to be occurring.

[bean-aid]

Originally Posted by BNMedia

I've not decided yet whether to keep NATS fully or scrap it completely in favour of Epochstats and maybe Sliiing. Will see how this goes and try and make the right decision this week!

If you go with sliiing affiliates sign up with 1 code (ccbill code) and will track through sliiing. You then have the option of any biller you would choose under the sun that can do a postback. Marco is top notch and works *hard* to get your business.

The method to track is browser cookie, flash cookie and by IP address and stays in the system for 365 days.

Hope that helps. We are going live next week and nobody will skip a beat on our setup.

[BNMedia]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

Well the only problem appears to be that now cookies set by your affiliates appear to be worthless so it's like you don't have cookies. Either they buy then and now or the affiliate gets no credit. Two cases to check:

Case A:

1. Customer clicks Nats link.
2. Customer decides not to signup.
3. Customer comes back in as a typein three hours later and joins. (Epoch join comes up)

Case B:

1. Customer clicks CCBill link.
2. Customer decides not to signup.
3. Customer comes back in as a typein three hours later and joins. (Epoch join comes up)

To give affiliates credit for ccbill with epoch I know that the link must go through ccbill's cascading. I also tried Case A right now and it went to epoch without cascading first through ccbill and it seemed to bypass Nats entiely.

So unless I am mistaken you aren't giving me any credit now unless customers buy right away. Not good from my point of view if so.

To fix it you have to change some things around like use nats to direct returning surfers to go through the ccbill cascade or otherwise set up a special cookie and where detected send them to the right primary processor.

My apologies if I am wrong on something but this is how I understand it. I just wanted to make sure you were aware of this and what looks to be occurring.

Affiliate traffic for kinkykicks.net is currently set to a different tour than type-in traffic. So if the surfer bookmarks the page that you have sent them to then any credit for the sale should be safe. The current default affiliate tour (www.kinkykicks.net/tour) is currently set to direct to a CCBill join page for all referred traffic.
The only scenario where this could be compromised is if the surfer didn't bookmark the tour and returned via our main front splash page. This takes you to www.kinkykicks.net/tourseo which is currently by-passing NATS.
The beauty of NATS is that I can (and have been) using rules so that affiliate traffic only gets a CCBill form on any tour regardless of where they enter the site and I can use whatever cascade I want for my type-in traffic.
I must confess that I'm seeing pro's and cons for both setups but I am possibly leaning towards keeping the NATS setup.

[BNMedia]

Originally Posted by beaner

If you go with sliiing affiliates sign up with 1 code (ccbill code) and will track through sliiing. You then have the option of any biller you would choose under the sun that can do a postback. Marco is top notch and works *hard* to get your business.

The method to track is browser cookie, flash cookie and by IP address and stays in the system for 365 days.

Hope that helps. We are going live next week and nobody will skip a beat on our setup.

Yes I have spoke with Marco several times over the last week and I know that he's a hard working and great guy. He's already set Sliiing up for me and it's there ready to go should that be the direction I choose to go in.

[mikesouth]

didnt DWB have some issues with epoch wanting a ton of personal info on all his models?

[signupdamnit]

Originally Posted by BNMedia

Affiliate traffic for kinkykicks.net is currently set to a different tour than type-in traffic. So if the surfer bookmarks the page that you have sent them to then any credit for the sale should be safe. The current default affiliate tour (www.kinkykicks.net/tour) is currently set to direct to a CCBill join page for all referred traffic.
The only scenario where this could be compromised is if the surfer didn't bookmark the tour and returned via our main front splash page. This takes you to www.kinkykicks.net/tourseo which is currently by-passing NATS.
The beauty of NATS is that I can (and have been) using rules so that affiliate traffic only gets a CCBill form on any tour regardless of where they enter the site and I can use whatever cascade I want for my type-in traffic.
I must confess that I'm seeing pro's and cons for both setups but I am possibly leaning towards keeping the NATS setup.

Yes and your url is on most banners and videos and "kinky kicks" is pretty memorable too so a type in or return from google is very possible. From experience (14 years as an affiliate and when I had a pay site in the early days) somewhere from 10 - 30% of sales will come back and do a type in or return through a bookmark. I don't care too much which processor is used but as an affiliate I need to get credit if someone comes back and types in your site a few hours later. It's your business but it's also mine where I send traffic so I will probably have to pull links and just send to Clubdom if it remains this way past a few days because they do pretty good for me and I get credit for returning type ins too. You do have some very nice content though. Good luck with getting things how you want them.

[BNMedia]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

Yes and your url is on most banners and videos and "kinky kicks" is pretty memorable too so a type in or return from google is very possible. From experience (14 years as an affiliate and when I had a pay site in the early days) somewhere from 10 - 30% of sales will come back and do a type in or return through a bookmark. I don't care too much which processor is used but as an affiliate I need to get credit if someone comes back and types in your site a few hours later. It's your business but it's also mine where I send traffic so I will probably have to pull links and just send to Clubdom if it remains this way past a few days because they do pretty good for me and I get credit for returning type ins too. You do have some very nice content though. Good luck with getting things how you want them.

OK, I hear what you are saying. I have posted here for opinions and advice where appropriate. As one of my affiliates your input is important to me and I want to keep you and all the others happy.
I've switched all join links on all tours back to nats and any traffic you generate guarantees you credit 100%.
The only reason I was bypassing nats is because Epoch are offering different payment methods which I can't currently use with nats. But I'll figure that out with Too Much Media if necessary.

[signupdamnit]

Originally Posted by BNMedia

OK, I hear what you are saying. I have posted here for opinions and advice where appropriate. As one of my affiliates your input is important to me and I want to keep you and all the others happy.
I've switched all join links on all tours back to nats and any traffic you generate guarantees you credit 100%.
The only reason I was bypassing nats is because Epoch are offering different payment methods which I can't currently use with nats. But I'll figure that out with Too Much Media if necessary.

That's very cool of you. I don't want to tell you what to do with your biz though. It's just that in 2012 even 10% can mean a lot and trust is very important in an industry such as this. I understand you're just trying to maximize your sales. There are actually ways to do stuff like that and still use Verotel or Epoch as a primary for type ins if you want while still giving the affiliate appropriate credit. One way I know of using a cookie (same length as the affiliate cookie) which tells you that it's an affiliate sent surfer and then you check for that cookie and load the appropriate processor on return. I've seen some basic code for it posted here before. I'm sure nats has something to do it as well. Probably mpa3 and from what Beaner states Sling too. If you want some help with the cookie method and get stuck feel free to hit me up at [email protected] and I will see if I can find some sample code.

[BNMedia]

No worries. I can achieve most of what I want with rules in NATS. I've just set Epoch to primary for type-in and CCBill for affiliate referrals. I've been trialling this setup using Verotel also for the last week or so and it 100% works.

Eg. Someone with no cookie stored clicking on the join link http://join.kinkykicks.net/signup/si...MC4wLjA&step=2 with the default NATS code (used for type-in) should get an Epoch form when hitting a credit card option.

However, someone entering via http://join.kinkykicks.net/signup/si...MC4wLjA&step=2 which is an affiliate nats code will get a CCBill form for all options.

That cookie is then stored and the surfer will always get that CCBll option unless they clear their cookies!

In the meantime I can go ahead and assess the throughput of Epoch. Then I may do an A / B split test using nats weighting.

[SwirlsGirl]

Originally Posted by BNMedia

Affiliate traffic for kinkykicks.net is currently set to a different tour than type-in traffic. So if the surfer bookmarks the page that you have sent them to then any credit for the sale should be safe. The current default affiliate tour (www.kinkykicks.net/tour) is currently set to direct to a CCBill join page for all referred traffic.
The only scenario where this could be compromised is if the surfer didn't bookmark the tour and returned via our main front splash page. This takes you to www.kinkykicks.net/tourseo which is currently by-passing NATS.
The beauty of NATS is that I can (and have been) using rules so that affiliate traffic only gets a CCBill form on any tour regardless of where they enter the site and I can use whatever cascade I want for my type-in traffic.
I must confess that I'm seeing pro's and cons for both setups but I am possibly leaning towards keeping the NATS setup.

Just looked at your tour and your epoch join forms load lightening fast! Nice looking fast loading join forms...good luck with those

[BNMedia]

Originally Posted by SwirlsGirl

Just looked at your tour and your epoch join forms load lightening fast! Nice looking fast loading join forms...good luck with those

Thank you

For anyone one else who maybe in any doubt about my CCBill Program vs Type-in setup, here are the rules which I have setup in NATS.

CCBill Affiliate Program - Default Cascade


Type-in Traffic - Epoch - CCBill - Verotel Cascade


These rules ensure a completely different cascade for affiliate traffic and type-in traffic.
Possibly going OT a little now though!

[garce]

I love MPA3! Everytime one of my sponsors has switched from, say, DHDRevEx or maybe vanilla CCBill to MPA3 I`,ve magically lost a couple hundred bucks a week income.

Amateur Allure was the best. Got about $200 per week from them when they used DHDRevEx, and now its, well... nothing. Not a gradual thing, it was a light switch. We use DHD - here`s a couple hundred bucks each week. Now we use MPA3. Here`s a hundred bucks a month. I could almost here the `click` as sales and rebills instantly stopped.

Got to love any company that changes the rules for people who have been promoting them for six or seven years.

Not a big fan of starting from scratch. Not a big fan of MPA3. I do not like it. Or MPA2. Or MPA1. Or MPA.