d-null

someone else posted this, watched the whole video and found it so extremely disturbing

JesseQuinn

def difficult to watch that video (on a lighter note I ended up muting the speakers cuz the track is godawful)

while individual soldiers can and do commit horrible atrocities (against both civilians and their fellow soldiers; rape in the military is an issue) I guess I'm not sure how effective this anti-war message was? If this was a critique of specific acts committed by a small percentage of enlisted soldiers then I'd get it. As (based on the lyrics) it's simply a characterization of soldiers as monsters and bullies, I have a few problems.

Truth is, enlisted soldiers didn't choose to wage war against Afghanistan and Iraq, and many are serving their country not because they feel it's the right thing to do but because enlisting provides employment and access to education they need to provide for themselves and their families. In some cases these are resources they'd have difficulty accquiring in any other way.

Granted this is anecdotal, but over the years I've encountered a ton of military guys in my 'adult' line of work, and the vast majority are intelligent and moral people who are caught up in a really fucked situation not of their own making. Many are strident critics of the military and the war (at least privately) and negotiate a very delicate and difficult line between doing their job and being a human being.

War forces individual soldiers to act as agents of oppression on the behalf of their government, they don't get a choice in the matter. Yes there are soldiers who are despicable people who relish the power/authority they get in a military theater over civilian populations, but for most this is a job, a job they do not because they enjoy it and sometimes not even because they believe in what they're doing.

tl;dr The real criminals are the leaders who make the choice to send young men and women out into combat. As a result of decisions made by upper-echelon staff rather than combatants, civilian populations are oppressed as a function of these wars that shouldn't have been started in the first place.

If Vietnam taught the public anything, it's that the men and women who serve are profoundly affected by what they see and do while serving, often because they are forced to do and see things that no one should have to experience. I consider both enlistees and civilian populations in occupied nations to be the 'collateral damage', and in that sense this video omits a huge portion of the truth from the narrative.

cool topic, thanks for posting the video

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throwing molotav cocktails at the precinct

- Jesus Christ -

Horse shit.

The men pulling the trigger are just as responsible.

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Amen

Nookster

They're just doing their job.

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DWB

Sarcasm or serious?

Vapid - BANNED FOR LIFE

Serious like Nuremberg

StickyGreen

Agreed...

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d-null

that's a tough thing because those that sign up are put through training that de-individualizes and makes one accepting of orders without question

bronco67

What would they know about being a soldier, sitting in their momma's basement writing shitty music? I'm not saying soldiers don't commit atrocities, but these guys are idiots.

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d-null

kind of reminds me of Nile, this is a great song, not disturbing

d-null

did you watch the entire video in the original post? I'm still disturbed from watching it the other day

Matt 26z

Just a lame attempt at shock. Nothing creative. Nothing artistic. No substantive statement. They went for the low hanging fruit here. Probably in hopes of the media coming down on them. That would have been free publicity.

ICP used to do this, but at least they were entertaining in a train wreck kind of way.