Nightline/ABCnews expose: Is Mindgeek/Manwin killing the porn industry?

[signupdamnit]

Let the BROshit begin!!!



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xxRvJQtFwXw

[Antokas]

oh, it's about to begin.... taking my popcorn....

[Ramster]

Interesting

[arock10]

Toooooooobs

[2MuchMark]

Good reporting by ABC News. I know its unlikely but I would love to see government regulation here somehow. And since the tube sites are making it easier and easier, you'd think maybe the religious groups or porn haters would get involved...

[Creatine]

Wow this is an eye opener...

[marcop]

I'm surprised--that wasn't the usual network news drivel. Good reporting.

[adultmobile]

Why was not Mike South interviewed too?

[ITraffic]

did not adapt. died.

[slapass]

Sort of nice that the talent was speaking up. Maybe they will be herd more then the rest of us as they are viewed as being exploited already.

[AsianDivaGirlsWebDude]

Originally Posted by adultmobile

Why was not Mike South interviewed too?

WTF? They interviewed Fishbein instead of Theo!?!

What an oversight and shame to not interview or get a comment from Feras Antoon, the main geek currently behind MindGeek/Manwin/Mansef, since he overthrew Fabian Thylmann:



Good job Aaliyah and Tasha, and keep up the good work Nate (Takedown Piracy)!



ADG

[sandman!]

wow an actual news story thats about adult on gfy

[OneHungLo]

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude

WTF? They interviewed Fishbein instead of Theo!?!

What an oversight and shame to not interview or get a comment from Feras Antoon, the main geek currently behind MindGeek/Manwin/Mansef, since he overthrew Fabian Thylmann:



Good job Aaliyah and Tasha, and keep up the good work Nate (Takedown Piracy)!



ADG

Yeah, what the fuck! Why no Soul_Rebel interview!!!!!!

[bean-aid]

12 billion dollars... lol

[signupdamnit]

Originally Posted by beaner

12 billion dollars... lol

I caught that as well. I think they just pulled it from old AVN interviews? Anyway I'd like to talk to them about that.

They used 80 million uniques a day to the Mindgeek/Manwin/Mansef tubes. Let's just give them 100 million.

100 million uniques
$3/1k
= $300,000 / day

$300,000 * 365 days = $109.5 million / year (If you think my numbers are off then double or triple it and it still changes nothing)

Considering these tubes now have most of the traffic according to almost everyone in the industry I'd like to know where the other billions are being made?

It would be comical if we weren't all the dunces sitting in the middle of it with our dunce hats on.

[AsianDivaGirlsWebDude]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

I caught that as well. I think they just pulled it from old AVN interviews? Anyway I'd like to talk to them about that.

They used 80 million uniques a day to the Mindgeek/Manwin/Mansef tubes. Let's just give them 100 million.

100 million uniques
$3/1k
= $300,000 / day

$300,000 * 365 days = $109.5 million / year (If you think my numbers are off then double or triple it and it still changes nothing)

Considering these tubes now have most of the traffic according to almost everyone in the industry I'd like to know where the other billions are being made?

It would be comical if we weren't all the dunces sitting in the middle of it with our dunce hats on.

Include dating, camshow, and penis pill advertising $$$ (not to mention card slamming, money laundering, and various other scams)...



ADG

[deltav]

Wow, a concise & clear mainstream look at the biggest issue in our industry today, without any sensationalizing. I'm impressed.

The billion dollar question is, how do you combat a company with those kind of resources and market reach? AFAIK you don't. They got too big.

[iwantchixx]

Until the users realize what they are doing is wrong, it will never change. users feel entitled to freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[The Porn Nerd]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

I caught that as well. I think they just pulled it from old AVN interviews? Anyway I'd like to talk to them about that.

They used 80 million uniques a day to the Mindgeek/Manwin/Mansef tubes. Let's just give them 100 million.

100 million uniques
$3/1k
= $300,000 / day

$300,000 * 365 days = $109.5 million / year (If you think my numbers are off then double or triple it and it still changes nothing)

Considering these tubes now have most of the traffic according to almost everyone in the industry I'd like to know where the other billions are being made?

It would be comical if we weren't all the dunces sitting in the middle of it with our dunce hats on.

It's not just traffic and what they make per 1k, as ADG pointed out. But you also have to throw in assets, like real estate, stocks, private corporate investments, partnerships, tax advantages, etc etc. Once a company gets over, say, the $5 million mark then things 'change' in ways most 'average' people cannot fully understand. Most people do not realize the sheer economic POWER of 100 million dolllars and what that can do.

No, at THIS point the only thing that changes the tube situation is this:

1. Laws requiring Age Verification before entering a 'free' porn site.
2. Blocking the US, Canada and GB from accessing free sites like PornHub et al.
3. Political and religious groups mobilizing to accomplish #1 and #2
4. Users who upload porn to sites (AFTER the laws change) get prosecuted for illegal file sharing and pay damages.
5. Re-education, as in 'stealing is bad" combined with ad campaigns warning people their computers or worse may be at risk if they visit these 'illegal' porn sites (viruses, identity theft, wife finding out, etc).

Chances of any of the above happening within 5 years: 2%

Carry on wayward sons.

[deltav]

I agree with you on those, but move that % decimal point a few places to the left.

[bean-aid]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

I caught that as well. I think they just pulled it from old AVN interviews? Anyway I'd like to talk to them about that.

They used 80 million uniques a day to the Mindgeek/Manwin/Mansef tubes. Let's just give them 100 million.

100 million uniques
$3/1k
= $300,000 / day

$300,000 * 365 days = $109.5 million / year (If you think my numbers are off then double or triple it and it still changes nothing)

Considering these tubes now have most of the traffic according to almost everyone in the industry I'd like to know where the other billions are being made?

It would be comical if we weren't all the dunces sitting in the middle of it with our dunce hats on.

100 million sounds about right... and Nathan mentioned Manwin (a year ago or so) represented maybe 5% of online adult.

So that puts industry around 2 billion total. That is my evaluation of the industry and I'm sticking to it

[MaDalton]

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

No, at THIS point the only thing that changes the tube situation is this:

1. Laws requiring Age Verification before entering a 'free' porn site.
2. Blocking the US, Canada and GB from accessing free sites like PornHub et al.
3. Political and religious groups mobilizing to accomplish #1 and #2
4. Users who upload porn to sites (AFTER the laws change) get prosecuted for illegal file sharing and pay damages.
5. Re-education, as in 'stealing is bad" combined with ad campaigns warning people their computers or worse may be at risk if they visit these 'illegal' porn sites (viruses, identity theft, wife finding out, etc).

Chances of any of the above happening within 5 years: 2%

Carry on wayward sons.

running a site like Pornhub is per se not something illegal as long as the content is licensed, you can't forbid that

you could do it like the germans and require age verification (there is no free hardcore porn on .de domains) but it would help if Visa and Mastercard would be involved. Otherwise people just move on to other TLDs or countries

getting politicians and religious groups involved would be absurd, as if they would care whether it's legal or illegal porn. they just want us to go away in total

and you don't even need to re-educate people, you can still offer free content for those who are not able or willing to pay - make your money from ad revenue instead

i always see tubes as free TV and paysites as SKY or HBO - you just need to close a few loopholes and have real legal consequences for those that still break the laws.

but just "free = bad" is too simple

[mikesouth]

They contacted me but apparently didnt want to come to Atlanta to interview me. after seeing this ad for tubesites im glad they didnt.

they asked me for a ton of info on Mindgeek, they used very little of it and obviously nothing that was very damning. They were more interested in the chick saying she would be naked all the time if she could than they were in any piracy angle.

As a friend of mine said wh was watching it with me (I was in FL) "That just makes me want to go to pornhub and check out that Tasha reign chick"

[Paul]

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

100 million uniques
$3/1k
= $300,000 / day

$300,000 * 365 days = $109.5 million / year

You really need to stop pulling these numbers out of your ass

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

(If you think my numbers are off then double or triple it and it still changes nothing)

Yep it's still a made up number because you don't have a clue how much they make!

The clip was a good advertisement for Nate Glass of Takedown Piracy, someone who's business relies on piracy

[bean-aid]

Originally Posted by Paul

The clip was a good advertisement for Nate Glass of Takedown Piracy, someone who's business relies on piracy

...and Aaliyah and Tasha. Bet Aaliyah Love's website had a significant bump in joins.

[signupdamnit]

Originally Posted by mikesouth

They contacted me but apparently didnt want to come to Atlanta to interview me. after seeing this ad for tubesites im glad they didnt.

they asked me for a ton of info on Mindgeek, they used very little of it and obviously nothing that was very damning. They were more interested in the chick saying she would be naked all the time if she could than they were in any piracy angle.

As a friend of mine said wh was watching it with me (I was in FL) "That just makes me want to go to pornhub and check out that Tasha reign chick"

At least they clearly linked them to piracy though. Many used to not even do that. They used to pretend that Manwin was a "legit industry leader". They even showed people talking about having to send Pornhub DMCAs all the time. I think it's a start anyway although yeah I think it'll make most surfers jsut want to go out and pirate more stuff. Hopefully though it turns off some mainstream investors and might even persuade some religious "save the children" or "porn is of the devil!" group to rally against them.

[signupdamnit]

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

It's not just traffic and what they make per 1k, as ADG pointed out. But you also have to throw in assets, like real estate, stocks, private corporate investments, partnerships, tax advantages, etc etc. Once a company gets over, say, the $5 million mark then things 'change' in ways most 'average' people cannot fully understand. Most people do not realize the sheer economic POWER of 100 million dolllars and what that can do.

To make $1 billion a year from 100 million uniques a day they would have to be making a little under $30/k and that just isn't happening today. Considering the traffic type and with my experience running legal tubes I think even $10/k would be a serious stretch. That $10/k would include all income from ads, dating, cams, premium, everything. For comparison FFN has an estimated annual revenue of about $300 million but a lot of that is eaten up by ad buys and affiliate payments (in fact they have been net negative for a while due to various debts). Adding up all the revenues of all the adult companies would not be an accurate gage of the industry worth since it includes the same money multiple times. That is, say FFN pays MindGeek $100 million in year for ad buys. FFN counts the income gained from those ad buys as revenue and likewise Mindgeek counts the money earned from the ad buys as revenue so the same $100 million is double counted. I agree on other investments outside of porn but that's outside of the scope of the focus.

PS- Ironically $30/k probably could have happened back in 2006 before they started giving 100 million people free porn every day. But it's not happening now on that traffic. They hurt themselves.

[RyuLion]

Congratz Aaliyah Love for getting the chance on speaking out!!

[dyna mo]

I liked how the girls said they aren't gonna speak out on it, then they go right on ahead and speak out!

I love them porn chicks!

[mikesouth]

Im writing it up for tomorrow the piece they did was NOT the piece they told me they wanted to do.

[bluebook18]

Originally Posted by RyuLion

Congratz Aaliyah Love for getting the chance on speaking out!!

Yeah, and also kudos to nate glass.

[StinkyPink]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

I liked how the girls said they aren't gonna speak out on it, then they go right on ahead and speak out!

I love them porn chicks!

You do know about editing right? And the twisty turning of the news media? If yes then I know you can only assume that part was about something possibly totally out of context right?

Cool.

Carry on.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by StinkyPink

You do know about editing right? And the twisty turning of the news media? If yes then I know you can only assume that part was about something possibly totally out of context right?

Cool.

Carry on.

what are you talking about?

twisty turning? editing? out of context?

[StinkyPink]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

what are you talking about?

twisty turning? editing? out of context?

The camera cuts to the girls outside and they are just walking away saying they don't want to talk about it... that could have been about anything. The narrator says it is about mindgeek and piracy, but that means squat without seeing the context for which that part of the reel was made.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by StinkyPink

The camera cuts to the girls outside and they are just walking away saying they don't want to talk about it... that could have been about anything. The narrator says it is about mindgeek and piracy, but that means squat without seeing the context for which that part of the reel was made.

I can appreciate your mistrust of the media. However, I think they got it spot on re: this story. Besides, 1) you can hear aaliyah saying she doesn't want to get banned from them for talking about it in that clip and 2) the fact the girls "can't speak out" is the actual kicker of the story, as per the narrator in the conclusion stating that's the kicker.

Nevertheless, good story but still funny re: they girls, not uncommon.

[mineistaken]

Where are the usual bros and ass kissers of manthief?

[dgraves]

And yet there's no shortage of producers willing to team up with these same tubes to help them further fund the left. The tube owners have even managed to convince producers that they need 10-15 minute teaser videos to sell memberships and they drank the Kool Aid. This industry is chalked full of liars, cheats and thieves and it deserves everything it gets.

On a side note, I was watching Game of Thrones the other night and just for fun I timed their teasers for the next show. Each one was a minute and thirty seconds, some were less.

[MrTrollkien]

Time for google to buy porn 'sex-tubes'. 

[Barry-xlovecam]

I thought the whole segment was tongue in cheek.

If anything it's a message: "Let the pervs eat each other up ..."

Since there in no compelling public interest in this story the story is no more than sensationalism to sell their TV advertising -- sound familiar ?

[The Porn Nerd]

Originally Posted by MaDalton

running a site like Pornhub is per se not something illegal as long as the content is licensed, you can't forbid that

you could do it like the germans and require age verification (there is no free hardcore porn on .de domains) but it would help if Visa and Mastercard would be involved. Otherwise people just move on to other TLDs or countries

getting politicians and religious groups involved would be absurd, as if they would care whether it's legal or illegal porn. they just want us to go away in total

and you don't even need to re-educate people, you can still offer free content for those who are not able or willing to pay - make your money from ad revenue instead

i always see tubes as free TV and paysites as SKY or HBO - you just need to close a few loopholes and have real legal consequences for those that still break the laws.

but just "free = bad" is too simple

Excellent points! But in America, to get anything done concerning sex, you need to rile people up to take action and no one gets their panties in a bunch more than soccer moms and Christians. LOL Oh how I wish it was like in Germany and most of Europe, where the attitudes about sex (and sex workers) is sane.

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

To make $1 billion a year from 100 million uniques a day they would have to be making a little under $30/k and that just isn't happening today. Considering the traffic type and with my experience running legal tubes I think even $10/k would be a serious stretch. That $10/k would include all income from ads, dating, cams, premium, everything. For comparison FFN has an estimated annual revenue of about $300 million but a lot of that is eaten up by ad buys and affiliate payments (in fact they have been net negative for a while due to various debts). Adding up all the revenues of all the adult companies would not be an accurate gage of the industry worth since it includes the same money multiple times. That is, say FFN pays MindGeek $100 million in year for ad buys. FFN counts the income gained from those ad buys as revenue and likewise Mindgeek counts the money earned from the ad buys as revenue so the same $100 million is double counted. I agree on other investments outside of porn but that's outside of the scope of the focus.

PS- Ironically $30/k probably could have happened back in 2006 before they started giving 100 million people free porn every day. But it's not happening now on that traffic. They hurt themselves.

I agree with your numbers, I was mixing up Mind Geek and "the Industry" estimates. Typical of me. LOL But yeah, I would agree $100 million is about right based on estimates. Who knows for real?

[oppoten]

Originally Posted by arock10

Toooooooobs

It's always weird when I hear Americans pronounce web words that I've always said Britishly

*tyuuuubes*

[kane]

Nice ad for free porn.

[MrTrollkien]

Originally Posted by kane

Nice ad for free porn.

Who does not know them anyway?

[StinkyPink]

Originally Posted by oppoten

It's always weird when I hear Americans pronounce web words that I've always said Britishly

*tyuuuubes*

Ummm...

It's always weird when folks say they hear it when someone actually typed it.

[Juicy D. Links]

toooooooooooobessssssssssss

[kane]

Originally Posted by MrTrollkien

Who does not know them anyway?

I'm sure there are plenty of people that don't know about them. I have several friends that don't look at porn very often so they would simply type whatever they looking for into Google. That might lead them to a tube site, but if they were watching this piece they might say, "Oh, Pornhub is the biggest free site in the world. I need to check that out." or, "All of that girl's scenes are online for free? I'm going to go searching."

[StinkyPink]

Not to mention they flashed the tube logos several times so users know it when they get to the right place... what was the names of the studios mentioned? The performers websites? Oh wait... they didn't. Oh yeah they did... the ones owned by mindgeek that's right.

[JFK]

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude

WTF? They interviewed Fishbein instead of Theo!?!

What an oversight and shame to not interview or get a comment from Feras Antoon, the main geek currently behind MindGeek/Manwin/Mansef, since he overthrew Fabian Thylmann:



Good job Aaliyah and Tasha, and keep up the good work Nate (Takedown Piracy)!



ADG

Fishbein, sounds better on camera

[The Porn Nerd]

There IS no "bad" publicity, just remember that.

[JuicyBunny]

Originally Posted by dgraves

And yet there's no shortage of producers willing to team up with these same tubes to help them further fund the left. The tube owners have even managed to convince producers that they need 10-15 minute teaser videos to sell memberships and they drank the Kool Aid. This industry is chalked full of liars, cheats and thieves and it deserves everything it gets.

On a side note, I was watching Game of Thrones the other night and just for fun I timed their teasers for the next show. Each one was a minute and thirty seconds, some were less.

Nail on the head. Nice nod to Nate too. It's funny in a fucked way people complain about Nate's business while the backhandedly slap the back of the bro club. Sleazy and stupid.