what does age verification coming up mean?

[disinfected]

For the adult industry, what does that mean, when will it happen, where, and will it help or hurt?

Just thinking out loud but one scenerio in my mind would be to verify age by credit card. And if that is the case won't that open the doors for large scale almost hidden upsales/x-sales going rampant?

I guess my question is, if age verification by cc is going to be required, how in the world will that work knowing people who cross bang will be on that like shit on flies.

And will everything porn related on internet self implode?

Or will age verification be on the isp level?

[420]

Are you 18?

yes ---- no

[disinfected]

Originally Posted by 420

Are you 18?

yes ---- no

was done in late 90's and early 2000's and determined totally ineffective at stopping underage.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by disinfected

And if that is the case won't that open the doors for large scale almost hidden upsales/x-sales going rampant?

No, because Visa and MC put in new rules that stop that.
If someone tries it, I would assume that they do so at the risk of losing their merchant account and ability to make money.

EDIT: By the way. Your website doesn't work.

[disinfected]

Originally Posted by Robbie

No, because Visa and MC put in new rules that stop that.
If someone tries it, I would assume that they do so at the risk of losing their merchant account and ability to make money.

EDIT: By the way. Your website doesn't work.

Rules don't mean shit. Which website? They said cross sales were going to be banned 2 years ago and they are stronger then ever.

[Robbie]

"Rules don't mean shit"

Yeah, tell that to Visa and MC. They will drop you like a bad habit.

And no...xsales are not "stronger than ever". You can't x-sale from one merchant account to another anymore. Sharing of customer data like that isn't possible anymore with the way Visa and MC work.

As I understood it...CC Bill merchants can still x-sale with each other because it's all under CC Bills merchant account.

But the days of millions of dollars of x-sale revenue being made in the industry are long gone.

Get your own merchant account and you'll find out quick what the "rules" mean and how hardcore Visa and MC are.

[disinfected]

Robbie, you can x-sell from any account, to any account. Nothing has changed. I actually thought it would have, but no.

My main question still remains, what will be the age verification check?

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by disinfected

Robbie, you can x-sell from any account, to any account. Nothing has changed. I actually thought it would have, but no.

My main question still remains, what will be the age verification check?

I don't know about the age verification check. But I'm pretty sure that you can't do the x-sales the way you used to could.

I could be wrong.

But someone from one of the billing companies would be able to clear that up for you.

I can tell you that all the companies that USED to make bank with x-sales before the rule changes are now out of business.

Ever hear of QuickBucks? Or WEG?

That was THE way that they made millions. When it was stopped (and it was), they closed up shop.

I'm unsure if there is any other way to x-sale other than the way I said with CC Bill or else x-selling to your own sites (under the same merchant account)
Either way, it's not even a small fraction of what it was like when x-sales were wide open.

So I don't think that's even an issue.

As for credit cards being used to verify age...that won't work. Plenty of teenagers have Visa and MasterCard debit cards from the bank.

And lots of teenagers with parents who make decent money, have credit cards.

[disinfected]

The current law is you can x-sell to same merchant. 12clicks would not still be posting on this forum if he couldn't make money on those sales.

I think the direction of age verification will be thru cc's... it is the only way in my opinion. What will also happen is those cc's will be banged to all hell.

[tiramisu]

Basically means nothing if u asked me, cuz everyone eventually click yes or above 18. But it also means backlinks to google since every no will link to search engine somehow.

[shoot twice]

Several yeas ago James Digorgio did a PSA about keeping porn out of the hands of the under age. If my memory serves me correctly he took some heat from within the industry for being "moralistic". But frankly Digorgio was right and today the Internet is a shitty mess because no one put an end to the entire "click to enter if over 18" bullshit.

Today far too many parents knowingly allow their children to watch Internet porn. Because as long as their children are quiet and they know where they are, most parents aren't going to get too worried. Making matters worse, right under a parent's nose there are under age children uploading videos of themselves and trolling tumblr and facebook looking for horny old men that will paypal them money for a webcam show.

Then to top this shitty mess off there's goons on reddit and 4chan that if they find a 13 year old girl's nude photos they'll pull out all the stops to make sure the photos are plastered all over the net to prevent the full take down of them.

[Matt 26z]

Barring a radical shift in the makeup of the internet (i.e., a movement away from traditional websites), age verification will never be a reality. Realistically, the only way to do it is for the www to collapse and everyone starts using nothing but mobile apps. Then Apple and Google would essencially control the contents of the internet and they could allow porn apps with age ID required. But that is all very far fetched.

The US supreme court long ago struck down a Clinton era attempt at putting sexually explicit materials behind an age wall due to first ammendment issues. So it will never happen in the US.

You'd have to be delusional to envision an internet without free porn. The genie is out of the bottle and she isn't going back in. The only thing society can do at this stage is normalize porn. And that's exactly what's been happening over the past 15 years. Look at PornHub's billboard in Times Square this week. That is a sign of the times.

[Tam]

Originally Posted by Matt 26z

Barring a radical shift in the makeup of the internet (i.e., a movement away from traditional websites), age verification will never be a reality. Realistically, the only way to do it is for the www to collapse and everyone starts using nothing but mobile apps. Then Apple and Google would essencially control the contents of the internet and they could allow porn apps with age ID required. But that is all very far fetched.

The US supreme court long ago struck down a Clinton era attempt at putting sexually explicit materials behind an age wall due to first ammendment issues. So it will never happen in the US.

You'd have to be delusional to envision an internet without free porn. The genie is out of the bottle and she isn't going back in. The only thing society can do at this stage is normalize porn. And that's exactly what's been happening over the past 15 years. Look at PornHub's billboard in Times Square this week. That is a sign of the times.

This is kind of what I was thinking - I honestly don't see how they can do it wihtout upsetting a lot of apple carts.

As for cc being the way, that's not going to do it either - I just found out a week or so ago that a 16 yr old can get a checking and debit card from the bank - with a parent or guardian involved, but still remains, they can have and hold a debit card which essentially works the same way as a CC, I would think when it comes to this sort of thing - so that CC verification isn't really going to make any sense either - it's just going to get harder and harder and harder as time goes by and especially with porn getting more and more mainstream almost by the day.

[slapass]

I remember when warning pages were all the rage, and now no one has one. I don't see any serious effort at age verification coming down the pike any time soon.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by disinfected

Which website?

The website you have listed in your public profile in the "About Me" tab here on GFY.
The girlsoncam one.

[Barry-xlovecam]

In the USA credit card possession is not proof of age.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Child_O...Protection_Act

Ashcroft v. American Civil Liberties Union 2004, 2006
On January 21, 2009, the United States Supreme Court refused to hear appeals of the lower court decision

In other jurisdictions?

[disinfected]

Originally Posted by Robbie

The website you have listed in your public profile in the "About Me" tab here on GFY.
The girlsoncam one.

Just one of the many on the to do list. Check out the latest, actually offering games to solo model sites to use for further fan enjoyment. Hit me up for details if you like what you see.

On topic, why is JT from ruseful talking about age verification coming up in a big way in his summit talk? Anyone gonna spill the beans?

I did not watch the speech but relied on cliff notes from trollenskein and believe he mentioned that as a key note bullet point.

[TisMe]

Until such time as you can positively identify the person using any device, age verification is not and will not be possible.

Years ago published US Gov't rules required an adult website to verify age by requiring a credit card for access, I think it was 10+ years ago and the DOJ.

At the same time MC and Visa prohibited using their cards or even mentioning their names connected with age verification as they want to sell cards for kids.

[disinfected]

I just want to also say, in addition to JT has age verification is long over due, he has also said that tubes, industry in general, are in for a major shift and to brace yourself.

Well we all know a law will not be passed to require site owners to be responsible for content on site (aka the user uploaded protection... aka youtube) so only other logical summation of such a statement will be age verification requirements.

Doesn't mean they have to work, just that something is going to happen. So what in the feuck is it?

Or, is JT's ... brace yourself for major shift just hyping cloud.xxx?

[Matt 26z]

Originally Posted by disinfected

I just want to also say, in addition to JT has age verification is long over due, he has also said that tubes, industry in general, are in for a major shift and to brace yourself.

Well we all know a law will not be passed to require site owners to be responsible for content on site (aka the user uploaded protection... aka youtube) so only other logical summation of such a statement will be age verification requirements.

Doesn't mean they have to work, just that something is going to happen. So what in the feuck is it?

Or, is JT's ... brace yourself for major shift just hyping cloud.xxx?

So you based the thread on cryptic statements made by a known PR whore....

Nothing is going to happen.

[NatalieK]

Originally Posted by Matt 26z

So you based the thread on cryptic statements made by a known PR whore....

Nothing is going to happen.

It's amazing to see how many sites are still on the web not noticed by ATVOD & UK based, they'll be seen in the end

[InfoGuy]

Originally Posted by Robbie

As for credit cards being used to verify age...that won't work. Plenty of teenagers have Visa and MasterCard debit cards from the bank.

And lots of teenagers with parents who make decent money, have credit cards.

I agree, plus anyone could simply walk into a grocery store and buy a prepaid V/MC/AX gift card.

[chaze]

The truth is it will help save porn again, it needs to be standard on any site.

Just a how old are you page or pop up will work. I am sure something in .htaccess can pull it off site wide. Maybe have a general service that offers the code for this and has system that is pretty good. Like an age verification service.


Or even more the rule should be that you have to log in to see adult content. If this happens tubes will be brought down because won't want to share their details.

People will think of online porn more like a local business and find sites they trust.

It's a great thing and will bring porn back to adult webmasters not tube sucking free sites.

[Robbie]

chaze the point is....HOW can you verify age on the internet?

As has already been pointed out: credit cards don't prove anything.

I do think that it would cut down on traffic to free porn as you pointed out though...simply because the majority of people aren't going to trust their cc info to a site like Pornhub.

Why would you give your credit card info to a site that's built on stealing?

So in that regard, you are correct about it saving the porn biz if it happens.

[chaze]

Originally Posted by Robbie

chaze the point is....HOW can you verify age on the internet?

As has already been pointed out: credit cards don't prove anything.

I do think that it would cut down on traffic to free porn as you pointed out though...simply because the majority of people aren't going to trust their cc info to a site like Pornhub.

Why would you give your credit card info to a site that's built on stealing?

So in that regard, you are correct about it saving the porn biz if it happens.

Exactly, it's a good thing. We have a good future in adult sites. When age verification or logging in becomes a rule. The industry will go back to what it once was.

Yeah there is no way to tell age. But at least having an age verification pop up can help some. People are scared to lie even on the internet. Especially if it's against the law or can have some sort of re-precaution.

I'm all for it. Card verification or at least an "are you 18" pop up site wide.

Anything to stop the bleeding from simple free porn access that taking away from the industry.

[InfoGuy]

It's going to be an uphill battle getting sites to add age verification pages . Those pages will increase bounce rates and lower average visitor durations, 2 metrics which will negatively impact SERPs.

What's the best markup / solution to use in HTML5 to indicate adult content?

[chaze]

Originally Posted by InfoGuy

It's going to be an uphill battle getting sites to add age verification pages . Those pages will increase bounce rates and lower average visitor durations, 2 metrics which will negatively impact SERPs.

What's the best markup / solution to use in HTML5 to indicate adult content?

Yeah tags are good for SE's but for word to mouth it wouldn't matter ext...

Yeah age verification could hurt SERPs but Google can flick a switch and give points for it. Someone just needs to pitch them on it.

There would need to be a coalition and have some big names backing it. Then after it's locked down pitch it to Google to give love for sites using it.

[Robbie]

chaze, I was with you until the part about pitching an idea to Google.

Google is notorious for NEVER revealing their algorithm for SEO and they will never even bother listening to the adult industry on that matter.

[chaze]

Originally Posted by Robbie

chaze, I was with you until the part about pitching an idea to Google.

Google is notorious for NEVER revealing their algorithm for SEO and they will never even bother listening to the adult industry on that matter.

Yeah I hear ya.

Pipe dreams.

I just want to level the the playing field free porn is just too easy access now-a-days.

Age verification or needing to log in is the only way I can think of.

[Robbie]

Originally Posted by chaze

Age verification or needing to log in is the only way I can think of.

Changing the law to require 2257 docs for tube sites and file share sites will do the trick.

[DWB]

Originally Posted by Robbie

chaze the point is....HOW can you verify age on the internet?

The way they do in South Korea. Everything you do online, EVERYTHING, is connected to your real name, you use it to log onto the internet. It's the law. So you would be posting here by your real name, not just Robbie. They don't have online trolls there within the country because they have to attach their real names to the account every time they log on.

If you have to attach your name and ID to the internet at every login, you can A) filter out adult content, and b) know children are not visiting your site. If they log in via an account that is not theirs, they violate the law.

Yes, that is a harsh way, but that is one way it could be done. I'm sure with a little thought there could be other ways. South Korea just came to mind when I read your post. The good news is, it would get rid of all the online tolls.

[Matt 26z]

The industry itself could kill the tube sites overnight if it wanted to by simply not buying advertising on them. This talk of age verification to eliminate free porn is coming from people trying to save the industry from itself. And while that is an honorable effort, it ignores the technical and logistical impossibility of it ever happening within the current structure of the web.

[SEXTANT]

Originally Posted by 420

Are you 18?

yes ---- no

[marlboroack]

You DON"T want any kids in there.. that's for sure.

[disinfected]

Originally Posted by GspotProductions

It's amazing to see how many sites are still on the web not noticed by ATVOD & UK based, they'll be seen in the end

ATVOD does what exactly? I know it is UK based and they vagina'd their way into adult somehow... but what do they do again?

[disinfected]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Changing the law to require 2257 docs for tube sites and file share sites will do the trick.

Sounds eerily familiar to the xvideos bonanza just of recent. So that is it... hah! I knew it... the big age verification threat is that a rumor exists that 2257 will be required on any site hosting content and not legal for a certain age group. So that is the loop hole to fuck adult and not youtube... lol

[disinfected]

Bump for thoughts. Why would a site like xvideos start demanding 2257 if they were not "bracing" themselves?

[lezinterracial]

Originally Posted by disinfected

Bump for thoughts. Why would a site like xvideos start demanding 2257 if they were not "bracing" themselves?

I think in your case they were demanding the 2257 to take the video down. Not put the video up. Illegal tube sites like to make it as difficult as possible to remove your videos. Hoping that you will just give up.

My prediction, Politicians like free porn that is easy to get with no tracking. Just like everyone else. Nothing will be done. In a few years most new content on tubes will be ripped cam sessions.

People will no longer pay for digital media. All songs and movies will be a commercial for food, sodas and shoes.

Just my prediction.

[lezinterracial]

Oh, sorry Disinfected. Confused you with myleene. Myleene was the one that had a pirate tube site ask for a 2257 to take the video down.

I remember it was posted on gfy a little while back an underage person was on the front page of xvideos for a couple of days. Xvideos hired people to review videos because this had happened before. Xvideos is probably having to be extra careful now.

[lock]

Been and gone hasn't it. Laws in one country will only benefit another. Eg: if The US dollar started going off shore it would be amended.

[disinfected]

Originally Posted by lezinterracial

Oh, sorry Disinfected. Confused you with myleene. Myleene was the one that had a pirate tube site ask for a 2257 to take the video down.

I remember it was posted on gfy a little while back an underage person was on the front page of xvideos for a couple of days. Xvideos hired people to review videos because this had happened before. Xvideos is probably having to be extra careful now.

That is one issue, I am talking about JT's thread warning about content partners of xvideos must click a button that they relinquish all rights to xvideos to continue uploading. Part of that agreement, fairly certain, is that they have legal rights to your 2257.

So what robbie said and what I have read I connected these dots and just wondering if it has any merit.

is a means to have age verification really a means to kill "porn" tubes by requiring porn tubes to have the 2257 docs? The loop hole is that mainstream tubes, are not in general, age restrictive? So why would xvideos take such drastic measures as to use legal jargon to own your videos?

I do not think is because makes it harder to take down, I think because something is coming down the pipeline and tubes need to own the videos or else...

[signupdamnit]

Originally Posted by disinfected

That is one issue, I am talking about JT's thread warning about content partners of xvideos must click a button that they relinquish all rights to xvideos to continue uploading. Part of that agreement, fairly certain, is that they have legal rights to your 2257.

So what robbie said and what I have read I connected these dots and just wondering if it has any merit.

is a means to have age verification really a means to kill "porn" tubes by requiring porn tubes to have the 2257 docs? The loop hole is that mainstream tubes, are not in general, age restrictive? So why would xvideos take such drastic measures as to use legal jargon to own your videos?

I do not think is because makes it harder to take down, I think because something is coming down the pipeline and tubes need to own the videos or else...

The only effective ways to do this are:

1. Have Worldwide laws which require it.
2. Allow individual countries to start blocking sites to all internet users within their jurisdiction who do not comply. This means that regardless of what China or Russia does if all US ISPs are required to block the rogue sites then it will have an impact. Sure some will get around it but most will not.

Politicians largely do not know what the hell is going on though. Look at the UK with the ATVOD thing. All they did was put those in the industry who live within their borders at a tremendous disadvantage. It changed nothing otherwise.

Regarding why they are doing it I think it is "because they can". If they can get away with it (and they lack ethics which we all know already), why wouldn't they?