This is what is wrong with this country..

[crockett]

In Cali they are dismantling a homeless camp that had roughly 200 people living there on roughly a 1 square mile area. The city has spent 4 million dollars trying to deal with it and the end resualt is they just kick everyone out..

Now it's not about the homeless you could insert any issue in its place.. It's the fact that the city spent 4 million dollars or so they claim trying to deal with this and they haven't even paid for the destruction and hauling away of the shit..

4 million dollars and really nothing at all was solve and these homeless people will just move to a new carboard box elsewhere.. No solution to any problem just $4 million and counting of people's tax dollars going "somewhere".


San Jose, California, massive homeless camp being cleared out - CBS News

[L-Pink]

Committees, sub committees, advisory panels and probably a homeless task force to debate what should be done.

[brassmonkey]

with all the bs that government adds to life. they pocket the money! they make companies! go and look how many own companies! its a great system to legally fuck you over

[aka123]

It makes about 20 000 per homeless people during the 1,5 year timeframe. They could house, feed, entertain, etc. the people for less money, and everybody would win.

But I guess it would be communism or something, so it isn't an option.

[Rochard]

Article is unclear - They spent four million dollars on what? Seems they haven't done anything other than clearing them out once before in 2012. Clearly that wasn't four million bucks worth.

In my little home town here we have a pack of homeless people / meth heads we call the "creek crew". We have a little ravine that runs through town, along side two large parks about three miles apart, and they use stream to travel between the two and camp out. It's very strange.

[MiamiBoyz]

Individuals do not matter to governments. Governments are designed to keep themselves going and all they need to do for that is keep the majority "happy"...those homeless are meaningless to them.

[pornguy]

Its actually more of a complicated thing than you can imagine.

As Miami Beach PD how much it cost them to run them out and ultimately lose a battle in court to the homeless.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by brassmonkey

with all the bs that government adds to life. they pocket the money! they make companies! go and look how many own companies! its a great system to legally fuck you over

This is what I bet most of it is.. Like in FL for example when they had that whole drug testing for welfare scam. It was the Govenor's wife whom owned the company which did the drug testing. The worst part is it cost more for the testing than what was saved by the small amount whom tested positive.

Then in MA when they legalized medical Majauana they originally allowed only 10 permits for growers, of those 10 3 of them went to former state representatives and one was actually a former DA.

[brassmonkey]

Originally Posted by crockett

This is what I bet most of it is.. Like in FL for example when they had that whole drug testing for welfare scam. It was the Govenor's wife whom owned the company which did the drug testing. The worst part is it cost more for the testing than what was saved by the small amount whom tested positive.

Then in MA when they legalized medical Majauana they originally allowed only 10 permits for growers, of those 10 3 of them went to former state representatives and one was actually a former DA.

man its been happening for decades!!! dick cheney has a company that houses and feeds the troops! even when he was vice! so war makes him richer!!!! i want my cut of this

[MrGusMuller]

There are two kind of homeless people IMO.
- those who can't get a job/house
- those who WANT to live in the streets

Society should help both.
Try to get jobs and a decent life to the 1st group and give some food and clothes to the 2nd group.
This is my opinion. I can't make any of those, so I just respect them, and some time give them some coins... for food, alcohol, drugs.. Whatever...

[crockett]

Originally Posted by MrGusMuller

There are two kind of homeless people IMO.
- those who can't get a job/house
- those who WANT to live in the streets

Society should help both.
Try to get jobs and a decent life to the 1st group and give some food and clothes to the 2nd group.
This is my opinion. I can't make any of those, so I just respect them, and some time give them some coins... for food, alcohol, drugs.. Whatever...

It's not really about the homeless people, but how the hell did the city spend $4 million dollars and accomplish nothing.

[brassmonkey]

Originally Posted by crockett

It's not really about the homeless people, but how the hell did the city spend $4 million dollars and accomplish nothing.

they could have built a center to try to get these people to the working side. instead send them elsewhere.

[dyna mo]

I'm working to understand better your position. are you saying the problem is $4 million was spent unsuccesfully attempting to help the homeless? if so, which part of that illustrates what is wrong with USA?

[aka123]

Originally Posted by crockett

It's not really about the homeless people, but how the hell did the city spend $4 million dollars and accomplish nothing.

To avoid costly law suits, they used the 4 million to get advices from lawyers.

This is a joke.. I hope.

[brassmonkey]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

I'm working to understand better your position. are you saying the problem is $4 million was spent unsuccesfully attempting to help the homeless? if so, which part of that illustrates what is wrong with USA?

help what?

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by brassmonkey

help what?

umm, help the homeless get homes and get them out of that shithole. fucking duh.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

I'm working to understand better your position. are you saying the problem is $4 million was spent unsuccesfully attempting to help the homeless? if so, which part of that illustrates what is wrong with USA?

The position is, they solved absolutely nothing but still spent 4 million dollars. Their solution was to kick people off the property, but for some reason doing this cost 4 million dollars. They didn't find housing for them just a place for one night for people that worked with social services..

Meaning why the fuck would it cost 4 million just to have cops go in and kick people out. Where did the 4 million go? They aren't housing these people, they pushed them to the street and then they end up where ever. Essentially 4 million was spent to shove some people down the street so they can be a problem somewhere else.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by crockett

The position is, they solved absolutely nothing but still spent 4 million dollars. Their solution was to kick people off the property, but for some reason doing this cost 4 million dollars. They didn't find housing for them just a place for one night for people that worked with social services..

Meaning why the fuck would it cost 4 million just to have cops go in and kick people out. Where did the 4 million go?

crockett, the money went into a pilot project- the rapid re-housing program to rapidly get homeless people roofs over their heads and food in their guts and medical attention. the money paid for that.

http://sanjoseca.gov/DocumentCenter/View/22216

That's why the city began its Rapid Re-Housing Pilot Project in mid-2013, targeting $4 million toward shutting down the Jungle, with another $2 million possibly in the pipeline for next year. Santa Clara County also is committing between $850,000 and $900,000 in annual, supportive housing services for Jungle residents. The city has partnered with nonprofit agencies like HomeFirst, Housing 1,000 and Downtown Streets Team, and outreach workers from the various organizations have been canvassing the encampment, identifying homeless who want help.

Residents of The Jungle, San Jose?s largest homeless encampment, have recently received on-site medical care after the county moved a mobile clinic to the site.
?It?s important to bring the medicine to where the people are. This population doesn?t have a lot of transportation. A lot of times it?s hard for them to get bus fare to get to clinics,? said Janet Cole, nurse coordinator at the Valley Homeless Healthcare Program, which is part of Santa Clara Valley Medical Center.

KCBS Cover Story Series: Bringing Medical Care To San Joseâ??s Largest Homeless Encampment « CBS San Francisco



I have to disagree with the OP, this is an example of what is right with USA.

[Cherry7]

Originally Posted by aka123

It makes about 20 000 per homeless people during the 1,5 year timeframe. They could house, feed, entertain, etc. the people for less money, and everybody would win.

But I guess it would be communism or something, so it isn't an option.

As wealth and power get more concentrated ...communism will be the only option.

[aka123]

Originally Posted by Cherry7

As wealth and power get more concentrated ...communism will be the only option.

Well, not really. Just more equal distribution. And we are heading to that way. As fewer and fewer are able to make their living, it will arise the question that how will the wealth be divided, as current model "distribution by working" is not anymore working.

Somebody said in some thread that "how long will taxpayers put up with that" or something like that, but taxpayers are not the only people those share some country. Most fair and durable taxation will be taxing the part of the economy that makes the most from the productivity increase and such. Taxing more some gardener or something like that, isn't very durable or fair method, as those productivity hasn't much increased since the medieval times.

[shoot twice]

Originally Posted by crockett

In Cali they are dismantling a homeless camp that had roughly 200 people living there on roughly a 1 square mile area. The city has spent 4 million dollars trying to deal with it and the end resualt is they just kick everyone out..

Now it's not about the homeless you could insert any issue in its place.. It's the fact that the city spent 4 million dollars or so they claim trying to deal with this and they haven't even paid for the destruction and hauling away of the shit..

4 million dollars and really nothing at all was solve and these homeless people will just move to a new carboard box elsewhere.. No solution to any problem just $4 million and counting of people's tax dollars going "somewhere".


San Jose, California, massive homeless camp being cleared out - CBS News

Governments wasting money is nothing new.

The real crime here is that we don't even have the right to be homeless. 50 years ago a person had the right to pitch their tent on the outskirts of town or in a forest and be left in peace as long as they didn't cause any problems.

We live in a world of great instability and all of us could easily make a wrong turn and end up homeless. Being homeless doesn't make someone a bad person or a criminal... It's just someone that needs a helping hand.

[seeandsee]

better to give them money

[pinkz]

Better off spending the 4mill on building a homeless centre or low cost apartments to house them but hey stupid is as stoopid does!

[JJ Gold]

Sam Kinison - The Homeless: Sam Kinison - The Homeless - YouTube

[crockett]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

crockett, the money went into a pilot project- the rapid re-housing program to rapidly get homeless people roofs over their heads and food in their guts and medical attention. the money paid for that.

http://sanjoseca.gov/DocumentCenter/View/22216





KCBS Cover Story Series: Bringing Medical Care To San Jose’s Largest Homeless Encampment « CBS San Francisco



I have to disagree with the OP, this is an example of what is right with USA.

So you think almost $5 million dollars and another 800k a years is the right way to deal with roughly 200 homeless people? You don't think that is just a tad bit much money to deal with roughly 200 people, specially when they were not all housed but rather forced to move out and go elsewhere.

Edit.. After further review its even worse. It's the original 4 million, plus another 2 million for this year and the 850k and they can only house 100 people.. Meaning they are actually spending nearly 7 million to house 100 people while the other 100 go back to the streets.. That's the right way to go?

[crockett]

Originally Posted by shoot twice

Governments wasting money is nothing new.

The real crime here is that we don't even have the right to be homeless. 50 years ago a person had the right to pitch their tent on the outskirts of town or in a forest and be left in peace as long as they didn't cause any problems.

We live in a world of great instability and all of us could easily make a wrong turn and end up homeless. Being homeless doesn't make someone a bad person or a criminal... It's just someone that needs a helping hand.

You can still do that, but you can't look homeless. I just finished a 8 month trip of traveling in a camper van, but I've been doing it for about 2 years with a short break in between for a few months.

As long as you don't look like your homeless you can still get away with traveling and camping in a lot of places you aren't supposed to but if cops catch you they will usually haggle you. Personally I only had issues 3 times and not once was it any big deal and only once was I asked to move.

Essentially if you look like a bum and are street begging, then you will get treated like a bum. However if you look normal and aren't bothering people no one gives a fuck.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by crockett

So you think almost $5 million dollars and another 800k a years is the right way to deal with roughly 200 homeless people? You don't think that is just a tad bit much money to deal with roughly 200 people, specially when they were not all housed but rather forced to move out and go elsewhere.

Edit.. After further review its even worse. It's the original 4 million, plus another 2 million for this year and the 850k and they can only house 100 people.. Meaning they are actually spending nearly 7 million to house 100 people while the other 100 go back to the streets.. That's the right way to go?

absofuckinglutely. period.


the money was spent to get rid of the encampment over 18 months.

By each and every account the project was a success, the remaining people they cleared out were those who CHOSE not to be homed.

the city could have kicked everyone out of that shithole, instead they spent whatever the fuck it took to provide shelter, medical care and food to every single person in that camp that was able to receive it.

what the fuck ever that costs is money well fucking spent.


end of fucking story.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by crockett

Meaning they are actually spending nearly 7 million to house 100 people while the other 100 go back to the streets.. That's the right way to go?

that's not at all an accurate representation of the facts.

you completely neglect including all of the efforts spent on clearing out trash and garbage of that 68 acre shithole for ~2 years, providing ongoing food and medical care to the entire encampment over that time as well as many other efforts.

come on crockett, after what you've seen while boondocking USA you can't begin to tell me this is what you think is ultimately wrong with the USA, the fact that the math doesn't add up to you? Like you, I've seen the homeless situation from this angle too.

this is what's right with USA, helping the homeless, regardless of the costs.

[Matt 26z]

Illegal Mexicans come across the border with nothing and they are showered with social services while homeless Americans are in a tent city.

Disgusting.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by Matt 26z

Illegal Mexicans come across the border with nothing and they are showered with social services while homeless Americans are in a tent city.

Disgusting.

Many Homeless choose to live that lifestyle. Granted not all of them, but a large number of people whom are homeless do choose to live on the streets. He'll I met guy just outside of New Orleans whom was at a park in the middle of nowhere with just his bike and all the belongings he could carry.

The guy said he had been living like that for over 20 years and had traveled all over the US as well as much of South America. I offered the guy a couple cans of soup I had and he turned me down and only took 2 water bottles.


Many however clearly have mental issues and since we no longer have state run asylums the only place for them is on the streets or in jail if they don't have family to help them.

[crockett]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

that's not at all an accurate representation of the facts.

you completely neglect including all of the efforts spent on clearing out trash and garbage of that 68 acre shithole for ~2 years, providing ongoing food and medical care to the entire encampment over that time as well as many other efforts.

come on crockett, after what you've seen while boondocking USA you can't begin to tell me this is what you think is ultimately wrong with the USA, the fact that the math doesn't add up to you? Like you, I've seen the homeless situation from this angle too.

this is what's right with USA, helping the homeless, regardless of the costs.

I'm not against helping them, I all for it. I'm just against money being wasted while accomplishing nothing. I mean really if we go with the 200 number that kind of money spent is clearly not going to help those people, because there is no way it should cost that much.

However, looking again at the second article in your post above, puts the number at 1,200 people not 200 which is in the CBS article as well as your first article. Now if the number is actually 1200 people, then that makes all the difference in the world in what was spent.

Again I'm certainly not against helping them, what I'm against is govt officials using tax dollars to line the pockets of companies or supporters while claiming they are helping the homeless. If the number is just 200 then there is certainly something shady going on with needing that kind of money. However if it's actually 1200 people, then it's likely a good job done.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by crockett

I'm not against helping them, I all for it. I'm just against money being wasted while accomplishing nothing. I mean really if we go with the 200 number that kind of money spent is clearly not going to help those people, because there is no way it should cost that much.

However, looking again at the second article in your post above, puts the number at 1,200 people not 200 which is in the CBS article as well as your first article. Now if the number is actually 1200 people, then that makes all the difference in the world in what was spent.

Again I'm certainly not against helping them, what I'm against is govt officials using tax dollars to line the pockets of companies or supporters while claiming they are helping the homeless. If the number is just 200 then there is certainly something shady going on with needing that kind of money. However if it's actually 1200 people, then it's likely a good job done.

I agree, It seems to me like the CBS article misrepresented the situation. I'm not sure why they would choose to do that on a story like this.

and I also agree with you that many homeless claim to want to live that way. I think deep down though, many simply say that because they realize they don't have much hope to change their sitch and they've simply accepted that. hell, and if your RV adventures have been like mine, you meet homeless people on a completely different level. YOu've seen them on their level, not a charity level.

so the problem of figuring out a way to communicate to those folks that there are alternatives can be a difficult proposition, I think that's a big part of why it does cost so much.

ANd I do agree that government wreckless spending is a serious problem, but if they are going to dump cash onto a prob, I'd rather it be the homeless problem than IRaq or BFE.

Speaking of homeless, we're at our usual spot in Huntington BEach today, catching the ocean and ~an hour or so ago one of the homeless folks we've befriended here came up to the rig wearing hospital gown with sensors still glued to his chest. He's the most serious alcholic I have ever met in my life and I was in sobriety for many years. Anyhoo, he had walked out of rehab this morning and wanted a place to lie down inside. He was completely loaded on something, maybe booze, I didn't ask. I gave him a beer and turned him away.

[baddog]

Originally Posted by crockett

It's not really about the homeless people, but how the hell did the city spend $4 million dollars and accomplish nothing.

You read it on the Interweb so it must be true

[crockett]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

I agree, It seems to me like the CBS article misrepresented the situation. I'm not sure why they would choose to do that on a story like this.

and I also agree with you that many homeless claim to want to live that way. I think deep down though, many simply say that because they realize they don't have much hope to change their sitch and they've simply accepted that. hell, and if your RV adventures have been like mine, you meet homeless people on a completely different level. YOu've seen them on their level, not a charity level.

so the problem of figuring out a way to communicate to those folks that there are alternatives can be a difficult proposition, I think that's a big part of why it does cost so much.

ANd I do agree that government wreckless spending is a serious problem, but if they are going to dump cash onto a prob, I'd rather it be the homeless problem than IRaq or BFE.

Speaking of homeless, we're at our usual spot in Huntington BEach today, catching the ocean and ~an hour or so ago one of the homeless folks we've befriended here came up to the rig wearing hospital gown with sensors still glued to his chest. He's the most serious alcholic I have ever met in my life and I was in sobriety for many years. Anyhoo, he had walked out of rehab this morning and wanted a place to lie down inside. He was completely loaded on something, maybe booze, I didn't ask. I gave him a beer and turned him away.

My opinion on them wanting to live that way, is that they likely feel they still have control of their lives. When they enter a homeless shelter they are suddenly forced to live by certain rules and often their shit gets taken by other homeless people. Not to mention they can only carry in the things on their backs meaning any sort of belongings like say their typical shopping cart or even a bike can't be brought in. This IMO is why so many of them avoid the shelters.

IMO they should just set up homeless campgrounds in places that have large populations of them and just let them be. Build some public showers, restrooms and places they can do laundry and maybe socialize. Then just set up some campsites and allow them to build simple non permeant structures, allowing them to stay on the premise that they help take care of the place.

Every state has RV parks, public parks and so forth, so why not just accept that there will always be homeless people and just provide a legal place they can stay.

[JA$ON]

Wanna laugh out loud??? Search for the annual "waste book". Its a very funny / sad list of the biggest waste of government funds each year. Shit like 47 Million to study the mating habits of the Plains ground squirrel.

NONE of these programs are anything anyone really cares about. Not even the Congressmen and senators proposing them. Its all crap that gets attached to bills in order to secure "YEA" votes for the bills primary purpose (and to keep $ and jobs in the district of the clown that added them so they can talk about how brought jobs to their state)

If you just removed all the pork from these bills, we could feed and insure every child in this country with room to spare (as a Libertarian that is NOT what Id want to see done with the money, just making a point, lol)

[PAR]

Originally Posted by brassmonkey

they could have built a center to try to get these people to the working side. instead send them elsewhere.

$4mil wouldn't even pay for the committees, let alone the sub committees, advisory panels or the homeless task force to debate to review how best the center could serve the homeless.