Ferus

50 dogs that are in the know

Diomed

Elephants are proven to mourn spots where their relatives and friends died 7-10 years ago.

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aka123

How that translates to that dogs don't remember? The second paragraph makes this obsolete. What a bullshit. That mirror stuff is bullshit too. Many dogs recognize themselves from the mirror and they also know how to use mirror to observe things.

That time frame stuff too is erronous. Probably these errors are result from treating all dogs as a homogenous group. Or just misunderstanding other animals behaviour.

Besides, it has been documented that certain whale species do plan. What the fuck is this article about? Doesn't he read other people's studies?

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bronco67

This is just another thread that most people think they know more than people who observe, analyze and record scientific data -- and are also most likely smarter than they are.

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Imortyl Pussycat

thank you, i was going to post the same thing. i rescued a dog that was very abused and believe me, she shows signs, and has for years, that she has not fucking forgotten.

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aka123

Actually this goes usually the other way. We often take some qualities, keep those unique for us humans, and if other animals have or are said to have those qualities, we say those have human like qualities or are said to be "humanizing". The bias comes from keeping humans as very special, but in the end; we are not the only animals with a mouth and a asshole.

I accuse Bible.

We do the same regarding other humans too. We use ourselves as a measurement stick. The great human mind starts from the same baseline as the dogs too: me.

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just a punk

A mature dog has a mentality lever close to a 5-year old child. They are not dumb.

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Dvae

You left out the the part where we evolved from apes.

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Arguing with a troll is a lot like wrestling in the mud with a pig, after a couple of hours you realize the pig likes it.

aka123

My bad, but not that many refer to human qualities as "ape like quality", or "apenizing".

Now stop apenizing; I believe that you are primate with two nipples. No need make fuzz about that.

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PaperstreetWinston

oh well, dogs are still far better than most people despite not having episodal memory

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blackmonsters

If you think some scientist observed a dog more then "Mrs Snobbandhire" studies her poodles then you're out of your mind.

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aka123

"Although I appreciate Tulving's conception of episodic memory, I've always been troubled by the difficulty of documenting that other animals have episodic memory. Episodic remembering hinges on the conscious experience of the self in some other time and place. Episodic memory is thus hard to demonstrate without the verbal ability to describe conscious experience."

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...-dont-remember

This was noteworthy to bring up, as this has hindered our view about other animals for so long, before even more than now.

The baseline seems to be that other animals are dumb until otherwise proven. Maybe not the best starting point.

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blackmonsters

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJ13Wcx4wjQ



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyj63faGPPA

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L-Pink

This 60 minutes story about inferential learning, deductive reasoning and dogs with Anderson Cooper is well worth watching. "Chaser" smartest dog in the world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lhseg979EQk


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baddog

Just because a dog know it is close to dinner time or where he dropped that steak bone on the walk last night, doesn't mean he is going to remember events. Buddy has never even hinted that he was aware it was Christmas or his birthday. But he knows dinner is soon and every time I move he gets excited.

aka123

You remember your birth? LOL.




Someone telling it to you doesn't count. Without writing and written knowledge, I wouldn't be that aware of christmas either. Unless it is enough to have christmas when it is dark and cold, and midsummer celebration when sun doesn't set.

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TheSquealer

A) The thread title is inaccurate as the article refers to only one type of memory that a dog does not likely possess.

B) No one here has even the slightest clue it seems how various memory types work or what purpose they serve.

C) Given the fact that you all seem to be blissfully unaware that even your own cherished memories are mostly confabulated nonsense, you have zero chance of even hoping to guess what a dog might or might not "remember".

D) Stop projecting your own uniquely human experience onto animals. A dog is a dog. It's brain has little in common with humans when it comes to higher functions and its not capable of even a fraction of what people seem to think it is capable of when it comes to expressing feelings, emotions, remembering, conscious awareness etc..

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Rochard

TheSquealer

It always fascinates me that the very same people that will drone on and one about religious people being nutjobs - waste no time in droning on and on about how their pet is just a few weeks away from publishing a thesis on complex mathematical theories. People see what they want to see... and believe what they choose to believe.

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CDSmith

It's not that dogs have zero memory of that type, it's more about how they access (or process) it. A familiar person arrives and walks in the house, even one who hasn't been around for a year or more.... you and I as humans 'see' the person and know they are welcome. A dog remembers their scent, how they sound, move, etc. They remember it because of how they smelled/sounded etc before that. Do they remember the actual events of the day back then? Probably not. (as in not)

But they do remember, in their own way.

I've seen evidence of 'a dog's memory' far too often to believe anyone saying they have no memory ability of that kind at all. It's just different. Less than ours in many ways, but far sharper in some.

The fact that a dog can learn in itself belies the notion they have no memory. I once used an old 'dog whisperer' trick to teach my old dog Sully to stop jumping up on people. I have no doubt that he could not recall where or how the lesson came about or how it went etc, he very much did remember the central point of the lesson. Until the day he died he never again jumped up on anyone.

Planning? Dog's don't plan, they anticipate. They can also in certain situations use simple deductive reasoning to find something or someone. I've seen that too.

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L-Pink

Part of this video covers what ct scans of a dogs brain reveals when it deals with humans. It really is worth 12 minutes of watching.

ilnjscb

If American elect another Bush to the presidency, does it not conclusively prove that they have no episodic memory?

blackmonsters

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dyna mo

that's exactly what the psychologist who did the research did. He applied human experience, self-recognition, a requirement of humans for this, to dogs and made his assumption.

he's a psych human memory experimental researcher. What he did is called anthropromorphising and it's a logic fallacy, perfectly demonstrated here.

L-Pink

Check out the 60 Minutes link I posted.

fetishwealth

I dont member nuffins

bushwacker

That is because your dog is a senile as you are.

dyna mo

I'll give it a whirl.






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In trying to understand dogs' concept of time, humans cannot help but reference their own concept of time. But that's tricky since humans have the unique ability to construct artificial measures of time such as the second, minute, and hour. This is mainly because humans use episodic memory in order to travel through time, recalling past events and looking forward to future ones. It's what many scientists believe makes humans unique.

But just because dogs don't perceive time in this way doesn't mean they are completely stuck in the moment, as a lot of the research on this subject would suggest. Dogs are capable of being trained based on past events and taught to anticipate future events based on past experiences. This argues in favor of a kind of canine version of episodic memory, according to research conducted by Dr. Thomas Zentall of the University of Kentucky.

The essential difference appears to be that humans can pinpoint when something happened in the past by relating it to other events. For example, we remember our wedding day as well as who attended, what songs were played, and the happiness we felt. Dogs, on the other hand, can only distinguish how much time has passed since an event has occurred (e.g., "My food bowl has been empty for six hours.").


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Zentall has done research showing that dogs can distinguish how much time has passed since an event has occurred.



dogs have memory.

mineistaken

Plus it does not even mean that sighthounds don't have great smell as well, the one that would lead to the bone easily.