Business Clips4Sale - how not to do business

[CrkMStanz]

OK - its been a while since I've posted but I keep on seeing the common theme of "Sales are down"

And I thought that I would shed a glimmer of light on one of the reasons you aren't making sales.

Here I am, being all Don Surfer - scratching around some sites looking for a thrill.

I scope out things, decide on a clips4sale studio, and whip out my fully paid off, big assed credit limit, credit card(s).

I know, a web-sites wet dream right there - a brand new whale looking to SPEND.

I could get it free from 'somewhere' on the internet - but as a former producer - I figure I'm going to support the studio so as to encourage them to make some more.

Sounds reasonable and socially conscious - don't you think?

It starts out OK
- surfing their site

- find something I like

- whip out the card(s)

- get the initial purchase

- CC company confirms no extra charges applied (yet)

- All good so far (on the customer experience scale)

- watch the vids I got - and like them

- enthusiastically go to buy more


AAAAND it all goes horribly wrong from there

- denied !!!!!!!

- try another card

- denied !!!!!!!!!!!!!

- wait a day and try again

- denied !!!!!!!!!!!!!

- contact support@clips4sale (email)

- they say "prove I have the card"

- I send what they asked for

- they say "go ahead"
(Mary N has replied to your support request, #999999 with the following response:

Hello don mitchell, (not my real name)

We apologize for the inconvenience. Please try to make your purchase one more time and the order will go through.)

- I tell them exactly the dollar amount of my upcoming purchase

- I re-make my purchase

- works



All is right with the world, right?
oh fuck no


- start to download my paid-for and pre approved order

- downloads start to fail (with the message "YOUR ORDER HAS ALREADY BEEN DOWNLOADED")


WTF?!?!

- then they send me this letter

"Due to your most recent purchases, which have appeared to be unusual..." (I pre cleared them) - DENIED!!!
and
Please return this signed and dated credit card authorization form along with a clear copy of the front and back of your valid, government issued Photo ID (passport or drivers license) showing your signature for verification purposes. Once we have these documents on file, your account will be reviewed.


ROFL - like I'm giving out that kind of info to purchase something from a site that, you know, Sells stuff


anyways - Mary N from support didn't get all pissy at me and refunded the charge (so she says) so I guess that ends that
- paying client wants to pay
- selling site doesn't want to sell
- client spends money elsewhere (if you all are lucky and I don't just say fuck-it, and go get it for free)


DAMN. no wonder people pirate stuff

Don't want to see anymore threads around here titled "Sales are DOWN"
'cause you bring it on yourselves


On a happier note - I am now a free-agent Whale looking to buy

I might just land on YOUR site because of this.


Good Job Clips4Sale

[Serge Litehead]

cool sig

[CrkMStanz]

Originally Posted by holograph

cool sig

Thanks - I've flown that sig for many years

because I believe it to be true

too bad I can't actually buy what I want




perhaps its time to change the old sig

[badgirlfilms]

cool story bro

[K R I S T E N]

Vuier.com - thats the place to do business!

[The Porn Nerd]

Your experience surprises me. C4S has been around for a long time so unless this is something new it's weird they would operate that way. I mean, who asks for a customer to prove his card is his unless outright fraud is suspected?

As with most paysite owners I often wonder about 3rd party processers and why some charges are denied (or worse, not even put through). But I've learned, with adult especially, sometimes the problems are way up the financial chain. Wall Street having a bad day, Greece defaults, this excuse or that calamity, sales suffer.

But yeah, if you want to pay and cannot then there's a BIG problem.

[plaster]

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

Your experience surprises me. C4S has been around for a long time so unless this is something new it's weird they would operate that way. I mean, who asks for a customer to prove his card is his unless outright fraud is suspected?

As with most paysite owners I often wonder about 3rd party processers and why some charges are denied (or worse, not even put through). But I've learned, with adult especially, sometimes the problems are way up the financial chain. Wall Street having a bad day, Greece defaults, this excuse or that calamity, sales suffer.

But yeah, if you want to pay and cannot then there's a BIG problem.

Merrick bank makes almost all adult transactions in the US (a couple other banks do and nowhere near Merrick). Clips4sale is based out of Florida and likely uses Merrick bank for 90% of transactions.

CCBill also uses Merrick bank for most transactions.

As does US customers who use Netbilling, Orbital, Ecsuites, etc. etc. etc.

They are flagging adult sales at the bank level. Time to move on from Merrick bank and a lot of these problems will temporarily go away... until the masses of "banks" find the next banking institution to target.

[NatalieK]

Originally Posted by CrkMStanz

OK - its been a while since I've posted but I keep on seeing the common theme of "Sales are down"
a happier note - I am now a free-agent Whale looking to buy

I might just land on YOUR site because of this.


Good Job Clips4Sale

Damn, so sorry you've had this trouble



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[JuicyBunny]

Even sadder is that most consumers would have stopped at your steps 2 or 3 would never go back and will tell their friends about the negative experience. One of which will find and then give their friend the content they wanted from a "free" source. Thanks for the info.
Great sig!

[AmeliaG]

Always bothered me that C4S has no affiliate program that I know of.

If you feel like whale spending, I have some suggestions:

Free cams are AWESOME. Totally free to sign up and chat and see if it is your thing. You only have to whip out that big credit card if you want to spend.

High definition streaming cams are also pretty fun.

Gothic Sluts doesn't have the option to spend as much, but I sure like it.

Razor Candi has been adding a lot of video.

And I personally have a Kickstarter up now with some video of me on it, so please click here and whale it up. The Librarian package include a coffee table book of my photos amongst the goodies

[Paul Markham]

Sounds like a computer program following the rules and people unable to counter it. Had similar problems with CCbill and their 3 days rule with peole wanting to buy again.

C4S makes some sales on our content, would hate to have to shoot new content for it.

Agree with your sig, and been saying it for a long time.

[CrkMStanz]

Originally Posted by The Porn Nerd

Your experience surprises me. C4S has been around for a long time so unless this is something new it's weird they would operate that way. I mean, who asks for a customer to prove his card is his unless outright fraud is suspected?

As with most paysite owners I often wonder about 3rd party processers and why some charges are denied (or worse, not even put through). But I've learned, with adult especially, sometimes the problems are way up the financial chain. Wall Street having a bad day, Greece defaults, this excuse or that calamity, sales suffer.

But yeah, if you want to pay and cannot then there's a BIG problem.

The "proving my card" (asking for the first and last 4 digits) - turned out to be 'just to look up my purchasing history'
(I have none - first time user)

The 'proving my existence' that followed was the outrageous part: (from a customer point of view)
- Full CC declaration printed and signed with all my personal name, addy, card info, a declaration that I wanted to do recurring purchases, etc...
- had to be submitted with a 'clear' copy of my (front/back) passport or drivers license

???

just to buy some video clips

you should be thankful they don't have affiliates. Imagine what you would have to provide...

So yeah - every surfer wants to give out twice as much info than it takes to falsify an identity - just to buy some porn clips


now I had 9 stores bookmarked, and was prepared to pretty much buy a couple thousand worth of clips

but hell - why pay, especially when they won't let you.

[CrkMStanz]

And to carry on - this was not a biller denial - unless one must now prove ones identity before engaging in eCommerce

This was c4s saying 'lets see your papers mister', the transaction already approved by mastercard - c4s themselves stopped it mid download

My CC company, and therefore any 3rd party biller, have no problems with this transaction

[NETbilling]

Originally Posted by AmeliaG

Always bothered me that C4S has no affiliate program that I know of.

If you feel like whale spending, I have some suggestions:

Free cams are AWESOME. Totally free to sign up and chat and see if it is your thing. You only have to whip out that big credit card if you want to spend.

High definition streaming cams are also pretty fun.

Gothic Sluts doesn't have the option to spend as much, but I sure like it.

Razor Candi has been adding a lot of video.

And I personally have a Kickstarter up now with some video of me on it, so please click here and whale it up. The Librarian package include a coffee table book of my photos amongst the goodies

Good stuff!

[TheMaster]

it's insanity that in 2015 we're still having these billing issues and that most sites have rather limited ways of billing customers

imo a sign of this is that many affiliate programs still have different links for types of billing, language or device, I feel as an affiliate I send you a surfer and then it's up to the site to decide whether he's desktop or mobile, or which language best to serve him and most important give him all the available billing options

[tony286]

A few questions?

What country are you based out of?
Did you ever make a purchase with clips4 sale?
They have to protect themselves. As someone who did nice numbers on clips4sale in the past. I can see cc fraud being a large problem. I remember when there would be a big order, it was time to hold my breath, is it a chargeback waiting to happen? Especially in adult there isn't crap you can do about charge backs, I think there is nothing wrong with them having protections.

[Dirty D]

Clips 4 Sale is a joke.

They cancelled a bunch of our stores.

It only makes sense if you don't have any other way to sell your content = amateur

[Screwed Up]

Interesting post.
Reminds me of when I try to buy software through 2checkout. I hate 2checkout!

Originally Posted by Dirty D

Clips 4 Sale is a joke.

They cancelled a bunch of our stores.

It only makes sense if you don't have any other way to sell your content = amateur

Really!? What kind of content was this? Why?
So many questions.

[emmanuelle]

I've seen c4s sales from 3rd world countries that probably don't have credit cards. I suspect they use a variety of billing methods, and don't rely on US banks.

As for ccbill's 3 day rule, I just got 3 sales on the same card to the same site all made in just over an hour (30 minutes between each).

Ifriends used to make customers send in all that information after their first $100 in charges.

[CrkMStanz]

Originally Posted by tony286

A few questions?

What country are you based out of?
Did you ever make a purchase with clips4 sale?
They have to protect themselves. As someone who did nice numbers on clips4sale in the past. I can see cc fraud being a large problem. I remember when there would be a big order, it was time to hold my breath, is it a chargeback waiting to happen? Especially in adult there isn't crap you can do about charge backs, I think there is nothing wrong with them having protections.

Canada

No (well, if I did it was a long time ago)

They protected themselves right out of many sales/thousands of dollars


Good Job c4s

[plaster]

I see what you're saying.

A lot of cam companies will require some type of verification, usually a picture of yourself holding your ID. This is after a few regular purchases.

Reason is because on multiple purchases, merchant doesn't want some person to charge back 30 transactions from 1 day. It costs a lot of money.

By making someone verify with an ID, it does 2 things:
1) Limits the likely hood the person will chargeback
2) If they do chargeback, more ammunition to fight it. Won't prevent the $25 dings for each one though.

They should put a note like:
I see this is your 3rd purchase in 24 hours, to prevent a photo verification process you can purchase a block of credits for $200, would you like to do that now?

That would make the most sense. I also think an email verification link is more appropriate for first round of scrubbing.

But if you have ever received 27 chargebacks from the same person, all purchased on the same day, you will understand the reasons to try and prevent that.