why is it sexist to compliment a womans appearance?

[Joshua G]

sorry i dont get it.

reading this deal with FIFA: FIFA Website Praises USWNT Star Alex Morgan As 'Very Easy On The Eye' | ThePostGame

whats makes this offensive? seriously i want to understand better. all i see is a compliment.

[kane]

Many people think when you write about an athlete you should write about their abilities on the field because that is what matters not their looks. In this case I think her looks are fair game to at least mention because she did pose in nothing but body paint for the Sports Illustrated swimsuit issue. Still, it also sounds like the article basically came off like Morgan is so busy doing girly things that it is a wonder she has time to play soccer.

[MiamiBoyz]

Don't worry about it - ALL woman are whores!

[CPA-Rush]

Originally Posted by MiamiBoyz

Don't worry about it - ALL woman are whores!

[blackmonsters]

Originally Posted by Joshua G

sorry i dont get it.

reading this deal with FIFA: FIFA Website Praises USWNT Star Alex Morgan As 'Very Easy On The Eye' | ThePostGame



whats makes this offensive? seriously i want to understand better. all i see is a compliment.

Turning a soccer game into a beauty pageant in your review will do it.

[JesseQuinn]

Originally Posted by MiamiBoyz

Don't worry about it - ALL woman are whores!

Originally Posted by CPA-Rush

for real though, kane and BM nailed it. it's not sexist to appreciate or comment upon a person's appearance, it's fuckery when someone does so in a manner that minimizes accomplishments or personhood. that applies regardless of gender

(for real wicked commentary on football check out football365)

[mineistaken]

Comment that nailed it:

People are getting sick and tired of the P.C. B.S. world that liberals are trying creates. In the near future if liberals take over the mere suggestion someone going out of the PC will get you charged with a Felony by the politburo.

[CaptainHowdy]

Feminism in ruins ...

[DonJon69]

Now they should never mention her again in any magazine and see what happens to her.

[oppoten]

The male coaches of the England and Canada teams both made the effort to look good. Which they never do in the men's game.

They know that the ladies look after their appearance, so they pay them the compliment by doing the same. It doesn't have to be said, just implied.

[pornmasta]

Originally Posted by Joshua G

whats makes this offensive?

"feminists" cunts

[Joshua G]

Originally Posted by JesseQuinn

for real though, kane and BM nailed it. it's not sexist to appreciate or comment upon a person's appearance, it's fuckery when someone does so in a manner that minimizes accomplishments or personhood. that applies regardless of gender

(for real wicked commentary on football check out football365)

thank you to you BM & kane on clarifying. i see that the article is sophmoric coming from important people & reflects a teenage boys POV on the subject.

I just feel like such feelings by guys are primal & labeling such comments as offensive isnt constructive. cleansing the tendancy to focus on womens beauty to me is trying to emasculate male feelings that procreate. its genetic for guys to care a lot about looks. dumb jocks cant do PC. arent we supposed to appreciate & accept diversity, & shouldnt that include the alpha male POV?

[kane]

Originally Posted by Joshua G

thank you to you BM & kane on clarifying. i see that the article is sophmoric coming from important people & reflects a teenage boys POV on the subject.

I just feel like such feelings by guys are primal & labeling such comments as offensive isnt constructive. cleansing the tendancy to focus on womens beauty to me is trying to emasculate male feelings that procreate. its genetic for guys to care a lot about looks. dumb jocks cant do PC. arent we supposed to appreciate & accept diversity, & shouldnt that include the alpha male POV?

Of course guys are going to think about girls' looks (and the opposite is true as well), I think their point is that there is a time and a place for compliments. If we are talking about Alex Morgan on the red carpet of some event it is fine to say she looks great. If we are talking about her being one of the best women's soccer players in the world, it isn't, or at least a lot of people feel it shouldn't be.

A guy can be a guy and think whatever he wants, he just sometimes might keep those thoughts to himself.

[2MuchMark]

All this in an age where the world loves Kim Kardashian for being an absolute nothing.

[Mr Pheer]

Dont talk to women. You cant say the right thing no matter what. Who has time for that bullshit.

[JesseQuinn]

Originally Posted by pornmasta

"feminists"

the old binary male/female construct of feminism doesn't really exist anymore, or at least most peeps have moved on from it (there are still some second wavers out there annoying the rest of us)

in North America white women earn more than any other group except for white men, more women attend and graduate from university than men, the female prison population is lower, etc etc.

there are still huge gender-based issues to solve (rape, domestic violence, reproductive rights, etc) but for the most part social race, citizenship, class, sexual orientation, etc have become far more meaningful axes in people's lives

the face of feminism has changed. it's not about men vs women anymore, it's broadened to a focus on the rights of all people, including men. it's about fighting back when the personhood of another is violated or negated. FIFA demeaned Morgan by negating her accomplishments so yeah, sexist as fuck. not up there with instances of overt injustice, but the point is that mentality underlying each is the same.

it's almost comical to me that the solutions to most of the 'isms' (sexism, racism, homophobia, etc) really all boil down to peeps treating others with inherent dignity and respect and not acting like assholes. for real, it's not that fucking complicated but as a species we fail miserably. often.

[Jel]

getting butthurt over the fact you are easy on the eye, and it being mentioned, is pretty cunty. Even more cunty when you aren't the one butthurt, and there's a ton of people getting butthurt on your behalf.

If someone's biggest problem is that someone somewhere in the world thinks you are good looking, and remarks on it, well then you ain't really got any problems at all.

Newsflash: not everyone in the world has the same social etiquette as everyone else, it's one thing to be intentionally sexist/racist/blahblahist, another to accidentally tred on someone's toes. The way too many cunts these days ignore intent and scream in the face of toe-tredders like they just attacked someone with a baseball bat is ridiculous - here are my morals, and social skills, and you better damn well adopt them or I'll throw a hissy fit because I *fucking chose* to get offended at your well-meaning but different-from-mine idea of a compliment.... not only that but on someone else's fucking behalf!

cunts everywhere...

==============
disclaimer:
The above post is in general, that link in OP isn't working for me. I also woke up about 25 minutes ago, and for the first hour each day am on the same high horse as the people I'm berating for being on theirs.

[duk75]

It is sexist because feminists say it is, and many women like to obey feminists, so if they say that complimenting the beauty is offensive, feminism enthusiasts will be offended. In reality, most verbal "offences" are a superstition.

[nico-t]

o my god, this is a disaster. "Style thats easy on the eye"- complimenting the playing style. But then all of a sudden "with good looks to match". OMG OMG OMG! Let's tweet about it, and write a whole article about it! Effeminate whining guys unite!

Do these idiots even have balls?

[KyndFellow]

I don't think most women mind if your compliment above their shoulders, or keep the description general. They don't like be seen as sex object by someone who doesn't deserve it.

[Paul Markham]

Because in their world, women are the weaker sex and need lots of protection. Even from words.

[kane]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

Because in their world, women are the weaker sex and need lots of protection. Even from words.

This reminds me of a line from this week's episode of true detective. "The fundamental difference between the sexes is that one can kill the other with their bare hands."

[_Richard_]

Originally Posted by blackmonsters

Turning a soccer game into a beauty pageant in your review will do it.

'i don't understand why people pay attention to my breasts and not my skills'

*poses nude in magazine*

[woj]

Originally Posted by _Richard_

'i don't understand why people pay attention to my breasts and not my skills'

*poses nude in magazine*

no kidding...

[Joshua G]

Originally Posted by JesseQuinn

FIFA demeaned Morgan by negating her accomplishments so yeah, sexist as fuck. not up there with instances of overt injustice, but the point is that mentality underlying each is the same.

it's almost comical to me that the solutions to most of the 'isms' (sexism, racism, homophobia, etc) really all boil down to peeps treating others with inherent dignity and respect and not acting like assholes. for real, it's not that fucking complicated but as a species we fail miserably. often.

hello. i guess this is where i dont understand. i dont think its inherently wrong that the article is misfocused on her looks. are you saying that had they mentioned her accomplishment, its not offensive anymore? what specifically about focusing on appearance is wrong?

its not only a natural thing men do, women do it too & often bully women who have big boobs, for example. Kate upton gets killed for her torso. women hated hanna davis SI cover, too much navel. Why was that a problem?

i rarely see beautiful people of either gender spending time with fat or ugly anybody. are they wrong to be so judgemental?

& can women really expect all men to act like metro-sexuals? at what point do we acknowledge the natural reactions of both sexes to appearance?

[Joshua G]

Originally Posted by Jel

getting butthurt over the fact you are easy on the eye, and it being mentioned, is pretty cunty. Even more cunty when you aren't the one butthurt, and there's a ton of people getting butthurt on your behalf.

If someone's biggest problem is that someone somewhere in the world thinks you are good looking, and remarks on it, well then you ain't really got any problems at all.

Newsflash: not everyone in the world has the same social etiquette as everyone else, it's one thing to be intentionally sexist/racist/blahblahist, another to accidentally tred on someone's toes. The way too many cunts these days ignore intent and scream in the face of toe-tredders like they just attacked someone with a baseball bat is ridiculous - here are my morals, and social skills, and you better damn well adopt them or I'll throw a hissy fit because I *fucking chose* to get offended at your well-meaning but different-from-mine idea of a compliment.... not only that but on someone else's fucking behalf!

cunts everywhere...

==============
disclaimer:
The above post is in general, that link in OP isn't working for me. I also woke up about 25 minutes ago, and for the first hour each day am on the same high horse as the people I'm berating for being on theirs.

yes i want to know why a mans focus on beauty needs to be whitewashed from society, not accepted as a a natural tendancy. im being told its natural to be gay, its natural that bruce jenner wants to be catlyn, & i should accept that. OK. no problem. When do women accept i like to sexually objectify women? why is that POV not acceptable but i have to accept an olympic fame whoring celebrity tranny?

i guess i dont understand where all this freewheeling offensiveness is going. seems me just being a dirty old man is offensive. fuck that!

[Paul Markham]

How dare they say such a terrible thing and objectify her as a sex object.

She can do that all on her own and doesn't need men to help her.



Do I smell hypocrisy in the air?

[Joshua G]

Originally Posted by kane

Of course guys are going to think about girls' looks (and the opposite is true as well), I think their point is that there is a time and a place for compliments. If we are talking about Alex Morgan on the red carpet of some event it is fine to say she looks great. If we are talking about her being one of the best women's soccer players in the world, it isn't, or at least a lot of people feel it shouldn't be.

A guy can be a guy and think whatever he wants, he just sometimes might keep those thoughts to himself.

i hear ya. but i dont like it. its like trying to impose politically correct standards of etiquitte on everybody. PC has an in crowd & an out crowd. being gay is in. being a porn maker is out. is political correctness itself a form of discrimination?

& most important, many people are mentally unfit to behave in an educated and sophisticated manner. So we attack dumb guys cause they wink wink at a hot girl on the soccer field on a web article?

wheres the acceptance & tolerance for my POV im am told im supposed to practice for everybody elses POV?

[CaptainHowdy]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

I'd objectify it ...

[Screwed Up]

This thread is useless without pics...

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

How dare they say such a terrible thing and objectify her as a sex object.

She can do that all on her own and doesn't need men to help her.



Do I smell hypocrisy in the air?

Thread saved./

[JesseQuinn]

Originally Posted by Jel

Newsflash: not everyone in the world has the same social etiquette as everyone else

I appreciate your disclaimer, and your posts in general, all I'm saying is that maybe FIFA should be held to a higher standard of behavior? I'm lmao given their record in all matters concerning ethics as I write this, but still?

Originally Posted by Joshua G

hello. i guess this is where i dont understand. i dont think its inherently wrong that the article is misfocused on her looks. are you saying that had they mentioned her accomplishment, its not offensive anymore? what specifically about focusing on appearance is wrong?

its not only a natural thing men do, women do it too & often bully women who have big boobs, for example. Kate upton gets killed for her torso. women hated hanna davis SI cover, too much navel. Why was that a problem?

i rarely see beautiful people of either gender spending time with fat or ugly anybody. are they wrong to be so judgemental?

& can women really expect all men to act like metro-sexuals? at what point do we acknowledge the natural reactions of both sexes to appearance?

you raised a few different issues here, but I'd like to address em:

1) the article was misfocused because it should have been about football. here's an illustration I hope will assist in articulating my point. Take Cristiano Ronaldo, a sex symbol to many peeps who are into Ken dolls. He flaunts his body every fucking every chance he gets ffs, on the field ripping his shirt off and doing those weird ab flexes after a goal. Here's the latest FIFA article I could find on him: Cristiano Ronaldo: It feels every bit as special - FIFA.com

Notice the difference?

I searched for reference to those abs he loves to flex every chance he gets but funnily enough, no where to be found

2) Peeps who trash others are the opposite side of the same coin, diminishing someone's value to the eyes of the beholder is inherently dehumanizing. FIFA did that by focusing on her looks over the talent that made her news-worthy in the first place. This wasn't about her being talented, skilled and hot, the article was about pretty much everything BUT her talent and skill

beauty should be celebrated, but not like this

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

How dare they say such a terrible thing and objectify her as a sex object.

She can do that all on her own and doesn't need men to help her.



Do I smell hypocrisy in the air?

how is this hypocrisy? so she posed for SA, that means her body all of a sudden overshadows everything else? see Rinaldo above to explain my point

Originally Posted by Joshua G

i hear ya. but i dont like it. its like trying to impose politically correct standards of etiquitte on everybody. PC has an in crowd & an out crowd. being gay is in. being a porn maker is out. is political correctness itself a form of discrimination?

& most important, many people are mentally unfit to behave in an educated and sophisticated manner. So we attack dumb guys cause they wink wink at a hot girl on the soccer field on a web article?

wheres the acceptance & tolerance for my POV im am told im supposed to practice for everybody elses POV?

this isn't about someone in their living room thinking 'damn I'd hit that' as one checks out pics or a match. that's normal, that's natural and healthy.

this is about a major sports organization diminishing a woman's accomplishments solely because she's hot.

[_Richard_]

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

How dare they say such a terrible thing and objectify her as a sex object.

She can do that all on her own and doesn't need men to help her.



Do I smell hypocrisy in the air?

*partially nude*

my bad

[Jel]

Originally Posted by JesseQuinn

I appreciate your disclaimer, and your posts in general, all I'm saying is that maybe FIFA should be held to a higher standard of behavior? I'm lmao given their record in all matters concerning ethics as I write this, but still?

likewise mate. lol yeah, and you make some great and valid points. I do agree that they should be of a higher standard, but at the same time, is it really that awful that they aren't? They're a laughing stock anyway, few people take them seriously. They are like the retarded uncle in charge of the family fortune - you kinda have to play by their rules, but you can dismiss their verbal shit as idiocy.

Also, to specifically talk about fifa, they aren't some elected for-the-people outfit, so the thing about some people are tactless still applies - too many people get butthurt over what in reality is fuck all, it's meaningless, it's like being told by a 5 year old you are stupid, then having a bunch of strangers harp on about how wrong it is of the 5 year old. Who really gives a fuck? Some things are important, but some guy saying some woman is easy on the eye really isn't, but because we have become conditioned to gasp and wring our hands at every single instance of what we see as a social faux pas, this big deal arises out of perceiving we are supposed to have this oh-my-I'm-so-offended reaction.

diversity seems to be welcomed and encouraged in so many areas (and so it should be), yet simple things like tolerance of another person's fuck ups or genuinely well-intentioned but ill thought out opinions or actions are met with such ill-proportioned outrage that all I'm left thinking is fuck, these people have accomplished literally everything there possibly is to accomplish, because why else waste their time taking umbrage on someone else's behalf, because a person or group of persons see something as a compliment, and another person or persons don't.

Saying someone is easy on the eye also doesn't detract from their professional achievements, 'she is shit at her job but has nice tits' yeah, that's a dig. But 'good footballer and pretty too' I mean, take great offence at that, really?

I was reminded of this thread yesterday while driving.. I had the radio on, and caught the last few seconds of a Take That song (UK boyband in case they aren't known in the US) - the female dj announced afterwards who it was, then said along the lines of "I'd like a time machine, go back to that video being shot, and have a play in the water with Howard - that video was wet t-shirt heaven!". Now, I couldn't give a fuck about that, but it did make me wonder what would happen if that was a male dj commenting on how he'd like to play with christina aguilera in the boxing ring where she was wet in 'dirrty' - would he be detracting on her abilities, or simply adding an addendum to her qualities?

tl;dr
big fuss over fuck all

[JesseQuinn]

Originally Posted by Jel

They're a laughing stock anyway, few people take them seriously. They are like the retarded uncle in charge of the family fortune - you kinda have to play by their rules, but you can dismiss their verbal shit as idiocy.

agreed, no serious football fan (I left a wicked beach session today early to watch Agentina/Chile so I count myself in) can take them seriously but still, FIFA is a major professional sports org. Yes they are dinosaurs, the point is how will ish ever change if peeps don't point out those flaws?

Originally Posted by Jel

diversity seems to be welcomed and encouraged in so many areas (and so it should be), yet simple things like tolerance of another person's fuck ups or genuinely well-intentioned but ill thought out opinions or actions are met with such ill-proportioned outrage that all I'm left thinking is fuck, these people have accomplished literally everything there possibly is to accomplish, because why else waste their time taking umbrage on someone else's behalf, because a person or group of persons see something as a compliment, and another person or persons don't.

I primarily work adult but I hold on to my research work for some intellectual sanity. as a researcher/writer myself all I can say is that this piece was sloppy, unethical journalism. on the front page of the website of football's main institutional voice they turned an exceptional athlete into a hot chica who writes kiddie stories. She may have scored some goals as well. To reiterate my point in my post above, this was not a piece about a talented skilled chica who happens to be hot, the article was about everything but her talent and skill.

Originally Posted by Jel

Saying someone is easy on the eye also doesn't detract from their professional achievements, 'she is shit at her job but has nice tits' yeah, that's a dig. But 'good footballer and pretty too' I mean, take great offence at that, really?

that's the point, the author positioned her skill on the pitch below everything else. unlike peacock Ronaldo who can act like a fool and still be honored for his game, her body was the focus, her skills an afterthought.

Originally Posted by Jel

I was reminded of this thread yesterday while driving.. I had the radio on, and caught the last few seconds of a Take That song (UK boyband in case they aren't known in the US) - the female dj announced afterwards who it was, then said along the lines of "I'd like a time machine, go back to that video being shot, and have a play in the water with Howard - that video was wet t-shirt heaven!". Now, I couldn't give a fuck about that, but it did make me wonder what would happen if that was a male dj commenting on how he'd like to play with christina aguilera in the boxing ring where she was wet in 'dirrty' - would he be detracting on her abilities, or simply adding an addendum to her qualities?

I think it's safe to say that if a chica is grinding sweaty in a cage that you can have sexual thoughts about her, and prob to express em verbally. preferably with tips.

regardless of what a chica is doing though sexual thoughts are normal, and often make life worth living

if you're talking about some chica on MTV/radio though? seriously, are you that obtuse? I know you're not, so honestly I can't understand where you'e coming from. Sex sells, you're not a criminal for participating in the marketing plan. (btw I'm so not into white blondes but that video is just...yes). I objectify the fuck out of hot women, when they're in that context. If she was accepting a research grant though, maybe that talent could be the focus? Still a damn fine, but not central to the piece?

the point is, thoughts are harmless, we're both on the same side there. lust all you want, say what you want in appropriate contexts. I think what all peeps who are bothered by the FIFA ish are asking for is that, in the same way it would be inappropriate for a mainstream biz colleague to centralize my appearance in one of our meetings, maybe FIFA could hop on board? for real, if we don't call them on this ish how will they ever change?

Originally Posted by Jel

tl;dr
big fuss over fuck all

Essentially I'm inclined to agree. I would hope my earlier post above makes clear that I don't consider white women to be a marginalized group in any way. I'm not crying any tears over this matter.

that said, the FIFA piece was wrong. lusting after Morgan is natural, particularly if she works those aspects of her being, but perhaps the FIFA article could have been about her actual sport? the same way they write about the dudes (ahem Ronaldo) who flaunt themselves all over the pitch? ffs Beckham became an actual model, and still peeps focus on his sport, why is that?

this is not as assault on men (or women who share those predilections -holla) for feeling lust and expressing it in appropriate spaces, this is about her ultimate sports representative minimizing her accomplishments because she happens to be hot.

I know I'm repeating myself here but it's for cause.

[Jel]

LIike I said mate, the article won't load for me, so while I'm generalizing, you're talking specifically about the article... maybe it is that bad, in which case meh, I still can't get myself worked up about what comes out of fifa's mouth. Will they ever change - meh, who cares? Obviously some, but I'm not one of them

[editeur]

All these 'isms are invented by the rich to distract working class of all races, ages and sexes from the real struggle - class struggle.

[JesseQuinn]

Originally Posted by Jel

LIike I said mate, the article won't load for me, so while I'm generalizing, you're talking specifically about the article... maybe it is that bad, in which case meh, I still can't get myself worked up about what comes out of fifa's mouth. Will they ever change - meh, who cares? Obviously some, but I'm not one of them

until I went back and reread I hadn't realized you hadn't read the piece. knowing now that you hadn't actually read it though I can totally understand the visceral reaction.
for real though, 'head for the hills sons, no longer can you appreciate that azz'; that's not what this is about.

and btw wtf are you that you can't reach FIFA.com?

but yeah, I feel ya. wealthy pale chicas aren't an inspiration for my outrage. I am one myself, I know this ish is minuscule compared to real injustice.

we all have to pick and choose our battles. I just hope you never blend honest ambivalence with default tolerance for the status quo. not talking sexism re: this one very very very minor incident here, rather all the fuckery we inflict upon each other. when someone fucks up say something. Do something. If you don't care do nothing, just try not to get in the way of those who do care.

advice I try to dose myself with often, mate

you're good peeps. a little imagination goes a long way, all I'm saying

[Jel]

it's that yahoo link that won't load... I just tried again and it froze me up like a motherfucker. It still only referenced her 'easy on the eye [playing style] and good looks' so like I say meh, that isn't ill-intentioned.

Then it mentioned how the original piece mentions some other off field activities like books she has written - so? Do any of these people watch football? Do they know about the filler stuff, background stuff on players, teams, places of origin, history and factoids about cup venues, etc?

I can be a true sexist prick when the mood takes me (ie when I'm in a miscievuous, or just in a wanky mood if a woman has pissed me off), and from what I've seen so far, this doesn't even come close to real and/or harmful sexism.

In fact I'll be a sexist prick now, just for the fun of it, and wonder out loud if the original complainants were due their period to get so worked up about essentially, nothing. I just can't see the fuss (from what little I've read, and the lack of actual 'sexist' examples from the original piece).

And yeah that's good advice... though not pointing out when time/effort is wasted on nothing, when it could be better spent on REAL injustice(s), is just as important to me, so that we don't end up in a world where it *does* become a case of head for the hills sons, no longer can you appreciate that azz...

[bronco67]

I've seen better. How's that for sexist?

[nico-t]

Originally Posted by bronco67

I've seen better. How's that for sexist?

me too... to keep up with the football/soccer theme... heres a smoking hot dutch player.

[duk75]

Originally Posted by editeur

All these 'isms are invented by the rich to distract working class of all races, ages and sexes from the real struggle - class struggle.

Exactly.