How to talk to a Liberal - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

Paul Markham · 12-27-2015, 02:33 AM

50 liberals replying.

Quote:

Originally Posted by OldJeff

You are missing it Paul, I do not in any way claim to be conservative

And a flat tax does not create less revenue, in fact with the elimination of bullshit loopholes, and a simpler tax code it would create more. (like no you can't write off the private plane you took to Fiji to fuck your secretary undisturbed)

Among the left sided policies I could get behind are free healthcare are opposed to the Insurance company protection act, as well as free college.

All this as well as police, military, etc could be maintained with a true balanced budget, but special interest on both sides have long ago made that impossible.

It is much better to say fuck it and blame the other side for obstructing things like we do now

So a plane journey is not tax deductible. How about a trip to the mall in the car we claim as a business expense?

A balanced budget is the key phrase. Would that be the US Government cutting half a trillion in spending by closing huge swathes of the public sector, defence spending, roads, and whatever. so they no longer exist, or the private sector taking them over? And we pay at the point of delivery? For instance road tolls on every road, fireman ask for your credit card details before putting out the fire on your house, etc? Like the US healthcare system.

And of course, defence. Close all those massive factories and shipyards, sack the workers and soldiers. Then their local economy collapses, and more are out of work. And before we know it, sales are dropping because people who were further up the food chain, aren't doing so great.

Or just raise more taxes to pay for the bloated overspending that now funds so much of the economy.

This has to be the first step. Vote for politicians who will pass laws to limit how much politicians can spend campaigning. AND include businesses and individuals. Or get the Government people like the Koch brothers decide you deserve.

Paul Markham · 12-27-2015, 02:56 AM

The core problem for the West's debt is the way manufacturing has developed in the last 60 years.

Increasingly we have lost the economic powerhouses of Empires pouring in $millions every day. While manufacturing everything "industrial" in the West. Often from cut-price raw materials from the Empires.

In 1955, we never saw a Japanese, Korean or Chinese manufactured car, white goods, clothing, etc. Today we see so many. We buy so many goods we couldn't afford, if made in the West, we pay for it by borrowing money we haven't earned to buy goods we don't need.

How Much Would the iPad 2 Cost If It Were Made in the U.S.? About $1,140. Instead of $488.

It's not about Government spending or taxes. It's about whether we will pay more for goods to be made here by well-paid workers who buy from us. Or keep importing cheap goods made by people who can't afford to buy from us?

They promised us modern technology jobs to replace the labour intensive jobs we would lose to the East. All that appeared were jobs in Malls selling Third World goods. And now they're under threat as we buy direct from China via amazon.

slapass · 12-27-2015, 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Markham

The core problem for the West's debt is the way manufacturing has developed in the last 60 years.

Increasingly we have lost the economic powerhouses of Empires pouring in $millions every day. While manufacturing everything "industrial" in the West. Often from cut-price raw materials from the Empires.

In 1955, we never saw a Japanese, Korean or Chinese manufactured car, white goods, clothing, etc. Today we see so many. We buy so many goods we couldn't afford, if made in the West, we pay for it by borrowing money we haven't earned to buy goods we don't need.

How Much Would the iPad 2 Cost If It Were Made in the U.S.? About $1,140. Instead of $488.

It's not about Government spending or taxes. It's about whether we will pay more for goods to be made here by well-paid workers who buy from us. Or keep importing cheap goods made by people who can't afford to buy from us?

They promised us modern technology jobs to replace the labour intensive jobs we would lose to the East. All that appeared were jobs in Malls selling Third World goods. And now they're under threat as we buy direct from China via amazon.

And how would this be controlled? The govt can't force us to pay more. Consumers look for the best deal and labor has become fungible.

If you take the long term view, at some point the whole world with have to have the same standard of living more or less. That is not possible if the developed world doesn't take abreather and let them catch up.

Paul Markham · 12-27-2015, 05:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slapass

And how would this be controlled?

Import controls. Trade will be balanced or taxes will be imposed to cover the cost of paying people not to work or work in jobs with low skills. Look at the balance of trade without the financial markets. OTOH look at US trade restrictions on farm produce. Remove them and farmers go out of business, so they elect politicians who won't do what they did to the Car, clothing, White goods and others industries.

But that doesn't work for the 0.05%. So don't expect it to happen.

As for everyone having the same standard of living, dream on. The 0.5% have no intention of that. You and I might though.

slapass · 12-27-2015, 06:45 AM

Free trade has proven to be good even for the lowly. In the US everything is super cheap since we do not tax imports hardly at all. In Brazil they have a 100% import tax and everything is very expensive. Just the examples I know well.

In the EU and the US, we can't erect walls to keep stuff out since this would then allow other countries to do the same. Once you enter the free trade system is sort of a treadmill where you have to keep up.

Paul Markham · 12-27-2015, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by slapass

Free trade has proven to be good even for the lowly. In the US everything is super cheap since we do not tax imports hardly at all. In Brazil they have a 100% import tax and everything is very expensive. Just the examples I know well.

In the EU and the US, we can't erect walls to keep stuff out since this would then allow other countries to do the same. Once you enter the free trade system is sort of a treadmill where you have to keep up.

Cheap imports have put the lowly out of jobs.

Comparing the US economy with Brazil isn't a sound argument.

I said balanced trade, not keeping stuff out.

We can't keep up with workers on $2 an hour.

Paul Markham · 12-27-2015, 11:53 AM

Once Detroit was a thriving city, now not so.

Ss more good are made by workers on $2 an hour, our customer base shrinks. Yes, we still have money to buy lots of stuff made by people on $2 an hour. The US is now in debt to the tune of, 100%, and it's rising.

This is why people can keep buying goods made by those $2 an hour workers. Should it ever end. Look at Greece for an example of what happens. Of course, the 0.05% will be fine, instead of being worth a 100 million, they will only be worth 80 million.

Look at US debt in the long term.

Falling fast until Reagan, who it's claimed was a great President. now match those figures to trade balance. Yes, everything is fine while the credit cards work. Try living without them.

12-27-2015, 02:56 AM	#52
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	The core problem for the West's debt is the way manufacturing has developed in the last 60 years. Increasingly we have lost the economic powerhouses of Empires pouring in $millions every day. While manufacturing everything "industrial" in the West. Often from cut-price raw materials from the Empires. In 1955, we never saw a Japanese, Korean or Chinese manufactured car, white goods, clothing, etc. Today we see so many. We buy so many goods we couldn't afford, if made in the West, we pay for it by borrowing money we haven't earned to buy goods we don't need. How Much Would the iPad 2 Cost If It Were Made in the U.S.? About $1,140. Instead of $488. It's not about Government spending or taxes. It's about whether we will pay more for goods to be made here by well-paid workers who buy from us. Or keep importing cheap goods made by people who can't afford to buy from us? They promised us modern technology jobs to replace the labour intensive jobs we would lose to the East. All that appeared were jobs in Malls selling Third World goods. And now they're under threat as we buy direct from China via amazon. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

12-27-2015, 11:53 AM	#57
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	Once Detroit was a thriving city, now not so. Ss more good are made by workers on $2 an hour, our customer base shrinks. Yes, we still have money to buy lots of stuff made by people on $2 an hour. The US is now in debt to the tune of, 100%, and it's rising. This is why people can keep buying goods made by those $2 an hour workers. Should it ever end. Look at Greece for an example of what happens. Of course, the 0.05% will be fine, instead of being worth a 100 million, they will only be worth 80 million. Look at US debt in the long term. Falling fast until Reagan, who it's claimed was a great President. now match those figures to trade balance. Yes, everything is fine while the credit cards work. Try living without them. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

12-27-2015, 06:45 AM	#55
slapass Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Earth Posts: 14,627	Free trade has proven to be good even for the lowly. In the US everything is super cheap since we do not tax imports hardly at all. In Brazil they have a 100% import tax and everything is very expensive. Just the examples I know well. In the EU and the US, we can't erect walls to keep stuff out since this would then allow other countries to do the same. Once you enter the free trade system is sort of a treadmill where you have to keep up.