It appears that the Summit went reasonably well.

[Steve Rupe]

Over the next six months to a year we will learn how well as actions over words is always primary.

[Rochard]

So they... Signed a piece of paper with a vague agreement to be nicer to each other?

The man who calls himself the "great negotiator" has yet to sign a deal with anyone. LOL.

[dyna mo]

NK got recognized as a global player, got war games cancelled, a photo op showing Un at the big boy table, and a WH invite.

what did the USA get out of the summit?

[xClips Jim]

Replace the name Trump with Obama and this is a historic success that never leaves the front page.

But by all means...continue.

[ilnjscb]

Originally Posted by Steve Rupe

Over the next six months to a year we will learn how well as actions over words is always primary.

This. Anyone disparaging a process that will potentially resolve a conflict that has existed since the 1950s because it didn't reach resolution in one day has, I guess, no idea what a real negotiation looks like.

Nuclear war has no winners. I personally thought there was no way out but war, where good people had to die. If this isn't the case, and it takes a few months, that's ok with me and any other sane person.

The cancellation of the exercises, the photos, the "legitimacy" all have no cost, in dollars or in lives. What has been given is Las Vegas coupons, and no real defensive capability has been lost.

Let's see where this goes, like smart people.

[RedFred]

Originally Posted by xClips Jim

Replace the name Trump with Obama and this is a historic success that never leaves the front page.

But by all means...continue.

You got some serious black penis envy going on there.

[beerptrol]

Originally Posted by xClips Jim

Replace the name Trump with Obama and this is a historic success that never leaves the front page.

But by all means...continue.

Fox News and the alt right would be slamming Obama for meeting with America's enemy and a ruthless dictator. Calling him a traitor. But by all means continue

[RedFred]

1985: North Korea signs the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, or the NPT -- "a landmark international treaty whose objective is to prevent the spread of nuclear weapons and weapons technology, to promote cooperation in the peaceful uses of nuclear energy and to further the goal of achieving nuclear disarmament and general and complete disarmament," according to the United Nations.

-- 1992: North and South Korea sign a "joint declaration of the Denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula. "The South and the North shall not test, manufacture, produce, receive, possess, store, deploy or use nuclear weapons" and they "shall use nuclear energy solely for peaceful purposes," it states.

-- 1994: North Korea pledges to the United States that it would freeze and eventually dismantle its nuclear program in exchange for international aid, including help building two power-producing nuclear reactors.

-- 2002: US President George W. Bush labels North Korea, Iran and Iraq an "axis of evil," saying that "by seeking weapons of mass destruction, these regimes pose a grave and growing danger." The administration later reveals North Korea admitted to operating a secret nuclear weapons program in violation of the 1994 deal.

-- 2003: The United States and other nations halt energy aid, and North Korea withdraws from the NPT. Later, the Six Party Talks begin over Pyongyang's nuclear program. The talks include the United States, China, Japan, Russia, South Korea and North Korea.

-- 2005: North Korea tentatively agrees to give up its entire nuclear program, including weapons. In exchange, the United States, China, Japan, Russia and South Korea say they will provide energy assistance to North Korea, as well as promote economic cooperation.

-- 2006: North Korea claims to have successfully tested its first nuclear weapon. The test prompts the UN Security Council to impose a broad array of sanctions.

-- 2008: The Six Party Talks break down over North Korea's refusal to allow international inspectors unfettered access to suspected nuclear sites, according to the Arms Control Association. North Korea says the US side fails to follow through on its commitments, too.

-- 2010: State media in North Korea report that the government issued a memo saying the country "will be party to nonproliferation and disarmament agreements 'on an equal footing with other nuclear weapons states.'"

-- 2011: "After a meeting between Russian President Dmitry Medvedev and North Korean leader Kim Jong Il, Pyongyang says that it would be willing to observe a moratorium on the production and testing of nuclear weapons and missiles" in the context of resumption of Six Party Talks," according to the Arms Control Association.

-- 2012, North Korea agrees to suspend the operations of its Yongbyon uranium enrichment plant and begin moratoriums on nuclear and long-range missile tests. Washington promises food aid. Washington later says it suspended the food aid after North Korea said it would launch a satellite.

-- 2016: North Korea signals a willingness to resume negotiations on denuclearization, according to the Arms Control Association.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by ilnjscb

This. Anyone disparaging a process that will potentially resolve a conflict that has existed since the 1950s because it didn't reach resolution in one day has, I guess, no idea what a real negotiation looks like.

Nuclear war has no winners. I personally thought there was no way out but war, where good people had to die. If this isn't the case, and it takes a few months, that's ok with me and any other sane person.

The cancellation of the exercises, the photos, the "legitimacy" all have no cost, in dollars or in lives. What has been given is Las Vegas coupons, and no real defensive capability has been lost.

Let's see where this goes, like smart people.

In other words: Un got resolution on what he wanted in 1 day.

[xClips Jim]

Originally Posted by RedFred

You got some serious black penis envy going on there.

Ouch, sick burn.

[xClips Jim]

Originally Posted by beerptrol

Fox News and the alt right would be slamming Obama for meeting with America's enemy and a ruthless dictator. Calling him a traitor. But by all means continue

And Fox News and the alt right would be wrong.

See how easy that is?

[Steve Rupe]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

In other words: Un got resolution on what he wanted in 1 day.

I think not. The most important thing he would want would be relief from the sanctions. I think that the Donald said there would not be any relief what so ever from sanctions until he sees what "actions" if any Kim takes to denuke.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Steve Rupe

I think not. The most important thing he would want would be relief from the sanctions. I think that the Donald said there would not be any relief from sanctions until he sees what actions if any Kim takes to denuke.

And you would be wrong to think not. they've been working on a photo op like this for decades and decades, probably 70 years. He couldn't give 1 single shit about north koreans and sanctions. If so, he would have negotiated at least removal of some sanction(s). he didn't and trump didn't crow he refused that.

no, Un accomplished his goals of the summit, Trump gave them to him without getting jack shit in return all while being submissive.

[Steve Rupe]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

And you would be wrong to think not. they've been working on a photo op like this for decades and decades, probably 70 years. He couldn't give 1 single shit about north koreans and sanctions. If so, he would have negotiated at least removal of some sanction(s). he didn't and trump didn't crow he refused that.

no, Un accomplished his goals of the summit, Trump gave them to him without getting jack shit in return all while being submissive.

I disagree. Kim would care little about any photo op's in my opinion but would care a great deal about the sanctions. So I agree to disagree with your thinking on the matter.

[xClips Jim]

People that negotiate in Asia understand the concept of FACE.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Steve Rupe

I disagree. Kim would care little about any photo op's in my opinion but would care a great deal about the sanctions. So I agree to disagree with your thinking on the matter.

no worries. nevertheless. it's clear the USA got nothing out of what we gave.

And for the obtuse, that doesn't mean I was expecting trump to come back to the USA today with a dump truck full of NK nukes.

[dyna mo]

Un forced this clause into document signed:

“denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula” —

terminology that historically meant the North would seek a reciprocal U.S. removal of its “nuclear umbrella,” or its policy of extended deterrence that protects Japan and South Korea, in any deal.

that's not at all NK denuclearization. at all.

[Bladewire]

Trump says here that denuclearization will take 15 years or longer

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Steve Rupe

I disagree. Kim would care little about any photo op's in my opinion but would care a great deal about the sanctions. So I agree to disagree with your thinking on the matter.

Steve, according to this report, the signed document doesn't include anything about sanctions.

The article also states that trump promised Un no new sanctions. And that trump would/could remove sanctions long before Un gives up nukes.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/north-k...-live-updates/

what did the USA get for all we gave to Un?

[Steve Rupe]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

Steve, according to this report, the signed document doesn't include anything about sanctions.

The article also states that trump promised Un no new sanctions. And that trump would/could remove sanctions long before Un gives up nukes.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/north-k...-live-updates/

what did the USA get for all we gave to Un?

I know there was not anything about sanctions. The Donald has stated that there will not be any relief on sanctions for Kim until he begins to actually denuke. We got nothing out of the summit at this point other than a photo op for the Donald and at this point that is about all Kim has gotten. It will be over the next few months to a year before will will know what, if anything of substance will have been gotten by either side. My confidence level is not high that either side will have gained anything of substance. Time will tell the tale.

The signed document means nothing other than a signed piece of paper. Both leaders are professional liars as has been proven time and time again. It is all in the actions not the words.

[TheSquealer]

Originally Posted by Rochard

So they... Signed a piece of paper with a vague agreement to be nicer to each other?

The man who calls himself the "great negotiator" has yet to sign a deal with anyone. LOL.

I never really thought I could take such pleasure and find such amusement in watching really super dumb people with absolutely zero self awareness lecture others on complex issues.

You are literally a a rhesus monkey in a university lecture hall with daily classes on particle physics who then writes daily summaries on the class each day in his own poop. It really is comedy gold. You are doing gods work. I just wish you'd remember to remind us each time that you're a Marine (praying for his country's and Commander in Chiefs failure like a true patriot) and that you owned a jeep.

You're so determined to hate and so committed to fake narratives, fake news and false beliefs that you're literally talking down the ending of the Korean War and de-nuclearization of the Korean Peninsula every step of the way. Jesus Christ. Hahaa... but but but but "muh Russia!"

Retards.

[beerptrol]

Now all Iran needs to do is get some nukes. Nukes mean security and ass kissing by the american president

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Steve Rupe

I know there was not anything about sanctions. The Donald has stated that there will not be any relief on sanctions for Kim until he begins to actually denuke. We got nothing out of the summit at this point other than a photo op for the Donald and at this point that is about all Kim has gotten. It will be over the next few months to a year before will will know what, if anything of substance will have been gotten by either side. My confidence level is not high that either side will have gained anything of substance. Time will tell the tale.

The signed document means nothing other than a signed piece of paper. Both leaders are professional liars as has been proven time and time again. It is all in the actions not the words.

I hear ya!

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

NK got recognized as a global player, got war games cancelled, a photo op showing Un at the big boy table, and a WH invite.

what did the USA get out of the summit?

So some further reading this morning tells me.... This went exactly how some of us expected. Trump promised to stop joint military exercises with South Korea, and in return.... Got a vague commitment to denuclearize "some time in the future".

North Korea just walked over Trump.

[Steve Rupe]

Originally Posted by Rochard

So some further reading this morning tells me.... This went exactly how some of us expected. Trump promised to stop joint military exercises with South Korea, and in return.... Got a vague commitment to denuclearize "some time in the future".

North Korea just walked over Trump.

Temporarily stop "exercises".

[beerptrol]

Trump declares North Korea 'no longer a nuclear threat'

There you have it folks. The Liar in Chief once again has spoken lol

[2MuchMark]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

NK got recognized as a global player, got war games cancelled, a photo op showing Un at the big boy table, and a WH invite.

what did the USA get out of the summit?

I think the better question is - what did TRUMP get out of the summit?

I knew that NK shares a border with China, but I never knew they also share a border with Russia.

NK gave nothing, while Trump is halting the US/SK Wargames in the area that have been in place since the 50's. Trump, "the great negotiator", just handed NK, China and Russia something they desperately wanted and would do anything for, and the US got sweet-fuck-all in return.

What is going on?

[pimpmaster9000]

Originally Posted by RedFred

1985: North Korea signs the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty, or the NPT -- "a landmark international treaty whose objective is to prevent the spread of nuclear weapons and weapons technology, to promote cooperation in the peaceful uses of nuclear energy and to further the goal of achieving nuclear disarmament and general and complete disarmament," according to the United Nations.

-- 1992: North and South Korea sign a "joint declaration of the Denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula. "The South and the North shall not test, manufacture, produce, receive, possess, store, deploy or use nuclear weapons" and they "shall use nuclear energy solely for peaceful purposes," it states.

-- 1994: North Korea pledges to the United States that it would freeze and eventually dismantle its nuclear program in exchange for international aid, including help building two power-producing nuclear reactors.

-- 2002: US President George W. Bush labels North Korea, Iran and Iraq an "axis of evil," saying that "by seeking weapons of mass destruction, these regimes pose a grave and growing danger." The administration later reveals North Korea admitted to operating a secret nuclear weapons program in violation of the 1994 deal.

-- 2003: The United States and other nations halt energy aid, and North Korea withdraws from the NPT. Later, the Six Party Talks begin over Pyongyang's nuclear program. The talks include the United States, China, Japan, Russia, South Korea and North Korea.

-- 2005: North Korea tentatively agrees to give up its entire nuclear program, including weapons. In exchange, the United States, China, Japan, Russia and South Korea say they will provide energy assistance to North Korea, as well as promote economic cooperation.

-- 2006: North Korea claims to have successfully tested its first nuclear weapon. The test prompts the UN Security Council to impose a broad array of sanctions.

-- 2008: The Six Party Talks break down over North Korea's refusal to allow international inspectors unfettered access to suspected nuclear sites, according to the Arms Control Association. North Korea says the US side fails to follow through on its commitments, too.

-- 2010: State media in North Korea report that the government issued a memo saying the country "will be party to nonproliferation and disarmament agreements 'on an equal footing with other nuclear weapons states.'"

-- 2011: "After a meeting between Russian President Dmitry Medvedev and North Korean leader Kim Jong Il, Pyongyang says that it would be willing to observe a moratorium on the production and testing of nuclear weapons and missiles" in the context of resumption of Six Party Talks," according to the Arms Control Association.

-- 2012, North Korea agrees to suspend the operations of its Yongbyon uranium enrichment plant and begin moratoriums on nuclear and long-range missile tests. Washington promises food aid. Washington later says it suspended the food aid after North Korea said it would launch a satellite.

-- 2016: North Korea signals a willingness to resume negotiations on denuclearization, according to the Arms Control Association.

the 13th time is a charm

[xClips Jim]

Originally Posted by 2MuchMark

I think the better question is - what did TRUMP get out of the summit?

1.) The United States and the DPRK commit to establish new US-DPRK relations in accordance with the desire of the peoples of the two countries for peace and prosperity

2.) The United States and the DPRK will join their efforts to build a lasting and stable peace regime on the Korean Peninsula

3.) Reaffirming the April 27, 2018 Panmunjom Declaration, the DPRK commits to work toward complete denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula

4.) The United States and the DPRK commit to recovering POW/MIA remains, including the immediate repatriation of those already identified.

[Steve Rupe]

Originally Posted by 2MuchMark

I think the better question is - what did TRUMP get out of the summit?

I knew that NK shares a border with China, but I never knew they also share a border with Russia.

NK gave nothing, while Trump is halting the US/SK Wargames in the area that have been in place since the 50's. Trump, "the great negotiator", just handed NK, China and Russia something they desperately wanted and would do anything for, and the US got sweet-fuck-all in return.

What is going on?

He has put a halt to the exercises temporarily to see what actions NK takes over the next few months. He has not handed NK anything of substance. If NK does not begin to denuke, the war games will be back in play but even worse come next spring there will be an attack on NK. There was going to be an attack this early spring but the delay has removed the training edge that had taken place over the previous year, especially the edge on the special ops and black ops. Even a week of missed training can and has cost lives.

Both NK and SK became aware of the imminent attack thus the current events. It is my best educated guess that SK became aware of the attack and alarmed the North.

[ghjghj]

Peacemaker Trump.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by beerptrol

Trump declares North Korea 'no longer a nuclear threat'

There you have it folks. The Liar in Chief once again has spoken lol

trump's statement undermines any future denuclearization.

why would NK have to give up their nukes now, they are no longer a threat.

master negotiator my ass.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by 2MuchMark

I think the better question is - what did TRUMP get out of the summit?

I knew that NK shares a border with China, but I never knew they also share a border with Russia.

NK gave nothing, while Trump is halting the US/SK Wargames in the area that have been in place since the 50's. Trump, "the great negotiator", just handed NK, China and Russia something they desperately wanted and would do anything for, and the US got sweet-fuck-all in return.

What is going on?

I don't think that's a better question at all. I couldn't give a single crap about what trump got out of the charade.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Steve Rupe

Temporarily stop "exercises".

Steve, I get the impression trump stated he stopped the war games period.
this article seems to suggest the same

https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/12/polit...ntl/index.html

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Steve Rupe

He has put a halt to the exercises temporarily to see what actions NK takes over the next few months. He has not handed NK anything of substance. If NK does not begin to denuke, the war games will be back in play but even worse come next spring there will be an attack on NK. There was going to be an attack this early spring but the delay has removed the training edge that had taken place over the previous year, especially the edge on the special ops and black ops. Even a week of missed training can and has cost lives.

Both NK and SK became aware of the imminent attack thus the current events. It is my best educated guess that SK became aware of the attack and alarmed the North.

trump shocked south korea when he canceled the war games as part of the deal, they had no idea Steve.

it's an insanely stupid move and hardly a shrewd negotiating tactic simply due to what you mentioned. military needs a lot of training.

[xClips Jim]

My prediction:

We are now allies with North Korea. They will de-nuke. Bed wetters will spaz.

Final curtain going up.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by xClips Jim

My prediction:

We are now allies with North Korea. They will de-nuke. Bed wetters will spaz.

Final curtain going up.

how would Nk ally with USA when they are allied with China?

[RedFred]

Originally Posted by xClips Jim

My prediction:

We are now allies with North Korea. They will de-nuke. Bed wetters will spaz.

Final curtain going up.

Bet you haven't been this excited since Hitler and Mussolini became lovers.

[xClips Jim]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

how would Nk ally with USA when they are allied with China?

The same way I ally with two different sponsors.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by xClips Jim

The same way I ally with two different sponsors.

there's a sign-up page?

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Steve Rupe

Temporarily stop "exercises".

Yes. He agreed to stop military exercises with South Korea. We walked away from the TTP, and now we are no longer conducting military exercises. China must be thrilled.

[Steve Rupe]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

Steve, I get the impression trump stated he stopped the war games period.
this article seems to suggest the same

https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/12/polit...ntl/index.html

He said they are stopped "unless or until" he becomes displeased with the NK actions or lack of action. That means to me "temporary" if NK does not proceed with denuking or their rhetoric becomes agressive again etc. etc. etc.

[RedFred]

Next Trump will be selling arms to Kim Jong Un because he's such a great guy who loves his people and he's no longer a threat.

And the Trumpers will cheer.

[Steve Rupe]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Yes. He agreed to stop military exercises with South Korea. We walked away from the TTP, and now we are no longer conducting military exercises. China must be thrilled.

I would say the world is thrilled "unless or until" NK does not denuke and or becomes agressive again with its threats. Putting a temporary halt to annual War Games is pretty meaningless. Maybe you have never experienced War Games as a Marine. They do not amount to much other than being a show of force much the same as the annual parades of Russia, China, NK etc. etc. etc. are a show of force. We do not hold parades we do War Games instead.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Steve Rupe

I would say the world is thrilled "unless or until" NK does not denuke and or becomes agressive again with its threats. Putting a temporary halt to annual War Games is pretty meaningless. Maybe you have never experienced War Games as a Marine. They do not amount to much other than being a show of force much the same as the annual parades of Russia, China, NK etc. etc. etc. are a show of force. We do not hold parades we do War Games instead.

Steve, as you pointed out, the war games are training exercises and military needs constant training.

[xClips Jim]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

there's a sign-up page?

Act now and you get a free MAGA hat. Although, I root for the world - of which the USA is just one part.

The usual suspects will be in here shrieking how nothing good has happened and Trump gave away everything and got nothing - they have no choice - their brains are swimming in cognitive dissonance and they need to grasp for some reed of hope that helps explains how their nemesis constantly wins.

When you are too emotional, you can't see things clearly. LOOK where we are compared to previous admins. Do you feel threatened by North Korea today?

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by xClips Jim

My prediction:

We are now allies with North Korea. They will de-nuke. Bed wetters will spaz.

Final curtain going up.

Um, no. We are not allies with North Korea. We have agreed to nothing at this point. They signed a very loosely worded agreement that speaks in vague terms about things they might do in the future. We've been here a dozen times with North Korea.

[Steve Rupe]

Originally Posted by dyna mo

Steve, as you pointed out, the war games are training exercises and military needs constant training.

Public war games have little to do with training the military undergoes in preparation for war this day and age of special ops which are the spear of all engagements. Public war games are primarily a show of force and not a preparation for war and have always been that way.

[xClips Jim]

Originally Posted by Rochard

Um, no. We are not allies with North Korea. We have agreed to nothing at this point. They signed a very loosely worded agreement that speaks in vague terms about things they might do in the future. We've been here a dozen times with North Korea.

This ignores everything else that has been happening in North Korea. It's like time itself started on 6-12-2018 and no events prior to that have any meaning.

[dyna mo]

Originally Posted by Steve Rupe

Public war games have little to do with training the military undergoes in preparation for war this day and age of special ops which are the spear of all engagements. Public war games are primarily a show of force and not a preparation for war and have always been that way.

sorry steve, you are completely incorrect to assume joint military exercises are primarily for show.

they are primarily field training exercises. that's why they are called field training exercises (FTX)