BaldBastard

Like it or not, most of the money was fairly made via tax loop holes and the fault of that was the countries it had been made in, but it was a double scam because they managed to rip off the American tax payer bringing it back thanks to Trump who then a month later increased borrowing from China to run the country. The VAST majority of American businesses bring their money back, pay what tax is owed and lead good lives.... But not these fucks, and Trump gave them a get out of jail free card, at the expense of the American tax payer.

There was no negotiations, he could of attached numerous clauses to it the most obvious using that cash to fund infrastructure building.

But nadda, Then next thing Trump was blow-harding that Apple was going to spend a billion on a new factory, whoopppe!@ they brought back an estimated 260 BILLION.

The billion offered for that factory was like a bad tip for a lame politician, and the red hats ate it up not realizing they're ones funding it... and their kids, and their kids and their kids.

OneHungLo

Plundered? You really don't understand how this all works.

If I have a product and sell it in another country, and pay all applicable taxes in said country, how did I plunder that money? All these companies are following the tax laws in whatever country they are selling their goods, and they're also following the tax laws of the US.

I'm assuming you're a capitalist since you're on a business forum, so do you think you should a company should be taxed in a foreign country then when they bring that income home, be taxed at a normal corporate rate?

BaldBastard

90% of American companies doing business overseas have no issues paying those taxes you realise?

One of the ways it works is, you setup a company in a tax haven, that company then sets up another company in a country like Australia. That Tax haven company then claims the Australian company owes it for intellectual fees, which is always more than the Australian one will ever earn, So at tax time any profit is sent back as a repayment on that "intellectual fee", and sadly no income was earned in Australia so no tax is due.

The reason it sat in offshore accounts was not so much fear of paying tax, it was the fear the American Government would snitch it back on behalf of the Australian Government.

Trump issued them a get out of jail free card, which is REALLY interesting as to why, like I've said he could of attached numerous conditions to that, and they still would of brought the money back and paid you the American tax payer what you were due.. like 90% of American businesses operating overseas. But no the deal slipped through very fast, nothing was negotiated, trillions were added to America's bottom line... and everybody dances the country is booming, totally forgetting that money was a one off event. It doesn't add up and is certainly being used to fudge the books, personally I suspect someone was being backhanded cash bigly to make it happen the way it did.

marlboroack

I don't believe it. It's all fake

BaldBastard

Even Foxnews is fessing up

https://www.foxbusiness.com/economy/...wth-fact-check

On Friday, the Bureau of Labor Statistics reported that nonfarm payrolls increased by 201,000 in August, marking the 95th consecutive month that employers added jobs.

--

Trump says.. The GDP Rate (4.2%) is higher than the Unemployment Rate (3.9%) for the first time in over 100 years!


This is totally true if you exclude:

1948Q1, 1948Q2, 1950Q1, 1950Q2, 1950Q3, 1950Q4, 1951Q1, 1951Q2, 1951Q3, 1952Q1, 1952Q4, 1953Q1, 1953Q2, 1954Q4, 1955Q1, 1955Q2, 1955Q3, 1956Q4, 1958Q3, 1958Q4, 1959Q1, 1959Q2, 1960Q1, 1961Q3, 1961Q4, 1962Q1, 1963Q3, 1964Q1, 1964Q3, 1965Q1, 1965Q2, 1965Q3, 1965Q4, 1966Q1, 1968Q1, 1968Q2, 1969Q1, 1971Q1, 1972Q1, 1972Q2, 1972Q4, 1973Q1, 1976Q1, 1977Q2, 1977Q3, 1978Q2, 1980Q4, 1981Q1, 1983Q4, 1984Q1, 1987Q4, 1988Q4, 1996Q2, 1997Q2, 1997Q3, 1998Q3, 1998Q4, 1999Q3, 1999Q4, 2000Q2, 2003Q3, 2006Q1

but yeah other than those few mistakes he's right, doesn't it bother you that he's caught in blatant lies daily?

thommy

don´t forget - the 4% unempolyment rate under obama was, regarding to trump, in real 35-40%

so the 3,9% of him must be 34-39% because the measuring method did not change.

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directfiesta

yep ... Vendzilla and Robbie can vouch for that also ....

SIK

erm, regarding that graph... there was a global economic crisis and pretty much all economies are going up

some slower, some faster, and it isn't obama or trump, it is just the global recovery phase

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CaptainHowdy

Where's the input our very own chart maestro Paul Markham??

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pimpmaster9000

This is completely true, but onehunglo said there was lots and lots of MAGA because of trump and how his trading is booming but I just dont see it on the graph...

He said its because of a 1% fed hike LOL...what kind of MAGA is that?

I am awfully suspicious about his clamis to say the least...

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thommy

this is just the half of the truth.
USA plays a big part in this world economy and as obama took the right desicions and regulated the cancer in the system - the financial sector - it helped the whole world to recover.

but as everyone know there is a time to borrow and a time to pay back.
trump is not really a professional when it comes to paying back and this would be the one and only smart step he could have done.

we will face another crisis sooner or later where should than the money come from when
the old loan isn´t paid back?

america is inevitably going into the next crisis because the signs are already almost the same as in 2008. but this time it is not only real estate that is affected but the entire consumption was financed on credit and not by the rich who would somehow manage to pay it back but by the poorer population.
THAT are the numbers you have to look at and assess their consequences.

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NewNick

Its very simple. Let me give you an example.

For many years google has sold vast amounts of ads to UK companies. The searches where the ads appeared were UK consumers. UK surfers clicking on ads for UK products delivered to UK households. So a transaction that 100% takes place in the UK. We are talking about billions of dollars of ad sales.

So do you think google paid UK sales taxes on that revenue ?

Do you think google paid UK corporation tax on the profits generated from that revenue ?

Or maybe if google did not pay UK taxes it must have paid US taxes because google is a US company ?

Or do you think that google used a structure of shell companies in low taxation jurisdictions to shield themselves from the taxes that all the rest of us have to pay on our business ventures ?

Do you need me to give you a clue ?, or can you join up the dots for yourself ?

So the Trumpster argument is that they pay the taxes that are due, and yes very clever corporate accountants and lawyers make sure that the structures are legal. But they are only legal because the actual root of the structure, the ultimate tax jurisdiction of the holding company, cannot be determined.

Its a bit like Trumps own tax return - fucking mysterious and yielding fuck all for the Treasury.

And then you end up with mountains of cash in off shore accounts. No shareholder value. No corporate responsibility. No contribution to the society that google depends on for its profits.

Do you understand yet ?

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thommy

It is even worse !

MANY big companies don´t own their own trademark.
this is mostly owned by offshore companies.

many international companies are operating in different countries and pay a "licence fee" to the trademark owner.
this fee is HUGE and these are business costs what will be taken off as spendings.

as this is legal the company does not even have to make offshore business.
you just open a company in the US and give the trademark to a company in Panama or
Virgin Islands. Than you can decide to pay zero tax or to pay 1% tax and get confirmation that the winnings have been properly taxed.

the next funny thing is that the companies can buy their own shares back with the tax cut they received and still have the money in their hand.

example: get 1 billion tax cutt
buy back shares for 1 billion
the money for the baught shares is right back in the company.

now imagine that:
private shareholders investing money on risk. if the company they bought the share is going to be bankrupt they are losing.

now the US government gave this companies a big tax cut what makes them able to buy this shares back and STILL have this money after they bought them back (because the invested money will go directly into the company as capital).

all what was before at least a bit in hands of the society (at least them who owns shares) is now 100% in the companies hand - financed by the own government.
more money and value is going to be in very few hands.

and THIS is the biggest problem of US since centuries.
when it comes to prosperity it is not a question of GDP of a country. it is a question of how the money is distributed across the population.

this is measured with the so called gini index that shows you that the income equality in USA is on a par with that of russia.

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OneHungLo

Sarn

In Ukraine all good - no money not problem

dyna mo

Google pays taxes in UK, as well as all the others. In fact, it's called the Google Tax:

Britain’s take from the so-called “Google tax” rose nine-fold to £281m in 2016-17, after 14 companies were hit by the contentious levy on profits diverted overseas.

In the first statistics to show the impact of the “ diverted profits tax”, HM Revenue & Customs said on Wednesday that the yield had been slightly higher than estimated when it was introduced in 2015, amid opposition from US technology companies and other groups.

George Osborne, the former chancellor, introduced the levy in 2015 in an effort to crack down on multinational companies engaged in tax avoidance by shifting profits overseas that were originally generated in Britain.

BaldBastard

And pre 2015? The moneys been accumulating for years, hence why I keep telling you its a one off event. Sure there's still money coming back but NOTHING like the cash windfall they just had. Of course you will note all economic forecasts and stats have noted this in the USA.

ooops

dyna mo

I'm not shocked you need an overly simplified chart to try and attack America(ns). According to you and your chart, Bangladesh (per capita income of $1,693) and the Netherlands (per capita income of $42,183) have the same wealth inequality since their gini index is the same.

you = idiot.

dyna mo

who gives a shit about pre 2015. this is 2018. What about pre-1642? irrelevant.

BaldBastard

Its totally relevant

Much of the money has been accumulating since 2004 when they last let them off, that's why there was so much sitting there this time.. trillions.

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/26/what...s-profits.html


the main reason it wasn't brought back earlier, wasn't so much the due tax, the companies were concerned the American government would work with the Government's of the countries where the money came from, to get back their tax due as well, it would of come back eventually, was just a waiting game. Keep in mind out of the tens of thousands of American companies that do international business, less than 200 used this scam. Not only did Trump let them off the hook from raping other countries, he then raped the American tax payer by letting them bring it back, no strings attached and sweet fuck all tax.

many seem to think this is an ongoing thing, its not, laws have been plugged like you pointed out, and there still being plugged. So its not a rinse and repeat thing... 3 trillion added to the US economy's bottom line in one year.... same year trump borrowed another trillion to run the country ;)

Then start looking at figures.. minus that 3 trillion and start pondering on.. wtf happens next year cos the moneys not there no more.. Trump smashed the piggy bank

Mr Art of the Deal, could of attached numerous conditions to that money and it still would of come back... but nadda, its you the American tax payer that got duped.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/apples-...ons-1493566748

dyna mo

you're conflating issues. I'm addressing the fact that the UK tax laws caught up with the issue in 2015 and there is now UK regulation called the Google tax. That has nothing to do with repatriating money and trump.

BaldBastard

yeah we have it in Aus now too, and its everything to do with it because that's how MUCH of the money was accumulated. They took billions out of Aus as well, the money been horded since 2004. Most of its not possible any more because countries have plugged the tax loopholes.

https://www.ato.gov.au/Business/Inte...avoidance-law/

dyna mo

it's a shitload of money. historically, [tax] laws have never kept up with technology.


what are you suggesting?

BaldBastard

Yeah its H U G E money, yet its never mentioned..

3,000,000,000,000 / 325,700,000 (USA Population) = $9210 per person, extra added to the bottom line in a one off event that's non repeatable.


First I would question how that got passed so quickly with no negotiations. To me its got payoff written all over it, someone made a big chunk of cash from offshore accounts.. already in tax havens ;)

And then I guess its just a matter of making a mental note everytime you see Stock market and economy figures being paraded at present. And that mental note is ( Minus 3 trillion ) cos that's not coming next year yet its being sold to the public as if this is the new normal.

pimpmaster9000

berkelelelely it is about inequality in wealth distribution relative to that country...simple simple shit

for example a rich country can have great inequality in wealth distribution whilst a poor one can have even wealth distribution...now go get some crayons and draw bees and flowers

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NewNick

Correct, and the google tax as it became known was created in response to the practices that I described.

Before the google tax it was open season. Google got caught and there was demands for a response from Government.

However the cash mountains that Trump allowed to be brought into the US were built in the years up to 2015.

And this is just the UK. Multinationals, especially those in tech whose product is non-tangible, behave in this way all over the globe.

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dyna mo

Serbie,Youve already proven you don't understand charts unless they have a penis drawn on them.

dyna mo

got it, I appreciate the clarification. I agree.