O MARINA

100 Changed GFY'ers

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Raja

I just wanted to be below Marina...btw I LOVE your shoes

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Mickey_

Can we please rearrange the order so that she's in the middle? Much obliged.

#marinainthemiddle coming to Netflix this fall. Plot very loosely based on Malcolm in the Middle.

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12clicks

best sig on the board

RyuLion

That's what I see at the shows also, exept for TES Affeiliate Conferences over 1500 professionals.

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Rochard

There are lots of different sides to this industry.... Some of us produce content, but most of us don't. For those of us who do not shoot content seeing a topless chick walk around a show is fun for them. For those webmasters who work eight hours a day at a computer making websites and galleries but rarely if ever see a naked chick, yeah, naked chicks pull people in.

We one kid who bought a domain and put up a TGP and within days he was making bank... This kid actually owned a Ferrari when he was still a virgin. He loved hanging out with models.

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fuzebox

I always found the naked chicks screaming of desperation, plus the crowd of show photographers around them snapping thousands of photos...

I'm here to make money because I seem to be better at it than other industries, I don't need a trade show to also be a porn set. There still seems to be enough sex, drugs, and booze at shows to get me in trouble anyway

CaptainHowdy

He used to have an even better one . . .

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InfoGuy

Paul is not the only dinosaur who thinks the Internet killed the porn industry.

Prolific adult star Ron Jeremy believes internet killed the porn industry

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Nicky

At least the thread brought out some old-timers, so there's that. ;)

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Rochard

Ron Jeremy isn't allowed to have an opinion on anything. Ron Jermey was a pornstar who had his day in the 1980s. I've partied with Ron a dozen times, and no offense to him, but Ron was "content" - a long, long time ago. And he never moved past that.

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MassMarketing

Lets bring it back!

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Paul Markham

So what did cause the financial decline of the porn industry?

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Paul Markham

So you don't want the industry to feature what it sells. You don't want bigger better shows featuring what the industry sells and the customers it sells to either.

Why?

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Woodchuck

this place rolls over and sleeps at night. no more countries outside of the united states post here in the day. meaning they are out working.

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thommy

again WICH decline you are talking about?

your decline is not the industry ! it is your personal dumbness !

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Konda

Define porn industry?

The only thing that I can think of that declined over the last 10-15 years is things old school Videos/DVDs, mass content producers and smaller affiliates and paysites.

But on the other side more people are watching porn today than ever before. The big remaining porn networks, ad networks, traffic networks, tube site owners, media buyers, amateurs and independent models, cam models, dating sites, etc. combined make a LOT more than what was being made in the 'porn industry' 15 years ago. There is no decline, there is an increase.

You think that just because less people buy porn dvds or less people per impression buy memberships that the industry is declining. But you forget there are so many new parts of the porn industry now that you apparently don't know about, or don't want to know about, that make the money now and you just don't want to believe it, because you can't see it.

Like thommy said, for example all those amateurs and independent models alone are making more money combined today than all the porn affiliates back in the day made combined.

I don't understand why you fail to believe this when people that are actually part of today's 'porn industry' tell you so.

Konda

I love hanging out with models too, what I meant was those booths and parties with naked girls and/or live sex surrounded by 100 guys snapping pictures like they never saw a naked girl before. To me that was super creepy. Like if you want to see that just go to AVN next door. Of course I loved the private suite parties with models like any other guy

thommy

this is the wrong question to an ignorant man who claims to be the inventor of warm water just because he accidentally pissed his hand once.

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Mickey_

Three pages of someone explaining how a maturing industry cleaning up its act and tightening up its image is a bad thing.

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Kittens

Because these "parties" are not for the customers. We know what the fuck we sell, we sit and stare at naked girls all day, why would we want to do the same thing at a business event?

All that does is attract people to the events that shouldn't be there.

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ps. Paul I do hope you're getting compensated for the pageviews and engagement you generate here. Well done.

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Paul Markham

The clue is in your post. "You think that just because less people buy porn dvds or less people per impression buy memberships that the industry is declining"

People buy far less porn today than when they had to pay for it. If you don't understand the difference of having to buy and getting it for free isn't affecting sales then I feel sorry for you.

And people who are part of the industry tell me so.

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Paul Markham

It's the super creepy guys who are paying for this industry.

Yes AVN the bigger show is just next door.

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Paul Markham

The porn industry is cleaning up it's act.

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Paul Markham

So why are so many viewing and replying to threads with naked girls in?

The problem is you do know what you sell, clicks and the effectiveness is judged by stats after you've tested a few.

Your argument makes showing cars at a car show or boats at a boat show or any other product at it's show pointless.

This is from the man who has a bouncing boob in his signature!!!!!

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thommy

paul, why don´t you make your own industry and show us dumbs how it works?

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Ferus

You forgot he already did? he invented porn and producing content, and are living the lifestyle of the crazy rich ("rich" as in; he eats the food provided to him, earned by someone else having a real job)

thommy

this is not 100% true - he never said that HE made millions - he said he KNOWS the people who made millions (same as I met michael schuhmacher once and this makes me a formula 1 winner)

but maybe he gave his millions for charity - who knows.

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Ferus

he actually said billionaires .. just to be correct

thommy

you are right - but i do not live at such a high level.
i never made it more than millionair - i am simply not that smart as paul.

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Kittens

Car shows are not for manufacturers to get together, you dolt. It's for the general public to see what they've been working on.

No wonder you've failed in this industry.

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Paul Markham

And if that dope knew anything about porn and the industry he would know who those people were and their hands on approach to producing their products. But he doesn't so displays his ignorance again.

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Paul Markham

You didn't answer the question.

You and some others are claiming that any semi naked or nude girls are not required at shows because no wants them and their presence attracts lots of males to gawp at them. So what is it do trade people want them, not want or don't care because people can choose to watch or ignore?

This part is stupid "Car shows are not for manufacturers to get together," if our shows are not featuring what we sell what are they about?

Here you are spot on, today porn is merely the free bait to attract millions of clicks to sell ad space to. Most doing so have no interest in the product, production, quality, style, etc. To them it's worth nothing much, they even claim to know everything about it. No wonder so many failed at producing it.

What do you do kittens or ferus and the others who can't walk past a naked girl and are scared of their presence? We know what Thommy does he uses porn as the free bait to attract clicks.

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thommy

if there would be a shopping channel show (i am not sure if there is one) what will they show? hairdryers? potatoe peelers?

and what if there would be a weather site convention? what should they bring?
and WHAT could be sold there? weather cocks ?

no - i think they only thing they would show is their reach.

you still not get that the internet is a platform where any kind of offer can be promoted to any kind of consumers.

no matter if you attract them with weather, with news, with music or with porn.

have you ever seen a lighter with the brand of a car producer on it?

are they than the lighter industry?
or is the company that is selling this promotion product the lighter industry?

give up paul - you do not understand the big universe of marketing and success.
not in the past - not in the present and not in the future.
you are as stupid as a stone that has been lying in the same place under the earth for millions of years and want to explain to us how the world above you works.

i'm not even sure if you're asking questions here or just want to sell us your idiotic world formula as all-embracing wisdom.

don't you find it a bit presumptuous when an old loser here explains how to make money by changing the natural conditions?

what do you expect from your perpetual monologue here? you can still write in here so many times that we could all fly if the others gave us wings. but unfortunately we don't have any wings and have to run - and that's why we learned to run while you probably still check every morning to see if you have grown wings.

at your age you should already have learned that life does not adapt to you but that the entire human evolution is based on the talent that man adapts to circumstances.

you can block the wind through a wall or build a windmill and use it´s power to succeed.

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Ferus

If you are talking about Paul Raymond, he would not agree with you in any of your points. He would agree with us who claims its not about the product, but the customer. He evolved and developed(and made actual money)... you dident

thommy

exactly - and this gives me and the ones that produces the traffic a very good life.

we do not have to take any risk to promote a product that does not bring the costs back.
we do not have to wait the next paycheck and being scared that it will never come because we get paid upfront. we do not have to A/B/C test things on own risk and costs.
we do not have to find the mistakes in advertising and campaign strategy.
all this is risk of those ones who told us for centuries that they have the best product
that makes a fortune. they are all free to buy this traffic and show us that it is true.

unfortunately pornsites are not able to compete here because the traffic is too expensive
to become profitable for them. and IT IS THAT EXPENSIVE BECAUSE others can make it profitable. so it is not us that decide it - it is the free market and the age-old rule of supply and demand

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Ferus

At least I dont have to pay them to get naked and have sex with me, like you do

OldJeff

Of course the internet has killed the offline porn industry, the movie rental business, is is also killing newspapers, magazines, retail shopping, hell it's even changing the way we buy groceries.

Don't get me wrong, I find a scantily clad woman the greatest thing since sliced bread, but throwing a big party for a bunch of McJob holders is just not good business.

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Paul Markham

Agreed the online is taking a lot of business from the offline across the board. This is whether we should feature the product we claim to sell at shows. McJob holders can't and never could afford to attend shows, so that point is pointless. Throwing big parties for people who don't contribute to your income was always stupid and a dick swinging exercise.

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thommy

why should we care the offliners?
they never cared us.
and why should we change a biz that is working for us but not for the stupids?

what do you contribute to our biz except to tell us that we are all broke ?

if you are speaking for offliners than do it in an offliner board.
WE ARE ONLINERS and we give a fuck about this losers - we grilled them because they wanted to grill us. the smarter ones won - it is that simple.

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Kittens

I make fucking money, unlike you.

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Paul Markham

I've been retired for 11 years, do you make the money we made when we were working?

Why do you feature porn in your signature if it gives the wrong impression?

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Paul Markham

I asked what you did not pay girls to model for me?

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thommy

were you there as paul markham ? or was that still the time when you called yourself paula markham out of fear of your neighbours?

https://web.archive.org/web/20000519....com/about.htm

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Rochard

I don't think the porn industry is dead. It's evolved. The days of making thousands of dollars or tens of thousands of dollars on solo girl sites is dead, long gone. The days making a network of TGPs and making bank is also gone - people go straight to Google or Pornhub.

The average Joe who grabbed a camera, took some pictures, and then slapped together a website and an affilaite program and quickly made money is over with. Now it's companies that are making money.

People are still making money hand over fist, but they are larger companies. Paying a model $200 to take some dirty pictures doesn't cut it today. Our industry has evolved.

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King Mark

Last time I seen Ron, his dick couldn't stay hard without him choking it the whole time.

Respect to the legends, but...

MatureKing

Industry changed because of Rochard. He started order pizza

thommy

nobody doubts that the DVD sales and membersite sales went down.
before there was only the "product porn" and a limited number of people that wanted to buy it.

that means: as more people that want to sell it and as more member areas coming up, the cake is shared through more "eaters" because the cake will not become bigger because of a higher supply.

as soon the supply is higher than the demand - prices will go down. this is a 1000nds of year old rule that you can not ignore.

the market today is not focused on this "product porn" anymore.
porn is here to bring the people on the sites where in fact everything can be promoted.
some products are working some are not.
but the ones that will pay to find it out are the advertisers and not the publishers.

a publisher is not a professional marketer - he is professional in generating traffic.
so it is stupid to give an amateur in marketing the sales man job and make him responsable if there are no sales (wich is happening when a webmaster sends his traffic on his risk).

the job of the adnetworks is to find as many buyers as possible that can compete with each other and provide the technique that is needed from the point of a marketer.

as more professional advertisers are fighting against each other for the traffic as more expensive the traffic can be sold. so yes - also here only the smart ones can survive - the dumbs will lose money. but not the one that generated the traffic will pay for that. it is not his fault when a marketer don´t know how to advertise or have a product that does not make enough profit to pay the price.

so by giving porn for free the cake was growing HEAVILY as the profits we make are not based on one product. they come from hundreds of products and the most profitable will always win because this can pay the highest price.

networks are here to concentrate this traffic from many sources in one solution. a big media buyer is not buying even the best traffic when he can spend just a few thousand per month. to maintain a small campaign with just little traffic is too complicated and needs to much manpower. this is why this guys want to buy big numbers and have everything under one roof.

example:
if a mediabuying company pays a professional mediabuyer and his goal is a 20% ROI
it does not make sense to spend 10.000 per month in that campaign. the professional guy will cost much more than the profit. and the labour input to maintain is the same as for a campaign where he can spend 100 or 150 k per month.

to understand how and WHY this biz is working different today means to understand all circumstances and costs from everybody who is part of this game.
if you try to see it from one perspective you will never get anywhere.

in this example you see already that a buyer that buys small amounts can not work with a ROI of 20% - he needs 50 or 100%.
that means that he can not pay that much for traffic as a big buyer can and if someone wants to play this game in small and tries to buy traffic that will make him a huge profit - he will not get traffic because the big buyers are calculating harder and can pay MUCH MORE - so he will end up with no traffic.

the complete internet industry today has adapted this rules wich are not new - they are existing since centuries - but nobody believed that they are valid also in internet.
so everybody that understand this basics and understand a bit about internet technology will beat every dinosaur that did not learn it within the blink of an eye.

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The Porn Nerd

So great, what you are saying is a webmaster with a small budget (say under $1000 a month) cannot play this game, is wasting his money and will never get any good traffic? That only experienced media buyers working for large companies with huge budgets can turn a profit?

Gee how wonderful, hopeful and exciting! So all us Webmasters should just go home and let big companies do everything? Great.

Hey Thommy, instead of writing WALLS OF TEXT that really helps no one - since these large companies and media buyers already know what to do and do not need your advice - how about showing the rest of us how a SMALL Webmaster or company can buy traffic and make a profit. Hmm?

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