News Wanna know what's up with GM plant closures.....

[VRPdommy]

I had thought the news of GM shutting down many plants had much more to do with a major shift in GM's game plan. Either from a standpoint of taxes or concept.

So, I went looking... and it is first about concept.
The concept of electric vehicles. One that they are about to find themselves at a quick disadvantage. I have high confidence in GM's CEO. She came to the company from a very low level and may be the only CEO in 40 years in a major US auto co that ever worked the floor of the organization. I believe she has GM's core values and interest at heart. She is not just another bean counter CEO. More on GM later...

Lets just look at what is coming down the consumer pipeline...
Sure to at least get your interest, even if you can't afford it (like a Tesla Roadster)
This Monster from China



OK, not many are going for that just for practicality and price.
Also from China this... (60 Minutes that aired Feb 24)


This young fella summed it up pretty good for financials on NIO vs Tesla and keep in mind this from 5 months ago... It seems clear they intend to dominate electric car market worldwide with north America quickly in their cross-hairs.
Because that's where the money is.


NIO has several models that will simply be much more price competitive than 'ANY' gas model domestically built. This is the major issue.

So, I am predicting as I did when GM shut down those plants, that electrics were on their mind. but in what way ? We will have to wait on that.

The location for building these new electric models will probably be decided on supply chain logistics. And that can be complicated, but I am going to guess that after they figure it out, they will be looking for tax breaks.

There is little time so I would expect to hear something on this within the next year.

GM could change the way we think about cars in general in their version of 'some models'.
Being those that are designed for ride sharing and not personal ownership. that play is coming and the early bird gets the worm. So, I'm guessing they will play all angles.

FYI... electrics are going to be 'sexy' and sold no matter how you think about them now.
I see the same with motorcycles. There must be 6 new powerhouses in electric bikes.
Do a goggle search on them.

[Bladewire]

I can't wait for those cars to come to market so cool!

[VRPdommy]

I have watched many videos of China's advanced engineering and production of electric motors.
I think this will keep everyone on their toes now about how much emphasis is placed on engineering.

I look forward to the competition making it a bit better for everyone.
But I know some will whine, and perhaps justifiably depending on subsidies.
I have been waiting on this moment for a play in efuel stations.
I too have a new concept. And it looks as if I have been sleeping on it to long.

[VRPdommy]

[VRPdommy]

[VRPdommy]

[aimike]

What about Nuclear powered cars

[Farang]

Originally Posted by VRPdommy

That looks very cool.

[Farang]

I meant to quote the Rivian video...

[GAMEFINEST]

Make GM great again

[Grapesoda]

Originally Posted by Bladewire

I can't wait for those cars to come to market so cool!

bad for tesla

[SilentKnight]

All the vehicles in this thread are fucking ugly design styles.

At least Tesla has a nice looking design.

Why do so many electric vehicles have to look like boxy pieces of shit? One would think with a limited battery range they'd be doing somersaults to make them as aerodynamic and streamlined as possible.

[VRPdommy]

Some of the required base tech is changing and rapidly.
The use of super capacitors is fundamental to fast acceleration and regenerative breaking.

[2MuchMark]

I'll never buy another gasoline-powered car.

[pimpmaster9000]

Originally Posted by SilentKnight

All the vehicles in this thread are fucking ugly design styles.

At least Tesla has a nice looking design.

Why do so many electric vehicles have to look like boxy pieces of shit? One would think with a limited battery range they'd be doing somersaults to make them as aerodynamic and streamlined as possible.

if your design is too far ahead of its time your sales will suffer...pick up truck owners are a different type of customer and if they are unfamiliar with a new and radical design they will probably not be as attracted to a product...

[SilentKnight]

Originally Posted by crucifissio

if your design is too far ahead of its time your sales will suffer...pick up truck owners are a different type of customer and if they are unfamiliar with a new and radical design they will probably not be as attracted to a product...

You never fail to colosally impress me with the vast amount of expertise and experience you seem to have on every...single...topic.

It's...as if you've lived a dozen lives and have a finger on the pulse of every single human being on this planet.

Remarkable.

[VRPdommy]

GM Closes Lordstown Ohio Plant
They made the Chevy Cobalt body type.


This plant stands a very good chance of coming back with electric production models.
And that is really about supply logistics. It is in the center of the rust belt, between Cleveland and Pittsburgh.
Everything is close from steel production to electric motor manufactures.
Not that they will be farming motors out but the supplies are nearby.

It's a very large plant and always been a profitable one for GM.
A plant in Mexico is as likely.

But, all the profits seem to be in SUV's and trucks so that might be the big twist. Electric SUV's.

[VRPdommy]

Amazon, GM May Invest in Rivian'''s Electric Pickups: Report | Fortune
Amazon and GM May Invest in Electric Pickup-Truck Manufacturer Rivian, Report Says

The joint investment would confer unicorn status on Rivian, valuing it between $1 billion and $2 billion. It would also give both the ecommerce giant and the storied automaker minority stakes in Rivian, a startup based in Plymouth, MI. The investment, still in negotiation, could be officially announced as early as this month, Reuters said.

On its web site, Rivian calls its trucks “the world’s first electric adventure vehicles,” a claim that Tesla, the maker of the Model X SUV, might take issue with. Rivian’s trucks—which the company says feature a quad-motor systems for off-road driving, a wading depth of 3 feet, and three-second acceleration to a speed of 60 miles per hour—could offer Tesla competition in its high-end model.

Last August, Tesla CEO Elon Musk discussed electric pickup trucks as a likely future project. “Probably my personal favorite for the next product is pickup truck, and we are going to just do an amazing pickup truck,” he said in a conference call discussing earnings.

General Motors starts taking orders for its electric bicycle https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/14/gene...c-bicycle.html

[VRPdommy]

To understand some of the changes about to happen, first understand that small cars are not big profit makers in the US.
And, we have a average everyday drive 2-3x more than the rest of the world.

Electrics are going to be bigger outside of the US.
But here lives a problem.
Big auto makers want to sell into the Chinese and EU markets where they are going to be a larger share of the pie.
So if I were one of the big 3, I would not want to make them here and ship them there.
So, you can forget about the export market for autos in the future.

So as I stated above, the market is in electric trucks/suv's in the future in the US, or, at least they will be testing for it now.
I still can't see them not trying to compete with many low cost electrics that will soon be shipping from China, if they want to sell anything at all, but we shall see. Perhaps they know they can't compete against small cars from China..

It would be my prediction that the electric market will turn from less than 1% to more than 10% in just 8 years from now. Most likely in warmer climate areas of the states.
Some of the more advanced battery tech that was developed years ago, will finally be making its way to the manufacturing process.

[VRPdommy]

Tesla’s ‘rotor geometry’ patent hints at more efficient electric motors


https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-pate...ectric-motors/

[PR_Glen]

Originally Posted by SilentKnight

You never fail to colosally impress me with the vast amount of expertise and experience you seem to have on every...single...topic.

It's...as if you've lived a dozen lives and have a finger on the pulse of every single human being on this planet.

Remarkable.

yeah i generally dislike him too but he's fucking right and you should get past your bullshit and read what he actually said.

you can have the best product in the world but if there is no assimilation stage the marketing will kill it before it gets off the ground. no mass sales, no mass production, no sales drop, no market... Tesla didn't start off with fucking moon cars either, like you said yourself. He is saying EXACTLY what you are and you are shitting on him for it.

[VRPdommy]

Chinese electric car maker BYD reports 632% jump in profits as Tesla falters

https://qz.com/1606881/chinas-byd-re...tesla-falters/

[BaldBastard]

As cities around the world continue to grow there needs to be a better solution than oil powered vehicles owned by the individual, its especially evident in Asia.

I think in the not to distant future many cities around the world will ban fossil fuel powered vehicles unless they have zero emissions.

[onwebcam]

Electric Car-Owners Shocked: New Study Confirms EVs Considerably Worse For Climate Than Diesel Cars

https://truepundit.com/electric-car-...n-diesel-cars/

[onwebcam]

Originally Posted by MrBaldBastard

I think in the not to distant future many cities around the world will ban fossil fuel powered vehicles unless they have zero emissions.

I think in the not to distant future you're going to feel like a complete moron for buying into that con

[VRPdommy]

Volvo’s Polestar Introduces Electric Car To Challenge Tesla
https://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/20...allenge-tesla/

They are coming... like it or not.
Some, I know will not. that is your freedom of choice for now.
Eventually, the electric will be cheaper than petro powered.
Much easier to work on for me anyway. less moving parts. Fewer machined parts.

[Robbie]

Been watching this too.

When GM closed those plants...some of it was the hybrid Chevy Volt being a failure.
But the company said they were going to start making all-electric cars very soon.

Then a few months back...Ford announced that they have stopped production of ALL cars except the Mustang. They are only going to be releasing Ford trucks for the time being.
My guess would be that their next lineup of cars will be all electric.

Also...I just bought a new Jeep Wrangler Rubicon a couple of months ago. And while I was at the dealership they told me about a new electric Jeep Wrangler that will be out in the next couple of years!
When that comes out, I'll trade my current one in on that one for sure.

My guess is that within 10 years, gas cars are going to be nostalgic.

[VRPdommy]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Been watching this too.

When GM closed those plants...some of it was the hybrid Chevy Volt being a failure.
But the company said they were going to start making all-electric cars very soon.

Then a few months back...Ford announced that they have stopped production of ALL cars except the Mustang. They are only going to be releasing Ford trucks for the time being.
My guess would be that their next lineup of cars will be all electric.

Also...I just bought a new Jeep Wrangler Rubicon a couple of months ago. And while I was at the dealership they told me about a new electric Jeep Wrangler that will be out in the next couple of years!
When that comes out, I'll trade my current one in on that one for sure.

My guess is that within 10 years, gas cars are going to be nostalgic.

Agreed somewhat.
I don't think petro power will go away anytime soon, but it will become noncompetitive like the electrics have been before this point. And some are using high HP engines with high torque motors for a performance wahoo !

I can understand those that are judging this from what they have seen and herd to this point. But they really have not engineered these very well before.
Tesla did show the way and you can see the engineering talent being poured on to this now from many players.

I'm sure there will be bumps on this path, but like everything else, once there is a commitment, they will be overcome and surpassed.
I've been watching some of the patent activity and if you are a performance junkie, there is plenty coming your way.

Most American manufacturers have not made their own electric motors, they subbed them out. The big change I see is that they are serious now, is that they have plans on the books to make there own. Tesla and at least one Chinese manufacture are far ahead of the engineering on these motors.

But the games have begun. It will get very serious very soon.
The battery tech has to improve more than anything else. It's close but needs to get better. And from what I have seen.... it's coming. Safety for battery arrays is also a concern.

It seems 2021 is the year everyone will have more than one model electric so it's coming very soon. I have been trying to stay on top of this for a very long time now as I see opportunity in charging stations. But not quite like many might think.
But I can't reveal that LOL. But I have been buying assets to that end.

[CurrentlySober]

[Busty2]

Originally Posted by Grapesoda

bad for tesla

But great for customers, competition means lower prices !

[Busty2]

Ford may be leaping ahead by investing in the new Rivian?

[VRPdommy]

Originally Posted by Busty2

Ford may be leaping ahead by investing in the new Rivian?

Read back further in the thread... it is GM & Amazon in vesting in Rivian.
And I'm guessing they will build it in Lordstown, Oh plant.

edit:
But, I have been asking myself what has been Amazon's interest in this.
I am guessing that they are looking for vehicles for the 'last mile delivery' as they call it for the last run from distribution centers. So, I think this fits with their want to be a carrier for themselves and perhaps others.

[candyflip]

We've recently ordered the wife a Model Y. I drove one in Palo Alto last week and the wife and Tesla won this round

[Busty2]

Originally Posted by VRPdommy

Read back further in the thread... it is GM & Amazon in vesting in Rivian.
And I'm guessing they will build it in Lordstown, Oh plant.

edit:
But, I have been asking myself what has been Amazon's interest in this.
I am guessing that they are looking for vehicles for the 'last mile delivery' as they call it for the last run from distribution centers. So, I think this fits with their want to be a carrier for themselves and perhaps others.

You read back and do some Googling


Ford Motor has agreed to invest $500 million in Rivian, an electric-car start-up that is widely seen as a potential rival to Tesla, Ford announced on Wednesday. Rivian, based in Plymouth, Mich., plans to begin producing a pickup truck and a sport utility vehicle by the end of next year.Apr 24, 2019

https://media.ford.com/content/fordm...ment-ford.html

[VRPdommy]

Missed Update April 13
Rivian Says “No Thanks” To GM Overture
https://cleantechnica.com/2019/04/13...o-gm-overture/
(but they still own a piece of them)

The way these are built, you can put any body on them.
VW is working on the same concept as shown here earlier.

https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/s...-electric-car/

Rivain prefers to call their vehicle a 'adventure vehicle' not a truck.

STRANGE NONE OF THE AMERICAN MANUFACTURES HAD 'GOOD PLANS' ON THE BOOKS THAT THEY HAD TO BUY INTO THOSE THAT DID.

[VRPdommy]

the Skateboard concept

[VRPdommy]

Almost... But not exactly as I thought.... No Cigar....

GM selling Lordstown plant to electric truck company Workhorse

https://www.foxnews.com/auto/trump-g...pany-workhorse

[VRPdommy]

Why your next Jeep could be electric:
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money...ns/1256498001/

[Bosa]

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by SilentKnight

All the vehicles in this thread are fucking ugly design styles.

At least Tesla has a nice looking design.

Why do so many electric vehicles have to look like boxy pieces of shit? One would think with a limited battery range they'd be doing somersaults to make them as aerodynamic and streamlined as possible.

I haven't watched the video, but based on the pictures and what I've seen on the road I agree with you. The VW Bus might be the exception. They are trying to push a "radical design change" with these new cars and it's one of the main reasons people aren't too interested in them. If they were to take regular cars and make them electric, they would sell.

Just my two cents.

[notinmybackyard]

Explain This:

Why is it that ALL male electric car enthusiasts seem to have absolutely no cock?

I mean they all come across as some sort of brainwashed male feminist that feels the need to ask a woman's permission before going down on her?

Eating her out is something that he obviously does only after he gives the broad his testicles as collateral insurance against the possibility that he might accidentally say or do something masculine during sex.

--
--

[VRPdommy]

Originally Posted by Bosa

A very good piece... tnx for sharing that.
But, it does not show the reason for the closures in the US.
Which I contend is a bit of "re-tooling"
Meaning, the EU is about to make great strides for electrics and China is about to fill that market and at the same time, supply the US with plenty of cheap electrics.
And many EU producers will be competing in the US market with similar electrics.
Much of this is to transpire by 2021.

So, I contend they are trying to gear-up for the coming headwind cautiously, by investing in others that have been in the market (and are all non-union producers)
I find it surprising that a major revolution in transportation is playing out before me.
But, don't think the early models will all be great, but do expect them to evolve into something great in a very short period of time.

So the big change I think is the 'skateboard' construction concept. The key to it all.

[Bladewire]

After Losing over $1 Billion to Tariffs, General Motors Announces 14,000 Layoffs

[crockett]

Originally Posted by notinmybackyard

Explain This:

Why is it that ALL male electric car enthusiasts seem to have absolutely no cock?

I mean they all come across as some sort of brainwashed male feminist that feels the need to ask a woman's permission before going down on her?

Eating her out is something that he obviously does only after he gives the broad his testicles as collateral insurance against the possibility that he might accidentally say or do something masculine during sex.

--
--

As usual has no ability to speak on the topic resorts to insulting people who are.. I find it funny just 2 to 3 years ago we told you people that electric was happening no matter if you liked it or not. You said never would the big manufacturers switch that Tesla was only a fad..

Once again you are shown to not have a clue.

[SilentKnight]

Originally Posted by Rochard

I haven't watched the video, but based on the pictures and what I've seen on the road I agree with you. The VW Bus might be the exception. They are trying to push a "radical design change" with these new cars and it's one of the main reasons people aren't too interested in them. If they were to take regular cars and make them electric, they would sell.

Just my two cents.

Agreed.

[Rochard]

Originally Posted by Robbie

Also...I just bought a new Jeep Wrangler Rubicon a couple of months ago. And while I was at the dealership they told me about a new electric Jeep Wrangler that will be out in the next couple of years!
When that comes out, I'll trade my current one in on that one for sure.

Jeep is killing it these days.... And their resale value has always been good.

I have a Jeep Grand Cherokee with 150k miles on it. So far it's been the shop twice - once for a sensor issue, and then recently for a thermostat.

I think my next car will be a Jeep Gladiator....

[VRPdommy]

Ford and VW set to unveil new details on electric and self-driving cars

https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/11/busin...ars/index.html

[VRPdommy]

...The beginning of the end...

Six to seven times cheaper to power cars by renewables than oil: BNP Paribas

https://www.rechargenews.com/transit...il-bnp-paribas

I should be careful not to give the wrong idea. Petro powered vehicles will always play some part of transportation. But the renewable market is slowly gaining cost advantage.

[VRPdommy]

Porsche’s first electric car...

https://www.theverge.com/2019/9/4/20...e-car-hands-on

[VRPdommy]

Amazon will order 100,000 EV's from Rivian as delivery vehicles.

https://www.theverge.com/2019/9/19/2...ff-bezos-order