CC Processing > In the Worst Case Scenario - GoFuckYourself.com

KRL · 07-30-2003, 06:58 AM

Don't panic just because every day another CC processor is getting laid to rest in the adult dot com graveyard.

In the worst case scenario you can always sell memberships and just invoice people like the credit card companies do themselves. I'm not joking. Its logistically a bit more involved. But I've tested it and people will indeed send in their checks and money orders to you when they get their bill in the mail. And you can also pop a few ad inserts in the invoice envelope promoting things like phone sex, adult toys, other sites, etc to generate additional revenue streams.

After I get done with this big acquisition I'm working on right now, I'm going to start working on refining a solid billing concept like that for us. I also have a pre-paid system in development as well.

The time has come guys. We have to face reality and not count on Visa or Mastercard any longer. This ass fucking and not knowing what bad news tomorrow will bring has to stop. You can't do business successfully when the logistics of your processes are constantly changing. We need our own independent processing system and network to collect and distribute the revenues for our industry.

cezam · 07-30-2003, 07:00 AM

sms billing is the shit. its on the rise in europe now.

Calvinguy · 07-30-2003, 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by cezam
sms billing is the shit. its on the rise in europe now.

Yes, but you can't charge people more than $1-$2 at a time right now so it's not worth much

cezam · 07-30-2003, 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Calvinguy

Yes, but you can't charge people more than $1-$2 at a time right now so it's not worth much

how about billing them let's say $1 per one time access?

Snailey · 07-30-2003, 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by cezam
sms billing is the shit. its on the rise in europe now.

Forget about it , you'll never get more than 40% of what ppl pay , just like dialers .
Feeding big telecoms is the same shit like feeding VISA with registration fees .
Besides , SMSes are popular in EU where calls are expensive not in the USA where folks can talk for hours for

Theo · 07-30-2003, 07:07 AM

the things are not that bad

we have 1 processor out of business every week

we still have a whole month of billing left

BigFrog · 07-30-2003, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KRL
Don't panic just because every day another CC processor is getting laid to rest in the adult dot com graveyard.

In the worst case scenario you can always sell memberships and just invoice people like the credit card companies do themselves. I'm not joking. Its logistically a bit more involved. But I've tested it and people will indeed send in their checks and money orders to you when they get their bill in the mail. And you can also pop a few ad inserts in the invoice envelope promoting things like phone sex, adult toys, other sites, etc to generate additional revenue streams.

After I get done with this big acquisition I'm working on right now, I'm going to start working on refining a solid billing concept like that for us. I also have a pre-paid system in development as well.

The time has come guys. We have to face reality and not count on Visa or Mastercard any longer. This ass fucking and not knowing what bad news tomorrow will bring has to stop. You can't do business successfully when the logistics of your processes are constantly changing. We need our own independent processing system and network to collect and distribute the revenues for our industry.

i'd like to talk to you about that....the industries own payment solution.
contact me if ya have some time.
93437521

funkmaster · 07-30-2003, 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KRL
Don't panic just because every day another CC processor is getting laid to rest in the adult dot com graveyard.

In the worst case scenario you can always sell memberships and just invoice people like the credit card companies do themselves. I'm not joking. Its logistically a bit more involved. But I've tested it and people will indeed send in their checks and money orders to you when they get their bill in the mail. And you can also pop a few ad inserts in the invoice envelope promoting things like phone sex, adult toys, other sites, etc to generate additional revenue streams.

After I get done with this big acquisition I'm working on right now, I'm going to start working on refining a solid billing concept like that for us. I also have a pre-paid system in development as well.

The time has come guys. We have to face reality and not count on Visa or Mastercard any longer. This ass fucking and not knowing what bad news tomorrow will bring has to stop. You can't do business successfully when the logistics of your processes are constantly changing. We need our own independent processing system and network to collect and distribute the revenues for our industry.

... read and re-read again, this guy knows what he is talking about !!

geps · 07-30-2003, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Soul_Rebel
the things are not that bad

we have 1 processor out of business every week

we still have a whole month of billing left

Fabien · 07-30-2003, 07:16 AM

Give me a break

polish_aristocrat · 07-30-2003, 07:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KRL

After I get done with this big acquisition I'm working on right now, I'm going to start working on refining a solid billing concept like that for us. I also have a pre-paid system in development as well.

good to hear that from one of the most intelligent webmasters here

geps · 07-30-2003, 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KRL
Don't panic just because every day another CC processor is getting laid to rest in the adult dot com graveyard.

In the worst case scenario you can always sell memberships and just invoice people like the credit card companies do themselves. I'm not joking. Its logistically a bit more involved. But I've tested it and people will indeed send in their checks and money orders to you when they get their bill in the mail. And you can also pop a few ad inserts in the invoice envelope promoting things like phone sex, adult toys, other sites, etc to generate additional revenue streams.

After I get done with this big acquisition I'm working on right now, I'm going to start working on refining a solid billing concept like that for us. I also have a pre-paid system in development as well.

The time has come guys. We have to face reality and not count on Visa or Mastercard any longer. This ass fucking and not knowing what bad news tomorrow will bring has to stop. You can't do business successfully when the logistics of your processes are constantly changing. We need our own independent processing system and network to collect and distribute the revenues for our industry.

this is a very good ideia... but how to bill people that don't live in your country? you can't leave that market share behind

Carrie · 07-30-2003, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Soul_Rebel
the things are not that bad

we have 1 processor out of business every week

we still have a whole month of billing left

LMAO

KRL · 07-30-2003, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by geps

this is a very good ideia... but how to bill people that don't live in your country? you can't leave that market share behind

That's one of the components that require serious brainstorming.

wig · 07-30-2003, 07:56 AM

If you are going to invoice consumers, you should just follow an EBPP model and convert the sale to electronic after the initial validation routine.

JoeA · 07-30-2003, 07:58 AM

SMS is a great idea but it seems not to even have started in the States. A pal over there wanted to use it when I told him I charge UK£2 for a 30 minute trial and it does well.

Thank god for my dialers which at one time I was anti but they are now bringing me in another $400+ a month from nothing. I also now have live 1-2-1 chat lines at UK£1 - £1.50 a minute and I'll be launching them soon..

As I shoot my own content and also 10-20 minute videos I've been picked up by a company over here and my first dvd will hopefully be released in the UK in Oct. and the States next spring..

Yup diversify but keep it in the business and you'll continue to make money

solonline · 07-30-2003, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JoeA
SMS is a great idea but it seems not to even have started in the States. A pal over there wanted to use it when I told him I charge UK£2 for a 30 minute trial and it does well.

Thank god for my dialers which at one time I was anti but they are now bringing me in another $400+ a month from nothing. I also now have live 1-2-1 chat lines at UK£1 - £1.50 a minute and I'll be launching them soon..

As I shoot my own content and also 10-20 minute videos I've been picked up by a company over here and my first dvd will hopefully be released in the UK in Oct. and the States next spring..

Yup diversify but keep it in the business and you'll continue to make money

We have been trying SMS billing for a few months on 1 of our sites. It only turns small revenues over, payments take forever to arrive (but they do arrive) we have installed in on most sites now, and slowly usage is on the up.
Combined with some kind of dialer system...this is certainly 1 way to go. Also promotion of direct deposits or cash payments.
We have built up a small but reliable set of users who pay this way, and after the first payment we always give them credit, e.g there membership runs out and we keep them active with a email asking for further payment. 90 percent resend.
sure its not big bucks but longer term and with more refinment it has a chance. If I could drop VISA/MC for a solid universal alternative I would do so. They has to be answer someplace to this. and who ever comes up with it,,,has won the fucking lotto!

Carrie · 07-30-2003, 08:41 AM

Actually the second one to do it will win the lotto.
The first one will be more focused on getting it out there and being the first to offer it, whereas the second will take the extra time to see what the first is doing (both right and wrong) and then improve on it and release a better, more thought-out product.

solonline · 07-30-2003, 08:43 AM

1st , 2nd, 3rd, dont matter as long as the system was being devoloped. Get your point though.

EscortBiz · 07-30-2003, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by KRL

In the worst case scenario you can always sell memberships and just invoice people like the credit card companies do themselves. I'm not joking. Its logistically a bit more involved. But I've tested it and people will indeed send in their checks and money orders to you when they get their bill in the mail. And you can also pop a few ad inserts in the invoice envelope promoting things like phone sex, adult toys, other sites, etc to generate additional revenue streams.

How would it work?>

Would they get access right away or after sending the check?

solonline · 07-30-2003, 09:05 AM

acess would have to be right away, wide open to abuse of course though. The key is some kind of direct deposit system without using any credit cards for the deposit.
Its a tall fucking order though, ..... I think the most promising would and is SMS access, so long as more countries become available.

rebel23 · 07-30-2003, 09:14 AM

it's a great idea...

If you had a decent address validation system you could give them the benefit of the doubt and grant the user instant access then invoice them.

Also, aren't electronic signatures supposed to be just as good as real signatures? if so, that would surely prevent abuse?

Just need to work on this a bit more and test it... let us know the results!

rebel23 · 07-30-2003, 09:18 AM

Solo, I believe are systems available to validate names+addresses... I think Netbilling use such methods as part of their security checks. I am sure there would also be similar systems available in Europe and elsewhere.. the key is finding a company that could provide the initial checks..

of course, you will never stop fraud or abuse completely with any system ...

Simey · 07-30-2003, 09:27 AM

Take a good look at the gaming industry - they are trading without the cards already - its less efficient but they still trade and still do well.

The good side of this is that they have already explored the best payment methods so if it does happen theyve done alot of the research already.

wig · 07-30-2003, 09:36 AM

Speaking strictly for the US, which is the biggest market, here's what can be done:

Yes, you can use services like Experian to perform consumer information validation. It will return many codes that allow a scoring test to be derived which is then used to determine the credibility of a consumer.

There is also StarCheck, which for 50% of the checking accounts in the US can be used to verify the bank account number. An additional step, but one that does not aid in the impulse purchase is a microdeposit that is then used as a PIN (what paypal does).

The probelem is that consumer profiling and account verification have no direct correlation.

In any event, and no matter what methods you choose to validate with, an ACH debit is the most effective and cost efficient means of getting the money.

Obviously, thee is more details to all this, but to keep it short....

Jer · 07-30-2003, 09:50 AM

Here in Brazil most of the paysites have options like wires and this thing with a codebar that we print and go to the bank (or use internet banking) and pay.

Bobby Vicious · 07-30-2003, 09:56 AM

Quote:

The time has come guys. We need our own independent processing system and network to collect and distribute the revenues for our industry.

I am very interested in this. The entire industry is at the mercy of the CC companies. It is very annoying to know your income can be affected by a third party. We definately need a solution to transact directly with the consumer, the existing payment model is flawed and we are feeling the pain now.

GeXus · 07-30-2003, 10:03 AM

Go to any online casino.. Look at how many different payment options they offer, you will also notice that pretty much all of them use the same company.. there will always be credit card billing available..

KRL · 07-30-2003, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by EscortBiz

How would it work?>

Would they get access right away or after sending the check?

I tested with a 2 step approach. You want to build trust with your customers so I used a limited access approach until the invoice was paid. Surprisingly, and despite what most people here would think, the vast majority did send in their payments. Granted, I did use some clever marketing techniques obviously to get the followthrough to happen. And without those enticements, the results might not have been as great, so its not easy without thorough thought for each step of the process.

What was very interesting also was the secondary sales from the inserts. I wasn't expecting to see much but the response was good.

One of the biggest mistakes in this business is so many people look at customers as a one time sale, hit 'm and that's it. Well that's not it, and it shouldn't be done like that. There is nothing more valuable in a business than having a highly satisfied customer base that truly recognizes you do care about them and that you want to continue providing them with services and products they will enjoy for a long time. Every time you can resell existing customers your average customer acquisition costs get better and better on the bottom line.

Anyway much thought needs to be done to figure out and tweak the logistics and that is what I will do.

icedemon · 07-30-2003, 11:02 AM

Hey KRL,

Hit me up on ICQ 268776569
or bigfoot AT nwphenomenon DOT com
Shoot me your phone #. I live in Lutz above Tampa.

I have an idea that would take care of both the US and European market (or any other country for that matter). I also have the programming knowledge to make it work. I having been thinking the same as you of a system were there is no need for Visa/Mastercard. There is some risk with the idea I have, but the risk is very low. Especailly with the amount of return that would come out of it. There would be no waiting with the customer to use this process, to buy membership from a website.

wig · 07-30-2003, 11:32 AM

WOW, not a single comment to my posts. I guess you guys have it all figured out.

NewView · 07-30-2003, 11:39 AM

Jer... Contact me at [email protected]

Have some questions :-)

jennycards · 07-30-2003, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by geps

this is a very good ideia... but how to bill people that don't live in your country? you can't leave that market share behind

O.K. ... my company is able to direct debit customers in Germany and Austria - legally.
I am looking for someone in the U.S. who can handle my U.S. checks.
How about an exchange?

os at jennycards.com

Keev · 07-30-2003, 01:09 PM

Good NOW wheres my DAM PICS!!!!!!!!!!

Jayman Kick DOWN BITCH!

07-30-2003, 06:58 AM	#1
KRL Entrepreneur Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: USA Posts: 31,429	CC Processing > In the Worst Case Scenario Don't panic just because every day another CC processor is getting laid to rest in the adult dot com graveyard. In the worst case scenario you can always sell memberships and just invoice people like the credit card companies do themselves. I'm not joking. Its logistically a bit more involved. But I've tested it and people will indeed send in their checks and money orders to you when they get their bill in the mail. And you can also pop a few ad inserts in the invoice envelope promoting things like phone sex, adult toys, other sites, etc to generate additional revenue streams. After I get done with this big acquisition I'm working on right now, I'm going to start working on refining a solid billing concept like that for us. I also have a pre-paid system in development as well. The time has come guys. We have to face reality and not count on Visa or Mastercard any longer. This ass fucking and not knowing what bad news tomorrow will bring has to stop. You can't do business successfully when the logistics of your processes are constantly changing. We need our own independent processing system and network to collect and distribute the revenues for our industry. __________________ If you would like to develop your domains, you can lease inexpensive foreign labor from the leaders in the field at iWebmasters.com TO LOWER YOUR COSTS AND INCREASE YOUR PRODUCTION! * * * * * * * * * * * * Domains Adult News KRL's Newsletter Biz Tips Just Listed Domains

07-30-2003, 07:00 AM	#2
cezam Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: CZ, EU Posts: 1,363	sms billing is the shit. its on the rise in europe now. __________________

07-30-2003, 07:56 AM	#15
wig Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Panama Posts: 708	If you are going to invoice consumers, you should just follow an EBPP model and convert the sale to electronic after the initial validation routine. __________________ Credit Card and ACH Processing

07-30-2003, 07:58 AM	#16
JoeA Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Location: London Posts: 568	SMS is a great idea but it seems not to even have started in the States. A pal over there wanted to use it when I told him I charge UK£2 for a 30 minute trial and it does well. Thank god for my dialers which at one time I was anti but they are now bringing me in another $400+ a month from nothing. I also now have live 1-2-1 chat lines at UK£1 - £1.50 a minute and I'll be launching them soon.. As I shoot my own content and also 10-20 minute videos I've been picked up by a company over here and my first dvd will hopefully be released in the UK in Oct. and the States next spring.. Yup diversify but keep it in the business and you'll continue to make money __________________ www.saharagetsdirty.com/ www.ravishingindians.com/ www.anglo-indian-girls.com/

07-30-2003, 09:27 AM	#24
Simey Registered User Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 30	Take a good look at the gaming industry - they are trading without the cards already - its less efficient but they still trade and still do well. The good side of this is that they have already explored the best payment methods so if it does happen theyve done alot of the research already. __________________ <a href="http://www.topshelfdollars.com" target="newwindow"><img src="http://www.topshelfdollars.com/images/tsdbutton.gif" border="0"></a><p> Also known as 'Kermey' on other boards

07-30-2003, 07:07 AM	#6
Theo HAL 9000 Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 34,515	the things are not that bad we have 1 processor out of business every week we still have a whole month of billing left

07-30-2003, 07:16 AM	#10
Fabien Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2003 Posts: 4,788	Give me a break

07-30-2003, 08:41 AM	#18
Carrie Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Virgin - nee Posts: 3,162	Actually the second one to do it will win the lotto. The first one will be more focused on getting it out there and being the first to offer it, whereas the second will take the extra time to see what the first is doing (both right and wrong) and then improve on it and release a better, more thought-out product.

07-30-2003, 08:43 AM	#19
solonline Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: EU- Posts: 718	1st , 2nd, 3rd, dont matter as long as the system was being devoloped. Get your point though.

07-30-2003, 09:05 AM	#21
solonline Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: EU- Posts: 718	acess would have to be right away, wide open to abuse of course though. The key is some kind of direct deposit system without using any credit cards for the deposit. Its a tall fucking order though, ..... I think the most promising would and is SMS access, so long as more countries become available.

07-30-2003, 09:14 AM	#22
rebel23 Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 817	it's a great idea... If you had a decent address validation system you could give them the benefit of the doubt and grant the user instant access then invoice them. Also, aren't electronic signatures supposed to be just as good as real signatures? if so, that would surely prevent abuse? Just need to work on this a bit more and test it... let us know the results!

07-30-2003, 09:18 AM	#23
rebel23 Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 817	Solo, I believe are systems available to validate names+addresses... I think Netbilling use such methods as part of their security checks. I am sure there would also be similar systems available in Europe and elsewhere.. the key is finding a company that could provide the initial checks.. of course, you will never stop fraud or abuse completely with any system ...

07-30-2003, 09:36 AM	#25
wig Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Panama Posts: 708	Speaking strictly for the US, which is the biggest market, here's what can be done: Yes, you can use services like Experian to perform consumer information validation. It will return many codes that allow a scoring test to be derived which is then used to determine the credibility of a consumer. There is also StarCheck, which for 50% of the checking accounts in the US can be used to verify the bank account number. An additional step, but one that does not aid in the impulse purchase is a microdeposit that is then used as a PIN (what paypal does). The probelem is that consumer profiling and account verification have no direct correlation. In any event, and no matter what methods you choose to validate with, an ACH debit is the most effective and cost efficient means of getting the money. Obviously, thee is more details to all this, but to keep it short.... __________________ Credit Card and ACH Processing

07-30-2003, 09:50 AM	#26
Jer God is Brazilian Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Brazil Posts: 10,601	Here in Brazil most of the paysites have options like wires and this thing with a codebar that we print and go to the bank (or use internet banking) and pay.

07-30-2003, 10:03 AM	#28
GeXus Confirmed User Join Date: May 2003 Location: Yo Mommas Pussy Posts: 3,320	Go to any online casino.. Look at how many different payment options they offer, you will also notice that pretty much all of them use the same company.. there will always be credit card billing available.. __________________

07-30-2003, 11:02 AM	#30
icedemon Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Lutz, FL Posts: 1,022	Hey KRL, Hit me up on ICQ 268776569 or bigfoot AT nwphenomenon DOT com Shoot me your phone #. I live in Lutz above Tampa. I have an idea that would take care of both the US and European market (or any other country for that matter). I also have the programming knowledge to make it work. I having been thinking the same as you of a system were there is no need for Visa/Mastercard. There is some risk with the idea I have, but the risk is very low. Especailly with the amount of return that would come out of it. There would be no waiting with the customer to use this process, to buy membership from a website. __________________ Clips4Sale.com

07-30-2003, 11:32 AM	#31
wig Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Panama Posts: 708	WOW, not a single comment to my posts. I guess you guys have it all figured out. __________________ Credit Card and ACH Processing

07-30-2003, 11:39 AM	#32
NewView Registered User Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Netherlands Posts: 54	Jer... Contact me at [email protected] Have some questions :-)

07-30-2003, 01:09 PM	#34
Keev Confirmed User Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 5,335	Good NOW wheres my DAM PICS!!!!!!!!!! Jayman Kick DOWN BITCH! __________________ ReliableServers.com - NO REF LINK!