Why do American cops hold their guns with both hands???????? - GoFuckYourself.com

Antonio · 08-21-2006, 01:02 PM

I've never seen any other cops doing that, do they all have drinking problem and their hands shake badly or is there another reason?????

Anthony · 08-21-2006, 01:05 PM

http://www.midwesttraininggroup.net/...ke_a_stand.htm

Learn and grow.

JakeR · 08-21-2006, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antonio

I've never seen any other cops doing that, do they all have drinking problem and their hands shake badly or is there another reason?????

they do it because that is the proper way to hold a gun.

2HousePlague · 08-21-2006, 01:07 PM

To cultivate the belief among the citizenry that the combined action of 2 hands is somehow more determined, more considered, more thoroughly-willed, more careful, more valid, and therefore farther ABOVE moral scrutiny than the actions of 1.

2hp

JakeR · 08-21-2006, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anthony

http://www.midwesttraininggroup.net/...ke_a_stand.htm

Learn and grow.

Anthony · 08-21-2006, 01:09 PM

Modern Weaver

It was Cooper and John Plahn who refined the modern Weaver Stance, as we know it today. Although Weaver himself used it solely for more reliable accuracy, Cooper found that adding isometric tension also aided in recoil management. The shooter needed to push out with the gun arm with the same amount of force as the support hand was pulling in. The Classic Weaver has about seven key coordinates. Feet are in a boxerhahaha8217;s stance with the gun foot to the rear and the knees locked. The support arm is sharply bent with the elbow tucked in to the body and pointing toward the ground. Gun arm pushes out as support arm pulls in. You may or may not have to then tip your head down or to the side to see the sights. The FBI liked it. So much so they adopted it as doctrine circa 1981 as I recall.

The Weaver does tend to fall apart under extreme stress. As we all know by now, fine motor dexterity is lost and replaced with exaggerated strength. The equal amount of force the shooter was applying in his isometric hold becomes a case of strong hand overpowering the weak. This will cause the right-handed shooter to throw his shots to the left. The "locked up" position of the Weaver lends itself poorly to traversing, making it necessary to move the feet to address targets to the flank. Last but not least, most body armor is open on the sides so unfortunately the boxerhahaha8217;s stance presents that opening to incoming hostile fire. If you are cross eye dominant, right-handed but "left-eyed" if you will, rotating the head to bring the chin or cheek to the shooting arm bicep should get the dominant eye lined up with the sights.

Anthony · 08-21-2006, 01:09 PM

goddman double post.

Antonio · 08-21-2006, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anthony

http://www.midwesttraininggroup.net/...ke_a_stand.htm

Learn and grow.

I have no doubt that when you stand still and shoot at birds holding your gun with both hands will improve your accuracy, what I meant is they do that when they enter a house full of armed drug dealers for example - and then holding your gun with both hands restricts your movements - it is simply unnatural, and these are the times when you can not afford the luxury of slow(er) movements, no?

OG LennyT · 08-21-2006, 01:14 PM

so you can aim better?

wasnt that the obvious answer?

Anthony · 08-21-2006, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antonio

I have no doubt that when you stand still and shoot at birds holding your gun with both hands will improve your accuracy, what I meant is they do that when they enter a house full of armed drug dealers for example - and then holding your gun with both hands restricts your movements - it is simply unnatural, and these are the times when you can not afford the luxury of slow(er) movements, no?

So you are speaking out of ignorance and your own views?

You think a 2 handed grip is going to restrict movement? You've watched too many cop movies.

The Modified Weaver is dogma among law enforcement, and the military because it is a stable platform that ensures consistent aim while compensating for recoil.

Jarmusch · 08-21-2006, 01:24 PM

The proper way to hold a gun is sideways with your right hand like a gangsta. :D

Sly · 08-21-2006, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antonio

I have no doubt that when you stand still and shoot at birds holding your gun with both hands will improve your accuracy, what I meant is they do that when they enter a house full of armed drug dealers for example -

You must lead an interesting life. I have never been in a house full of armed drug dealers getting raided by the police in the United States, and I have lived here for 23 years. You live on the other side of the world!

BigCashCrew · 08-21-2006, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarmusch

The proper way to hold a gun is sideways with your right hand like a gangsta. :D

exactly...

jimthefiend · 08-21-2006, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JakeR

they do it because that is the proper way to hold a gun.

Pretty much, yeah.

Antonio · 08-21-2006, 01:42 PM

[QUOTE=Anthony]So you are speaking out of ignorance and your own views?

Well, I was two years in the army, and my father was a cop all his life, he thought it was wrong and so do I.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anthony

You think a 2 handed grip is going to restrict movement? You've watched too many cop movies.

I watched the Olimpics - none of the athlets there was running with both his hands strethed in front of him, I wonder why...

Webby · 08-21-2006, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antonio

I've never seen any other cops doing that, do they all have drinking problem and their hands shake badly or is there another reason?????

Well.. that drinking problem is one aspect

Common first tactic in an out of control scenario with law enforcement is get behind a sold wall

Next, is take your time and assess. Ya will have decided to either shoot to kill or disable - then it's take accurate aim with both hands and press the trigger.

If all else fails... adopt the "live to shoot another day" law enforcement rule - run like hell - like you have never ran in your life before - if shoes slow ya down, dump em and run barefoot - you will never notice the pain

I know damn all about this stuff Antonio - only picked it up from a couple of people who did know - and it saved their asses numerous times. Appears the norm is both hands on the weapon.

Antonio · 08-21-2006, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sly

You must lead an interesting life. I have never been in a house full of armed drug dealers getting raided by the police in the United States, and I have lived here for 23 years. You live on the other side of the world!

we have Discovery on the other side of the Wold, watch it every now and then, you'll love it

Darkland · 08-21-2006, 01:54 PM

It's plain and simple, Stability and Accuracy. What's not to understand?

EZRhino · 08-21-2006, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antonio

I've never seen any other cops doing that, do they all have drinking problem and their hands shake badly or is there another reason?????

Sounds like you have never fired a pistol and know anyone who has.

Darkland · 08-21-2006, 01:56 PM

Double post

Anthony · 08-21-2006, 01:59 PM

[QUOTE=Antonio]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anthony

So you are speaking out of ignorance and your own views?

Well, I was two years in the army, and my father was a cop all his life, he thought it was wrong and so do I.

I watched the Olimpics - none of the athlets there was running with both his hands strethed in front of him, I wonder why...

Okay, I gave you enough rope...

When the adrenal dump occurs, you lose all fine motor skills. Comparing olympic shooting, where no one is shooting back to a shootout between a cop and drug dealers is beyond sane.

Modified weaver stance provides a stable platform where consistent shots can be fired. So does the isoceles, and others that use both hands.

I doubt you have fired a gun as again, military and Law Enforcement teach both hands for combat shooting. As for your father, the modified weaver/isoceles, etc stances came into play in the late 70's early 80's.

Get that distinction, COMBAT SHOOTING IS NOT OLYMPIC SHOOTING.

smack · 08-21-2006, 02:01 PM

that's a stupid question. have you ever shot a handgun?

woj · 08-21-2006, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkland

It's plain and simple, Stability and Accuracy. What's not to understand?

Solid Bob · 08-21-2006, 02:15 PM

No idea, they should be doing this.

madawgz · 08-21-2006, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dvd316

so you can aim better?

wasnt that the obvious answer?

exactly what i was thinking...

dissipate · 08-21-2006, 02:20 PM

Because you have more control over the weapon, simple as that.

dunefield · 08-21-2006, 02:20 PM

hahaha i think you watch too much gangsta movies...

HaleyH · 08-21-2006, 02:43 PM

jimmy-3-way · 08-21-2006, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HaleyH

More jugs, less smilies.

Sly · 08-21-2006, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antonio

we have Discovery on the other side of the Wold, watch it every now and then, you'll love it

alan-l · 08-21-2006, 04:04 PM

well, both parties are right. You use the Isosceles everytime you have the chance, specially on high caliber handguns since it will give you more accuracy. Now, if you are on a dynamic gunfight where you have to move, the best way is one handed and offering the less target surface, which means you can't face fire gun with all your body exposed like on isosceles or chapman or weaver unless you like your body with a lot more plumb and a lot less fluids. Basically, to use the 2 hands you need to be in a position where a) you aren't being fired b) you're shooting from behind 3/4 of your body protected, like a car c) you're fully protected, and you jump at the side to shoot and get back to protection d) you're prone shooting

I think those saying the way to properly shoot is using two hands stands are polygon shooters, which make sense. But armed and security forces have to face a lot of situations where 2 hands shooting is simply impossible, anyone who was in the army knows this.

btw, the gangsta drug dealers example is really funny. Not to mention the Olympics example

Darkland · 08-21-2006, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alan-l

well, both parties are right. You use the Isosceles everytime you have the chance, specially on high caliber handguns since it will give you more accuracy. Now, if you are on a dynamic gunfight where you have to move, the best way is one handed and offering the less target surface, which means you can't face fire gun with all your body exposed like on isosceles or chapman or weaver unless you like your body with a lot more plumb and a lot less fluids. Basically, to use the 2 hands you need to be in a position where a) you aren't being fired b) you're shooting from behind 3/4 of your body protected, like a car c) you're fully protected, and you jump at the side to shoot and get back to protection d) you're prone shooting

I think those saying the way to properly shoot is using two hands stands are polygon shooters, which make sense. But armed and security forces have to face a lot of situations where 2 hands shooting is simply impossible, anyone who was in the army knows this.

btw, the gangsta drug dealers example is really funny. Not to mention the Olympics example

Thing is though, anyone who has been trained to fire weapons in a battle situation KNOWS you can still fire a handgun presenting only the sides of your body (least visible target by another shooter) AND utilizing two hands. If you think in order to fire two handed it requires you to square your full body towards the shooter you haven't spent enough time behind a gun. Not to say there isn't going to be situations where two hands isn't a viable option depending on obstacles/surroundings, pinned down, etc. But most "Police" situations affords you the ability to use a proper, controlled and accurate use of two hands.

Manowar · 08-21-2006, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarmusch

The proper way to hold a gun is sideways with your right hand like a gangsta. :D

pimp

free4porn · 08-21-2006, 04:37 PM

def for more control

Manowar · 08-21-2006, 04:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solid Bob

No idea, they should be doing this.

alan-l · 08-21-2006, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Darkland

Thing is though, anyone who has been trained to fire weapons in a battle situation KNOWS you can still fire a handgun presenting only the sides of your body (least visible target by another shooter) AND utilizing two hands. If you think in order to fire two handed it requires you to square your full body towards the shooter you haven't spent enough time behind a gun. Not to say there isn't going to be situations where two hands isn't a viable option depending on obstacles/surroundings, pinned down, etc. But most "Police" situations affords you the ability to use a proper, controlled and accurate use of two hands.

well, that's why I said both parties are right. Sadly, I spent some time behind a gun, nothing I'm proud of for reasons I won't comment.

You're right on that you don't NEED to present your full body, but it happens most of the time, hence you're trained not to do that in combat. Besides, in the army most of the times you'll fire with long weapons, not handguns, you'll use handguns mostly in training, mainly for urban combat. I agree with the police situations, and if you read what I wrote before, you'll see the possible situations where you'll be able to use 2 hands shooting will happen mostly in police duty (or feds or anything else than army).

AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE · 08-21-2006, 04:51 PM

Here in LA they go 1 hand.
Something about square exposure, they do not want a wide frame to be shot at.

I seen them hold one hand outside a liquor store to boot.

AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE · 08-21-2006, 04:54 PM

PS: In the Military Police they train one arm as well with a 45, two arm in prone positions.

AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE · 08-21-2006, 04:57 PM

Oh and Personally.
I prefer One Arm myself.

Secondly...

You do not shoot with your hands. You shoot with your arm(s).

Matt 26z · 08-21-2006, 04:57 PM

We are the gun capitol of the world. Do not question our techniques.

E$_manager · 08-21-2006, 05:13 PM

so we all should take lessons from American cops.

aico · 08-21-2006, 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Antonio

I watched the Olimpics - none of the athlets there was running with both his hands strethed in front of him, I wonder why...

Cuz they aren't Cops dumbass. Holding a gun with both hands is the proper way to fire a gun, end of story, thank you and goodnight.

E$_manager · 08-21-2006, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Solid Bob

No idea, they should be doing this.

beemk · 08-21-2006, 05:29 PM

[QUOTE=Antonio]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Anthony

So you are speaking out of ignorance and your own views?

Well, I was two years in the army, and my father was a cop all his life, he thought it was wrong and so do I.

I watched the Olimpics - none of the athlets there was running with both his hands strethed in front of him, I wonder why...

i'd rather be ready to shoot someone with a gun accurately than to try and outrun a bullet, thats just me though.

Hollywood376 · 08-21-2006, 06:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jarmusch

The proper way to hold a gun is sideways with your right hand like a gangsta. :D

plus it allows one free while you are shooting so you can grab your cock and say shit you heard in Scarface.

tony286 · 08-21-2006, 06:08 PM

its what they are taught and it works.

shahab6 · 08-21-2006, 06:09 PM

There to weak to hold the gun

notabook · 08-21-2006, 06:18 PM

It's so they can shoot black people easier.

pussyluver · 08-21-2006, 06:22 PM

Your gun, hold the way you want. If you have the shakes, ya have a better chance with two hands. That's provided you're not shot first.

evilclown · 08-21-2006, 06:57 PM

08-21-2006, 01:02 PM	#1
Antonio Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Spartaaaaaaaaa Posts: 14,136	Why do American cops hold their guns with both hands???????? I've never seen any other cops doing that, do they all have drinking problem and their hands shake badly or is there another reason?????

08-21-2006, 01:05 PM	#2
Anthony Keyboard Warrior Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: One of the outer rings of Hell Posts: 9,653	http://www.midwesttraininggroup.net/...ke_a_stand.htm Learn and grow. __________________

08-21-2006, 01:07 PM	#4
2HousePlague CURATOR Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: the attic Posts: 14,572	To cultivate the belief among the citizenry that the combined action of 2 hands is somehow more determined, more considered, more thoroughly-willed, more careful, more valid, and therefore farther ABOVE moral scrutiny than the actions of 1. 2hp __________________ tada!

08-21-2006, 01:09 PM	#6
Anthony Keyboard Warrior Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: One of the outer rings of Hell Posts: 9,653	Modern Weaver It was Cooper and John Plahn who refined the modern Weaver Stance, as we know it today. Although Weaver himself used it solely for more reliable accuracy, Cooper found that adding isometric tension also aided in recoil management. The shooter needed to push out with the gun arm with the same amount of force as the support hand was pulling in. The Classic Weaver has about seven key coordinates. Feet are in a boxerhahaha8217;s stance with the gun foot to the rear and the knees locked. The support arm is sharply bent with the elbow tucked in to the body and pointing toward the ground. Gun arm pushes out as support arm pulls in. You may or may not have to then tip your head down or to the side to see the sights. The FBI liked it. So much so they adopted it as doctrine circa 1981 as I recall. The Weaver does tend to fall apart under extreme stress. As we all know by now, fine motor dexterity is lost and replaced with exaggerated strength. The equal amount of force the shooter was applying in his isometric hold becomes a case of strong hand overpowering the weak. This will cause the right-handed shooter to throw his shots to the left. The "locked up" position of the Weaver lends itself poorly to traversing, making it necessary to move the feet to address targets to the flank. Last but not least, most body armor is open on the sides so unfortunately the boxerhahaha8217;s stance presents that opening to incoming hostile fire. If you are cross eye dominant, right-handed but "left-eyed" if you will, rotating the head to bring the chin or cheek to the shooting arm bicep should get the dominant eye lined up with the sights. __________________

08-21-2006, 01:09 PM	#7
Anthony Keyboard Warrior Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: One of the outer rings of Hell Posts: 9,653	goddman double post. __________________

08-21-2006, 01:14 PM	#9
OG LennyT Wall Street Pimp Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 14,345	so you can aim better? wasnt that the obvious answer? __________________ Tradeking - my online broker \| 4.95 a trade \| make real $$

08-21-2006, 01:24 PM	#11
Jarmusch Industry Role: Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 12,464	The proper way to hold a gun is sideways with your right hand like a gangsta. :D

08-21-2006, 01:54 PM	#18
Darkland Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 1,488	It's plain and simple, Stability and Accuracy. What's not to understand? __________________ "The towers are gone now, reduced to bloody rubble, along with all hopes for Peace in Our Time, in the United States or any other country. Make no mistake about it: We are At War now -- with somebody -- and we will stay At War with that mysterious Enemy for the rest of our lives." H.S.T. 09/12/01

08-21-2006, 01:56 PM	#20
Darkland Confirmed User Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 1,488	Double post __________________ "The towers are gone now, reduced to bloody rubble, along with all hopes for Peace in Our Time, in the United States or any other country. Make no mistake about it: We are At War now -- with somebody -- and we will stay At War with that mysterious Enemy for the rest of our lives." H.S.T. 09/12/01

08-21-2006, 02:01 PM	#22
smack Push Porn Like Weight. Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Inside .NET Posts: 10,652	that's a stupid question. have you ever shot a handgun? __________________ Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war.

08-21-2006, 02:15 PM	#24
Solid Bob Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Easy Webcam Pro Posts: 1,213	No idea, they should be doing this. __________________ [email protected]

08-21-2006, 02:20 PM	#26
dissipate The Dirty Frenchman Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Lost Angeles Posts: 8,904	Because you have more control over the weapon, simple as that.

08-21-2006, 02:20 PM	#27
dunefield www.barely18movies.com Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Melbourne, Australia Posts: 10,920	hahaha i think you watch too much gangsta movies... __________________

08-21-2006, 02:43 PM	#28
HaleyH Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: www.haleyholmes.com Posts: 56	__________________ Visit my site! Last edited by HaleyH; 08-21-2006 at 02:44 PM..

08-21-2006, 04:04 PM	#31
alan-l Confirmed User Join Date: May 2003 Location: look behind you Posts: 2,477	well, both parties are right. You use the Isosceles everytime you have the chance, specially on high caliber handguns since it will give you more accuracy. Now, if you are on a dynamic gunfight where you have to move, the best way is one handed and offering the less target surface, which means you can't face fire gun with all your body exposed like on isosceles or chapman or weaver unless you like your body with a lot more plumb and a lot less fluids. Basically, to use the 2 hands you need to be in a position where a) you aren't being fired b) you're shooting from behind 3/4 of your body protected, like a car c) you're fully protected, and you jump at the side to shoot and get back to protection d) you're prone shooting I think those saying the way to properly shoot is using two hands stands are polygon shooters, which make sense. But armed and security forces have to face a lot of situations where 2 hands shooting is simply impossible, anyone who was in the army knows this. btw, the gangsta drug dealers example is really funny. Not to mention the Olympics example

08-21-2006, 04:37 PM	#34
free4porn Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 4,654	def for more control __________________ Switch To Fling Now! I'm on 1:201 paid signups sending little traffic! Make $$$ Free Porn

08-21-2006, 04:51 PM	#37
AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE best designer on GFY Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: IALIEN.COM - High Definition Video and Photographic Productions -ICQ 78943384 Posts: 30,307	Here in LA they go 1 hand. Something about square exposure, they do not want a wide frame to be shot at. I seen them hold one hand outside a liquor store to boot. __________________ NAKED HOSTING FTW!11 I'm On The INSANE PLAN $9.95/mo! \| The Alien Blog Adult News Worth Reading Updated Daily \| Content For Sale! 641 PICS 216 MINUTES OF VIDEO $350.00 \|ICQ: 78943384 \|

08-21-2006, 04:54 PM	#38
AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE best designer on GFY Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: IALIEN.COM - High Definition Video and Photographic Productions -ICQ 78943384 Posts: 30,307	PS: In the Military Police they train one arm as well with a 45, two arm in prone positions. __________________ NAKED HOSTING FTW!11 I'm On The INSANE PLAN $9.95/mo! \| The Alien Blog Adult News Worth Reading Updated Daily \| Content For Sale! 641 PICS 216 MINUTES OF VIDEO $350.00 \|ICQ: 78943384 \|

08-21-2006, 04:57 PM	#39
AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE best designer on GFY Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: IALIEN.COM - High Definition Video and Photographic Productions -ICQ 78943384 Posts: 30,307	Oh and Personally. I prefer One Arm myself. Secondly... You do not shoot with your hands. You shoot with your arm(s). __________________ NAKED HOSTING FTW!11 I'm On The INSANE PLAN $9.95/mo! \| The Alien Blog Adult News Worth Reading Updated Daily \| Content For Sale! 641 PICS 216 MINUTES OF VIDEO $350.00 \|ICQ: 78943384 \| Last edited by AlienQ - BANNED FOR LIFE; 08-21-2006 at 04:58 PM..

08-21-2006, 04:57 PM	#40
Matt 26z So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: ¤ª"˜¨๑۩۞۩๑¨˜"ª¤ Posts: 18,481	We are the gun capitol of the world. Do not question our techniques.

08-21-2006, 05:13 PM	#41
E$_manager Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: pink adult dreams Posts: 13,557	so we all should take lessons from American cops. __________________ Enjoy more sales with EnjoyBucks! Homemade: Asian : Ebony : GFs : Voyeur : Nudist : Public : 3D

08-21-2006, 06:08 PM	#46
tony286 lurker Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: atlanta Posts: 57,021	its what they are taught and it works.

08-21-2006, 06:09 PM	#47
shahab6 So Fucking Banned Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Los angeles Posts: 1,614	There to weak to hold the gun

08-21-2006, 06:18 PM	#48
notabook Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Not a Library! Posts: 9,748	It's so they can shoot black people easier. __________________

08-21-2006, 06:22 PM	#49
pussyluver Clueless OleMan Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: ICQ - 169903487 Posts: 11,009	Your gun, hold the way you want. If you have the shakes, ya have a better chance with two hands. That's provided you're not shot first.

08-21-2006, 06:57 PM	#50
evilclown Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 131