Jace

sorry, apparently polls have been disabled on gfy...LOL....so post your answer here

Just wanna see what you all have to say about this

I contact a programmer that I had used before

he talks with me for an hour, I send him the specs and he says he is working on something else tonight and will start on the job in the next few days

a few days go by, I email him, no response

a few more days, I email again, no response

after a week or so I give up and chalk him up in my "total flakes" list

he is saying that because he didn't reply to my emails that I am being a dick (not those exact words), I say he is being a total and complete flake

you decide

OH, yeah, the great part is while insulting me about him flaking, he says he will never take on a job from someone with over 32k+ posts on a message board...ROFL.....that is like insulting someones spelling while arguing with them on a forum, it all but means you lost the battle before it started

GrouchyAdmin

It depends on the job, but moreover, the professional demeanor of the client and the coder.

Ugh, this sounds like a plug, but... If I'm unwilling, or unable to take on a job, I let people know after I find what their needs are. However, I won't discount someone immediately, even if I am busy. They may just need something simple, and if I can't do it, I always offer to refer their needs to anyone else I've worked with previously (who is capable of doing the job).

Usually both sides are at least partially at fault. It's difficult to write software at times without having a complete view, and spending time discussing the needs of the client. Other times, life can just suck being a programmer, and you can get a bit "snippy," even when it seems to be unwarranted.

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calmlikeabomb

I'm the person Jace is talking about.

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subarus.

jact

Jace, if I posted on GFY every time I had an issue with a programmer, I'd have more posts then juicy. Don't spend the effort on it man.

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Free agent

fris

PLEASE GET IN TOUCH WITH ME

PLEASE GET IN TOUCH WITH ME

PLEASE GET IN TOUCH WITH ME

PLEASE GET IN TOUCH WITH ME

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Jace

no effort...lazy saturday, newcastle and a movie

i just got peeved with the little programmer bitch said he added ME to his ignore list AFTER saying he would start work on the project

Jace

good luck man, he might have said no telepathically to your project and expect you to just "know"

SmokeyTheBear

he actually has a deeper point to the "not doing jobs with people over 32k posts"

some people consider green users as having "clout" so they will win any argument by default.

Speaking from a programmers perspective ( albeint an amateur? and somewhat disorganized ) i often get too much on my plate and dont meet "floated" dates like " perhaps next week" heh . I try to always meet hard dates but "theoretical" dates don't often meet their goal.

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fris

At least you got an answer. I been trying for a couple weeks now, one of my sites i cant even update.

Too many hours have gone into this project.

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Jace

calmlikeabomb

Thanks, Smokey.

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subarus.

Jace

he said nothing in defense of you, idiot

calmlikeabomb

Ha, maybe you didn't read the first two lines of his posts, but whatever you just proved his point.

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subarus.

Tempest

I don't know about being a "flake"... but leaving you hanging without some sort of response after more than a week when he said he would start in a few days is just unreasonable. I can understand getting overloaded/whelmed with work.... but more than a couple days?? come on... at least a "I can't get to it for a couple more days yet.. do you still want me to do it for you?" type of reply is in order after a couple days.

Jace

so, you are basically saying that you didn't flake because I have a lot of posts?

go back to flaking on people, it seems to be what you are best at lately

hurry up and get that phone back on broke bitch, and I will sit here with my 3 cellphones and 4 computers, all functional....LOL

maybe if you didn't flake on people you would actually have money for bills

tony286

I dont understand I do editing jobs for others, we agree on a date. I get blogged down , I contact them explain the situation. I always get the same answer that's fine man thanks for keeping me posted. You will find people are much more patient when not left in the dark and in the age of email there is no excuse not to keep a client posted.

Jace

if he had replied, "sorry, can't do it" I would have moved on and been fine....but not even that...so, to me, that is flaking

cheapgallerydesign

What is your point? You have too much on your plate?

If that is the case, don't shovel so much fucking crap onto it. Do you owe this guy money or some shit? If so, pay him fucking back and go your separate ways.

Jace

no money is owed, he is just a flake

Pornwolf

The fact is the most programmers don't have the organizational skills to handle client management.

Usually the gene that handles that kind of stuff isn't found in programmers. Every now and then you will find it but it's rare.

It's especially rare in 21 year olds in general... so combine that with a 21 year old programmer and you got a clusterfuck on your hands.

He's a talented guy though. Good luck with everything.

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SmokeyTheBear

actually to be fair i was defending both of you heh

the main thing in any dilema is "float dates".

when you have hard dates like March 3rd 3:00 pm , its easy to say " you said etc etc " and it simply wasnt done and i had not heard from you therefor your a flake"

when you have float dates its alot more fuzzy . maybe he didnt realise it was needed now etc etc. alot of wiggle room. wiggle room most programmers use to their advantage heh.

i feel for both of you because you expected progress , he didnt have any nor a response.

I try to keep people i work with well informed if its a float date that its exactly that a float date not a hard date. you have to look at it from both perspective. I have done work for people on the quick then had them flake then your left with 6 hours of work you dont get paid for..

my best advice is . get a recomendation #1
#2 set hard dates if you need them
#3 if you expect hard dates you will likely have to put a deposit
#4 even if you cant get a hard date GIVE a deposit , this locks them in and usually helps speed the process up.

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hatisblack at yahoo.com

uno

Sounds like a normal programmer to me.

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Blue Player

If someone is working for me and I send an email or ICQ and they dont respond I swear I start buying plane tickets and planning a trip to their house.

I always make sure I have their mobile and home number or no go. I want to see progress and spek to them atleast twice a day. I dont care if people say I am demanding if they think that way they can fuck off.

Redmanthatcould

From all that was said, I can't really say if there IS a right or wrong in this case.

Was a date set? Was a price set? Other than speaking for an hour (I'm guessing ICQ?), was there any official quote/proposal sent and accepted via email/fax?

If you were friends, or have worked together in the past, I'd say it would be "reasonable to assume" that he would get started on the project, but from the demeanor in your posts back-and-forth, I don't think that is the case. Even if it were the case, and you were friends and/or past business associates, I would still only feel a sense of security with something more tangible than an ICQ log, or a phone call (since it wasn't specified how you two spoke).

Without anything concrete, agreed upon for X amount of dollars at Y time, I would say at best a "favor" was discussed. From the information available in the thread, nothing legally/contractually-binding was discussed, so my expectations would be low to see a finished project.

Example:

When I ran a computer store, we would accrue a fair amount of electronic waste (CRTs, motherboards with blown caps, dead HDDs, etc etc), and it would just pile up in our storage area. The store manager before me didn't really have a regular way to handle it, so I had to find a solution.

I found a place that would palletize it for us, and take it away, free-of-charge. Sure they made a profit on it by recycling or reselling, but I was only interested in getting rid of it. Even with this service, being free and all, I still had to fill out a pretty lengthy form, fax it to them, and have it faxed back to me (with their representative's signature and company information). On the sheet, there was a time/date and a procedure outlined, for how the waste would be picked up.

Do I *feel* that he flaked? Do I *feel* that you are being unreasonable? Maybe... maybe not... but feelings are not applicable in the business world. Why? 'Cause stuff like this is BOUND to happen. If the expectation is professional work, then that should be indicative of how it is being sought after as well. Not taking sides here, just giving my objective, Switzerland-esque take on the matter.

borked

Jace - You,re coming here to moan and gripe, and this OP shows it. You discussed the project with the programmer and according to this post, nothing was finalised - no deadlines, no money exchanged, just a verbal start date. Now I'm not advocating flaking, but there are two side to every story. Maybe his current job that needed finishing required extra work, maybe it evolved to more work, maybe something else more lucrative came up. You know, everyone works to make money...

If a down payment was made, that's a different story. But outside of written contracts or money chaning hands, chalk it down to normal business life - thought you being a greeny and all, you'd know that by now. Programmers live by the same ethos as the rest of the business world.

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(consider figuring out the email as test #1)

borked

Thank god I don't work for you!

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For coding work - hit me up on andy // borkedcoder // com
(consider figuring out the email as test #1)

GAMEFINEST

work 1st ..pay later

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Compound interest.

acctman

independant programmers are very flakey i've gone through 9 different programmers and no, i wasn't being cheap. Average programmer was getting paid 40-65/hr yet they still flaked. They'll start out excellent for about 1-2wks then disappear. I heard every family related excuse in the book. It's better to go with a company like bluewire they always meet deadlines.

calmlikeabomb

I'm in college I charge $15 per hour.

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subarus.

Brujah

That's your problem. You're too cheap. Raise your rates appropriately to your skill level, and you'll probably appreciate the jobs you're given too because you'll feel you're getting paid what you're worth.

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Shoplifter

You only waited a week? I've been waiting 10 days now on another GFY member. Sigh.