Tempest

"Bitter"... no.. but the whole "... cling to guns or religion... "... that's most of the US he basically slammed..

tony286

its true what he said, your job was sent offshore, your losing your house and the cc companies raise your rate from 12 to 25 just because they feel like it. Those people arent bitter thats funny.
He responded
https://youtube.com/watch?v=Sc9PepjyDow&feature=user

GrouchyAdmin

...and all of Canada are drunk moosefuckers. Wheee, stereotypical accusations are fun.

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Tempest

Doesn't matter... what he said about losing jobs and being bitter isn't going to be the issue.. The issue is that his statement trivializes their religious and gun ownership beliefs... This is now the 2nd or 3rd item now that the republicans will play over and over again and will lose him major votes in areas that take gun ownership and religion serviously... The truth doesn't matter.. Facts don't matter.. All that matters is whether or not you can win the election...

Tempest

You mean the US isn't the most armed country on earth?? Wasn't Bush basically put into office by the religious right, the "base" of the current republican party?

Doctor Dre

What an awesome speaker this guy is

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GrouchyAdmin

Can I travel back to 1950 with you and get gas for like thirty cents a gallon? That'd be awesome.

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JFK

Thanks for that, hit the nail right on da head
The truth doesn't matter.. Facts don't matter.. All that matters is whether or not you can win the election...[/QUOTE]

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Tempest

Bush wasn't voted in as president in the 50s.. and the data I read about the US being the most armed country in the world was recent data as well.

GrouchyAdmin

Your accusations and supporting "facts" are incredibly out of date. The US has been the most armed country since, oh, let's say the 1940s when we developed the bomb, and Bush is too awful at PR to have been voted in during the 1950s. We were still about charisma; Clinton ruined that. You're still a bit far off, but, hey, if you wanna believe that religion is the reason Bush is in power, it's evident that your schooling system is no better than ours.

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tony286

i thought the swiss have the most guns per citizen.

Tempest

You're killing me... I'm not talking about the military.. I'm talking about individual gun ownership.. The US is the most armed country in the world...

Do you even follow politics in your own country? The base of the republicans for Bush was the religious right and they were the ones that were "energized" to vote him into office. While true that the end result is questionable, it's still a fact that they're the ones that propelled him to have the votes that he needed..

Tempest

http://www.reuters.com/article/topNe...rpc=22&sp=true

But stats can be twisted however one wants to make the point they want.

notoldschool

I cant wait to see how they cheat Obama out of this one. Its going to be fucking entertaining to say the least.

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kane

I guess this is a case where two people can watch the same thing and form two different opinions on it. I didn't see it as trivializing their beliefs but more a statement that people don't vote for candidates based on economic ideals because they feel like it doesn't matter who they vote for when it comes to the economy because they won't do anything good for them so they end up voting for things they feel can impact them which is guns and religion. I didn't see it as him talking down to anyone.

tony286

I agree and think your right but the media is spinning this so hard. I love a bunch of rich people from the pundits to Hilary to mccain calling obama a elitist . lol

pocketkangaroo

I don't think he was trivilializing it at all. He was saying that people don't vote based on economic issues because they feel the government won't do shit. That they put their energy into some fringe social issues because they know the corrupt government won't change anything.

tony286

They are spinning that he is bad mouthing America and looking his nose down on them and on god and guns.its making me want to throw up and all the channels are doing it.

kane

True. you know they will be floating around clips where he just says, "you only vote on guns and religion," and attempt to make it seem like he said something bad.

The reality is that the guy hasn't been around that long so there isn't that much dirt and both McCain and Clinton are desperate to find anything that they can on him.

pocketkangaroo

Unfortunately a large percentage of our country is the God and guns crowd. People like that are the reason we still have trouble teaching basic biology in our school systems.

Tempest

I listened to it from the standpoint of how the opposition will use it to defeat him which is the only thing that matters. The last 10 years has proven that the the masses will buy anything they're fed and will believe anything regardless of the facts or the truth.. the Republicans are skilled at playing to the public's biases and prejudices.. The Democrats are rarely able to use common sense to explain things to the masses... The Republicans figured out awhile ago that the only thing that matters is winning.. The Democrats and the "idealist" portion of society that tends to vote Democrat hasn't figured that part out yet.

I'd love to see Obama win and actually make real changes.. But I really don't see either one happening... Even if he does happen to pull it off and win, his presidency just won't get much done.. He hasn't gotten much done prior to it and because of the history making aspect of his presidency he's going spend a lot of time on photo ops etc.

What's sort of "sad" is that Hillary is slammed for doing "anything to win" and yet that's exactly what's needed.. Not just to win the election in November, but also to lead and change the country.

Look at it this way.. By his statement "I" believe he doesn't respect our bitterness or our religious or gun toting beliefs... Now convince me I'm wrong in 20 seconds.. Cause that's what it's going to come down to come election time.

Bill8

Like the white south was gonna vote for him in the first place.

GrouchyAdmin

No matter how you wrap up bigotry to support your views, it's still bigotry. Creationists and people who want to protect themselves may have a place in a Venh diagram, but it's hardly inclusive of either side. Stop making yourself look like an idiot.

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Pleasurepays

"everyone wants Capitalism when they think it works and Socialism when they think it doesn't"

1) credit card companies dont just arbitrarily raise rates (double them) "just because they feel like it" .... only a moron would make a remark like that to make a point about broader economic issues.

2) jobs offshore? its a global economy. adapt or die. you can't subsidize buggy whips just because you are losing to cars. the choice is to remain competitive or lose. end of story.

3) losing their houses? really? did something happen that they didn't agree to in a massively long contract and process that takes days to go through?

God forbid the United States of America look to free markets and the ingenuity of people to solve problems.... and please... please... lets not hold individuals accountable for buying homes they couldn't afford and the fact that no one feels they can live without absurd amounts of debt.

Tempest

In Texas...
Hillary: 1,459,814
Obama: 1,358,785

A lot of the southern states were quite close like that...

Snake Doctor

It's not as if those people were going to vote for Obama (or any democrat) anyways.

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Snake Doctor

Yeah in a democratic primary.

The people he just offended (supposedly) aren't going to vote for Hillary in November either. The Dems don't have a prayer in Texas and most southern states.

Southern states with large black populations might be close if Obama is the nominee, but by and large the dems lost the south when they passed the civil rights act in 1965, and that's not going to change for at least one more generation.

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tony286

http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/FinancialS...=129664&page=1
http://www.creditbloggers.com/2008/0...aack-bank.html

Tempest

Do you EVER follow thru with what you say you're going to do? At one point you said you'd never come back to GFY because of something that happened here.. but you came back... Just a couple weeks back you said you wouldn't take part in these Obama discussions anymore.. And yet here you are.. You're worse than a woman..

Pleasurepays

Here's an idea. read the contract you sign. think about it and what it means more than you are thinking about how you can spend money that isn't yours and that you didn't earn.



be responsible.

don't be in debt.

don't take out loans you can't pay back.

accept responsibility for the debts you have...

stop looking to government to be your keeper.

stop looking to government to parent your children.

stop looking to government for everything.




this country has became a nation of helpless, crybaby pussies.. and while assholes refuse to accept responsibility for the decisions they make... the people that have their shit together pay the lions share of taxes to support their irresponsible behavior.

whats worse than that, is you have a black nazi telling everyone what they want to hear, that government will take care of them, that life's just not fair, that they don't have to be responsible for their actions and decisions and he's become a rock star for it.

the fucking democratic party lost 2 elections just because they couldn't put forward an electable candidate... now we have a communist idiot turned rock star and a vile, pathalogical lying cunt who both want to tax people into oblivion on one side and a wishy washy idiot on the other side whose only claim to fame is getting shot down in vietnam, getting sent to a prison camp and being a republican that acts like a democrat.




i've given up.

seriously.

the rest of the world is right about this country and the direction its headed.

its over.

i've accepted it.

i'm moving back out of the country.


what a shame. an economic and military powerhouse - turned into a broke, unpopular nation of helpless, whiny pussies with bad attitudes about the rest of the world.

being a leader used to be about communicating a vision for the future. now its about a mad race of telling helpless idiots that their new caretaker is Washington D.C. and how the evil rich guy who actually busted his ass to build something is going to pay for it all.

fuck that.

Tempest

I think it's deeper than that... People just don't actually understand the ramifications of either and so will pick the one that they beleive will give them what they want in the short term... Capitalism and the free market have proven themselves to NOT be in the best interest of a country and it's citizens in the long run.. The recent FAA issue is just one more example of one of the many results. i.e. the free market puts preasure on the airlines to lower their prices more and more which results in poorer maintence, pay-offs etc. Capitalism and the free market are like locusts and it will move elsewhere when it's finished devouring all it can.. But people also don't want governement controlling everything which would be a hardcore form of Socialism... People want their own home, couple cars, 9 to 5, health car that won't make them lose everything if they get really sick.. a "good" life"... Neither Capitalism nor Socialism will give them what they really want in the long run.. There needs to be something different that's a balance between the two.

Pleasurepays

FAA has nothing to do with putting pressure on airlines for anything other than safety. the airline industry has always been full of turds for the very reasons i am talking about... when things get tough... the federal government steps in and gives them billions of dollars. AND they do it while at the same time, airlines like Southwest become the most successful and most profitable in history.

this country wasn't built on socialism... it was built on the principles of a free market economy.

i kinda agree with you in that people have unrealistic expectations... that with success comes risk... with risk comes losses etc. i understand that people are incapable of thinking about "the good of the whole" vs "the good of me and my shiny new wheels" and thats a problem that will never go away.

my issue in all of this is the constant reinforcement of the idea that the individual is never anything but a victim and government is there to pick up the pieces for them. i am tired of the constant pandering to these people. people in this country these days go through life like a 1/2 retarded 10 year old.

kane

I agree with a lot of what you have said here but I think you are off on one point.

First, The major flaw with that is that most of the places that our jobs are moving to we can't compete with. American's can't live in our economy on $2 a day. So what does that mean? Well, it means we have to get other types of jobs, the problem is the job market is shrinking fast.

The middle class in America was built on manufacturing jobs. These were jobs that anyone with a high school diploma could get, work for several years and start making enough money to buy a house, have a few kids and live a decent middle class life. Those jobs are now going offshore. Why pay some dude $20 an hour when you can pay some guy in a third world country .50 cents an hour and you don't have to pay him overtime, give him benefits or provide a safe work environment? This leaves all these people that build their lives around these manufacturing jobs to adapt or die. They basically have two options. They can get another job which most likely will be paying them less or they can go back to school and learn to do something else. I guess they could get into a company and try to work their way up too.

I saw the other day on the news that most of the new jobs being created in the US are in the service and retail industry. They said the reason for this is that 70% of our economy is now based on consumer spending. We don't make anything to sell to other people/countries anymore, we make most of our money because our people spend their money on a bunch of shit they don't need. When they stop doing that we are in trouble. Since these are the only industries that are booming (meaning sales/retail and service waiters, gardener etc) most of the new jobs are in those lower paying worlds. Even many of our higher paying tech jobs are going out of the country. Big companies are moving offshore where labor, even very skilled labor, is very cheap. Without some kind of help it will be harder and harder to keep good paying jobs in this country. It isn't impossible, it is just getting harder and harder.

I agree that people should work to remain competitive, but our economy is changing and with the globalization of the labor force it is getting harder and harder for our workers to get jobs where they make a good living. Remaining competitive is one thing, but you can't compete against certain things. I don't look to the government to subsidize insdustries and just give them money to stay here, but maybe they should stop giving money to them when they move their jobs offshore and maybe they should help (in the form of tariffs or some kind of taxes) those that are staying here. Make it a little harder for companies to build a product offshore then sell it here. If you have ever been a third world shithole country something you will notice is that most of the people there make their living by either selling stuff to each other or by providing services to each other. With nothing being exported they have no outside money coming in so they just keep passing the same money back and forth. I fear we are quickly heading that way and the phrase will no longer be adapt or die, but just die.

sorry for the long post

pocketkangaroo

I don't think it's bigotry at all. I have no problem with anyone who believes in God(s). I have a problem when anyone starts trying to teach bullshit (Creationism) to our kids. Or when they stop the education of basic human sexuality (birth control, etc).

They are free to teach their kids that dinosaurs never existed. But don't go pushing that shit on my kids.

pocketkangaroo

The biggest whining pussies in the country are on Wall Street. They're the ones that have cried to the Fed for months begging for more money after they made bad mistakes. They're the ones who begged for bailouts and got them.

$30 billion to Bear Stearns. Billions more to broke investment firms who are giving us crap securities as collateral.

I agree with everything you say about people being responsible for their mortgages and everything they sign. I think they should deal with the consequences of their poor decisions. But the only ones in this country who are whining and getting bailed out are the folks on Wall Street. Not the middle class home owners.

baddog

You are an idiot. Besides that, he never had the South.

xmas13

Wait a sec, African Americans don't have churches, guns and are not bitter?

Oooooppssssss.

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cykoe6

I am not sure why anyone is surprised. It has been obvious for some time that Obama is a left-wing, Ivy League elitist who firmly believes the unwashed masses would joyfully embrace socialism if they only understood their own best interests. Pretty much a typical Democrat.

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tony286

When people call him a elitist for telling the truth I think thats funny and its more funny when his two opponents call him that and they are both richer than him by alot. lol

selena

Agreed.

I know it's probably just another politican, but something when he talks makes you think that he's not another politican. I can't really explain it, but somehow he conveys hope and change.

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Bill8

All this rhetoric is same old shit red/blue divide.

It means nothing.

We'll see what happens in november. That's when it fuckin' counts.

pornguy

He to, like all the rest, will talk shit to get the vote, and then do ONLY what makes him the most money!

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ronbotx

Obviously he thinks like most Liberals. If you believe in God, think that self defense and the second amendment is a fundamental right, and have the audacity to oppose amnesty for illegals, you must be stupid....

I'm glad his true feelings do show from time to time despite his attempts to hide them.

Robbie

I live in the south. And contrary to the crap the media wants people to believe, I find that the northern states are much more racist. The blacks and whites are separated into "neighborhoods" and they all seem to hate each other. Down here it's just not like that. I have a black neighbor across the street along with several mexican families on the same block. I go to clubs with black and white people. The only time I hear the "n" word is when one black guy is talking to another black guy.
Yeah, my grandparents were pretty racist. But overall the south is far more "black" both in terms of population and race relations than the northern states. Hell, I was up in New York a few months ago...now THAT is a racist city. I love the city , but the blacks and whites there hate each others guts. I was shocked. It was the same way when I was up in Detroit. The same in Washington, DC and Ocean City, Maryland as well.
I think the "white" south is a vastly exaggerated myth. Just my opinion from living down here for 46 years from Fla., Georgia, SC, Alabama, NC, Tenn., and Kentucky.
And I have spent a good amount of time in Miss. and Louisianna too. Blacks and whites live together down here pretty much in harmony. Hell, just go to downtown Atlanta anytime. If you're white you are the MINORITY there.

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pocketkangaroo

The biggest social program we have is the military. But most Republicans only think its socialism if it's something they don't support. Military, border control, farm subsidization must not count as socialism in your world.

Bill8

I got no problem with the claim that the northern states are more racist, or just as racist.

I wasn't really talking about that.

I'm saying mosty of the states that voted red last time will vote red this time too.

Robbie

I assumed you were saying that the southern states wouldn't vote for Obama because of race when you said "the white south" I guess using the word "white" if it wasn't about race is what threw me off. And I'm not so sure about whether the states that voted republican last time will do so again. They may. But everyone that I speak to where I live are all ready for a big change. Don't forget that the south was pure Democrat up until Ronald Reagan came along. Dixie used to be Democrat country. And it still has been as far as local elections were concerned. I think that in the 1980's when the Democratic Party became more of an alliance of interest groups like gay rights and feminism is when the older formerly Democrat voters turned to the Republicans in national elections.
But now that a new generation is taking their place, that is starting to change. Whether or not it will happen in this election I don't know. But if there was ever an election that could change the South's vote in national elections, this might be the one.
Just my opinion. And I could be way off base. I'm just commenting from my own observations in this region. Which is probably a lot more accurate than the national news reporters sitting in New York reading a script off of a monitor.

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kane

What you say is exactly why I think Obama could win some southern states against McCain. The conservative Christian right doesn't really like McCain and there is a strong chance they wouldn't support him if her were up against Obama (or at least not support him in big numbers) if you factor that lack of support in with the fact that a lot of black people haven't voted in the past, but might not vote for Obama it could take a couple of the states that were close in the last election, but went to the republicans and move them over to Obama.

DirtyProfits

Watch some Obama videos. Click my sig

slapass

The biggest issue is that whites vote and blacks don't. I am talking stats not trying to create issues. If minorities and young people voted and supported a candidate they would win. Wee are ruled by older white conservatives because that is who votes. Clinton got in by walking down the middle of the road and energizing some youth. Hilary is way to liberal to do the same thing and Obama might be able to pull it off.