chapecito

How much on average is Dickman's charging for a regular tour site? what about other quality designers? prices went up right for designers?

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JD

dickmans is in the several thousand range per site

chapecito

mnn Do his clients Actually pay that? or is it like Boeing or Airbus. where they advertise their airplanes as 100 millon but airlines actually pay much less than that?

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TMM_John

I must say Dickman's did a fantastic job on our new site: www.toomuchmedia.com

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Ozarkz

I remeber the old site. This new one is very nice! Imagine if Dickman's redesigned the Frontend of all your Software?

Zuzana Designs

WOW they did do a good job.. The site looks great !!

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Porn Producer

how much did it set you back?

CaptainHowdy

Ask them directly ??

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DamageX

Not to knock down on Dickman's, but I'd say more than half the price is for the "hype". Especially when you can get similar (or better) results conversion-wise from people charging way less.

Same goes for AdultDesign and a few other ones who "don't post on boards" because they have too much to do.

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Verbal

Given how typically flaky designers are, there is something to be said about knowing the job is going to get done right.

Ace_luffy

nice work!!!

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tranza

They have some great stuff!

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jay23

I think they charged $55/Hr for a project i worked on but thats 3 years ago.

chapecito

I bet that if i asked how much did averyone payed for their car.. i would have tons of replies with the exact price.. and even how much they paid for gas.. but for some reason.. its almost impossible to get people to tell how much they paid for everything else

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chapecito

jay23.. and how many hours did it take to make a site at that rate?

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Cyndalie

Dickmans is the best for corporate sites.
But for surfer sites you could find just as good quality for much less.

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czarina

I like to think of Myself as a Quality Designer. I am for sure one of the few around here that when you HIRE ME, I AM THE ONE that does the design. I dont hand it over to someone else..

My prices have stayed the same.

If you would like to contact me, you can send me a mail at info at wedesig.net my adult site is www.wedesig.net

sexxxydesign.com

dead today

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Doctor Dre

Design work is artistic non tangible work... effort and results varries a lot

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F-U-Jimmy

You have done some nice work

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devine

I was thinking the same. They're simply amazing, but their adult tours are usually between those that convert worse as opposed to simpler designs that convert way better. Now, if you have the money and you need an aff program or mainstream design, they're second to none

Kiwigirl

Depending on what you are looking for in a design will reflect in price. I have several very talented designers capable of fantastic work and the pricing can range from $400 for a simple design up wards from there. If you have more questions please feel free to hit me up on ICQ or email to further discuss.

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devine

as many professional firms, they quote you per project, and the quotes include design, programming, flash and so on, so even tho yo may see sites designed by then that look similar, they might cost very different due to the work in the background. Since I don't own the sites, I won't mention names, but I know they charged 2500 for a (really good looking) paysite and 5000+ for an affiliate program. Then again, it all depends on the work they have done on it. ie, I'm just looking at their XBiz banner as I write this and it's 1000x times better than any other banner I had seen in this board. If I don't remember wrong, they charge around 400 for that. You may say '$400 for a banner?' but the results are outstanding. And if you have the money... who cares.

JamesK

Yep, this thread doesn't make much sense.

Every designer has different pricing and even when it's the same designer it varies, as the small details affect the final price. Not to mention you can pay per project, per hour etc

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czarina

Thank you so much.. I try to do the very best that I can and thats one of the reasons that most of my clients return, and why you dont see me on the boards that much.. But I will be expanding soon. Thinking about getting a Customer Service rep.

fris

paysite prob 3500+ range maybe more

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seeric

You get what you pay for.

Some people want Mercedes engineering

Some want Honda.

Dickman's is worth every penny. I have the conversion ratios to prove it.

Different designers for different purposes. Gallery designers, Banner Designers, Tour Designers. Print Designers. I have diff designers for diff tasks.

Deej

Dickman's is awesome!

Generally, a good solid fancy tour will run you around 1k give or take...

thats for people that are capable of making dickman's quality... it could go up or could go down depending on your budget and needs

Thats a generalization... I dont know how much dickman's charges for any of their work...

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Tat2Jr

Bingo, Bingo, Bingo.

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Sosa

dickmans puts out some great designs

theS2O

Checkout my portfolio at www.s2odesigns.com

I do quality sites with low rates.

Thanks,
mv

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Mutt

i used Dickmans once - a one page layout for $2200. pure crap. i tossed it in the garbage.

i will never use a design house again - i want a one on one relationship with the designer himself.

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chapecito

wow 2200 for a one page layout? at least I got someone to understand my post and actually reply with something Usefull !!!

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seeric

Lets see the page.

Mutt

i'll look for it. it's probably on an old external drive - it's 2 years ago now.

not saying Dickmans is crap - i hired them for this because of the great work i'd seen from them, especially for DieselAction. saying i was pretty disappointed in what they did for me.and that's how design houses with many designers working go - you don't know whether the top guy is working on your project or if it's a junior designer working under some supervision.

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chapecito

did you find the site?

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Spunky

They did some awesome work in the past

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chapecito

Nada on this????????

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devine

did you even bother in reading the thread?

Deej

Did you even bother in looking at who made the thread

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Voodoo

Quoted for truth.

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Deej

jesus... epileptic nazi!!!

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HorseShit

lot of good designers rarely get mentioned but dickmans is great

Altwebdesign

bruno dickman is a awesome business man, a lot can be learnt from him!

Bruno

Hi there everyone how are you?

This is an important thread for us. First of all I would like to thank everyone who shared some love, and to the ones that criticized, thanks for the opinions and pls read my replies below and write back. Dialogue is a great source for evolution, very much appreciated.

I've decided to quote many people who replied to this thread because to me it was the most efficient way to address what's being discussed, not leaving any perspectives or relevant inputs. For the ones without patience, sorry, it's a rather long post but I believe it's important to share our thoughts and explain everything in detail!


Chapecito, thanks for starting the thread. We have prices and ballpark figures on our website - www.dickmansdesign.com. Our hourly rate is around $85 at the moment. It depends on the volume of hours negotiated and the type and level of expertise in question. We charge more than that for consulting and motion graphics services, and we would charge less than that for junior tasks such as photo correction. In addition to visiting our site, you can always contact our account managers, Johnny and Pedro. Their icq numbers are 73102174 and 100100989 and their MSN Messengers are [email protected] and [email protected]

Now answering your other question, in my opinion, YES, design prices went up in general, specially because of the devaluation of the dollar against most currencies worldwide. In addition, I believe design is gaining more and more attention and respect. It used to be that ugly duck of the adult industry that people looked down to, but I'm proud to be part of a select group of companies that helped the "adult design field" to be recognized as a very important component of any adult operation.

The work we do for companies in branding, consulting, planning and design helped brands increase in perceived value and the performance orientation we have in our mindset has helped companies make way more money than they would with generic, unspired work.

It's very important to remember that as the adult industry becomes more and more competitive, companies need more than good results - everyone needs the best possible result. In addition, does it make sense to invest 3-8k in a exclusive scene, shoot 50 of those and then NOT invest in something that radically changes the performance and the "marketability" of that content? That's some food for thought.


Thank you very much John! It's an honor have Too Much Media as a client and to see the new identity and the online! I hope to see you in LA @ the XbizConference so we can have a drink, talk more and get everything else you need rolling!

PornProducer, this was a very long project that started with the total make over of the Too Much Media identity. "Long project" means "not cheap". At the same time, the most important question here is "how much more money will TMM be able to make? Not only in adult but in mainstream, with their awesome new identity and with a site that converts and persuades way more than the previous one?"

Another important question is... how much stickier is the new TMM identity?
TMM is a solid company with sensible amounts of marketing budget. They are everywhere: shows, magazines, forums and news sites. The performance of their ads with the new identity is way higher. The values of their brand and desired positioning are very clear now. The cost to be inside the mind of their targets with a clear message went down. This applies not only to Too Much Media but to all of our clients, who are usually large and careful with the growth or maintainance of their brand value.

Thanks a lot hon =)

Hi there DX, how are you buddy?

Sorry to disagree, but our price is definitely not hyped. We are a generously sized company, but very compact, lean and efficient. We have even dropped most of our development jobs, as they were creating more layers that were turning us into a more expensive operation. In the future we plan to drop it completely and only do what we do best: consulting, branding & high end design.

At the same time, we're based in Sao Paulo, Brazil, one of the most expensive cities on the planet, and fortunately abundant with talent and creativity.
The Brazilian design & advertising industries have worldwide recognition and most, if not all of the big ad conglomerates, have operations here. That means we fight with giants such as BBDO, DDB and Ogilvy for talent.
We hire the best, so we have to pay accordingly.

Another factor that made us bump our prices lower, as mentioned above, is the poor performance of the US dollar against the Brazilian Real. Our margins were very short in 2008 and thankfully with the crisis (lol) the dollar value went up a bit and improved our operation.

Now, regarding the conversions, I wouldnt believe that the companies choose and stick with us out of hype. They have smart, ROI conscious decision makers, and are with us because we created what they want, and also what they need. Some companies get fancy sites from us, some get simpler looking sites from us, but all of them are created with performance in mind. Ask our clients. My guess is they would be happy to share the good word.


Thanks for the kind words CynD! Makes my day when I hear we're the best at something.

Now for surfer sites... I really don't think we're expensive.
Some clients like OrgyCash order ellaborate sites for their flagship properties and very simple layouts for their other paysites. They get good results with both, and the rates paid for the simpler layouts are very competitive. It's great when there's trust and creative freedom. We are able to deliver quickly what we believe works for that situation and thus we charge less than we charge on projects that demand intensive labour. We're known for the sites that really are big standouts, because we're one of the few companies making such tours, but we design tons of sites that are not as expensive and unique, but deliver the desired results for that particular situation. ALL of our projects are done with the very same line of thought: we like to say that at Dickmans Passion Meets Performance.


Hi czarina, how are you?
You have some cool work. Keep it up.
Being a one person operation works too. There's the personality thing going, although we're large and do have a strong personality, and your costs are low, thus you're able to charge less per hour. At the same time, you're unable to have the very best expert in each of the facets of the design business. Here we have account managers who know tons about the needs of our clients and are great project managers.. we have planners and information architects who are always thinking about whats next but also about what works... we have concept artists who are creative and add tons of quality and wow effect to our work and we have production guys who are fast and efficient. Everything is done inhouse. The only position that makes sense having outside as we're based in Brazil is copywriting. We work with Stewart AKA Relentless, a passionate, experienced copywriter - in our opinion, the best in adult. (cheers bro!)

Also, we have the scale.
We're able to deliver tons of projects to our large clients, at the pace they need. It's actually never the pace they need! lol They are some very hungry fellas! But we do our best!

Cool stuff that your operation works for you and your clients. Keep up the good work!



Hey devine! As I wrote above, although we're known for fancy tours, we design tons of "down to earth" sites. If you look at the work we do for paperstreetcash to name just one, you'll see it's all a matter of desired positioning. www.oyeloca.com and www.therealworkout.com are great examples. Now, this doesnt mean the other sites dont convert. They are the best tours our clients can get. You must also always take into account that there are multiple factors that define conversions. Content is a HUGE one and as you can imagine, it's out of our control.

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Bruno

Airek, for you, the shortest reply: I LOVE YOU BRO É NÓIS! =)


Bingoooo hehehehe Bro I hope you're loving your new site design as much as I'm loving to see it evolve in here. It's one of the best looking sites of the year for us
Your surfers will love it cheers and thanks for the continued support and friendship!



Mutt, very very sorry to hear this bro. I don't like the site myself to be honest, and as you remember, I was the one talking to you during the design process. Not evading from your words, but sharing my point of view, there's something called "overdirecting" and it can ruin even the best efforts of a reputable company. I have to disagree on your comment about "working with the junior guy". I was dealing with you directly and that page and most revisions were done by Mike Dickman, my partner and Creative Director. Sorry once again to hear about your disappointment, but we got to that point together. This is a VERY rare situation for us. Two years have passed since then, I believe we're more prepared than ever, and you're always welcome to try us again in the future, or choose not to.
Thank you for your business.



Lots of good people everywhere and in every field, cheers to all of them and thanks for the great words bro =)


Thanks a million buddy. It was a pleasure to have that one long conversation that day. I hope it helped you. Cheers and happy new year! Dream big dreams!


----


Thanks to everyone that shared good words about me and Dickmans Design! We love to wake up and do our best everyday! For the ones with critiscism, thanks for spending the time to share it. I certainly read them and will always to whatever I can to minimize eventual flaws. Like with any company we can't be loved by everyone, although we like to try!

Cheers! I hope to see you in LA in a few days @ the XBizConference!

Kind regards,

Bruno Dickman

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Deej

Great reply Bruno!

Replies like that give no wonder to anyone as to what level of quality they are dealing with, both business and product

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LAJ

I'm actually going to make a comment about Bruno's character since much of what I would have said was covered by Air3k and others.

Simply put... I love the guy. He's cheerful, nice, professional and clearly loves what he does.

Add to that the quality of Dickmans design work... then you've got someone worth doing business with.

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Relentless

First off, thanks for the flattering mention Bruno... it means a lot to me.

I have done a lot of text work with Dickmans Design on several different projects in adult and mainstream. If you look at my copywriting site www.EngineFood.com you will see I have also completed extensive text projects independently for many major companies. I've had the honor of writing the text for the Porn.com website, I've written magazine articles for major publications including XBIZ, FubarTimes, Klixxx and others. I have also had the pleasure of working hand-in-hand with some of the industy's best known designers and SEO gurus.

What I can tell you comes from direct firsthand knowledge. Nobody in the entire adult industry cares more deeply about the success of their clients than Dickmans Design. They scrutinize every pixel, every word, every punctuation mark and every meta tag with a true passion for perfection. Their designs are inspired, and working with them is truly inspiring. It's about trying to create perfection.

If you have an idea and want help expressing it to the world, Dickmans Design gets my highest recommendation. They are not cheap and they do not try to be cheap. However, ask yourself... do you want someone who is trying to be cheap working on your dream project... or do you want someone who is trying to make your brand the absolute best?

There are many good designers out there. I know. I have worked with many of them. I am not saying Dickmans is the only competent design firm. I am saying, if you spend money on a site with Dickmans.... it isn't being wasted, it's not about the hype... you get the maximum effort and enthusiasm of a world class design firm poured into your brand.

The results speak for themselves.

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Mutt

Well Bruno - you're half right half wrong about the 'overdirecting', - I originally gave you certain design elements, the logo itself and one design element and basically told you to create some magic. The first rough concept you showed me I liked - in general, the colors and style. At that point I should have been more direct and told you that there was a flaw in it that would never be overcome - but I wanted to see it more fleshed out to be sure. The 'fleshing out' of the concept just made it worse. The reason I began to 'over direct' is that what I was getting from you after the original first draft which i thought was pretty good was pretty blah - so I gave u suggestions to see if it would add something to the design.

I wish designers would actually use rough pencil and paper sketches - I don't need to see a completely rendered design to see if something is going to work out or not. because I know you have a business to run and can't spend unlimited hours per project.

It's true, I can be a control freak when it comes to design - but only when I can see that things aren't working out well and things weren't coming together well on this one.

oh well - as I said, Dickmans does some amazing work - i only said what was true for me. The overdirection has *some* validity.

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