LCN / LiveCam Network / 2Much.net ***WARNING*** - Page 3 - GoFuckYourself.com

VIXEN ESCORTS · 11-21-2009, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

Hi again.

Why is this a BS reply? All I am saying that we currently host everything on our own servers, and may in the future, allow customers to host it on theirs. How is this a BS reply?

LOL I can read people like no other, including their text, and the speed of your response just validates it

2MuchMark · 11-21-2009, 07:50 PM

The speed of my response is become I'm sitting here working on a Saturday night and refreshing this thread about once a minute or so because I can see that you're online too.

So again, why is this a BS response? All I am saying is that at the time, it was expensive for us to support clients who were hosted on other servers.

For example: If a customer would complain about poor speed, we could log in to check things out. If the problem was with our software, then we could fix it of course as per our service level agreement. However if the problem was due to a slow server, congested router, or other things at the operating system level for example, we had to ask our customer to call his hosting provider for support as some things were simply not fixable by us, or were beyond the scope of our service agreement with our customers (and instead were under the agreement of that hosting company). Many customers did not like this, or understand why we would only support our software and nothing else.

Our current system has dependencies such as Redhat Enterprise 5x, MySQL, and Wowsa. If our customers wanted to host this with their own ISP's, they would also be responsible for the licensing which that hosting provider may charge them for (or perhaps they would have to buy direct). This by itself may may it more complex for some customers (especially newbies) to manage.

I hope this better answers your question.

VIXEN ESCORTS · 11-21-2009, 07:54 PM

"This by itself may may it more complex for some customers (especially newbies) to manage"

ooh bitchy, you didn't answer my question about US$ or CN$

2MuchMark · 11-21-2009, 08:05 PM

Sorry, I didn't think I was being bitchy. (In fact, I'm in a great mood! This thread has generated lots of new contacts lately..)

Alot of us here have servers all over the place and are used to managing them via Cpanel, Telnet, whatever. "Newbies" can be new to adult, and can also be new to this as well.

When a customer is trying to run his website, the only thing he should be concentrating on, is that. Hosting, Operating Envrionments, server dependencies, routers etc, should not be his concern.

By hosting our customer's licenses for them, we make ourselves 100% responsible for our software AND the quality of service. We own all of our own servers and do all of the maintenance on them. So as an example, if a client calls to complain about an issue, we can fix it regardless of whether or not its a software bug, or a server / hosting / switching / routing issue. This guarantees all problems are fixed very quickly, without the customer having to call multiple providers.

2MuchMark · 11-21-2009, 08:05 PM

And sorry I missed your question earlier. We charge in US Dollars. We also payout in US Dollars.

2MuchMark · 11-21-2009, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

look at the current video system at www.livecamnetwork.com if anyone's live at this moment. Click on the Free Chat button for the model that's live. Now tell me if the video chat client looks even remotely close to on any other cam site in terms of video quality...
...This was totally not the case when I first bought their license, it used to look better than most cam sites, and I would say the video was much more superior.

PornSiteNewbie, the quality of the video is only as good as its source. A girl using a good quality camera and fast computer will produce a better image like we say in the screenshot below:

The amount of Light also makes a big difference. Ivy has lot of light in her room.

A girl using a little webcam with a small iris and slower computer will upload poorer quality video, such as the girl in this screenshot:

Hints, tips and tricks on how to improve image quality Leon is on our website, on our forum, and shown to all of the girls we hire. It is not rocket science. Any photographer will tell you that good light is essential. Anyone working in digital video will tell you that bandwidth and speed is essential (and selectable with our software). Ivy's video is better because her camera is better and she selected "Wide Screen" mode + High Bitrate. It is very simple.

will76 · 11-21-2009, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

Well, really there were 2 reasons I bought their license, one was being able to have instant models on my site when I first start out without any models. If I didn't have that essential component, how could I ever recruit models? No model wants to work for a site with no models or be a first guinea pig. The second reason was at the time, Mark did have a pretty impressive video chat client, which had video and audio quality that I haven't seen anywhere else. Both of those 2 factors made me buy his license. As for why I didn't question him only having a couple of models live on his site at the time is he told me on the phone, that there are a lot more models on his network, and all I would have to do is enable them for my site. I figured with a great video chat system, I could stand apart from the rest.

Well, look at the current video system at www.livecamnetwork.com if anyone's live at this moment. Click on the Free Chat button for the model that's live. Now tell me if the video chat client looks even remotely close to on any other cam site in terms of video quality, and the layout of the client itself. To me, it looks totally amateur, with no links anywhere on the chat page to go back, see other models live (lol), go back to the previous page, etc.. This was totally not the case when I first bought their license, it used to look better than most cam sites, and I would say the video was much more superior. I was not asked if I wanted this "upgrade" from the previous system, or given any choice whatsoever. I had to take what I was given, no questions asked. When I brought up the fact that I didn't like how the new chat client looked, or that the video was much worse, I was brushed off saying that it's much better (yeah right)! So the main reason I feel cheated is because I got neither of the 2 things that I paid for, and this was the main reason I decided to leave. The other reasons I already mentioned earlier in this thread, so I won't repeat them again. The funny thing is, I would have left as quietly as PastorSinAlot, and just admitted defeat, if Mark didn't try to recruit my models and hold over $10,000 of my money. It would have been that easy for Mark to keep doing business as usual to the next newbie that came along.

So you admit you should have checked to see "HOW MANY" girls where on the network to make sure it meet what you thought was a good enough amount, but you didn't. So basically you saying you failed because they upgraded the video software and you didn't think it was as nice as the previous version. Not due to the fact you didn't have much traffic, that you had tons of fraud and was having to get your own merchant account, couldn't recruit your own chathost etc... you failed using their product because you didn't think the software was as nice as the previous version....

Mark even explained how you could adjust the video settings, but it was limited to the chathost's internet connection. Jesus I know more about their system than you do and I never been to their site before reading this thread.

will76 · 11-21-2009, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

Hi Will76,

In the past we used to allow our customers to host it on any servers they wanted to, but it was a technical support nightmare, and "passing the buck" when a problem was found to be outside of our scope of control was never appreciated either.

In 2004 we decided that this was simply too expensive and decided to do all of our own hosting for our clients. This saved alot of money and created new revenue for us as well.

We have no plans to change this in the near future, however the topic comes up once in a while. Never say never.

Mark, I read that the first time you posted it. So you wouldn't even consider it if the server was located with your servers, had the same OS, everything set up the same exact way as if it was on your server, and an understanding that "fixes" would be billed at "x" amount per hour. That would fix all of your previous issues such as the clients BW being bad, different OS, etc... It would be identical to one of your own servers, colocated next to your servers.

The other part of the question was, if you still wouldn't do what I mentioned above will you put a copy of the code in a trusted 3rd party's hands, or some where that your clients could get access to it to keep their business going if something was to happen to your company. I think NATS does something like this.

If I can't own it, or at least be assured that I could get my hands on it if something happened to you, then I (personally) wouldn't want to pay a decent amount of money to take a risk on what happens to you in the future.

you never know, if the Crips move up to Canada, traffic might send them after you too.

will76 · 11-21-2009, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

The speed of my response is become I'm sitting here working on a Saturday night and refreshing this thread about once a minute or so because I can see that you're online too.

So again, why is this a BS response? All I am saying is that at the time, it was expensive for us to support clients who were hosted on other servers.

For example: If a customer would complain about poor speed, we could log in to check things out. If the problem was with our software, then we could fix it of course as per our service level agreement. However if the problem was due to a slow server, congested router, or other things at the operating system level for example, we had to ask our customer to call his hosting provider for support as some things were simply not fixable by us, or were beyond the scope of our service agreement with our customers (and instead were under the agreement of that hosting company). Many customers did not like this, or understand why we would only support our software and nothing else.

Our current system has dependencies such as Redhat Enterprise 5x, MySQL, and Wowsa. If our customers wanted to host this with their own ISP's, they would also be responsible for the licensing which that hosting provider may charge them for (or perhaps they would have to buy direct). This by itself may may it more complex for some customers (especially newbies) to manage.

I hope this better answers your question.

If my server was located right next to your server, and all of the dependencies were the same, OS the same, the server had the hardware as good or as better as the ones you use, there would be no bw issues since it was on the same network, the only wild card would be if the client broke something. If they did you bill them per hour to fix it, there would be no other way to pass the buck.

I'm not harping on this to bust your balls, but if you offered an option like this I would be interested in finding out more.

XMerchant · 11-21-2009, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by will76

So you admit you should have checked to see "HOW MANY" girls where on the network to make sure it meet what you thought was a good enough amount, but you didn't. So basically you saying you failed because they upgraded the video software and you didn't think it was as nice as the previous version. Not due to the fact you didn't have much traffic, that you had tons of fraud and was having to get your own merchant account, couldn't recruit your own chathost etc... you failed using their product because you didn't think the software was as nice as the previous version....

Mark even explained how you could adjust the video settings, but it was limited to the chathost's internet connection. Jesus I know more about their system than you do and I never been to their site before reading this thread.

No, what I am saying is that once Mark had my money, and the money of all his other customers whom I've yet to even see, he could care less about doing anything but making his own site better. He did absolutely nothing to try to improve his model network by getting more models online during the time I was there, and he actually made the video product much worse. The video and color quality is nowhere near what they used to be, fine print or not. Look at how ugly and amateur that chat client looks, Will? Have you ever seen anything that bad on any other cam site? It looks like it's still in beta testing if not alpha. I failed because I was lied to and stuck with a system that only benefitted it's owner, noone else! Especially for the amount of money I paid. Ever hear of bait and switch, Will? I would say more than 60% of my business wasn't from my own site, it was from recruiting models for Mark's network which I believed had actual sites besides his. Remember, these were all factors I was considering before signing up, so chargebacks of $400 had absolutely nothing to do with me wanting to leave. As for traffic, I had more traffic than Mark, just less regular customers who wouldn't stay once they saw my empty site. Will, ask yourself this question as a webcam consultant of 10+ years, knowing what you learned here about LCN, would you recommend them to anyone? Come on, please be honest...

will76 · 11-21-2009, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

No, what I am saying is that once Mark had my money, and the money of all his other customers whom I've yet to even see, he could care less about doing anything but making his own site better. He did absolutely nothing to try to improve his model network by getting more models online during the time I was there, and he actually made the video product much worse. The video and color quality is nowhere near what they used to be, fine print or not. Look at how ugly and amateur that chat client looks, Will? Have you ever seen anything that bad on any other cam site? It looks like it's still in beta testing if not alpha. I failed because I was lied to and stuck with a system that only benefitted it's owner, noone else! Especially for the amount of money I paid. Ever hear of bait and switch, Will? I would say more than 60% of my business wasn't from my own site, it was from recruiting models for Mark's network which I believed had actual sites besides his. Remember, these were all factors I was considering before signing up, so chargebacks of $400 had absolutely nothing to do with me wanting to leave. As for traffic, I had more traffic than Mark, just less regular customers who wouldn't stay once they saw my empty site. Will, ask yourself this question as a webcam consultant of 10+ years, knowing what you learned here about LCN, would you recommend them to anyone? Come on, please be honest...

I don't agree with the vast majority of what you posted here and I can tell you this much if you consulted with me prior to getting set up with 2much you very likely wouldn't be in the situation you are now. While I couldn't help with chargebacks much as that is a result of where ever you are getting your traffic from and how the billing companies (ccbill in this case) handle fraud, I could have helped you in a lot of other ways. I would have made sure you were aware of how many models they have on your network, exactly how their system works. I still don't think you understand 1/2 of how it works because you are wrong in a lot of the things you are trying to argue here. Obviously you didn't get it or never bothered to, I would have made sure you got it, the risks, etc...

A white label is definetly the best option for you, but can't compare a white label vs a live cam software solution. apples and oranges.

I would likely use Mark's software if I had more control over the programming or if I was guaranteed to have the source code if they stopped supporting it. I wouldn't recommend using it if you were relying on them for chathost, I also personally would get my own merchant account. The only thing I would want to rely on someone else for is the software, which if I had access to the code there would be no riskes involved.

I don't think Mark did anything wrong here from everything I have read. I would recommend someone using his system if they don't want to spend big bucks creating their own live cam solution, if they had their own chathosts, and with their own merchant account. All things his solution allows you to do. The chathost on LCN's network should be a suppliment, or bonus in addition to the ones that you would bring on board. If you can't get chathosts then there is no point paying for software, just do a white label.

I like the concept of sharing chathosts, which can work both ways for you. If you don't have traffic but you have chathost you can still make money in his system. If you don't have chathost but you have traffic you can still make money in his system. The concept is great as you need both traffic and chathost at the same time to launch a site, something that is very hard to do so his network gives you a little extra help than if you were on your own. But if you don't have your own chathost you are basically an affiliate that paid a decent amount of money for software, when you could have just got a white label with another company.

2MuchMark · 11-21-2009, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by will76

If my server was located right next to your server, and all of the dependencies were the same, OS the same, the server had the hardware as good or as better as the ones you use, there would be no bw issues since it was on the same network, the only wild card would be if the client broke something. If they did you bill them per hour to fix it, there would be no other way to pass the buck.

I'm not harping on this to bust your balls, but if you offered an option like this I would be interested in finding out more.

Hi Will,

Of course this would be possible. However there are still a number of concerns that would need to be addressed. What would our responsibilities for support be? How much would it cost us? Who is responsible when an OS upgrade occurs which creates a compatibility issue? Can we charge our clients extra for this? Should we? And would customers be willing to pay for this? "Technical" is one thing. "Policies", legal issues, how it affects our business model etc are all quite different.

2MuchMark · 11-21-2009, 10:58 PM

PornSiteNewbie:

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

No, what I am saying is that once Mark had my money, and the money of all his other customers whom I've yet to even see, he could care less about doing anything but making his own site better.

You are wrong, Leon. It is in our best interests to help you with all aspects of your business because We make more money after the sale. The more chat hosts you have on your site, the more chat host streams we have to sell. The more we have, the more you have. The more our customers have, the more everyone has.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

He did absolutely nothing to try to improve his model network by getting more models online during the time I was there,

You are wrong, Leon. We advertise in a local newspaper here in Montreal to hire new chat models all the time.

Here is our newest girl:

Natalia, available via Mbase. Hired this summer.

Here is another:

Sophie, available via Mbase: Hired in September.

Here is another:

Kedra, available on mbase. Found us from Webdreams.

As a side note Leon, we "feature" the actual girls who work for us, by way of large rotaing pictures or banners on the front page of our site.

Anyone who knows anything about traffic conversion will tell you that you cannot promise one thing, and sell another. We place large pictures of our own girls on our site BECAUSE they log in often and chat. They are the "Real" girls of LiveCamNetwork. They are not fake models.

Your site on the other hand, pictured fake models. You promised one thing, and delivered another.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

and he actually made the video product much worse. The video and color quality is nowhere near what they used to be, fine print or not

Please scroll up and see the screenshots I posted a couple of hours ago, and read what I said again regarding this issue. There is no fine print. The system is much better than it used to be because it is now compatible with various browsers and requires no .exe to run. Ask anyone here about the benefits of using Flash over Windows Media. And Leon as I already told you, if a chat model had bad image quality, all she had to do was to select a higher quality mode, or maybe upgrade her camera.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

Look at how ugly and amateur that chat client looks, Will? Have you ever seen anything that bad on any other cam site?

I'm sorry if you do not like how it looks.

2MuchMark · 11-21-2009, 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by will76

I like the concept of sharing chathosts, which can work both ways for you. If you don't have traffic but you have chathost you can still make money in his system. If you don't have chathost but you have traffic you can still make money in his system. The concept is great as you need both traffic and chathost at the same time to launch a site, something that is very hard to do so his network gives you a little extra help than if you were on your own.

Thank you very much, Will. This sums up perfectly what LiveCamNetwork's MBASE system tries to do.

What I think I will do though is to place a note on our mbase description page that explains that each chat site's participation in mbase is OPTIONAL and therefore the number of available chat models is not guaranteed. This is explained already in emails and phone calls but after this thread, I think it would be a good thing to add.

Cheers!!!

XMerchant · 11-22-2009, 05:04 AM

Will, I never said I didn't make any mistakes, and I feel my 2 biggest mistakes were choosing 2Much to begin with, and not leaving sooner. This is a warning thread, remember. I am warning everyone reading this that if you go with Mark's solution, you will get:

- A substandard product that will make your site look amateur, no matter how much traffic and models you have.

- You will not be able to share models (yes the concept is great, but unfortunately it's only a concept) because there would be noone to share them with that has any real traffic.

- There won't be enough models for you to use on your site if you don't have enough models yourself.

- When you give it your all for one year realizing there is no way to get ahead using this system, Mark will keep all your money, your customers, all software, and recruit your models for himself.

This is all I am saying, Will! I know I was wrong picking this solution to begin with.

Even if Mark improves his system, you need to know about how he does business, as having trust in your software partner is very important when choosing a solution. The fact that Mark tried to recruit my models tells you a lot about his character, apology or not. He only apologized because he got caught! The $400 chargebacks is only an excuse for him to keep $10,000 of mine, nothing more. The check he bounced to me for $1,700 is business as usual for Mark, he bounces checks on his models all the time. Read this thread, I am not the only person who came out publically to say I was duped.

The ultimate proof of my case is in the lack of even a single cam site that uses 2Much software that looks even remotely successful or like it was designed after the year 2000.

JimmiDean · 11-22-2009, 06:26 AM

Im not going to bother with this pissing match anymore, however I will take one thing to task.
"No, what I am saying is that once Mark had my money, and the money of all his other customers whom I've yet to even see, he could care less about doing anything but making his own site better"

Just want to mention Mark let me and my crew use his whole studio for six hours on Friday and gave us complete run of the place to shoot a project we are working on at no charge.
Pics and thanks will be in another thread Monday.
All he would accept at the end of the day was a cold well deserved beer.
And yes for the two or three people on this board who do not know I would consider Mark a friend.
However we always keep business strictly business and I am very happy with Mark 2much and the whole package.
If I was not friend or not I would never back his product if I did not like it.
Anyways that's my two cents do what you want with it I really don't fucking care.
Spend some time working on your product instead of being a one man side show here and you might just maybe but some money in your pocket one day.
Im done with thread......

will76 · 11-22-2009, 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

Will, I never said I didn't make any mistakes, and I feel my 2 biggest mistakes were choosing 2Much to begin with, and not leaving sooner. This is a warning thread, remember. I am warning everyone reading this that if you go with Mark's solution, you will get:

- A substandard product that will make your site look amateur, no matter how much traffic and models you have.

- You will not be able to share models (yes the concept is great, but unfortunately it's only a concept) because there would be noone to share them with that has any real traffic.

- There won't be enough models for you to use on your site if you don't have enough models yourself.

- When you give it your all for one year realizing there is no way to get ahead using this system, Mark will keep all your money, your customers, all software, and recruit your models for himself.

This is all I am saying, Will! I know I was wrong picking this solution to begin with.

Even if Mark improves his system, you need to know about how he does business, as having trust in your software partner is very important when choosing a solution. The fact that Mark tried to recruit my models tells you a lot about his character, apology or not. He only apologized because he got caught! The $400 chargebacks is only an excuse for him to keep $10,000 of mine, nothing more. The check he bounced to me for $1,700 is business as usual for Mark, he bounces checks on his models all the time. Read this thread, I am not the only person who came out publically to say I was duped.

The ultimate proof of my case is in the lack of even a single cam site that uses 2Much software that looks even remotely successful or like it was designed after the year 2000.

So you bought the wrong thing and then waited a year to change it and bitch, because it wasn't what you wanted.

He bounces checks all the time to his models ? You've made some bold accusationg in this thread about him being a thief, etc... Would like to see your proof where he bounces checks to his models all the time. If thats the case I would never use them, can you provide proof to back that up or is that just more smear campaign from you because you are mad at him ?

Ethersync · 11-22-2009, 08:00 AM

I've been following LCN for years. I know several people that have paid for licenses and made nothing and ended up paying a lot more than they expected for the service. Jean-Francois, please post a follow-up about how your experience is with LCN in say 6 months. Will be interesting.

joshuawk · 11-22-2009, 08:59 AM

I bought a license from them once..

2MuchMark · 11-22-2009, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

if you go with Mark's solution, you will get:

- A substandard product that will make your site look amateur, no matter how much traffic and models you have.

The "Look and Feel" of each website is completely up to the webmaster. You can customize the look and feel to look any way that you like. Here are a few examples:

1 of these is an original design by our designer. The middle one is my own personal design which I like, but you call amateur (Sorry! I still like it). The 3rd is a "skin job" where we took graphics from an existing site and applied it to his new cam site. Each of these took only a few hours to do. If you paid $4000 to your webmaster to do your site, he is the one you should be mad at.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

- You will not be able to share models (yes the concept is great, but unfortunately it's only a concept) because there would be noone to share them with that has any real traffic.

This is... True! Unfortunately very few customers of ours have good quality traffic. We are trying to encourage them to to find traffic any way that they can. We do go 1 step further though and look for traffic sources for them (Including inviting bids here at GFY). We also place banners inside our own news area for traffic companies once in a while. As I mentioned eralier, alot of our customers are newbies and unfortunately think that all they need to make a million dollars is to own a website.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

- There won't be enough models for you to use on your site if you don't have enough models yourself.

This is also true. Mbase provided SOME models to you, and again it all depended on how much other sites were charging, and how much you were willing to pay for those models. You had the chance to Network with those customers and try to make deals. You never did this. You also had 121 of your own chat models which you never contacted and ecouraged to chat. You never provided them with any support, showed them how to read their stats, established a community for them, nothing at all. It's no wonder your chat models never logged on.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

- When you give it your all for one year realizing there is no way to get ahead using this system, Mark will keep ... all software...

No Leon, you are wrong. You still own the license. This is your license to start again, or to re-sell, or to give away if you want to. How much you sell it for is completely up to you. This is the exit strategy I was trying to tell you about. If you had contacted us first without acting the way you did this entire situation need not have taken place.

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

The check he bounced to me for $1,700 is business as usual for Mark

Your Check, Leon, did not bounce. As I already told you both in this thread and by email, we put a Stop Payment on your check because you were in breach of contract. Here again is another screenshot:

I think it is time that we ended this thread as I don't think I will be posting in it any longer. I have shown that :

- You did not know what you were doing.
- You violated the Terms of Service
- You were in breech of contract
- Your paid your own webmaster for a site design ($4000!) that you did not like
- You had poor quality traffic
- Your own girls did not log in.
- You had lots of fraud (and failed to act on it)
- You prevented your own customers from getting what they paid for and made a bad situation worse.
- You ignored instructions and advice
- Etc.
- You lied constantly throughout this thread to me and to everyone else reading this.
- You failed to acknowedge you were wrong after seeing any of the screenshots I have posted.
- You tried to bring this drama to a customer forum (and lied about doing that too)

In this same thread, we shown you via the magic of screenshots that:

- Announcements were made about version 3 in advance of the upgrade.
- Your site was never down during the upgrade. (You lied and said it was down for a week)
- Image quality is selectable (Video Size Settings) (You lied and said everyone had bad quality)
- The accounting system lets you choose to payout to your models on fraud. (You said you chose to ignore this feature because "they worked anyway" - sorry - your business decision, not ours). Our software gives you the power to make this decision of course but its not something I would recommend to clients.
- That all customer information including Real Names, IP Addresses, CCBill Transaction #'s etc are readily available to you. You lied and said this was nowhere to be found.
- Potential Suspect transactions are flagged
- That you had massive fraud on your own site. (And that you made it even worse)
- That you had only 1 performer who knew what she was doing (The rest were boring).
- That there IS a forum for users (You lied and said there was none).
- Etc ETc...

I sincerely hope that you learn to pay more attention to your business in the future. If you fail at your next venture, blame your providers and lie endlessly like you are doing here, you may find yourself in court. Good luck to you.

XMerchant · 11-22-2009, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

The "Look and Feel" of each website is completely up to the webmaster.

Of course, except you can't have a search function, all the models have to appear on a single page, since there is no way to have pagination for multiple pages of models, there is no way to separate your models in categories (these are very basic functions every successful cam site should have), there is no way to have any links on the page with the video player, not even the navigation bar, the templates are so clumsy and cumbersome that you need a full time designer to customize them, etc.. Yeah, very flexible, and it's completely up to the webmaster

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

This is... True! Unfortunately very few customers of ours have good quality traffic. We are trying to encourage them to to find traffic any way that they can. We do go 1 step further though and look for traffic sources for them (Including inviting bids here at GFY). We also place banners inside our own news area for traffic companies once in a while. As I mentioned eralier, alot of our customers are newbies and unfortunately think that all they need to make a million dollars is to own a website.

Thank you for admitting this, Mark, this was one of the main reasons I went with you. Then maybe you also should be warning your newbie customers not to expect any of this before you take their money.

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

This is also true. Mbase provided SOME models to you, and again it all depended on how much other sites were charging, and how much you were willing to pay for those models. You had the chance to Network with those customers and try to make deals. You never did this. You also had 121 of your own chat models which you never contacted and ecouraged to chat. You never provided them with any support, showed them how to read their stats, established a community for them, nothing at all. It's no wonder your chat models never logged on.

Thanks once again for proving my original point that I had no support whatsoever when I launched my site with you. My 121 models had a good LOL at me after they tried working on your system, and never came back. Many of those same models are happy now to finally be given a fair chance to make money.

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

No Leon, you are wrong. You still own the license. This is your license to start again, or to re-sell, or to give away if you want to. How much you sell it for is completely up to you. This is the exit strategy I was trying to tell you about. If you had contacted us first without acting the way you did this entire situation need not have taken place.

Hehe, OK, Mark. I'll tell you what, I will offer this license right here on GFY for free to the first person who claims it under one condition. That condition is they try this license and your system for at least 6 months, and come back here after that time to share their experience with everyone here. Any takers, hit me up right here in this thread? Will, maybe you want to try, I'd love to give this one to you to prove how incompetent of a businessman I really am. Yes, something I paid $6,000 for absolutely free. This is a 3 site license, so you will have 3 times the success!

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

Your Check, Leon, did not bounce. As I already told you both in this thread and by email, we put a Stop Payment on your check because you were in breach of contract.

My breaching your contract was taking the domain which I own and moving it to another provider, nothing more. There were no customers left with any balances, and there was no content on my site left after your last "upgrade" to even get any customer to come back. In addition, I was already on my own CCBill account when I left (and not on your sub account), so there was no breach of contract at all. Me leaving does not give you any right to keep over $10,000 of my money which you do not deny doing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

I sincerely hope that you learn to pay more attention to your business in the future.

Let's have some more testimonials here, folks, as Mark still seems to think we are a bunch of idiots for not making millions after buying his licenses!

GonZo · 11-22-2009, 01:48 PM

I dont hang out here any longer however I was directed to this thread and in the spirit of fair play...

Ill take you up on the offer with these caveats...

I already have secured the same license as yours with Mark so yours isnt needed and I will be constantly updating on the results of my progress.

And its well documented here and on other boards that Mark and I arent good old boys and neither of us kiss each others ass.

Im on record as saying after 90 days of research for another client this is the BEST turnkey system on the web for this purpose.

However there are a lot more things you must have on the ball even if you use the best software available. Youve heard from Will who is well qualified on this subject as well as a couple of other of his clients that they have been able to make a go of it.

From what I can see your traffic sources were riddled with fraud which is what you get when you advertise on tube sites and then in turn disable any fraud protection.

How you can have 3K of income with 2K of it as chargebacks and fraud and blame the solution provider is beyond me.

But all about fair play so Im going to see for myself.

2MuchMark · 11-22-2009, 03:21 PM

Welcome aboard, Gonzo.

TheEnforcer · 11-22-2009, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GonZo

I dont hang out here any longer however I was directed to this thread and in the spirit of fair play...

Ill take you up on the offer with these caveats...

I already have secured the same license as yours with Mark so yours isnt needed and I will be constantly updating on the results of my progress.

And its well documented here and on other boards that Mark and I arent good old boys and neither of us kiss each others ass.

Im on record as saying after 90 days of research for another client this is the BEST turnkey system on the web for this purpose.

However there are a lot more things you must have on the ball even if you use the best software available. Youve heard from Will who is well qualified on this subject as well as a couple of other of his clients that they have been able to make a go of it.

From what I can see your traffic sources were riddled with fraud which is what you get when you advertise on tube sites and then in turn disable any fraud protection.

How you can have 3K of income with 2K of it as chargebacks and fraud and blame the solution provider is beyond me.

But all about fair play so Im going to see for myself.

What he said. .... Except I've always gotten along with Mark.

Abbie · 11-22-2009, 06:06 PM

Heya Mark,

Sorry for the delay in responding. I wanted to get some records together before responding. You should have an email from me now. Please let me know if you didn't receive it.

Abbie

2MuchMark · 11-22-2009, 06:54 PM

Hi Abbie,

Email received! Reply sent.

Abbie · 11-22-2009, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

Hi Abbie,

Email received! Reply sent.

Thanks, Mark

I truly appreciate it. You have a happy camper on your hands.

will76 · 11-22-2009, 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

Hehe, OK, Mark. I'll tell you what, I will offer this license right here on GFY for free to the first person who claims it under one condition. That condition is they try this license and your system for at least 6 months, and come back here after that time to share their experience with everyone here. Any takers, hit me up right here in this thread? Will, maybe you want to try, I'd love to give this one to you to prove how incompetent of a businessman I really am. Yes, something I paid $6,000 for absolutely free. This is a 3 site license, so you will have 3 times the success!

Sure I'd take it, but only if I could colo my own server with Mark, where I would have access to the source code if they stopped supporting it at some point in the future. I'm not worried about the upfront costs, I am more worried about building a business that relys on what happens to 2much media.

btw though, I can already answer your question. If my results with his system was shitty I wouldn't blame anyone other than myself.

The only thing he guarantees is software, the rest would be up to me to provide.

2MuchMark · 11-22-2009, 09:08 PM

PornSiteNewBie:

You are free to sell or give away your license as I said above, however the following conditions have to be met before we can support the new client:

#1. We must have a signed Terms of Service with that new customer.

#2. You need a very clear letter signed by the two as well as our lawyer, which clearly states that this new person or entity is the clear and rightful owner of your license, and that you have no claim to any portion of it now or later on. (We do not want to get into a dispute over who to pay), and that your new customer assumes all costs of any current or future liabilities on your account. (Right now, your liabilities are high)

#3. You also need to be very clear if you are providing your, database of customer, your database of performers, graphics and artwork, stats and other data along with your license.

#4. Your license must include your domain name, verifiable via a whois serarch. If it does not, we will have to charge additional setup fees to properly transfer the account, userlist, performer list, etc.

In other words, the "owner" must own "everything".

Will76:
I talked with our lawyer today about your idea and while interesting, it is not possible at this time, sorry. However I do have something for you that I think you will find very interesting. Please hit me up on ICQ and I will give you more info.

Cheers!

XMerchant · 11-22-2009, 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

#4. Your license must include your domain name, verifiable via a whois serarch. If it does not, we will have to charge additional setup fees to properly transfer the account, userlist, performer list, etc.

Boy, I just can't win! Here I was feeling charitable, trying to do a good deed and donate your $6,000 3 site license to the good people of GFY, and you have to spring this on me now! This means that whoever wants my license will have to pay you a $1,600 fee to change their domain name, since I can't offer my domain for free with the license, as it's currently being used to finally make money. So, I am sorry folks, but I have to ammend my free license offer. You can still have it free, but you will have to agree to pay Mark $1,600 to use your domain with it. I am sure it's still worth it, since you will still be saving $4,400 off the MSRP

Gonzo, luckily we didn't shake on this deal yet, because it wouldn't make any sense for you to take my license, since it will cost you another $1,600 on top of what you already paid Mark. No need to thank me, just post the URL of the site you will run on Mark's software, as we would all love to watch how you do the impossible, and make it succeed.

So, anyone who doesn't have a current license with Mark, please step forward to claim mine under the new terms above. Please be sure to consult with your attorney prior to accepting this offer, as it may be dangerous to your wallet

2MuchMark · 11-22-2009, 10:56 PM

PornSiteNewbie:

You are wrong.

You had asked me to install a new license on a new domain, with new accounts (ftp, email, ccbill), new template, new everything. You were in effect asking for a whole new standard license. Our regular cost on this license was $2100.00 but I had offered it to you at $500.00 off since you were already an existing customer.

A license ownership transfer is not the same thing. We sometimes charge $100.00 to cover legal costs but generally it is free because the domain name, account details, users, performer accounts etc, all remain intact. There is little work for us to do except to review the paperwork and sign off on it.

You may want to read things more carefully before you get so upset.

PastorSinAlot · 11-23-2009, 12:03 AM

Mark why was I triple billed in one month. In 2008 you can only do so much with the design
You bill for hosting, you bill each time a model download the software, That what I just recall. I was cool with your company until I keep getting billed for stuff three months . Which was not part of the terms

PastorSinAlot · 11-23-2009, 12:10 AM

This is what you say I owe in sept 09

Account balance: -3590.12
Minimum Payment due: -3840.12

You keep billing me when i ask you guys to stop billing me after charging me 3 months out the blue on my debt card. Why do you keep billing me. I can even contact ccbill if you like. Do right by people sending you money

Accounts in good standing Maintain a $250.00 minimum reserver and bennefit from the following:

- Preferred Mbase Pricing
- Free Miristream licenses
- Continuous Access to MBase
- Software updates as as they become available
- Qualify for 1 month free hosting
- Save on interest and late payment fees

Accounts which become late are subject to :

- Additional service fee of $35.00
- Interest charges of 28.8% per annum
- Limited Access to Administrator program
- Suspension of Mbase Services
- Suspension of email services
- Possible suspension or redirection of website and hosting services

XMerchant · 11-23-2009, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

You are wrong. You had asked me to install a new license on a new domain, with new accounts (ftp, email, ccbill), new template, new everything.

No, Mark, that couldn't be further from the truth. I told you I was moving my primary domain to someone where I would actually make money, and asked if I could move a small domain with little or no traffic to you, just to keep your worthless license and at least get something that I paid for. It was a simple domain change, nothing more!

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

A license ownership transfer is not the same thing. We sometimes charge $100.00 to cover legal costs but generally it is free because the domain name, account details, users, performer accounts etc, all remain intact. There is little work for us to do except to review the paperwork and sign off on it.

Really? Sometimes? Paperwork to sign off on LOL? Before you get all conglomerate corporate on me with your usual BS, read what you wrote before (pasted below) in an earlier post in this thread:

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

Here is the other big mistake you made. You wanted to "change your domain name". This was my point all along. You can not change your domain name "just like that' because your domain name is your account. It is how your customers find you, how your chat models log in, and how CCBill processes for you.

Here is what "changing your domain name" means:

Installation of a new LiveCamNetwork license.
Creation of new accounts on our servers
Creation of new CCBill account or sub account.
Installation of the CCBill post-back scripts and other software.
Testing, testing, and more testing.
Installation of Template
Website design and graphics (if requested), or tech support for your webmaster to do it.
A new Terms of Service agreement for the new domain.
Transfer all all performer accounts to the new site
Transfer of all user accounts to the new site.
Emails to all of the above with instructions (and reason I hope).

To do all of the above would have taken at least 4 days to complete.

Pardon me sir, if we dare to charge you for work that you ask us to do for you.

OMG, Mark. So let me check my dictionary to translate the above. Emm, how is changing a domain different then selling your license to someone else with another domain? How is it any less work which only carries a "sometime" price of $100 instead of the usual $1,600 price you wanted to charge a one year loyal customer like myself who has never bounced a single check to you? Please explain!?

OK folks, important update! It looks like there may have been a misundersanding with Mark after all about the license transfer. There is a good chance you may only have to pay $100 to claim my license for yourself. Let's keep our fingers crossed that Mark will get approval from headquarters and his attorney to allow me to help him promote his business and give away his $6,000 license for free to the first person who claims it here. Please stay tuned...

Sorry, Mark, I am not upset at all any more. This is getting funnier and funnier by the minute

PastorSinAlot · 11-24-2009, 02:01 PM

If you want to waste money go with Mark. You will get nicke and dime to death

sarettah · 11-24-2009, 02:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

No, Mark, that couldn't be further from the truth. I told you I was moving my primary domain to someone where I would actually make money, and asked if I could move a small domain with little or no traffic to you, just to keep your worthless license and at least get something that I paid for. It was a simple domain change, nothing more!

Really? Sometimes? Paperwork to sign off on LOL? Before you get all conglomerate corporate on me with your usual BS, read what you wrote before (pasted below) in an earlier post in this thread:

OMG, Mark. So let me check my dictionary to translate the above. Emm, how is changing a domain different then selling your license to someone else with another domain? How is it any less work which only carries a "sometime" price of $100 instead of the usual $1,600 price you wanted to charge a one year loyal customer like myself who has never bounced a single check to you? Please explain!?

OK folks, important update! It looks like there may have been a misundersanding with Mark after all about the license transfer. There is a good chance you may only have to pay $100 to claim my license for yourself. Let's keep our fingers crossed that Mark will get approval from headquarters and his attorney to allow me to help him promote his business and give away his $6,000 license for free to the first person who claims it here. Please stay tuned...

Sorry, Mark, I am not upset at all any more. This is getting funnier and funnier by the minute

Are you that dense really? Or do you never read what is put in front of you?

I am not a Mark supporter. But you are killing yourself here.

Read what he wrote! If you do an ownership change, which includes the domain name (meaning you sold the whole kit and kaboodle to someone) then it is a relatively cheap process that might cost $100.

If you do a domain name change, it requires more.

All in all that actually makes a lot of sense.

Please feel free to carry on.

sextoyking · 11-24-2009, 02:46 PM

Mark,

You sound like a putz.....

Take care of this guy - jesus.....

Customer service is #1 - if he's not happy, etc - refund him, make it good and all is over....

XMerchant · 11-24-2009, 04:21 PM

Man, and I thought this thread was dead already! Still no takers for the free license?

LeRoy · 11-24-2009, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

Man, and I thought this thread was dead already! Still no takers for the free license?

Is there really a free license? I'll take it . Hit me up

XMerchant · 11-24-2009, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LeRoy

Is there really a free license? I'll take it . Hit me up

Yes, it's a license I paid $6,000 for and am giving away for free. The problem is since it's not just an ownership change, but also a domain change (since my domain isn't included with the license), you will have to pay Mark a $1,600 fee to accept and use my license. If I was including my domain, it would have only cost you $100, but since my domain is being used on another project, you'll have to use your own. Is that OK with you?

XMerchant · 12-01-2009, 12:42 PM

I guess keeping $10,000 of my money isn't enough, Mark continues to bill me even after I canceled all service with him in writing:

I just got 2 of these today:

Dear XXX,

Account balance: $470.31
Minimum Payment due: $279.69

This is an automated curtosy reminder to inform you that your account has fallen below its Credit Limit, and must be paid up to date immediately in order to remain in good standing with us.

Accounts in good standing Maintain a $750.00 minimum reserve and bennefit from the following:

- Preferred Mbase Pricing
- Free Miristream licenses
- Continuous Access to MBase
- Software updates as as they become available
- Qualify for 1 month free hosting
- Save on interest and late payment fees

Accounts which become late are subject to :

- Additional service fee of $35.00
- Interest charges of 28.8% per annum
- Limited Access to Administrator program
- Suspension of Mbase Services
- Suspension of email services
- Possible suspension or redirection of website and hosting services

Please maintain your account's good standing now by making a payment. Failure to make payments on time may result in the suspension or closure of your account, and the reporting of your late payment to Equifax and other credit agencies, and the transfer of ownership to your account to collection agencies in your area. If you are unable to make your payment at this time please contact us to arrange for an alternative payment schedule.

Will someone please take my license for free to end this nightmare!

XMerchant · 12-10-2009, 10:06 AM

Someone just brought the following thread on YNOT to my attention:

Another fine sales thread on YNOT for 2much.net back from 2007

Sounds a lot like this thread, except it happened 3 years ago! Mark is almost using the same language in his responses here as he did back in 2007. I think he has them saved as a form letter to save time from having to come up with new BS every time he gets accused of being a scammer. This way he just posts the screenshots, but just has to cut and paste the BS. I wonder how many more posts like that there are, and how many people fell for his scam and kept quiet.

Tjeezers · 12-10-2009, 10:16 AM

There is nothing wrong with mark prince his system
I have heard my clients speak about it, and it was always catching their minds.
I am sure Mark has a lot of happy clients also.

XMerchant · 12-10-2009, 10:35 AM

I would like to see just one happy client with a real website, and one who is not getting to use Mark's studio free for buying him a beer.

LeRoy · 12-10-2009, 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornsitenewbie

Yes, it's a license I paid $6,000 for and am giving away for free. The problem is since it's not just an ownership change, but also a domain change (since my domain isn't included with the license), you will have to pay Mark a $1,600 fee to accept and use my license. If I was including my domain, it would have only cost you $100, but since my domain is being used on another project, you'll have to use your own. Is that OK with you?

I might have a need for it. If its possible let me know.

PastorSinAlot · 12-10-2009, 10:42 AM

Pornsitenewbie, year later I am still getting billed, didnt see the bill in December thru. His program only help him make money, he tries and still people models and overcharge you on the back end. I was a client and i got burned. I hope no one else get burn

XMerchant · 12-10-2009, 10:44 AM

Absolutely, although I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. Please get in touch with Mark to make the arrangements, and pay him the $1,600 fee to change the domain on my license. Once that's been settled, and you're OK with all his terms, please contact me. Just to be sure, we will post the domain you will be using with his license here, and we will track your progress both in terms of traffic and revenue for the next 6 months.

2MuchMark · 12-10-2009, 11:16 AM

PornSiteNewbie,

The notices that you received on Monday are automatically generated from our system when accounts fall below the minimum reserve.

Even when accounts are "closed", they are still active in the system to allow you to receive additional payments. These payments can include Returning Holdbacks from CCBill and returning holdbacks from us. Without this, you would not receive proper credit for these returning holdbacks.

I have adjusted this for you and you will no longer receive these notices and requests for payments. If you would like updates on this in the future please let me know and will send you updates myself.

As for the Ynot post, that customer failed in his business and chose to blame us instead of himself. That post and others contained some wild accusations which we had proven to be false, but he had refused to believe. In the end we had no choice, and sued him in court for Libel. We won.

I understand that you are not happy with how our business together turned out and I am sorry it had to end the way that it did but labeling us as a "scam" and even going as far as to put it in your sig is uncalled for.

For those interested, Almost everything that "PornSiteNewbie" has posted in this thread is false and I have backed it all up with screenshots. I invite everyone to take advantage of our offer to use our software for free and see for yourself just how powerful our system is, and how detailed the accounting system is. http://www.2Much.net.

PastorSinAlot · 12-10-2009, 11:23 AM

why would he lie **********, did he lie about you guys contacting his model to come over to your site?

XMerchant · 12-10-2009, 11:29 AM

Mark, I don't know exactly what you proved, to me you only proved every point I made in full detail. You market your system to newbies, promise them the world, and then take their money and send them packing, that simple.

Even if I was Bill Gates, I couldn't make a profit with your system, it's so amateur and mickey mouse that you should be embarrassed to market it to third parties.

Once again, the proof is in the pudding, show me one yes just one sucessful website who has "made it" using your software!!! Come on, prove me to be libelous, and I will take my signature down! As far as I am concerned what I am doing is preventing others from being scammed, and rightly so. If that's libel, then telling people that I got robbed would be libel too.

11-21-2009, 07:50 PM	#102
2MuchMark Videochat Solutions Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 48,537	The speed of my response is become I'm sitting here working on a Saturday night and refreshing this thread about once a minute or so because I can see that you're online too. So again, why is this a BS response? All I am saying is that at the time, it was expensive for us to support clients who were hosted on other servers. For example: If a customer would complain about poor speed, we could log in to check things out. If the problem was with our software, then we could fix it of course as per our service level agreement. However if the problem was due to a slow server, congested router, or other things at the operating system level for example, we had to ask our customer to call his hosting provider for support as some things were simply not fixable by us, or were beyond the scope of our service agreement with our customers (and instead were under the agreement of that hosting company). Many customers did not like this, or understand why we would only support our software and nothing else. Our current system has dependencies such as Redhat Enterprise 5x, MySQL, and Wowsa. If our customers wanted to host this with their own ISP's, they would also be responsible for the licensing which that hosting provider may charge them for (or perhaps they would have to buy direct). This by itself may may it more complex for some customers (especially newbies) to manage. I hope this better answers your question. __________________ VideoChat Solutions \| Custom Software \| IT Support https://www.2much.net \| https://www.lcntech.com Last edited by 2MuchMark; 11-21-2009 at 07:52 PM..

11-21-2009, 08:05 PM	#104
2MuchMark Videochat Solutions Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 48,537	Sorry, I didn't think I was being bitchy. (In fact, I'm in a great mood! This thread has generated lots of new contacts lately..) Alot of us here have servers all over the place and are used to managing them via Cpanel, Telnet, whatever. "Newbies" can be new to adult, and can also be new to this as well. When a customer is trying to run his website, the only thing he should be concentrating on, is that. Hosting, Operating Envrionments, server dependencies, routers etc, should not be his concern. By hosting our customer's licenses for them, we make ourselves 100% responsible for our software AND the quality of service. We own all of our own servers and do all of the maintenance on them. So as an example, if a client calls to complain about an issue, we can fix it regardless of whether or not its a software bug, or a server / hosting / switching / routing issue. This guarantees all problems are fixed very quickly, without the customer having to call multiple providers. __________________ VideoChat Solutions \| Custom Software \| IT Support https://www.2much.net \| https://www.lcntech.com

11-21-2009, 08:05 PM	#105
2MuchMark Videochat Solutions Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 48,537	And sorry I missed your question earlier. We charge in US Dollars. We also payout in US Dollars. __________________ VideoChat Solutions \| Custom Software \| IT Support https://www.2much.net \| https://www.lcntech.com

11-22-2009, 06:26 AM	#116
JimmiDean Confirmed User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Margarittaville Posts: 3,433	Im not going to bother with this pissing match anymore, however I will take one thing to task. "No, what I am saying is that once Mark had my money, and the money of all his other customers whom I've yet to even see, he could care less about doing anything but making his own site better" Just want to mention Mark let me and my crew use his whole studio for six hours on Friday and gave us complete run of the place to shoot a project we are working on at no charge. Pics and thanks will be in another thread Monday. All he would accept at the end of the day was a cold well deserved beer. And yes for the two or three people on this board who do not know I would consider Mark a friend. However we always keep business strictly business and I am very happy with Mark 2much and the whole package. If I was not friend or not I would never back his product if I did not like it. Anyways that's my two cents do what you want with it I really don't fucking care. Spend some time working on your product instead of being a one man side show here and you might just maybe but some money in your pocket one day. Im done with thread...... __________________ My God there's Porn on here! Still on the Beach !!!

11-22-2009, 08:59 AM	#119
joshuawk Confirmed User Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: my moms house Posts: 1,092	I bought a license from them once.. __________________ i love GW

11-21-2009, 07:54 PM	#103
VIXEN ESCORTS Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 1,103	"This by itself may may it more complex for some customers (especially newbies) to manage" ooh bitchy, you didn't answer my question about US$ or CN$

11-22-2009, 05:04 AM	#115
XMerchant Adult Merchant Accounts Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tampa Posts: 416	Will, I never said I didn't make any mistakes, and I feel my 2 biggest mistakes were choosing 2Much to begin with, and not leaving sooner. This is a warning thread, remember. I am warning everyone reading this that if you go with Mark's solution, you will get: - A substandard product that will make your site look amateur, no matter how much traffic and models you have. - You will not be able to share models (yes the concept is great, but unfortunately it's only a concept) because there would be noone to share them with that has any real traffic. - There won't be enough models for you to use on your site if you don't have enough models yourself. - When you give it your all for one year realizing there is no way to get ahead using this system, Mark will keep all your money, your customers, all software, and recruit your models for himself. This is all I am saying, Will! I know I was wrong picking this solution to begin with. Even if Mark improves his system, you need to know about how he does business, as having trust in your software partner is very important when choosing a solution. The fact that Mark tried to recruit my models tells you a lot about his character, apology or not. He only apologized because he got caught! The $400 chargebacks is only an excuse for him to keep $10,000 of mine, nothing more. The check he bounced to me for $1,700 is business as usual for Mark, he bounces checks on his models all the time. Read this thread, I am not the only person who came out publically to say I was duped. The ultimate proof of my case is in the lack of even a single cam site that uses 2Much software that looks even remotely successful or like it was designed after the year 2000.

11-22-2009, 08:00 AM	#118
Ethersync Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: London, Saint-Tropez, Bermuda, Moscow Posts: 5,289	I've been following LCN for years. I know several people that have paid for licenses and made nothing and ended up paying a lot more than they expected for the service. Jean-Francois, please post a follow-up about how your experience is with LCN in say 6 months. Will be interesting.

11-22-2009, 01:48 PM	#122
GonZo Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Atlanta,Ga. Posts: 3,180	I dont hang out here any longer however I was directed to this thread and in the spirit of fair play... Ill take you up on the offer with these caveats... I already have secured the same license as yours with Mark so yours isnt needed and I will be constantly updating on the results of my progress. And its well documented here and on other boards that Mark and I arent good old boys and neither of us kiss each others ass. Im on record as saying after 90 days of research for another client this is the BEST turnkey system on the web for this purpose. However there are a lot more things you must have on the ball even if you use the best software available. Youve heard from Will who is well qualified on this subject as well as a couple of other of his clients that they have been able to make a go of it. From what I can see your traffic sources were riddled with fraud which is what you get when you advertise on tube sites and then in turn disable any fraud protection. How you can have 3K of income with 2K of it as chargebacks and fraud and blame the solution provider is beyond me. But all about fair play so Im going to see for myself.

11-22-2009, 03:21 PM	#123
2MuchMark Videochat Solutions Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 48,537	Welcome aboard, Gonzo. __________________ VideoChat Solutions \| Custom Software \| IT Support https://www.2much.net \| https://www.lcntech.com

11-22-2009, 06:06 PM	#125
Abbie Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 1,004	Heya Mark, Sorry for the delay in responding. I wanted to get some records together before responding. You should have an email from me now. Please let me know if you didn't receive it. Abbie

11-22-2009, 06:54 PM	#126
2MuchMark Videochat Solutions Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 48,537	Hi Abbie, Email received! Reply sent. __________________ VideoChat Solutions \| Custom Software \| IT Support https://www.2much.net \| https://www.lcntech.com

11-22-2009, 09:08 PM	#129
2MuchMark Videochat Solutions Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 48,537	PornSiteNewBie: You are free to sell or give away your license as I said above, however the following conditions have to be met before we can support the new client: #1. We must have a signed Terms of Service with that new customer. #2. You need a very clear letter signed by the two as well as our lawyer, which clearly states that this new person or entity is the clear and rightful owner of your license, and that you have no claim to any portion of it now or later on. (We do not want to get into a dispute over who to pay), and that your new customer assumes all costs of any current or future liabilities on your account. (Right now, your liabilities are high) #3. You also need to be very clear if you are providing your, database of customer, your database of performers, graphics and artwork, stats and other data along with your license. #4. Your license must include your domain name, verifiable via a whois serarch. If it does not, we will have to charge additional setup fees to properly transfer the account, userlist, performer list, etc. In other words, the "owner" must own "everything". Will76: I talked with our lawyer today about your idea and while interesting, it is not possible at this time, sorry. However I do have something for you that I think you will find very interesting. Please hit me up on ICQ and I will give you more info. Cheers! __________________ VideoChat Solutions \| Custom Software \| IT Support https://www.2much.net \| https://www.lcntech.com Last edited by 2MuchMark; 11-22-2009 at 09:12 PM..

11-22-2009, 10:56 PM	#131
2MuchMark Videochat Solutions Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 48,537	PornSiteNewbie: You are wrong. You had asked me to install a new license on a new domain, with new accounts (ftp, email, ccbill), new template, new everything. You were in effect asking for a whole new standard license. Our regular cost on this license was $2100.00 but I had offered it to you at $500.00 off since you were already an existing customer. A license ownership transfer is not the same thing. We sometimes charge $100.00 to cover legal costs but generally it is free because the domain name, account details, users, performer accounts etc, all remain intact. There is little work for us to do except to review the paperwork and sign off on it. You may want to read things more carefully before you get so upset. __________________ VideoChat Solutions \| Custom Software \| IT Support https://www.2much.net \| https://www.lcntech.com Last edited by 2MuchMark; 11-22-2009 at 10:59 PM..

11-23-2009, 12:03 AM	#132
PastorSinAlot So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Compton Posts: 2,837	Mark why was I triple billed in one month. In 2008 you can only do so much with the design You bill for hosting, you bill each time a model download the software, That what I just recall. I was cool with your company until I keep getting billed for stuff three months . Which was not part of the terms

11-23-2009, 12:10 AM	#133
PastorSinAlot So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Compton Posts: 2,837	This is what you say I owe in sept 09 Account balance: -3590.12 Minimum Payment due: -3840.12 You keep billing me when i ask you guys to stop billing me after charging me 3 months out the blue on my debt card. Why do you keep billing me. I can even contact ccbill if you like. Do right by people sending you money Accounts in good standing Maintain a $250.00 minimum reserver and bennefit from the following: - Preferred Mbase Pricing - Free Miristream licenses - Continuous Access to MBase - Software updates as as they become available - Qualify for 1 month free hosting - Save on interest and late payment fees Accounts which become late are subject to : - Additional service fee of $35.00 - Interest charges of 28.8% per annum - Limited Access to Administrator program - Suspension of Mbase Services - Suspension of email services - Possible suspension or redirection of website and hosting services Last edited by PastorSinAlot; 11-23-2009 at 12:11 AM..

11-24-2009, 02:01 PM	#135
PastorSinAlot So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Compton Posts: 2,837	If you want to waste money go with Mark. You will get nicke and dime to death

11-24-2009, 02:46 PM	#137
sextoyking Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Portland, OR. Posts: 6,034	Mark, You sound like a putz..... Take care of this guy - jesus..... Customer service is #1 - if he's not happy, etc - refund him, make it good and all is over.... __________________ ICQ: 52344098 -------------------------------------- 50% Commissions on all Product Sales. http://www.wishing.com/money

11-24-2009, 04:21 PM	#138
XMerchant Adult Merchant Accounts Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tampa Posts: 416	Man, and I thought this thread was dead already! Still no takers for the free license?

12-01-2009, 12:42 PM	#141
XMerchant Adult Merchant Accounts Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tampa Posts: 416	I guess keeping $10,000 of my money isn't enough, Mark continues to bill me even after I canceled all service with him in writing: I just got 2 of these today: Dear XXX, Account balance: $470.31 Minimum Payment due: $279.69 This is an automated curtosy reminder to inform you that your account has fallen below its Credit Limit, and must be paid up to date immediately in order to remain in good standing with us. Accounts in good standing Maintain a $750.00 minimum reserve and bennefit from the following: - Preferred Mbase Pricing - Free Miristream licenses - Continuous Access to MBase - Software updates as as they become available - Qualify for 1 month free hosting - Save on interest and late payment fees Accounts which become late are subject to : - Additional service fee of $35.00 - Interest charges of 28.8% per annum - Limited Access to Administrator program - Suspension of Mbase Services - Suspension of email services - Possible suspension or redirection of website and hosting services Please maintain your account's good standing now by making a payment. Failure to make payments on time may result in the suspension or closure of your account, and the reporting of your late payment to Equifax and other credit agencies, and the transfer of ownership to your account to collection agencies in your area. If you are unable to make your payment at this time please contact us to arrange for an alternative payment schedule. Will someone please take my license for free to end this nightmare!

12-10-2009, 10:06 AM	#142
XMerchant Adult Merchant Accounts Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tampa Posts: 416	Someone just brought the following thread on YNOT to my attention: Another fine sales thread on YNOT for 2much.net back from 2007 Sounds a lot like this thread, except it happened 3 years ago! Mark is almost using the same language in his responses here as he did back in 2007. I think he has them saved as a form letter to save time from having to come up with new BS every time he gets accused of being a scammer. This way he just posts the screenshots, but just has to cut and paste the BS. I wonder how many more posts like that there are, and how many people fell for his scam and kept quiet. __________________ XMerchant - Adult Visa/MC Merchant Accounts From 4.25% ICQ: 477888 Email: [email protected]

12-10-2009, 10:16 AM	#143
Tjeezers Webmaster Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: BP4L - NL/RO Posts: 16,556	There is nothing wrong with mark prince his system I have heard my clients speak about it, and it was always catching their minds. I am sure Mark has a lot of happy clients also. __________________ Enroll in the SWAG Affiliate Asian Live Cam Program and get 9 free quality linkbacks from my network! Wanna see how old school I am? Look at this! All my Cam Review Sites are here!

12-10-2009, 10:35 AM	#144
XMerchant Adult Merchant Accounts Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tampa Posts: 416	I would like to see just one happy client with a real website, and one who is not getting to use Mark's studio free for buying him a beer. __________________ XMerchant - Adult Visa/MC Merchant Accounts From 4.25% ICQ: 477888 Email: [email protected] Last edited by XMerchant; 12-10-2009 at 10:37 AM..

12-10-2009, 10:42 AM	#146
PastorSinAlot So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Compton Posts: 2,837	Pornsitenewbie, year later I am still getting billed, didnt see the bill in December thru. His program only help him make money, he tries and still people models and overcharge you on the back end. I was a client and i got burned. I hope no one else get burn

12-10-2009, 10:44 AM	#147
XMerchant Adult Merchant Accounts Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tampa Posts: 416	Absolutely, although I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. Please get in touch with Mark to make the arrangements, and pay him the $1,600 fee to change the domain on my license. Once that's been settled, and you're OK with all his terms, please contact me. Just to be sure, we will post the domain you will be using with his license here, and we will track your progress both in terms of traffic and revenue for the next 6 months. __________________ XMerchant - Adult Visa/MC Merchant Accounts From 4.25% ICQ: 477888 Email: [email protected]

12-10-2009, 11:16 AM	#148
2MuchMark Videochat Solutions Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 48,537	PornSiteNewbie, The notices that you received on Monday are automatically generated from our system when accounts fall below the minimum reserve. Even when accounts are "closed", they are still active in the system to allow you to receive additional payments. These payments can include Returning Holdbacks from CCBill and returning holdbacks from us. Without this, you would not receive proper credit for these returning holdbacks. I have adjusted this for you and you will no longer receive these notices and requests for payments. If you would like updates on this in the future please let me know and will send you updates myself. As for the Ynot post, that customer failed in his business and chose to blame us instead of himself. That post and others contained some wild accusations which we had proven to be false, but he had refused to believe. In the end we had no choice, and sued him in court for Libel. We won. I understand that you are not happy with how our business together turned out and I am sorry it had to end the way that it did but labeling us as a "scam" and even going as far as to put it in your sig is uncalled for. For those interested, Almost everything that "PornSiteNewbie" has posted in this thread is false and I have backed it all up with screenshots. I invite everyone to take advantage of our offer to use our software for free and see for yourself just how powerful our system is, and how detailed the accounting system is. http://www.2Much.net. __________________ VideoChat Solutions \| Custom Software \| IT Support https://www.2much.net \| https://www.lcntech.com Last edited by 2MuchMark; 12-10-2009 at 11:17 AM..

12-10-2009, 11:23 AM	#149
PastorSinAlot So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Compton Posts: 2,837	why would he lie **********, did he lie about you guys contacting his model to come over to your site?

12-10-2009, 11:29 AM	#150
XMerchant Adult Merchant Accounts Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Tampa Posts: 416	Mark, I don't know exactly what you proved, to me you only proved every point I made in full detail. You market your system to newbies, promise them the world, and then take their money and send them packing, that simple. Even if I was Bill Gates, I couldn't make a profit with your system, it's so amateur and mickey mouse that you should be embarrassed to market it to third parties. Once again, the proof is in the pudding, show me one yes just one sucessful website who has "made it" using your software!!! Come on, prove me to be libelous, and I will take my signature down! As far as I am concerned what I am doing is preventing others from being scammed, and rightly so. If that's libel, then telling people that I got robbed would be libel too. __________________ XMerchant - Adult Visa/MC Merchant Accounts From 4.25% ICQ: 477888 Email: [email protected] Last edited by XMerchant; 12-10-2009 at 11:31 AM..