Credits & CB's now taken from affiliates

[james_clickmemedia]

I am seeing a trend now that even PPS programs are taking all credits & CB's from affiliate's payouts. I know it is standard practice in the revshare model however did not know it was becoming a common practice amongst pps now.

Anyone else seeing this ?









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[TheDoc]

Many major programs don't do it that way, but many smaller ones have for years. I always took the stance that if I didn't get paid, you don't get paid.

[TeenCat]

yes it is good. now with nats4 you see cbs and i always feel guilty when i get money and sponsor get cb

[iSpyCams]

PPS is such a magnet for fraud that this does not surprised me.

[james_clickmemedia]

hmm. ok. Food for thought.

[HomerSimpson]

I hate CB in any way...

[candyflip]

Originally Posted by TeenCat

yes it is good. now with nats4 you see cbs and i always feel guilty when i get money and sponsor get cb

Why should you feel guilty. You sent the sale. They had a shit backend and didn't deliver.

You did your part of the job. They didn't.

[Sharky]

I think this should be standard

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by candyflip

Why should you feel guilty. You sent the sale. They had a shit backend and didn't deliver.

You did your part of the job. They didn't.

Technically no sale was sent... the money was reversed, that's not a sale.

People refund for a large number of reasons, even the best, biggest, most updating, perfect support sites that tackle every issue every time.... still have cb's and refunds, they are impossible to stop from happening.

[MobiusMike]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Technically no sale was sent... the money was reversed, that's not a sale.

People refund for a large number of reasons, even the best, biggest, most updating, perfect support sites that tackle every issue every time.... still have cb's and refunds, they are impossible to stop from happening.

Excellent point. Further you have to remember the program picked up a fee (avg $15 to $25) for each chargeback or, in the case of credits, was charged interchange on the credit in addition to the discount fee for the original sale.

[fuzebox]

I'm used to seeing refunds on the PPS programs I promote... Have nothing against it.

[candyflip]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Technically no sale was sent... the money was reversed, that's not a sale.

People refund for a large number of reasons, even the best, biggest, most updating, perfect support sites that tackle every issue every time.... still have cb's and refunds, they are impossible to stop from happening.

Of course, it could be a number of reasons. BUT...most people are charging back because they didn't get what they purchased, simple as that and not really something that's up for debate. Which is the crux of my point.

[BlackCrayon]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

Technically no sale was sent... the money was reversed, that's not a sale.

People refund for a large number of reasons, even the best, biggest, most updating, perfect support sites that tackle every issue every time.... still have cb's and refunds, they are impossible to stop from happening.

so what? thats pps. you get to keep the rebills and in turn, have to handle refunds and cb's..seems only fair.

[TheStout]

Originally Posted by candyflip

Of course, it could be a number of reasons. BUT...most people are charging back because they didn't get what they purchased, simple as that and not really something that's up for debate. Which is the crux of my point.

Most of the time payouts are set with the CB% in mind.

For the record we pay on the sale, regardless of CB.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by candyflip

Of course, it could be a number of reasons. BUT...most people are charging back because they didn't get what they purchased, simple as that and not really something that's up for debate. Which is the crux of my point.

Most CB's fall into a very tight group of reasons... never tried to access/never used it, never contacted support and something didn't work for them for many reasons or it's claimed stolen/not them that purchased it - ie: fraud. All of which is them contacting the bank for help and not us or the processors - so valid or not, we have no way to help at that point.

It's the refunds that are more, random problems, no contacting support or even if they do, false claims of who made the purchase, many many reasons. It's easier to keep these in check with decent support but they are just as frequent.

End of the day, it's still not a signup, not a sale.. no money was made and with the way affiliate fraud has been the last few years, any extra protection just means less of them returning to try again.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by BlackCrayon

so what? thats pps. you get to keep the rebills and in turn, have to handle refunds and cb's..seems only fair.

PPS means pay per sale/signup - if no money was made, no sale was made. That's fair.

Of course we get the rebills (but not on cb's/refunds), that's why the payout is normally higher than the sale. Without the rebills, this wouldn't be possible.

[gleem]

Originally Posted by candyflip

Of course, it could be a number of reasons. BUT...most people are charging back because they didn't get what they purchased, simple as that and not really something that's up for debate. Which is the crux of my point.

no, people get credits for not getting what they purchased, CB's are 95% of the time just pure fraud/stolen cards.

[Fiddler]

Originally Posted by james_clickmemedia

I am seeing a trend now that even PPS programs are taking all credits & CB's from affiliate's payouts. I know it is standard practice in the revshare model however did not know it was becoming a common practice amongst pps now.

Anyone else seeing this ?

We operate in that way, if we don't get the money why would anyone pay an affiliate for nothing?

Our retention is so strong that I personally recommend all my affiliates use revshare as we've had people earning a lot more after a few months on revshare then the same time on PPS.

Yes ok, less profit to us because now we're paying out more to those people, however if we are earning, they are earning, they have more money to invest in promoting us and everyone's a winner!

[TidalWave]

When a sales guy at any company, in any industry makes a sale -- its only a sale if the customer actually BUYS something.

Affiliates ARE THE SALES GUYS for programs.
If you make an introduction but the customer DOES NOT BUY, you didn't make a sale, you don't get paid the commission. All you did was make an introduction.
No company will pay anyone for simply making an introduction.

It's up to the sales guys as well to make sure they are getting the right type of customers that will seal the deal and stay on board.

Usually the sales guy is also responsible for making sure the customer is happy beyond the sale as well, luckily adult affiliates don't have to do that / have a way to do that.
So your job is still a typical sales guy, but some parts are easier, and some parts are harder.

[KillerK]

Originally Posted by TidalWave

When a sales guy at any company, in any industry makes a sale -- its only a sale if the customer actually BUYS something.

Affiliates ARE THE SALES GUYS for programs.
If you make an introduction but the customer DOES NOT BUY, you didn't make a sale, you don't get paid the commission. All you did was make an introduction.
No company will pay anyone for simply making an introduction.

It's up to the sales guys as well to make sure they are getting the right type of customers that will seal the deal and stay on board.

Usually the sales guy is also responsible for making sure the customer is happy beyond the sale as well, luckily adult affiliates don't have to do that / have a way to do that.
So your job is still a typical sales guy, but some parts are easier, and some parts are harder.

You are wrong, people pay for leads all the time in tons of different verticals.

Why do they have Email and Zip submits?

For Doc who we all know is an idiot, a PPS is someone entering his/her credit card and being approved for the Trial/Full purchase of said site.

[Barefootsies]

Originally Posted by james_clickmemedia

Credits & CB's now taken from affiliates

That is how it should be done.

That is how it works in the real world if you do commissioned type sales.

They cancel, back out, fraud, charge back, refund, etc. they remove it from your next check.

[DBS.US]

Originally Posted by Barefootsies

That is how it should be done.

That is how it works in the real world if you do commissioned type sales.

They cancel, back out, fraud, charge back, refund, etc. they remove it from your next check.

So true, but people still cry about it in the real world to

[OldJeff]

Originally Posted by candyflip

Of course, it could be a number of reasons. BUT...most people are charging back because they didn't get what they purchased, simple as that and not really something that's up for debate. Which is the crux of my point.

Not even remotely close to the truth, not in 1998, not today.

Most charge backs by far, excess of 90% are because the surfer is simply fucking lying to his bank saying he did not join any porn site.

[Paul Markham]

Originally Posted by candyflip

Of course, it could be a number of reasons. BUT...most people are charging back because they didn't get what they purchased, simple as that and not really something that's up for debate. Which is the crux of my point.

If the site is that bad why are you promoting it?

If a site is getting a few CBs above the average you should be sending your traffic elsewhere.

Or don't you care if your surfers get a good deal when they spend money?

[Dirty Dane]

CB on affiliate payout is not PPS. It's revshare.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by KillerK

You are wrong, people pay for leads all the time in tons of different verticals.

Why do they have Email and Zip submits?

For Doc who we all know is an idiot, a PPS is someone entering his/her credit card and being approved for the Trial/Full purchase of said site.

We're talking about pay per signup, not paying for leads... Other than adult mail programs, I don't know of a program that pays on email leads on a pps program.

I've never seen PPS explained that way in the terms of a program, but if they did then that's how it would work for that program.

Being that I've ran PPS and taken cb's/refund away and nobody bitched about it... it's safe to say your viewpoint probably is a bit closed minded or more likely you're a troll.

[TheDoc]

Originally Posted by Dirty Dane

CB on affiliate payout is not PPS. It's revshare.

Short of being paid up front an average of 2 months (often more) of the revshare amount. So instead of waiting months or needing time to balance out and raise the join value, you get it now and skip waiting 3-9 months and hoping the site keeps going.

Other than that, it does make it a bit more like revshare.

[Stephen]

Originally Posted by TheDoc

...if I didn't get paid, you don't get paid.

Fair is fair and this helps mitigate the incentive for affiliates to defraud programs

[GTS Mark]

I agree with it, but i think it should be standard practice to show the CB or credit on the PPS stats page. I am promoting an affiliate program currently where it showed 5 sales = $120 (i am getting $30 PPS). I had to e-mail to find out what was the discrepancy since they don't show the CB/credits on their stats page.

[bjlover]

Some of you guys need to grow up, this is business, affiliate programs are not charities