Shap

The explosion of free porn has hurt all of us. There is no question about that. The big question is where do we go from here? I think when fighting this problem (or any problem) it's important to know what the opposition is up to and thinking. If you have the time check out this link.

http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/n...1#comments-bar

Michael showed me this article this morning. At first I read it and thought so what. Then he told me to read the comments. Check them out. This is what we are up against

onedree

Astonishingly enough, I am still at the 'so what' stage.

Congrad's on having one of your Twistys images on the Today Show today.

NaughtyRob

Sadly many of the things they say are correct. But one thing that really sucks is that many of them think the tube sites produce the porn and give it away for free.

__________________
[email protected]
Skype: 17026955414
Vacares Web Hosting - Protect Your Ass with Included Daily Backups

Shap

No shit. NICE! I had no idea.

trevesty

Was going to post something similar to this..

BIGTYMER

They got a crystal clear shot of it too! Good thing your watermark wasn't in the lower left or right corner. :P

Did they pay to show that image?

trevesty

Shap, not at all busting balls here..

but these are customers. Surely they're not the only 5 people on the internet who think the same way about pricing structures, content quantity and quality.. etc, otherwise the market wouldn't be acting like it does today.

To me, responding to the market(and no, I don't mean launching a tube site) seems more logical than fighting demand.

$5 membership x 1000 is more $ than a $25 membership x 100.

onedree

It was amazing. The segment was on the prostitute who was with Charlie Sheen in his New York hotel room when he destroyed it.
Her name is Christina Walsh and the Today Show displayed a non nude photo of her. In the upper left hand corner it stated "Twistys.com".
Obviously you have her featured on your website.

Congratulations.

trevesty

Mutt

the smart guy was the guy who nailed the biggest enemy and it isn't the tubes - it's direct downloads via thousands of forums and blogs filled with links to the exploding file hosting scene, Rapidshare, Hotfile, Megaupload,Fileserver et al

Tube sites grabbed millions and millions of freeloading surfers from TGP/MGP's, surfers happy with instantly streamed poor quality Flash videos. The direct downloaders are............were..... our best customers. The savvy porn connoisseurs who want premium quality content in their favorite niche(s). They now can get it all almost as instantly and in the quality they'd get from a members area, close to the same quality they'd get from a DVD, with the help of Google, Filestube which will soon have 50 copycats, and all those forums and blogs. They are the final nails in our coffin. The DMCA fully protects the file hosting operators and the forum owners.

we're fucked.

__________________

Bryan G

tmz.com as well!

__________________
Bryan
skype: bryan.glass3 | ICQ 302999591

bronco67

With most young people, there's definitely a basic lack of understanding of how a goods and services economy works. Also, who the fuck do they think is going to keep making the porn they love to watch for free, when those producers don't get paid for their work? It's idiocy.

I think anyone that hasn't created anything in their life would have this stupid attitude.

__________________

Agent 488

the opposition = 99% of internet users.

emotional responses aside, the structure of the internet is to make information worthless, and the only way to monetize it is to create a false scarcity, which is increasingly untenable as the internet and it's users become more sophisticated.

there was a small window where the internet allowed people to profit from ip using pre-internet models but those days are over.

where to go? who knows, although millions are hustling to figure out new ways to profit while others are hand-wringing.

CurrentlySober

See? YOUR DOING IT WRONG!!! lol

As if...

__________________

My Dream Gal... XXX

FreeHugeMovies

Everyone should stop sending traffic to the companies that do business with them. If you buy advertising you aren't going to get any traffic from other parties.

CIVMatt

This article is any kinda surprise? The sad thing is it's all true, I kinda feel bad for the guys around here that somehow think they are any kind of important and starting a new fresh faced solo site is somehow going to change anything. Get creative if you want money, anything else is a waste of time, everything has changed - accept it.

Edit: Mutt is 100% correct, tubes aren't hurting anything, they are annoying, you want porn, you go to a forum - hell even mainstream forums now have adult sections with all direct downloads and it's acceptable and if you mention it's copyrighted material everyone looks at you like you're stupid.

__________________
Make easy money with Webcams

stocktrader23

They are right in many ways. Not to convince a single program owner of that and see if they have the nuts needed to try something extremely different.

__________________


Hands Free Adult - Join Once, Earn For Life

"I try to make a habit of bouncing my eyes up to the face of a beautiful woman, and often repeat “not mine” in my head or even verbally. She’s not mine. God has her set aside. She’s not mine. She’s His little girl, and she needs me to fight for her by keeping my eyes where they should be."

st0ned

Interesting that the meeting was held in Tucson of all places.

__________________
Conversion Sharks - 1,000+ adult dating offers, traffic management, and consistently high payouts.
We will guarantee and beat your current EPC to win your dating traffic!
Skype: ConversionSharks || Email: info /@/ conversionsharks.com

Slutboat

HAHAHAHA the commenters on that blog are the smartest people in the room.

__________________
The Slut Boat soon will be making another run
The Slut Boat promises something for everyone

TCLGirls

Well Arstechnica surfers are all very computer savvy, and most are geeks...so it is very unlikely that any of them would pay for porn. The average Joe though is not as sophisticated, and may be more likely to pay for a site membership.

Alprazolam

who gives a fuck what those little smug fucks think.

what they will do is cry when they are getting their parents into trouble.

suing end users is the best thing you can do for this. i know i stopped stealing music when people started getting served papers.

fuckem.

stocktrader23

Not sure if you are joking or not but I read more common sense there in 5 minutes than I've seen on this forum in 2 months.

__________________


Hands Free Adult - Join Once, Earn For Life

"I try to make a habit of bouncing my eyes up to the face of a beautiful woman, and often repeat “not mine” in my head or even verbally. She’s not mine. God has her set aside. She’s not mine. She’s His little girl, and she needs me to fight for her by keeping my eyes where they should be."

pornguy

One of the things that i see here is the mistaken thought that porn is not important.

Why do I say thats a mistaken thought? Simple. Anyone and every one will admit to listening to music. Go out and poll 5k people on the street about watching porn.

Porn is also important in other ways. It has taught me a lot of what NOT to do.

__________________
PornGuy skype me pornguy_epic

AmateurDough The Hottes Shemales online!
TChicks.com | Angeles Cid | Mariana Cordoba | MAILERS WELCOME!

GTS Mark

Alot of interesting comments in there

__________________

TheLegacy

I feel so loved after reading that - though we all know that 99.9% of those posting use it, and yet - no thank you

__________________

BIGTYMER

Nobody invited me...

Maxi

tony286

They wouldnt pay if it was a dollar, they would complain why wasnt it 50 cents. They trade fucking music and you can buy it for 99 cents. That's the excuse they use to make themselves feel pure.

Tom_PM

I remember back in the BBS days, the piracy issue evolved into people selling diskettes with activation codes printed on them. You'd get the diskette, call the phone number, punch in your code, and they'd spit out another code for you to punch into the dialog box.

Of course programs came along like f'n cracker and such where you could peek at the data and at first it'd auto-crack all kinds of those things. But to this day, that is a deterant that works to some degree. Not perfect.

I think efforts to deter piracy are fine and a normal part of things. Some people will never buy, and some always will. Most will do what's easy, but not what takes slight effort.

__________________
43-922-863 Shut up and play your guitar.

grumpy

for years now they have tried to take down all cp and guess what, its still there.
Im happy i dont have to live from internet porn.

__________________
Don't let greediness blur your vision | You gotta let some shit slide
icq - 441-456-888

BIGTYMER

Right on man! Some people are just freeloaders.

Tickler

Would they spend $250 million making Avatar, if everybody thought they should be able to watch it for FREE?

__________________
Big Sister Live - Live sex club paid in Euros

Why all the PSYCHIC ads in the papers, and on TV?
Makes $$$s on the web @ Psychic Access

Alprazolam

ok, i'll pay you 1 dollar pps on a 4 dollar monthly membership. deal?

MattO

They actually think there are THOUSANDS of people producing porn and giving it away? Which internet is this they speak of?

Adam_M

Is this real? Our "industry leaders" got together and came up with the master plan to embarrass people?

Well I am your first victim!

__________________
DiscountedPorn.Com
ReviewedPorn.com

DWB

The best comment for me in all of those was the guy saying we would have to totally "redo the internet" in order to achieve our goal. With some hard work, a lot of lawsuits, and good old fashioned ingenuity, I believe we can do exactly that. The alternative is what?

I'm not going to openly list any ideas here because I know some of the biggest pirates and pro-pirate "webmasters" are among us.

"Where we go from here" will either be where we allow it to go or where we take it.

DWB

That is not true. It all hurts collectively.

However, where tubes and file sharing really hurt us are in search results. They often dominate just about every porn keyword and then give you the same thing you were just searching for, for free. That hurts.

Forums are devastating, no doubt about it, but I can't point to any one thing and say it is worse than the other. We are being attacked from all sides and are generally unable to defend ourselves with our current defenses. We either have to create new defenses, fight back, or do nothing and take the beating until we are forced to close shop.

Those with no dogs in the fight will hate (you can see it already here with their posts - easy to spot them), pro-piracy clowns will always have reasons for why we will fail, but those who are already taking action (whatever that action is) do not need to be told if it is the right thing to do or not, because you know it is.

2MuchMark

When I asked a friend what he would do if he was arrested for download and sharing movies, he actually said "Why would I be arrested? It's free!". He had absolutely no clue at all about what he was really doing. Neither do these porn surfers.

Did anyone notice a "tone" to their rants? To me some of them seemed to talk as if they "deserved" their free porn... as if it was their right. Maybe I'm just testy tonight, but some of those people gave me that vibe...

__________________

Custom Software | Server Management | Integration and Technology Solutions
https://www.2much.net

RogerV

[QUOTE=Mutt;17648560]the smart guy was the guy who nailed the biggest enemy and it isn't the tubes - it's direct downloads via thousands of forums and blogs filled with links to the exploding file hosting scene, Rapidshare, Hotfile, Megaupload,Fileserver et al

Tube sites grabbed millions and millions of freeloading surfers from TGP/MGP's, surfers happy with instantly streamed poor quality Flash videos. The direct downloaders are............were..... our best customers. The savvy porn connoisseurs who want premium quality content in their favorite niche(s). They now can get it all almost as instantly and in the quality they'd get from a members area, close to the same quality they'd get from a DVD, with the help of Google, Filestube which will soon have 50 copycats, and all those forums and blogs. They are the final nails in our coffin. The DMCA fully protects the file hosting operators and the forum owners.

we're fucked.[/QUOT


yep we are fucked. no way to stop it now...

RogerV

like i have always said just ask anyone what is their favorite pornsite and they will mention one of the tubes 9 out of 10 people. ofcourse they all think its free why would they pay

RogerV

Meanwhile those who get sued will fall into these categories:
1) OMG I got this letter, and I'm going to pay to make this go away (whoo-hoo, the industry just made $100, if that after lawyer fees).
2) OMG, I'm being blackmailed. They're extorting me by threatening to have a public record of my porn activity. I know enough about the law to counter-sue.
3) OMG, my 9 year old son has been downloading porn. THIS is why porn needs to be made illegal!!!! The porn industry itself has made the case for us that they can't control who sees this evil material and we Christians are determined to stop them.

post from a surfer
now this is scary if you DMCA someone with a child

will76

Shap, if you ever want to offer a product that can't be stolen and add more value to your sites hit me up.

Fighting content theft IMO is a losing battle. People like Steve can nickle and dime with the lawsuits and make some money but as much as he makes from that he will continue to lose more from his picture and video sites.

There is no beating them and there is no stopping it this point. If you people are smart you will use pictures and videos as promotional and marketing materials to get traffic and then get them to join a membership for the stuff they can't steal. Why fight a losing battle when you can make some changes and capitalize from it ?

__________________
ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

RogerV

JUst curious if anyone has figured out a way to stop the porn ship from sinking?

Everyone always says innovate or adapt but I havnt seen anything new

GatorB

I hope all those freeloaders love 10, 20 year old porn form now on. DO they HONESTLY think that ocne ther is ZERO money in porn new porn is going to be made? People in the porn busines aren't doing it for charity. So they may say "Oooh there so much free porn" yeah great if old porn was good as new porn then no new porn would be made there wouldn't be a demand for it. People would just watch porn from the 70's and 80's. Honestly there is enough porn made form 1970-1990 to last one a lifetime. So why do guys want new porn? Beause guys want NEW girls. They don't want some porno movie their grandmas friend made back in 1973. So in 2025 when the newest porn scene is one from 2015, well enjoy it for the 1000th time and don't keep asking when something new is going to be made.

You know 20 years ago I paid $5 for ONE 2 hour porn movie on VHS that I could rent for 24 hours. And of course I had to actually get out of the house and go to a questionable part of town to get it and bring it back. If I had an option of paying $25-$30 a month for HUNDREDS or even 1000's of porno movies and I didn't even have to leave my house, I would have jumped all over that shit in a heartbeat.

GatorB

You are 100% correct. Even the music industy is facing this future very soon. Lot of people want to put ther heads in the sand and think if they wish hard enough they can put the genie back in the bottle. Ironcially I think if laws like COPA had passed and was enforced vigorously as well as 2257 I think the porn industry would be better off now.

Honestly even with your idea of offering stuff they can't steal and just using content as a means to and end of attracting customers I think the paysite model is doomed. I think pay sites will have to be free and the stuff they can't steal will be behind a paywall and they can pay to access that. That's how most mainstream sites make revenue.

will76

It will be 10 out of 10 soon.

Some of the better picture and video sites like Twistys is still holding on by having a big volume of loyal, older members who either don't surf around looking for free porn or don't know its out there. However, every day there is a new generation of potential buyers turning 18 years old, and these kids are internet savvy and not only know where all the free porn is but they think it should be free. It's 4-5 years now with tube sites out there, pretty much everyone under 25-26 is up to date. As the older, loyal members cancel out for various reasons (get married, credit card maxes out, they die, etc.) they will continue to lose more members than are being replaced.

When you really stop and think about, it's just pictures and videos... you can find most of that, if not all of it for free. Who wants to join a site and pay what is considered a lot of money these days for stuff they can not only find for free but even if they did join, what incentive do they have to rebill? They can see 99% of what you have in day 1. So they pay $30 to see 99% of what you have and then pay $30 the next month for 1% new stuff in updates? doesn't make sense. In another 5-10 years I think people will look back in amazement that people use to pay $30 a month for just pictures and videos.

__________________
ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

will76

The answers are right in front of their faces. No big innovation is needed. It's simple, sites need to become more interactive, there has to be stuff that is live, and there has to be interaction between the members and the content. Members should also have more control over the site. I have tons of great ideas on how to accomplish this, but apparently no one wants to listen.

It's just new to them and for whatever reason some of these old timers don't want to change. I don't understand why. Is it because they are scared to, is it an ego thing and they think they can beat it, do they just not care anymore and they are going to cut costs and ride the ship down living off of the rebills for as long as they can, or are they so big that they think they can't change, or they think they shouldn't have to change, or do they have their heads in the sand and they think nothing is wrong. I totally don't understand it.

it's like trying to talk to your best friend who's gf just cheated on him and he is still hung up on her. You have a non biased opinion looking at it from the outside but he is all tied up into it and can't see clearly what is going on. It's like most of these people are in a fog and you can see crystal clear, but they don't want to hear what you have to say.

__________________
ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

will76

They don't care if they even know how it worked. There really is sooo much freakin porn on the net right now that has been produced in the last 5-10 years that most people could continuously watch porn videos non stop for the next 50 years and not run out of stuff to see that they like. Maybe in 20 years the porn will be out dated, and if there wasn't anything new made then they would be up shit's creek. But they don't care about that and none of you will be around in 20 years if everyone stops buying.

The 'there will be no porn produced and nothing for them to see" argument really doesn't hold water and isn't going to slow them down or stop the problem at all.

__________________
ICQ: 86364801 Email: will [at] innovativeassets [dot] com

Maxi

Get with the times man, this industry milked the fuck out of surfers for years, people made millions selling "free trials" that went on to charge $29.99 on peoples cards for months.

Then we have the garbage cookie cutter turn key "pay sites" that aren't worth 3 cents let alone $30 bucks a month, then there's the fact that you all sat on your fat asses raking in the money without any innovation since 1997.

What did you expect? Now the tables are turning and there's still money to be made in porn, just that you have to use your brain a little now and won't be selling memberships to your shitty cookie cutter turn key pay sites, and need to come up with a better way to promote then submitting galleries to TGP's and script generated blogs.

Look at mainstream, it's been evolving while this industry has pretty much sat on it's ass since the 90's.

I remember my first porn paycheck was over $30k and all I did was spam Altavista and had a page with no content other then thumbnails linking to cecash free trials. It's not that easy anymore.

RogerV

Crazy but I agree with everything you say in this thread lol.

I think its easier said then done. I know everyone hates my new model but It was the best I could come up with to counter the free porn. all the members in our system chat with eachother and are happy to pay and watch porn etc.
we took away the dirty feeling. you will see many women are in the system and ready to get you involved. Its not a CD industry anymore and its not an impulse buy anymore since its free.

If you have great ideas for paysites let us know I'm ready to improve our system and paysites anyway I can