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simon says 06-20-2014 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 20126713)
I think the only thing that Clinton did that got me upset was NAFTA. Even Hillary spoke about it needing changes when she ran for president.

You cant be serious Brett. Lying to congress, Monica Lewinsky, disbarred, Somalia.
Breath in, breath out, submariner.

Rochard 06-20-2014 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 20128943)

So here's your problem, you want me to keep posting the truth that there are problems with your stand on this or do you just want to agree?

And don't give me that shit about this was going on already, all these say it's because of Obamacare

But you aren't posting the truth - at all.

You quote an article that takes the cheapest "bronze" package and compares it to expensive private plan which is like comparing apples to airplanes. Then you post an article where a woman in a small down can't find a pediatric cardiologist without giving consideration to the fact that pediatric cardiologist can't make a living in a town of 50k people. Then you post a horror story about a woman with a huge medical problem and suddenly can't be found in the system - Well that's never happened before has it?

All of these problems existed before.

Robbie 06-20-2014 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kane (Post 20131665)
I have a feeling if a republican wins the White House in 2016 the democrats may return the favor and pretty much filibuster and otherwise block anything and everything they want to do. Some of that will have to do with the make up of the house and senate at that time, but think there are a lot of democrats who saw the republicans become obstructionists and how it worked to help get them control of the house back and they will be eager to return the favor.

Any republican president may have a long, uphill battle ahead of them.

Unfortunately they won't be able to filibuster anything.

Dumbass Harry Reid changed the Senate Rules (the nuclear option) and took away the minority party's right to filibuster.

The old senile fool didn't give a damn that he might not always be the majority party. And since he can't seem to find a way to work with the Republicans he pulled the "nuclear option".

So now when the Republicans take over...he's fucked. :(

kane 06-20-2014 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 20131684)
Unfortunately they won't be able to filibuster anything.

Dumbass Harry Reid changed the Senate Rules (the nuclear option) and took away the minority party's right to filibuster.

The old senile fool didn't give a damn that he might not always be the majority party. And since he can't seem to find a way to work with the Republicans he pulled the "nuclear option".

So now when the Republicans take over...he's fucked. :(

Doesn't that only apply to the senate? There is still plenty of opportunities to obstruct in the house and there are still many procedural things the opposing party can and (and in the current case are) do(ing) To slow things down.

There has always been partisan opposition, it is the nature of politics, it has just been taken to a new level in the last 5-6 years and I see that trend continuing.

Robbie 06-20-2014 06:11 PM

nah it's been MUCH worse in U.S. history. Like right before the Civil War for instance:
---
Preston Smith Brooks (August 5, 1819 – January 27, 1857) was a Democratic Representative from South Carolina, serving from 1853 until his death in 1857.

Brooks was a fervent advocate of slavery. He is primarily remembered for severely beating Senator Charles Sumner (Free Soil-Massachusetts), an abolitionist, with a cane on the floor of the United States Senate, on May 22, 1856.

This was in retaliation for an anti-slavery speech by Sumner in which Sumner attacked Brooks' uncle, Senator Andrew Butler (Democrat-South Carolina). Brooks' action was applauded by many Southerners, and abhorred in the North. Although an attempt to oust him from the House of Representatives was made, and he immediately resigned his seat, he received only token punishment and was re-elected by the people of South Carolina (but died before his next term began).

Sumner was seriously injured, and unable to serve in the Senate for three years, though eventually he recovered somewhat.

Brooks' act and the polarizing national reaction to it to are frequently cited as a major factor in the rising tensions leading up to the American Civil War.
----

Those crazy Democrats! lol

Vendzilla 06-20-2014 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simon says (Post 20131668)
You cant be serious Brett. Lying to congress, Monica Lewinsky, disbarred, Somalia.
Breath in, breath out, submariner.

Let me guess, LC again? Really stupid post BTW

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard (Post 20131679)
But you aren't posting the truth - at all.

You quote an article that takes the cheapest "bronze" package and compares it to expensive private plan which is like comparing apples to airplanes. Then you post an article where a woman in a small down can't find a pediatric cardiologist without giving consideration to the fact that pediatric cardiologist can't make a living in a town of 50k people. Then you post a horror story about a woman with a huge medical problem and suddenly can't be found in the system - Well that's never happened before has it?

All of these problems existed before.

Maybe you should look at what Amelia posted about her problems finding a doctor and she lives in the middle of Los Angeles.

And they are getting worse, we were promised they would get better. you know, every family would save $2500?
You can keep your doctor
you can keep your plan

These are the rally cries from the left that pushed the American people to believe that this was a good thing and they are all lies!

http://www.heritage.org/research/rep...acare-promises
Ten Broken Obamacare Promises

Promise #1: ?If you like your health care plan, you?ll be able to keep your health care plan, period.?[2]
Reality: Millions of Americans have lost and will lose their coverage due to Obamacare.

Promise #2: ?[T]hat means that no matter how we reform health care, we will keep this promise to the American people: If you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor, period.?[6]
Reality: Many Americans might not be able to keep their current doctor without paying extra.

Promise #3: ?In an Obama administration, we?ll lower premiums by up to $2,500 for a typical family per year.?[9]
Reality: Premiums for people purchasing coverage in the individual market have significantly increased in a majority of states.

Promise #4: ?[F]or the 85 and 90 percent of Americans who already have health insurance, this thing?s already happened. And their only impact is that their insurance is stronger, better and more secure than it was before. Full stop. That?s it. They don?t have to worry about anything else.?[12]
Reality: Obamacare imposes certain new benefit mandates on those with employer-sponsored coverage?a majority of Americans.

Promise #5: ?Under my plan, no family making less than $250,000 a year will see any form of tax increase.?[15]
Reality: Obamacare contains 18 separate tax hikes, fees, and penalties, many of which heavily impact the middle class.

Promise #6: ?I will not sign a plan that adds one dime to our deficits?either now or in the future.?[18]
Reality: Obamacare?s new spending is unsustainable.

Promise #7: ?[W]hatever ideas exist in terms of bending the cost curve and starting to reduce costs for families, businesses, and government, those elements are in this bill.?[21]
Reality: Health spending is still rising and is projected to grow at an average rate of 5.8 percent from 2012 to 2022.[22]

Promise #8: ?I will protect Medicare.?[24]
Reality: Obamacare cuts Medicare spending.

Promise #9: ?I will sign a universal health care bill into law by the end of my first term as president that will cover every American.?[27]
Reality: Millions of Americans will remain uninsured.

Promise #10: ?So this law means more choice, more competition, lower costs for millions of Americans.?[29]
Reality: Obamacare has not increased insurer competition or consumer choice.

2MuchMark 06-20-2014 09:35 PM

Lol give up Vendzilla. You are posting half-truths at best. The rest are lies or leave out the rest of the picture.

This is what I don't understand about you republicans. You see that Obama is doing a half decent job. You see that while he has been president he has accomplished alot, but you still refuse to give him any credit. Just a few days ago, the Benghazi suspect was caught. What do republicans say? "What took him so long?", if you can believe that. Republicans seem to forget that George Bush actually gave up looking for Bin Laden...

Sure you can disagree with some of his ideas and policies, but there's no reason at all to hate the guy. Republicans can't attack the guy as he is, so they make up things about him. IE: "He's a socialist". "He's a communist". "He's a Muslim". "He's a terrorist". "He hates America", and on and on. It used to be funny, but now its just sad.

Robbie 06-20-2014 10:55 PM

Mark, I didn't see Vendzilla post anything that you just said.

He posted some pretty straight forward facts. The President has straight up lied about most of the major things he promised to do.

And yes...so did the EVIL Bush.

But wasn't that the point of voting for Pres. Obama? That he would be different?

That's the disappointment people have in him. He promised WAY too much, and delivered far too little.

This is where he is right now:
http://www.gallup.com/poll/113980/ga...-approval.aspx

At least he's still ahead of EVIL Bush's last couple of years:
http://www.gallup.com/poll/116500/pr...orge-bush.aspx

kane 06-20-2014 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 20131868)
Mark, I didn't see Vendzilla post anything that you just said.

He posted some pretty straight forward facts. The President has straight up lied about most of the major things he promised to do.

And yes...so did the EVIL Bush.

But wasn't that the point of voting for Pres. Obama? That he would be different?

That's the disappointment people have in him. He promised WAY too much, and delivered far too little.

This is where he is right now:
http://www.gallup.com/poll/113980/ga...-approval.aspx

At least he's still ahead of EVIL Bush's last couple of years:
http://www.gallup.com/poll/116500/pr...orge-bush.aspx

One of my biggest disappointments in Obama is that he made transparency one of his major campaign themes. After Bush had hidden most of the cost of the war in Iraq through creative accounting and lost the trust of the people because of the deception behind it, Obama promised all kinds of transparency and not only has he not delivered, he has gone to great lengths to keep things secret and go after anyone who exposes things about his administration.

Robbie 06-20-2014 11:31 PM

Agreed Kane.

The first and biggest one to me was right off the bat when he promised to have the entire Health Care Act debated and written LIVE on CSPAN so that the American people would be 100% involved.

That's when I knew he was going to be just another politician. :(

Check out this story:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...cretive-nixon/

Rochard 06-20-2014 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ********** (Post 20131837)
Lol give up Vendzilla. You are posting half-truths at best. The rest are lies or leave out the rest of the picture.

This is what I don't understand about you republicans. You see that Obama is doing a half decent job. You see that while he has been president he has accomplished alot, but you still refuse to give him any credit. Just a few days ago, the Benghazi suspect was caught. What do republicans say? "What took him so long?", if you can believe that. Republicans seem to forget that George Bush actually gave up looking for Bin Laden...

Sure you can disagree with some of his ideas and policies, but there's no reason at all to hate the guy. Republicans can't attack the guy as he is, so they make up things about him. IE: "He's a socialist". "He's a communist". "He's a Muslim". "He's a terrorist". "He hates America", and on and on. It used to be funny, but now its just sad.


This is what I just don't get. I have a friend that is a die hard Republican and every now and then he'll make some silly comment. The last one was "Look at what Obama did the economy". I was dumbfounded and had no idea what to say to him. There is no denying that the American economy is much better than when Obama first took office. Is the economy great or fantastic? No, but six years ago we were in the worst recession in our lifetimes - people were loosing their houses in bulk.

If you cannot see that things are better you must be blind.

kane 06-21-2014 12:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 20131878)
Agreed Kane.

The first and biggest one to me was right off the bat when he promised to have the entire Health Care Act debated and written LIVE on CSPAN so that the American people would be 100% involved.

That's when I knew he was going to be just another politician. :(

Check out this story:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/...cretive-nixon/

That's crazy. It's one thing to not follow through with a promise, but in this case to go to the extreme in the opposite direction is just sad.

Robbie 06-21-2014 01:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kane (Post 20131900)
That's crazy. It's one thing to not follow through with a promise, but in this case to go to the extreme in the opposite direction is just sad.

I think he wanted to do the things he promised.

But then he got surrounded by old time career politicians: Reid in the Senate, Pelosi in the House, and the ultimate career/insider Joe Biden as his VP.

I think he respects them as having a lot more experience than he did in govt., so he heeded their advice and took direction from them.

It's the only thing I can think of that would explain what he did as opposed to what he said he was going to do. I can't think of anybody doing a total 180 on things like he did. Especially when he seemed so passionate about NOT doing that.

kane 06-21-2014 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie (Post 20131919)
I think he wanted to do the things he promised.

But then he got surrounded by old time career politicians: Reid in the Senate, Pelosi in the House, and the ultimate career/insider Joe Biden as his VP.

I think he respects them as having a lot more experience than he did in govt., so he heeded their advice and took direction from them.

It's the only thing I can think of that would explain what he did as opposed to what he said he was going to do. I can't think of anybody doing a total 180 on things like he did. Especially when he seemed so passionate about NOT doing that.

I wouldn't be shocked at all if that is exactly what happened. Every politician makes promises they can't or don't keep, but he did a full 180 on this. I have a feeling they might have convinced him that his enemies might use it against him somehow and he got paranoid.

Robbie 06-21-2014 02:18 AM

I can just hear Harry Reid in that high/scratchy bizarre voice saying: "Oh no Mr. President, that's not how WE do it here in Washington. That just won't do"

bronco67 06-21-2014 05:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vendzilla (Post 20131659)
So you were the kid that said to his parents, why not? Billy's parents let him? Just because the republicans did it makes it right? NO



LOL, you should read more history, first it was Bush that Originally signed the treaty you are talking about, second, then new treaty had flaws in it that the Republicans had issues with. Mainly letting the Swiss run it.


Immigration reform can't happen when 1,000's of kids are crossing a unsecured border and giving up to border patrol. Fix that first.



So you were for it when Reagan fired all of them and replaced them?


Yeah, Obama putting all the energy companies under the will of the EPA, that will work when China doesn't have to listen, you do know we are all breathing the same air don't you?

I think I did a pretty good job!

You didn't even give direct answers to my point (which are all knowable facts) and instead chose to evade.

The recent FAA thing wasn't about the FAA, they were just a pawn in Republicans little brinksmanship game. Regan's episode years ago? What the fuck does that have to do with what happened recently?

The UN treaty vote was fucked by the Teabillies, who don't trust the anything UN, and the rest of the senators fell in line with them. What you said was kind of correct, but it just proves my point. They come up with some excuse to not vote for something to be obstructionists, even in the presence of Mr Dole.

Complaining about Mexicans coming across the border doesn't answer why they waste our tax dollars with meaningless votes on repealing Obamacare over and over. Republicans need to be the leaders on Immigration reform, but they're waiting until after their seats are safe from the mid terms before they even make an attempt at it. Shows no balls, because it might actually help them more than they think.

So you're one of those geniuses who would get rid of the EPA? You realize our air would be worse than China's if we had no EPA.

You just looked at my points and probably had no idea any of that stuff happened because you get your news from all conservative sources. Then you popped around Google to brush up and give some half assed answers. That stuff I listed isn't even a fraction of all of their idiocy of late. I didn't even touch the gerrymandering, voting rights tampering, outright racism, abortion, etc. The bottom line is you constantly stick up for a pack of giant gaping assholes. These jerks are your kind of people.

Robbie 06-21-2014 10:23 AM

@bronco67 I think the EPA did a great job helping get some major pollution stopped in the USA

There used to be some very nasty stuff being dumped in rivers and landfills. VERY nasty.

But the agency has kind of morphed over the decades (like most bureaucracies do). And now they basically write LAWS. And that is something that shouldn't be happening.

They aren't legislators. They weren't voted in to office. They are not lawmakers.

But they create "regulations" and punish people all the same.

And because the head of it is a political appointee, they are politicized as well.

That's my problem with the EPA.

Like every bureaucracy, it has become too big and too powerful without enough Congressional oversight.

And because it has a warm and fuzzy name "Environmental Protection Agency", it makes it sound like if you say something bad about it...you HATE the environment.
(sort of like they did with The Patriot Act, criticize that and you HATE your country because you're not a "patriot")

timmyc38 06-21-2014 03:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AsianDivaGirlsWebDude (Post 20125315)
http://www.capitalnewyork.com/sites/...mney%20mtp.jpg

FWIW, unless he flip-flops again, Romney on Meet the Press today said he is NOT running in 2016:



He would be doing this... :helpme



/thread

:stoned

ADG

good god, look at Christie .. fat f*ck


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