adult is dead....it's not, however... - GoFuckYourself.com

AWW - Kevin · 03-30-2011, 10:17 AM

IMO we really fucked ourselves.

then ...say 6-8y ago
1. we had half as many internet users
2. today people are 500% less scared using CC's online
3. internet was to slow to offer HQ.. and WTF is HQ !
4. back then little video content and low Q compared to now
5. and and and

still so many webmasters made a shitload MORE cash back then....

besides the few cam sites, "some" tubes selling ads. etc... that are doing well
we are nowhere near making the money we should be making!

talk about fucking up an industry sector Well Done

nikki99 · 03-30-2011, 10:19 AM

and another thread

Scott McD · 03-30-2011, 10:20 AM

Then this asshole came along and made a site where people spend most of their time online updating a stupid fucking "status", instead of jerking off to some HD porn they paid for with their CC...

Fuck you!

CaptainHowdy · 03-30-2011, 10:21 AM

djroof · 03-30-2011, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott McD

Then this asshole came along and made a site where people spend most of their time online updating a stupid fucking "status", instead of jerking off to some HD porn they paid for with their CC...

Fuck you!

omg.... hahahahahahahahahaha

AdultKing · 03-30-2011, 10:24 AM

As I have said in many other threads, people are still sitting on the same business model that existed when I started 15 years ago.

Tour, Subscribe, Content Area + Affiliate Programs which took off around 2000

The model is old, the surfers are disinterested and more savvy about how to get your content for free.

So what's the solution ? Entertain and engage the surfer , don't just throw a members area at them.

The reason why we made so much 15 - 10 years ago was that there were less sites and high demand. Filesharing hadn't really taken off, tubes weren't even dreamt about , even YouTube as we know it now is only 7 or 8 years old.

There is a huge amount of free content around, content doesn't sell like it used to because there is (a) so much of it cheap or free and (b) it's more readily available.

What's the solution ? Interactivity and engagement. Passive sites don't cut the mustard anymore.

TeenCat · 03-30-2011, 10:27 AM

i see you are doing 1:14 ... not bad for fucked up industry

AWW - Kevin · 03-30-2011, 10:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

As I have said in many other threads, people are still sitting on the same business model that existed when I started 15 years ago.

Tour, Subscribe, Content Area + Affiliate Programs which took off around 2000

The model is old, the surfers are disinterested and more savvy about how to get your content for free...................

more savvy..... sure, the real problem is the "free content" part, not that there is free content available but the amount and even decent quality that is available now in every niche you can think off!

and 99% of "porn' surfer know that

AdultKing · 03-30-2011, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWW - Kevin

more savvy..... sure, the real problem is the "free content" part, not that there is free content available but the amount and even decent quality that is available now in every niche you can think off!

and 99% of "porn' surfer know that

So what's new ? This isn't limited to this industry. I watch TV shows now that take years to make it to Australia, content is slushing around everywhere, music, tv, movies, porn etc

If there is a copious amount of ready content to take the time of the consumer and provide them less time and inclination to sign up to paysites based on a 15 year old model, then what the fuck does that tell you ?

For an industry that led the way forging e-commerce, content delivery, affiliate marketing systems and drove much innovation in video, programming and web standards there seems to have been a rapid shift from innovation to laziness and utter fucking stupidity!!!

If you hit your finger with a hammer you are careful not to do it again because it hurts, but most of this industry is doing everything that hurts and not learning from it.

Dont blame Facebook, dont blame Nathan/Manwin, blame your fucking selves for being so fucking dumb! Do something new for fucks sake.. these threads frustrate me , I am sure that there are some smart people left in this industry, perhaps they can lead the way because the masses seem to want to shift blame to some other problem rather than the fact that they are too stupid to try something new.

bbobby86 · 03-30-2011, 10:56 AM

we are the champions...

03-30-2011, 11:04 AM

6-8 years ago, your ratios were better than 1:14?

AWW - Kevin · 03-30-2011, 11:09 AM

slow down mate..

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

So what's new ? This isn't limited to this industry. I watch TV shows now that take years to make it to Australia, content is slushing around everywhere, music, tv, movies, porn etc

never said it was limited to this industry, but i don't see many bands or movie studios giving away free CDs/DVDs or uploading new releases on the net!

Quote:

For an industry that led the way forging e-commerce, content delivery, affiliate marketing systems and drove much innovation in video, programming and web standards there seems to have been a rapid shift from innovation to laziness and utter fucking stupidity!!!

no argument there

Quote:

If you hit your finger with a hammer you are careful not to do it again because it hurts, but most of this industry is doing everything that hurts and not learning from it.

like giving away "to much" free porn? agree

Quote:

Dont blame Facebook, dont blame Nathan/Manwin, blame your fucking selves for being so fucking dumb! Do something new for fucks sake.. these threads frustrate me , I am sure that there are some smart people left in this industry, perhaps they can lead the way because the masses seem to want to shift blame to some other problem rather than the fact that they are too stupid to try something new.

didn't even know how to spell facebook or manwin till you brought it up

PiracyPitbull · 03-30-2011, 11:18 AM

It would help if some content owners removed the bajillion cyberlocker links to their content.

96ukssob · 03-30-2011, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWW - Kevin

IMO we really fucked ourselves.

then ...say 6-8y ago
1. we had half as many internet users
2. today people are 500% less scared using CC's online
3. internet was to slow to offer HQ.. and WTF is HQ !
4. back then little video content and low Q compared to now
5. and and and

still so many webmasters made a shitload MORE cash back then....

besides the few cam sites, "some" tubes selling ads. etc... that are doing well
we are nowhere near making the money we should be making!

talk about fucking up an industry sector Well Done

translation... "i have to actually put in time now to make money and there are more serious competitors then 5 years ago. big business (tubes) are 'stealing' my customers and instead of developing sites and ideas on how to get visitors to convert to a customer, ill just sit around and hope big box adult store closes down."

How do you think those small town businesses feel when a WalMart comes in? most people sit outside of walmart and protest (as most here are bitching about tubes) while others come up with more creative ideas to keep customers. Sure, business isnt as easy as it was before with customers just walking in with money in hand, but they now have to actually try and use more tools, such as creative marketing, etc.

BTW, same people in mainstream bitch about how its 10x or 100x harder now then 5 years ago. No shit, there was a lot more smaller guys back then and traffic was a lot easier to convert then now.

cooldude7 · 03-30-2011, 11:38 AM

adult is not dead, people are still making shitload of money in adult.

AWW - Kevin · 03-30-2011, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bossku69

translation... "i have to actually put in time now to make money and there are more serious competitors then 5 years ago. big business (tubes) are 'stealing'.....

lol don't worry about me mate..i'm doing just fine.

WalMart as an example... no offense but wtf are u smoking.... WalMart maybe compared to
say videobox.....lots of choices at a discount price... not giving it away for free.

INever · 03-30-2011, 11:47 AM

I'm back in mainstream working on mobile projects.

Giving away free content, google ranking pirates above paysites, tubedevils, lack of technical and marketing innovation plus too much time wasted chatting with Paul Markham on GFY combined to kill adult.

GatorB · 03-30-2011, 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWW - Kevin

lol don't worry about me mate..i'm doing just fine.

WalMart as an example... no offense but wtf are u smoking.... WalMart maybe compared to
say videobox.....lots of choices at a discount price... not giving it away for free.

A) that doesn't mean shit.

B) don't spend that $420 all in one place.

$5 submissions · 03-30-2011, 08:08 PM

One thing doesn't change though--keep the customer FIRST in mind and build a QUALITY experience and you will be rewarded.

AdultKing · 03-30-2011, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by $5 submissions

One thing doesn't change though--keep the customer FIRST in mind and build a QUALITY experience and you will be rewarded.

AWW - Kevin · 03-31-2011, 12:29 AM

1st up i suggest you read my title "adult is dead....it's not, however..."

i know it's not dead..doesn't mean it's doing anywhere near as well for webmasters as it should !!

internet/IT.. one of THE growth sectors over the last decade or so, yet big programs
have closed down, resource sites, news sites, adult hosts, webmaster forums gone.

what's that tell ya?

HarryMuff · 03-31-2011, 01:29 AM

links pulled

Tantrixxx · 03-31-2011, 02:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TeenCat

i see you are doing 1:14 .

boubtful

Paul Markham · 03-31-2011, 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

As I have said in many other threads, people are still sitting on the same business model that existed when I started 15 years ago.

Tour, Subscribe, Content Area + Affiliate Programs which took off around 2000

The model is old, the surfers are disinterested and more savvy about how to get your content for free.

So what's the solution ? Entertain and engage the surfer , don't just throw a members area at them.

The reason why we made so much 15 - 10 years ago was that there were less sites and high demand. Filesharing hadn't really taken off, tubes weren't even dreamt about , even YouTube as we know it now is only 7 or 8 years old.

There is a huge amount of free content around, content doesn't sell like it used to because there is (a) so much of it cheap or free and (b) it's more readily available.

What's the solution ? Interactivity and engagement. Passive sites don't cut the mustard anymore.

Quote:

If you hit your finger with a hammer you are careful not to do it again because it hurts, but most of this industry is doing everything that hurts and not learning from it.

Dont blame Facebook, dont blame Nathan/Manwin, blame your fucking selves for being so fucking dumb! Do something new for fucks sake.. these threads frustrate me , I am sure that there are some smart people left in this industry, perhaps they can lead the way because the masses seem to want to shift blame to some other problem rather than the fact that they are too stupid to try something new.

If there is one main reason it's the belief that "Traffic is King" because it led to so much money being spent on traffic and so little on the product that 1,000s of sites and affiliates could pop up and all were sharing from the same pot.

The increase in traffic was largely in countries we couldn't bill or simply didn't have the disposable income to spend. The actual market never expanded enough to take up the expansion in the suppliers.

Why don't sites improve the product? Most can't because of skills of the shooter or the cost of making a members area that's god enough. The head long rush to go exclusive, to please affiliates submitting to TGP sites, led to more cheap content because no would pay for a decent scene. We were making more selling non exclusive than any custom shooter could dream of. And the same goes for every good shooter.

Adult's not dead, just a lot of people in it and many more are just hanging on.

Paul Markham · 03-31-2011, 03:50 AM

The big question is how to turn it all around?

Obviously the present business model isn't working. So what would?

The solution has to be inside the members area. We've tried just about everything we can outside and that's what brought us to this point.

Here's a few ideas.

Explain to surfers how most Dating sites work, by Geo targeting and hanging on to members for as long as possible. Then giving them links to free dating sites.

Giving away inside the members area live 1-1 chat for a lot less than is available on sites like cams.com. I don't know what they cost at the moment but a large % has to go to affiliates, by removing that the price falls. Sites earn by keeping the member rebilling to get his cheap chat.

Selling a product that can't be given away. Live sex 1-100 or 1-1,000. What ever it takes to make the cost so low a site can afford to add it into their members area. These shows have to be good. A live version of the faked porn on most websites isn't going to retain. So pay girls according to the people watching her and how long they watch her. Kick out bad girl.

The business can no longer afford decent exclusive content. 3 solo scenes for $2,000 isn't enough. A BG for $1500 isn't either. And many sites want it for less.

In major niches the idea that a scene can be saturated in a year is silly. So sell non exclusive scenes enough times at a price that allows the shooter to shoot great content. Say 15 times for a solo girl at $100.

Kick out bad shooters, bad models and the idea that the same scene shot over and over with just changing the girl is worth anything more than a 30 day membership. How many times before this gets boring? A girl getting fucked in the back of a van? Members don't stay because sites don't deserve staying in.

And then there's price and membership. Some customers simply don't want 30 days. They are very content with 30 minutes today and then 30 minutes next week. A 30 day membership only suits the customer who wants to login everyday. Change prices and membership to suit the member, not the affiliates and sellers.

Stop sending traffic to sites that rip off or disappoint customers, you're only hurting yourself. Because how long do you keep hitting yourself with a hammer, does it take until you realise it's wrong? 15 years most customers are very wary.

Quite clearly online porn started in times when customers had little options. Today he does and he CHOOSE those options over ours. We need to change to suit him, not ourselves.

SomeCreep · 03-31-2011, 03:58 AM

Makes you wonder what the online adult industry will be like 10 years from now.

criticaldotnet · 03-31-2011, 04:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AWW - Kevin

IMO we really fucked ourselves.

then ...say 6-8y ago
1. we had half as many internet users
2. today people are 500% less scared using CC's online
3. internet was to slow to offer HQ.. and WTF is HQ !
4. back then little video content and low Q compared to now
5. and and and

still so many webmasters made a shitload MORE cash back then....

besides the few cam sites, "some" tubes selling ads. etc... that are doing well
we are nowhere near making the money we should be making!

talk about fucking up an industry sector Well Done

Those who adapt to the times are the ones who will make money.

Fabien · 03-31-2011, 06:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott McD

Then this asshole came along and made a site where people spend most of their time online updating a stupid fucking "status", instead of jerking off to some HD porn they paid for with their CC...

Fuck you!

Yep and add tube sites/torrents, card scrubbing, new laws, money crisis and ALL OF US marketing da shit.

Lots of slices of the pie left huh ?

CaptainHowdy · 03-31-2011, 06:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbobby86

we are the champions...

...

Fabien · 03-31-2011, 06:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdultKing

So what's new ? This isn't limited to this industry. I watch TV shows now that take years to make it to Australia, content is slushing around everywhere, music, tv, movies, porn etc

If there is a copious amount of ready content to take the time of the consumer and provide them less time and inclination to sign up to paysites based on a 15 year old model, then what the fuck does that tell you ?

For an industry that led the way forging e-commerce, content delivery, affiliate marketing systems and drove much innovation in video, programming and web standards there seems to have been a rapid shift from innovation to laziness and utter fucking stupidity!!!

If you hit your finger with a hammer you are careful not to do it again because it hurts, but most of this industry is doing everything that hurts and not learning from it.

Dont blame Facebook, dont blame Nathan/Manwin, blame your fucking selves for being so fucking dumb! Do something new for fucks sake.. these threads frustrate me , I am sure that there are some smart people left in this industry, perhaps they can lead the way because the masses seem to want to shift blame to some other problem rather than the fact that they are too stupid to try something new.

Well what do you think i've been trying to do for the last 2 fucking years ?
Seriously

I ain't mad at you by the way, i'm pissed about the hole biz and anything constructive will be MORE THAN WELCOME

TheDoc · 03-31-2011, 06:31 AM

Industry is done people, take a hike, leave, go... retire, that's business. More money for those that are killing it, every ever minute of the day, that's business too.

PornHero · 03-31-2011, 07:30 AM

The only reason why anyone would be surprised at the changes in the industry is purely due to a lack of understanding of Business 101.

The internet is a decentralized system that has increased competition for people's time & money. The adult business has a low barrier-to-entry so competition has increased because of higher than average profit margins.

Even if there weren't any tubes or filesharing sites, 1000 of new webmasters would have entered the business over the past few years and you would have ended up making the same money you are currently making in 2011 due to the increased competition.

If you can't figure out a way to continue to make good cash in the adult business in 2011 then you aren't as smart as you think you are.

03-30-2011, 10:17 AM	#1
AWW - Kevin Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: AdultWebmasterInfo Posts: 2,353	adult is dead....it's not, however... IMO we really fucked ourselves. then ...say 6-8y ago 1. we had half as many internet users 2. today people are 500% less scared using CC's online 3. internet was to slow to offer HQ.. and WTF is HQ ! 4. back then little video content and low Q compared to now 5. and and and still so many webmasters made a shitload MORE cash back then.... besides the few cam sites, "some" tubes selling ads. etc... that are doing well we are nowhere near making the money we should be making! talk about fucking up an industry sector Well Done __________________ Add Your Resource ICQ: 1212-58311

03-30-2011, 10:19 AM	#2
nikki99 Supermodel Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Sodoma & Gomorra Posts: 22,847	and another thread __________________ SMC Revenue - Best Tgirl websites of the world now VR Non exclusive BIG Tranny/shemale Package for sale, full 2257 - hit me up skype: nikkimontero

03-30-2011, 10:20 AM	#3
Scott McD Too lazy to set a custom title Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Glasgow, Scotland Posts: 67,795	Then this asshole came along and made a site where people spend most of their time online updating a stupid fucking "status", instead of jerking off to some HD porn they paid for with their CC... Fuck you! __________________ I Buy My High Quality Traffic Here, You Should Too!

03-30-2011, 10:21 AM	#4
CaptainHowdy Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Happy in the dark. Posts: 93,006	__________________ FLASH SALE INSANITY! deal with a 100% Trusted Seller Buy Traffic Spots on a High-Quality Network 1 Year or Lifetime — That’s Right, Until the Internet Explodes!

03-30-2011, 10:27 AM	#7
TeenCat Too lazy to set a koala Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: CZ/EU forever! Posts: 16,139	i see you are doing 1:14 ... not bad for fucked up industry __________________ 6bot / Coming again very soon! Svit Zlin Radio 24/7!

03-30-2011, 10:24 AM	#6
AdultKing Raise Your Weapon Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Outback Australia Posts: 15,605	As I have said in many other threads, people are still sitting on the same business model that existed when I started 15 years ago. Tour, Subscribe, Content Area + Affiliate Programs which took off around 2000 The model is old, the surfers are disinterested and more savvy about how to get your content for free. So what's the solution ? Entertain and engage the surfer , don't just throw a members area at them. The reason why we made so much 15 - 10 years ago was that there were less sites and high demand. Filesharing hadn't really taken off, tubes weren't even dreamt about , even YouTube as we know it now is only 7 or 8 years old. There is a huge amount of free content around, content doesn't sell like it used to because there is (a) so much of it cheap or free and (b) it's more readily available. What's the solution ? Interactivity and engagement. Passive sites don't cut the mustard anymore.

03-30-2011, 10:56 AM	#10
bbobby86 partners.sexier.com Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 11,926	we are the champions... __________________

03-30-2011, 11:04 AM	#11
shermo Guest Posts: n/a	6-8 years ago, your ratios were better than 1:14?

03-30-2011, 11:18 AM	#13
PiracyPitbull Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 583	It would help if some content owners removed the bajillion cyberlocker links to their content. __________________ http://www.piracypitbull.com

03-30-2011, 11:38 AM	#15
cooldude7 Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Heaven Posts: 4,306	adult is not dead, people are still making shitload of money in adult.

03-30-2011, 11:47 AM	#17
INever Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: .......in a niche, in orbit...... Posts: 3,491	I'm back in mainstream working on mobile projects. Giving away free content, google ranking pirates above paysites, tubedevils, lack of technical and marketing innovation plus too much time wasted chatting with Paul Markham on GFY combined to kill adult. __________________ I love Camdough

03-30-2011, 08:08 PM	#19
$5 submissions I help you SUCCEED Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: The Pearl of the Orient Seas Posts: 32,195	One thing doesn't change though--keep the customer FIRST in mind and build a QUALITY experience and you will be rewarded. __________________ Need a NON-ADULT income stream? We build your YOUTUBE CHANNEL for only $20 per video! For Hire: $3/hour or $400 per month Marketing Specialist Virtual Assistants

03-31-2011, 12:29 AM	#21
AWW - Kevin Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: AdultWebmasterInfo Posts: 2,353	1st up i suggest you read my title "adult is dead....it's not, however..." i know it's not dead..doesn't mean it's doing anywhere near as well for webmasters as it should !! internet/IT.. one of THE growth sectors over the last decade or so, yet big programs have closed down, resource sites, news sites, adult hosts, webmaster forums gone. what's that tell ya? __________________ Add Your Resource ICQ: 1212-58311

03-31-2011, 01:29 AM	#22
HarryMuff Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 271	links pulled

03-31-2011, 03:50 AM	#25
Paul Markham Too old to care Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: On the sofa, watching TV or doing my jigsaws. Posts: 52,943	The big question is how to turn it all around? Obviously the present business model isn't working. So what would? The solution has to be inside the members area. We've tried just about everything we can outside and that's what brought us to this point. Here's a few ideas. Explain to surfers how most Dating sites work, by Geo targeting and hanging on to members for as long as possible. Then giving them links to free dating sites. Giving away inside the members area live 1-1 chat for a lot less than is available on sites like cams.com. I don't know what they cost at the moment but a large % has to go to affiliates, by removing that the price falls. Sites earn by keeping the member rebilling to get his cheap chat. Selling a product that can't be given away. Live sex 1-100 or 1-1,000. What ever it takes to make the cost so low a site can afford to add it into their members area. These shows have to be good. A live version of the faked porn on most websites isn't going to retain. So pay girls according to the people watching her and how long they watch her. Kick out bad girl. The business can no longer afford decent exclusive content. 3 solo scenes for $2,000 isn't enough. A BG for $1500 isn't either. And many sites want it for less. In major niches the idea that a scene can be saturated in a year is silly. So sell non exclusive scenes enough times at a price that allows the shooter to shoot great content. Say 15 times for a solo girl at $100. Kick out bad shooters, bad models and the idea that the same scene shot over and over with just changing the girl is worth anything more than a 30 day membership. How many times before this gets boring? A girl getting fucked in the back of a van? Members don't stay because sites don't deserve staying in. And then there's price and membership. Some customers simply don't want 30 days. They are very content with 30 minutes today and then 30 minutes next week. A 30 day membership only suits the customer who wants to login everyday. Change prices and membership to suit the member, not the affiliates and sellers. Stop sending traffic to sites that rip off or disappoint customers, you're only hurting yourself. Because how long do you keep hitting yourself with a hammer, does it take until you realise it's wrong? 15 years most customers are very wary. Quite clearly online porn started in times when customers had little options. Today he does and he CHOOSE those options over ours. We need to change to suit him, not ourselves. __________________ Blowout deal. 880 videos, 2,400 image sets, plus many RAW videos. $500. PM me for a deal. Skype Paulmarkham70

03-31-2011, 03:58 AM	#26
SomeCreep :glugglug Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Where the Wild Things Are Posts: 26,118	Makes you wonder what the online adult industry will be like 10 years from now. __________________ Webair Hosting I use and recommend Webair for hosting.

03-31-2011, 06:31 AM	#31
TheDoc Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Currently Incognito Posts: 13,827	Industry is done people, take a hike, leave, go... retire, that's business. More money for those that are killing it, every ever minute of the day, that's business too. __________________ ~TheDoc - ICQ7765825 It's all disambiguation

03-31-2011, 07:30 AM	#32
PornHero Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,381	The only reason why anyone would be surprised at the changes in the industry is purely due to a lack of understanding of Business 101. The internet is a decentralized system that has increased competition for people's time & money. The adult business has a low barrier-to-entry so competition has increased because of higher than average profit margins. Even if there weren't any tubes or filesharing sites, 1000 of new webmasters would have entered the business over the past few years and you would have ended up making the same money you are currently making in 2011 due to the increased competition. If you can't figure out a way to continue to make good cash in the adult business in 2011 then you aren't as smart as you think you are.