Yanks_Todd

If the tyrannical government(s) are always behind terrorist attacks against their unassuming ignorant citizens, does this mean there numerous extremely frustrated camps of terrorists upset that the government always get there first?

Seriously, since the conspiracy junkies have already started in on the Boston attack (way to early no matter who was behind it) I would like to know what they consider to be legit attacks.

Please list them and what reasons make you sure those where carried out by real terrorists vs the government.

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epitome

Apparently everyone in the world is all about peace and love... Except the government.

Rochard

The funny thing is when it comes to conspiracy they lack the most basic item: Motive.

What was the motive with 9/11? To attack a poor land locked country with no oil? (They tried to debate that there was some oil pipeline that was going to run through Afghanistan but it still hasn't been built; You can't build a oil pipeline through a war zone idiots.)

Before there can be a conspiracy theory with the Boston bombing, you need to have a motive.

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CurrentlySober

i lick boston bumming...

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DWB

Here is the problem. When you have a government that has discussed creating false flag events in order to achieve their goal, or in the case of The Gulf Of Tonkin, or lies about WMD in Iraq to actually start a war, then you have to be skeptical about all events and not just believe what the mainstream corporate media tells you. That doesn't mean all events are false flags, but it does mean you should look at all the facts presented and try to make sense of it the best you can with ALL of the information available.

The corporate media has its own interest. It selectively tells the news they want us to know with the slant they want to put on it. Fair enough, so knowing this how can we base all events on what they say if we know they will lie to us or distort the truth sometimes?

Some conspiracy guys are bat shit crazy. No doubt. But it's healthy to question everything and not just drink the kool-aid because that is what the media and corporate shills in the government tell us to do. The media lies. Governments lie. People lie. Not always, but it does happen. This is what fuels conspiracy theorists. And sometimes those theories turn out to be true.

Just grabbing some older crazy shit off the top of my head, if you were told at the time any of these were happening you would have said the person is crazy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuskege...lis_experiment
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compulsory_sterilization
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unethic...nited_Stat es
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Statevi..._Malaria_Study
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_r...on_experiments
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_of_Tonkin_incident

All bat shit crazy. But it all happened. This is why people are conspiracy theorists. They are always looking for the truth, as history is full of governments who lie.

seeandsee

Conspiracy people gone mad - everything is conspiracy
Anti-conspiracy people gone mad - nothing is conspiracy

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_Richard_

are you prepared for some soul crushing?

scottybuzz

funny how none of the conspiracy guys predicted this.

A certain member of this board:
predicated putins death (still not happened)

bombs at the London olympics (didn't happen)

and something bad to happen on December 21st (didn't happen)

They seem to be shit at seeing the world behind the curtains which obviously the rest of us can't see.

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scottybuzz

Hey wow, a little bit of balance in the argument.

At fucking last.

Richard and wehatelife ... take note....

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Mike Honcho

You forget to mention that Afghanistan has one of the richest deposits of lithium in the WORLD. Not to mention mineral sources valued at over a trillion dollars, just of their known resources.

You're also neglecting the fact that Afghanistan gives the United States a front door to Pakistan as well as Iran, so once you can look at the big picture, maybe you'll be able to realize the United States know has an East and West point of invasion of Iran. .

There's so much more to it, but with this information I provided, I think you should be able to better understand why.

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Yanks_Todd

Oh I agree that the government does lie and that conspiracies can and do happen.

I am really addressing the people that are already pointing to the Boston Attack being a government action before anybody could possibly have fully investigated what really happened.

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dyna mo

what this misses is critical thinking. i'm a skeptic, but there's a process to follow. it's learned.

dyna mo

"the intellectually disciplined process of actively and skillfully conceptualizing, applying, analyzing, synthesizing, or evaluating information gathered from, or generated by, observation, experience, reflection, reasoning, or communication, as a guide to belief and action"

Yanks_Todd

So what terrorist attacks are real then?

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wehateporn

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Mike Honcho

This doesn't even deserve an answer. This is something Currently Sober would love to eat, because it's complete shit.

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Yanks_Todd

Typical response of someone in a debate who is beaten.

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_Richard_

???

8char

dyna mo

congrats, you are now a gfy conspiracist!

Rochard

I have taken a look at the big picture. And for a while there it looked great - We were in Irag and Afghanistan, and Iran was right in the middle. The United States was in the perfect position to strike. Even I was starting to question that.

Buy why would you invade one country to invade another? That makes no sense at all. Iraq was difficult to get to; Iran is easier to get to.

The argument about Pakistan makes no sense either - Pakistan would be easy to invade with all of that coastline in the Abrian Sea.

But no matter what your cute little conspiracy theory was proved false because we didn't attack Iran and didn't attack Pakistan.

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_Richard_

took a long time for me to get here

i suppose all one needs to do is not automatically believe everything they read on the internet/paper, and they're 'conspiracy nutter'

which, you know, is nuts.. but hey, i just work here

dyna mo

i'll be honest, i am skeptical about afghanistan, they do have the lithium and some other mineable resources that add up.


however.



afghanistan has been bad news for countries for, what, 100 years now. the british fell into it for a decade, the russians, the us. that was all before anybody had the tech to find those precious resources. that was when it was just a shit hole, yet it sucked in major developed nations.

no, i *tend* to believe we went there to get obl and, just like the uk and the ussr, the us got sucked in.

Penny24Seven

what would gfy be without you? just a tiny bit better

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dyna mo

i like the way you put that. you said "not automatically believe everything they read on the internet/paper".

key word: everything.

i think when folks read as much as possible about an event that is clouded, they tend to be able to put the conspiracy theories into better perspective.

it seems to me that conspiracist don't read everything yet believe what they have read/watched on youtube.

moreover, as studies of truthers has shown, they tend to only read/watch more resources that support their view.

Si

Family guy, the Simpsons, and Spongebob predict these events though. (Apparently )

crockett

Wait... so you think we flew airplanes into the WTC and the Pentagon killing a hell of a lot of people and doing a lot of harm to our own economy in the process, just to have a staging area to attack Iran?

Oh and 10 years later we have yet to attack Iran.. What are we waiting on Santa Clause to send us an invitation? I mean seriously Iraq was Iran's worst enemy. I mean don't yea just think that had our entire secret plan been to actually to attack Iran, that we would have skipped over Iraq and potentially used them as a ally to fight Iran?

Joshua G

well. there were these merchant ships carrying tea in boston harbor. & they were attacked by terrorists & the tea thrown overboard.

TheFootMan5

You use the term "we" as if you are a member of the elite

Si

Don't use logic, they don't like it.

TheFootMan5

This makes no sense whatsoever and is nothing but a play on words

Define "terrorist" and you will find that most in the upper echelons of government are terrorists...you're just using a play on words which makes no sense

Si

You use the term "elite" as if you have an inferiority complex.

TheFootMan5

Exactly, and strangely enough people simply just ignore this. This is what is ADMITTED by the government...now imagine what they actually do that they never tell the public

And yet when you bring up the possibility that it COULD have been an FBI plot gone live, the propaganda kicks in in their head and they flip out. It's amazing to see. Yet in their personal lives if you have a person who lies to you over and over, then you never believe what they say after a few times. However, the government can lie, cheat, steal, kill, imprison and people still bow down to it and declare it as "good"...this is mind control

Supz

We are a member of the Elite. By We I mean me, by Elite. I mean enjoying superior intellectual, social, or economic status.

TheFootMan5

They're all real

Quit using a play on words

TheFootMan5

You are not a member of the ruling elite or in any upper echelon of society. They do not think like you or act like you or I. They look down on us like we look down on animals.

TNVeric

I have worked with many in government, the last thing that comes to mind is "elite".

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TheFootMan5

Not sure if serious

Frank21

To see who probably did the crime in this case the bombing. You first have to see what the consequeses are and who benefits.

You could argue that there is somewhere a terrorist organisation who hate sport and therefore targets sport events.
In this case this terrorist organisation would keep attacking sportgames untill they are banned.

You could also argue that there are terrorist element within the government who would like to have more power to check and control on the comon man. Because there are laws and constitution they are prevented from having checkpoints, home inspections and public searches. If the result of this and similar upcoming bombings/shootings/chemical attacks is that these laws and constitution are limited or deleted it is more likely that some elements whitin the govenment or elements in the world who control pupets within the government instead of some terrorist organisation bombing some people without any benefits at all.

One question for you, what would be the motive of whomever did the bombing?

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FLFHoles

I don't think everything is a conspiracy but to think our government does not bend the law or create situations for their own gain is just stupid.

Why would we declare Iraq had WMD when we knew they did not? To wage a war, the Bush war. Why does government wage wars even when it hurts the economy here at home? Because war is profitable. Maybe not profitable the way it was 50 years but it is profitable but only to a smaller segment (defense contractors, banks, etc..)

One only has to look back over the last 12 years to see the direction our country is going. Even after 9/11 and the PATRIOT Act, life in America wasn't that bad where liberties are concerned. Since Obama has taken office, the government now has the right to arrest anyone and detain you indefinitely without charge or trial and even kill you by calling you a terrorist.

Listen to the news from yesterday to today. The common thread among many outlets now is they are suspecting Boston was homegrown. Perhaps it is but anyone who trusts a damn word from the government doesn't study history.

Look at Aurora, Newtown, and Boston and every single event had a terror drill in the same proximity. In the case of Aurora and Newtown, multiple witnesses claimed to have seen multiple shooters but the government explains it away. Even 9/11 has military drills going on with planes crashing into buildings. Aurora had drills on movie theater shootings. I can buy circumstantial occurrence for one event but when it occurs for multiple events, it is easy to question every narrative that comes along from the mouth of the government.

Is this a plan of impending marital law? Who knows but look over history to find out how to do it. Hitler and others eased their people into tyranny by conditioning them. When you boil a frog slowly, they have no idea they are about to die. The same applies to tyranny. Americans have happily swallowed every shitty law that takes their liberties away while sticking their head in the sand denying it the entire way.

Were these events staged to get gun control and martial law? Maybe, maybe not. But with a severely devalued currency with little purchasing power, banning weapons that could attempt to match force of that found in military weapons, laws that allow the government and military to arrest and kill you based off suspicion and not factual evidence, large purchases of ammunition, armored vehicles being sent to local and state municipalities, etc... sure does not look good.

Do we really want to be the assholes in the future that look back and say all the signs were there but we did not want to believe it? Isn't that what we say after every happens and we discover the signs we missed leading up to it?

If you keep drawing the line and redrawing that line when the government calls your bluff and steps over it, at some point you will run out of room to draw a line and eventually you will have to make a stand.

Hitler convinced the Jews that every command and law was for the good of the country and for them. Even up to the point where the Jews were killed, they never rose up to say "Stop". Jews went along to get along hoping to be spared. How did that work out for them?

Are we headed down the same path? 20 years ago we could have said no. Now should the government actually have this plan, it is far easier to pull off now than it was even 12 years ago when the country was consumed with fear. But when 19 terrorists are able to defy the laws of Physics and accomplish something that 3,000 engineers and detonation experts claim is not possible, you have to question everything especially when our country has done false flags in the past.

Our government mourns the children of Sandy Hook and calls them victims but refers to innocent children killed in drone strikes as collateral damage. He decries an attack on the homeland but orders drone strikes in foreign lands that impact people who aren't terrorists and are only guilty because they live in the same area as the terrorists are hiding in.

The one area that the public should be able to count on to get the truth is the media but they don't even care to do their jobs right anymore. Dumbasses like Chris Matthews and Wolf Blitzer immediately jump the gun and say it had to be a Tea Party radical because it was Tax Day without ever considering if it could have been some radical from the left. They have a narrative they want to push regardless of the facts because most people remember the first person they heard that is deemed responsible.

When the NSA, CIA, IRS, DHS, TSA, etc... claim they can read emails, search you, suspend your Constitutional rights, etc... you better be afraid because if you ever get in their sights, you won't be able to overcome their defined narrative. DHS, military, and police are reporting they are training for civil unrest.

Let's not forget what is being debated in Congress right now either. CISPA and gun control. And with the narrative being shifted to Boston being homegrown and that directions to make the bomb are easily found on the internet, it's easy to see how that event could give the government the votes they lack to get the result they want. Either way, get ready for more cameras, TSA on the streets, and governmental control over the internet. All in the name of democracy that allows the majority to impose their will on the minority as they wipe their ass with the Republic.

Captain Kawaii

"Terrorists" tend to be:
State backed
Corporate backed or State/Corporate backed
Religious Agenda backed.
Lone-wolf disgruntled citizens/small groups twisted by brain washing.

In the 80's the worlds biggest terrorists were the US/Corp. and Israel then maybe PLO. As the 80's wound down, corporations moved in to greater power positions. I the 90's more Arabs stepped up to the plate and began to plan for the future.

If you put the list of items DWB pointed out and add them to the revelations of wikileaks, the mafia like business actions of US Cabinet members for one, many world governments for another, then it is not hard to see what is going on now is a continuation of whats been going on since there were lines drawn between rich and poor. Between haves and have-nots AND....the "Have Mores."

People like to believe the evening news storyline because it comforts them into thinking they know whats going on. They are weak in mind and body.

My personal take on Boston? Patriots day celebrates Lexington and Concord, the start of the American Revolution. Behind it? Given the legislation in DC at the moment, somebody has just declared the beginning of American Revolution 2 or WW3. Hard to say.

The American people are being sold down the river by their reps. The bombings are a big "go fuck yourself" to gov. STILL, it could be anybody for any reason. We may NEVER know who is really behind the attack. At this moment in time the US gov is in decline, it is a looooooong slow decline and the US has more enemies than ever.

Just my I am expecting things to escalate.

wehateporn

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rogueteens

There can be no conspiracy theory about the Marathon bombing because there is no official theory yet!

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NewNick

Bad news for 300 years.

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NewNick

That is a very limited view.

You have never heard of the IRA, or the INLA, or PANAM 103 (Libya) or the UDA/UFF ?.

What about the Central and South American death squads in Honduras, Chile, Brazil, El Salvador etc.

You seem to have a very narrow view of the world.

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Dirty F

He was one already for a long time. That's why i have the idiot on ignore.

PR_Glen

as johnny the kook illustrates perfectly in his posts here they will fabricate a whole magical land of evil beings that do nothing but think up evil plots to plan against the rest of us 'sheep'. The entertainment factor sky rockets when such a kook points these things out they actually believe they are elevated above everyone else when in actuality they are broke losers living in their mom's basement.

I enjoy observing them afar as one would observe birds in nature.. strange beings but may make a pleasant meal if needed...

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BlackCrayon

typically people like yourself don't say that it 'could' be a fbi plot, false flag or whatever, you come right out and say it like its fact about nearly every event that receives a lot of media attention. it doesn't seem to matter the nature of the event, just as long as the mainstream media covers it at length. last month people were saying a baby being shot was a false flag but i guess everyone has forgot about that one and moved on. fact is the people shouting false flag don't have a clue and just figure, if they call everything that, they will be right eventually. how many threads have been created just about the boston thing that have been shot down already making them look like idiots because they didn't do their research and instead just jumped right on it.

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BlackCrayon

no doubt. these same people probably blame their parents for their failures, so why not other authority figures? its not that i'm a loser, its that the global elite keeps us all down except those who have joined the illuminiati. why even try in life. i can feel important and special right here on the internet by 'discovering' secret world plots...oh but of course.

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NewNick

You really are insane Johnny.

Do you really think that government agencies sit around plotting heinous crimes in order to achieve goals that are actually easier to achieve by normal means ? Like evil witches around a cauldron.

"I know lets control the people and achieve our goal of worldwide domination by flying planes into buildings and then blame a load of cave dwelling Muslims".

"Or we could just control the people and dominate the world by the use of pseudo democracy, fiscal taxation, and superior military industrial resource."

Which one is a) easier and b) more likely to succeed.

I suppose it is a symptom of your condition that you de-humanize the people that you accuse. You don't see the people who work for govt agencies as just a group of people trying to do a difficult job and raise their families the same as the rest of us. You have to demonize them in order to make your madcap schemes look plausible.

THERE ARE NO LIZARD PEOPLE JOHNNY. IT IS A FANTASY.

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BlackCrayon

while you may have the odd valid point it just sounds like propaganda from another angle.

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