420

Damn. They must all have reason to be scared. I don't know what can be done about it.

Jel

then aren't cops as dumb as us mortals who think that every cop is a bad cop thanks to some youtube videos?

I'm not saying nothing is seriously wrong here, but the only option was really death? Sorry, I can't buy that. That's a cop-out, if you'll excuse the phrase, on the officers involved actually doing some thinking of their own in this particular situation.

L-Pink

Cops respond to call of man with gun, their adrenaline kicks in and look what happens. Not defending cops but couple the mindset of someone wanting the job in the first place then putting them in certain positions and the results shouldn't be a surprise.

Jel

if a cop's first thought when attending a call about a kid somewhere is 'some guy started a fire elsewhere some other day and opened fire so we better not take any chances', I'd say that cop is a bit of a fucking tool.

Jel

now I get ya, and this I can agree with. though apparently the call was about a kid, with what was 'probably a toy', but yeah, I hear what you're saying.

L-Pink

Like my post below says, only certain types of people apply for jobs as cops in the first place. No one normal wants to be a cop in todays fucked up cities. The fucked up cities have determined who wants to be a cop in the first place ... vicious circle.

L-Pink

Looking at the macho pumped up cops I see everyday makes me wonder what percentage are hyped up steroid users.

Seriously.

SilentKnight

Factual truth will always be unpopular amongst those with an agenda.

johnny o

these stats?
Killings By Police in Utah Outpacing Gang, Drug, Child-Abuse, and Spousal Homicides | The Free Thought Project

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420

Maybe they didn't know what the caller said or maybe this kid was big and tall.

Those guys probably hear lots of horror stories. Some of their mindsets seem to be 'they don't pay me enough to take chances so I'm shooting first since I'm within my rights'.

L-Pink

No, responding to crime in areas where a large percentage of the population have criminal records and confronting people doing stupid things.

420

They are keeping the peace by committing more murders than criminals.

L-Pink

Here's another contributing factor, the amount of cops that our government spent large amounts of money training to be gunslingers.

"So it's natural that many military veterans seek employment in police ranks when they rejoin the civilian workforce. That's what is happening right now in numbers unseen since the closing days of the Vietnam War. The result is a job market flooded with well-qualified police officer candidates who served in Iraq and Afghanistan."

Military Vets Joining Law Enforcement - Article - POLICE Magazine

Guess how trained combat vets might handle many situations. Plus the whole gung-ho attitude that they bring to a police department, "us vs them"

DWB

It was a stupid move the kid made, but he was a KID. Kids do stupid things. That's why they can't drive until they are 16, can't join the military until 18, can't drink until 21, and so on. At no time should police be firing at a child, gun or no gun. They should be better trained and better prepared for such situations. What happened to rubber bullets, sandbag shot guns, and other non lethal weapons the police have?

Tragic. It seems there are too many trigger happy police these days. It's going to all blow up in their faces eventually.

PornoMonster

And if it was a real gun, and he shot little Sally on the playground because the cops were there and it was his last chance, you would complain about the cop not using force...

No, you still would of said it wasn't pointed at the cop, so no shoot.

Could of used Mace... Or a taser... Yeah, fuck it.

Why did the 911 Dis batch even put the call to the Police, it was "probably" a TOY... Duh, prank call, the teachers should of handled it...

LOL

For fucks sakes, you would of done 1 of 2 things.
1 Shit your pants when the kid reached for the gun.
2 Shot the kid so you and all the other people could go home safe...

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Socks

If the cop was "scared" of getting shot, wait until he tries to sleep at night for the next 10 to 15 years. He just shot a child with a toy gun. That's scary.

imo common sense says you wait to hear a gunshot in this situation. I think we can assume that they were behind their cars for protection, wearing vests, and that any other children were cleared away at this point. If I'm a cop, and it's a child on a playground, I'm not shooting until I hear real gunshots.

kane

Sadly, many police departments are underfunded and don't have that equipment. A friend of mine is a cop and the department he works for only got the shotguns that shoot the less-lethal rounds about 4 years ago and they got tazers about 2 years ago. There are many police departments that don't have either.

This doesn't mean that they should just open fire on anyone, but I just wanted to point out that in many departments less-lethal options aren't available.

kane

I wish there were some kind of video or eye witness account of this situation. Maybe there is and we just haven't seen it. In most cases where a gun may be in play the cops are trained to use their cars as cover. If they had their cars as cover they had no real excuse to shoot this kid. They could have drawn on him and if he pulled a gun out and shot they could have taken him down ASAP. If there are no cars for cover (or there are others around that are in danger) the situation changes.

In many cases they are not trained to just let a guy shoot before they shoot him. Imagine if it were a real gun and the guy pulled it out and got a shot off and hat shot killed an innocent bystander. The cops would get hammered for not acting fast enough.

Sadly, many of these situations are situations where the police likely can't win no matter what the outcome.

MrBottomTooth

I would have liked to have seen a video as well.. If the kid seen officers pointing guns at him yelling at him and he suddenly decided to point the gun at them then he was a moron. It's also possible he went to put the gun down and got shot anyway just for reacting too fast like the black dude that got shot for reaching for his wallet. Either way I'd have to agree with the bad parenting. You dont let kids walk around with airsoft guns in a city playground.They are made to look like the real thing.

Phoenix

I think airsoft should not be sold if they look so authentic...why not make them a special colour ot emit a signal or something

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MrBottomTooth

Most guns of this type come with a flourescent orange tip on the barrel, but i believe someone said the kid had removed it.

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Phoenix

Well if they are real enough to fool a trained police officer, then i do not think they should be sold to kids. Or they need to be coloured flourescent green or purple or something.

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Xenophage

It's a 12 year old feral black thug who has been taught by his parents to hate whitey, be violent, and that he can do anything he wants. I'd shoot him too. Society at large has been IMPROVED -- GOOD FUCKING RIDDANCE.

Lets see:

- past the age of knowledge of right and wrong (age 6-8)
- unsupervised in public space
- has removed orange safety tip indicating toy
- is pointing gun object at people
- is intentionally frightening people
- is commanded by uniformed police to put gun object down
- points gun object at police
- police in fear for selves and others in park
- police fire

Fuck YOU, liberal trash. Your pity party for criminal Blacks is repugnant.

Just a few weeks ago a Black 12 year old stabbed to death a little white boy at a playground. The Black boy can offer no discernible reason for his behavior - he did not know the victim, he had no fight with the victim, just walked up and stabbed him to death. The media all but ignored this hideous event.

Watch the Jewmedia make a martyr of this 'baby in diapers shot to death by maniacal crazed whitey popo out to murder Blacks', blasting it for months across America's TV sets for dopes like you to suck on. That is, unless they find out one of these cops who fired happens to also be Black.

Jel

and if you took my post out of context you'd reply with a dumb fuck post like the one above

Jel

This is part of the overall problem, obviously, and lends itself to everyone just passing the buck to circumstances x, y, and z. We can achieve some pretty spectacular things, and have done, and continue to do so, but a 1st world country can't solve the situation where instant death is the 'only' route in a scenario like this

BlackCrayon

its an obvious truth but it doesn't justify the actions in any way. we can't devolve as a society into shrugging our shoulders when a kid gets killed for doing something stupid. making mistakes, pushing limits and getting to trouble is built into the brains of kids. its what they are supposed to do, some do it more stupidly than others but it doesn't mean we should not care when an injustice is done to them.

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BlackCrayon

something to note about what society as become, so fear based and certain areas so crime ridden that someone calls the cops for a 12 year old playing with a toy gun. when i was a kid there was no orange marker on toy guns. my friends and i would walk down the street with our BB guns and no one would of though to call the cops. kids are now expected to be as rational minded as adults now.

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baddog

yeah. kids never kill people

You make a lot of assumptions. It does come with a bright orange tip so cops know it is a toy; someone took it off.

I doubt many 12 year old ghetto kids have the money to buy one; dumb parents gave it to him or he stole it most likely

tony286

Blaming the victim has become very popular now.

notjoe

Can you blame them??

brassmonkey

uh sandy hook your memory going bad?

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Tom_PM

Hmm.... weird since it's so solidly on your own radar to catch assumptions. I have to be wrong and it's only a matter of time before it's explained to me.

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Jel

who intimated that? and what does that have to do with my assertion that surely there is a different course of action than shooting dead a 12 year old stupid child?

Even going by your unrelated 'logic', because in the past a tiny number of kids have killed someone, we have to assume every dumb kid with a toy gun is a killer, so mete out instant death accordingly? Men have raped, so now every woman has to assume that a blind date is a probable rapist? If he tries to make his move, mace that motherfucker? Some guys had road rage somewhere, so I'll assume every motorist is a case of road rage waiting to happen?

No wonder you guys need all those guns, if that's what the thought process is of the possible 'danger' lurking at every corner...

TheSquealer

What fascinates me about these conversations most is the fact that our brains are hard wired to identify and point to a single cause. The kid, music, video games, the cop, the parents etc. no one thinks a kid deserves to die for any reason and the simple fact is that incidents like this are complicated and the causes that led to the event itself are many. Shitty parents, a reactive student body/school staff, police training/equipment, a kid that was apparently suicidal or deeply disturbed in some manner and so on and so on.

Blaming a cop doesn't solve the problem of kiss bringing guns to school in a world where school massacres happen. Blaming the child doesn't address the shitty parenting, our fucked up "me me me" culture, the mental illness, the medications or everyone's inability to deal with him before it got to this point and so on.

Of course this stuff will happen over and over. It was said that "those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it" and if there was ever an inescapable truth of man, it's that history rarely does anything at all to change future behaviors. We are what we are... talking, self important apes living in the shared delusion that we are not as primative as we are. 2014 and we are still watching genocides, still watching hungry children die, still starting wars. Still acting like unevolved apes.

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Jel

agreed

Tom_PM

That kid might have had GREAT parents 100% all the way!

Go ahead and just raise your hand if you were a perfect child whose parents instructed you in everything you ever encountered and you obeyed every rule and never did anything that they didn't know about? Right. Not a single person in history including Jesus and Moses and all those ultimate bros.

Next assumption based on nothing.

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brassmonkey

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TheSquealer

His parents might have also been magical unicorns

As long as it's 99.9% ghetto blacks and white trash kids bringing guns to school, we can safely assume culture and parenting in those demographics are a huge part of the problem.

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DWB

That's too bad. Perhaps the communities who are sick of having their people shot and killed should pony up and help them buy non-lethal weapons. Or take to the streets until the state buys them. I dunno, but since there are options out there, everyone should be diligently working towards making sure the police has them. The alternative is, people keep dying.

Jel

DWB

We used to roam the streets with BB Gun rifles, bow and arrows, and sling shots. There was always a war taking place somewhere in our neighborhood. We had forts and battle stations everywhere. I'm honestly surprised none of us died or lost an eye, as we would literally shoot arrows at each other and not bother where we aimed with our high powered BB and pellet guns.

We had dirt bike tracks in the woods, an abandon bridge, train tracks that ran through the woods where we used to hop moving trains like hobos, rope wings, you name it. From the time we were home from school until it was bed time, we were out and playing. No worry of pedophiles or adults hurting us. It was awesome. I'm sure a lot of you had the same experience. Best child hood ever.

I can't fathom these poor kids growing up today in the nanny state. The thought of having to worry about getting shot by the police just doesn't even compute. We did have a few run ins with them but at no time were we in actual danger or harms way.

SuckOnThis

Killings By Police in Utah Outpacing Gang, Drug, Child-Abuse, and Spousal Homicides

In the past five years, more Utahns have been killed by cops than by gang violence, drug dealers, or from child abuse.

romeo22

too many teen can easily get weapon and some shit when are angry,the parents need to think more about this before having a weapon at home

newB

This is such a fucked up thread on so many levels.

One side want's to make all cops out to be trigger-happy psychos who only took the job so they can shoot people, and the other side that the kid had it coming for just being a dumb kid.

BTW, Xenophage - you have called the kid a thug twice now, is there more to this story than in the original article that supports that label?

Every day you hear stories about kids with guns. While it is certainly a tragedy, I think the cops responding to a call of someone brandishing a weapon that turned out to be a realistic toy are in the clear on this one.

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Jel

there's at least 3 sides that I've read in this thread

420

I forgot which side I was arguing.

Everyone is wrong here. Kid shouldn't have had the gun. He should have cooperated (allegedly he didn't). His parents should have lernt him better. Cop should have been more cautious so he didn't feel the need to shoot.

mlmleads

Cops just need more training. Airsoft are very realistic looking replica pistols but I think police should be forced to adopt the military policy of engagement before you can fire. Meaning if they don't shoot first regardless what they are holding you don't shoot.

If the cops are not smart enough to recognize the differences than they shouldn't be allowed to carry anything but tasars.

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L-Pink

So the bad guy/criminal/idiot gets first shot? How about the bad guy/criminal/idiot behaves in such a way the cop doesn't draw his gun in the first place?