why are the GFY global warming alarmists such debbie downers? - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

Robbie · 11-30-2014, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arock10

So we could be fine... or not. But I'd believe the scientists over the monied interests

I agree that scientists getting money have an agenda.
BUT...I am also cognizant of the FACT that the science that alarmists use is backed and funded by people with billions of dollars at stake in "Green Energy".

Now for the "climate change" that is supposedly caused by CO2? Well, I just put up a graph of Earth's temps to go right along with your graph of CO2 levels.

If you look at both graphs and see the time periods and the temps of the Earth & match them up...it just doesn't lead to ANY proof that CO2 in the atmosphere is causing the Earth to warm.
The Earth goes through phases.

Some take millions of years. Others (like the one that changed the Sahara) can take just a few decades. And NONE of them were caused by mankind.

FIFTY rational discussions of climate change (give or take a few that derailed into politics)

2MuchMark · 11-30-2014, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dyna mo

I just don't see why you can't even give Obama credit on this.

Typical. Righties can't give Obama credit for anything, ever. It's not in your DNA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

Mark, I thought this discussion was (once again) about the gas that we exhale every time we breath and that plants need to survive: CO2

Now you are calling CO2 "pollution" and somehow tying it in with clean water?

Hi Robbie...

Yes we exhale CO2, and plants breath it in. There has always been CO2 in the atmosphere. The problem though, is that today there is a lot more of it, and soon there could be too much CO2. Plants and trees are very effective at sucking the CO2 in and pushing it into the ground, but deforestation and urban expansion are reducing the how fast CO2 can be absorbed.

I mention clean water because increased global warming means increased drought. California is in serious trouble already.

However, too much CO2 in the ocean is causing Ocean Acidification. When CO2 dissolves in sea water it increases hydrogen ions and decreases the pH level, which damages corals, which form the habitat of approximately 25% of marine species.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

That's the reason that people like you drive other people AWAY from your argument when you don't base it on reality.

I don't mean to drive you away man, I'm sorry... but this comes from NOAA.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

And by the way...the MAIN thing that is leading to people (poor people anyway) having their "lives more miserable" is the fact that the govt. is deliberately making energy prices more expensive.
And that in turn makes EVERYTHING more expensive...and as usual, hurts the poor the most.

The markets + supply and demand is what controls the price of energy, not the government or the president. What's up (and down) with gasoline prices? - FAQ - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)

What hurts poor people the most isn't just high energy prices. It's lack of opportunity, access to education, crime, health, lack of proper social assistance, and of course the export of job opportunities to other countries etc, the list goes on.

Peace...

dyna mo · 11-30-2014, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

Typical. Righties can't give Obama credit for anything, ever. It's not in your DNA.

Hi Robbie...

Yes we exhale CO2, and plants breath it in. There has always been CO2 in the atmosphere. The problem though, is that today there is a lot more of it, and soon there could be too much CO2. Plants and trees are very effective at sucking the CO2 in and pushing it into the ground, but deforestation and urban expansion are reducing the how fast CO2 can be absorbed.

I mention clean water because increased global warming means increased drought. California is in serious trouble already.

However, too much CO2 in the ocean is causing Ocean Acidification. When CO2 dissolves in sea water it increases hydrogen ions and decreases the pH level, which damages corals, which form the habitat of approximately 25% of marine species.

I don't mean to drive you away man, I'm sorry... but this comes from NOAA.

The markets + supply and demand is what controls the price of energy, not the government or the president. What's up (and down) with gasoline prices? - FAQ - U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA)

What hurts poor people the most isn't just high energy prices. It's lack of opportunity, access to education, crime, health, lack of proper social assistance, and of course the export of job opportunities to other countries etc, the list goes on.

Peace...

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

Typical. Righties can't give Obama credit for anything, ever. It's not in your DNA.

brainiac, I'm the one who pointed out Obama made the call to bring the USA out from under the kyoto bullshit from decades ago.

you and crockett are righties? good to know, because again, you have yet to even acknowledge the optimistic information I've posted here. That also explains why you don't give a shit about the environment, only about trying to control others.

gofuckyourself.

dyna mo · 11-30-2014, 11:31 AM

double post

2MuchMark · 11-30-2014, 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dyna mo

brainiac, I'm the one who pointed out Obama made the call to bring the USA out from under the kyoto bullshit from decades ago.

you and crockett are righties? good to know, because again, you have yet to even acknowledge the optimistic information I've posted here. That also explains why you don't give a shit about the environment, only about trying to control others.

gofuckyourself.

My post had nothing at all to do with you, yet you went out of your way to attack me. My comment about Obama not getting credit was also not directed at you, but you attacked me again. Can you please stop now? Thanks big guy.

dyna mo · 11-30-2014, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

My post had nothing at all to do with you,

then why did you direct it at me?

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

Typical. Righties can't give Obama credit for anything, ever. It's not in your DNA.

it's not in YOUR DNA, would you like me to explain your post to you for you?

you quoted me and used "your", i.e., your post had everything to do with me.

again, womp womp. keep ignoring the optimism **********, you just keep proofing my point, debbie downer.

dyna mo · 11-30-2014, 12:03 PM

here, I'll give the global warming alarmists another chance to acknowledge the optimism of current events re: pollution and greenhouse gases:

my OP:

Quote:

Pledges by Chinese President Xi Jinping and U.S. President Barack Obama earlier this month to limit their emissions after 2020 sent a powerful signal that a global deal could be possible next year. The two countries, which produce about 40 percent of all global emissions, long have been adversaries in the U.N. climate talks.

PS, i waited many days after getting this news waiting for a gfy global warming alarmist to post this news, none did. That's because they truly do not care about the issue.

dyna mo · 11-30-2014, 12:08 PM

my post from earlier, more optimism for the debbie downer gfy global warming alarmists to ignore or discount

Quote:
NRG, which built a leading electricity business from coal and other conventional power plants, is aiming to reduce its carbon emissions 50 percent by 2030 and 90 percent by 2050, the company said on Thursday.

David Crane, the company?s chief executive, made the announcement at a ceremony breaking ground for the company?s new headquarters in Princeton, N.J., conceived as a green-energy showcase that will open in 2016.

?The power industry is the biggest part of the problem of greenhouse gas emissions, but it has the potential to be an even bigger part of the solution,? Mr. Crane said in an interview before the announcement.

Businesses like Coca-Cola, Google and Walmart are increasingly looking to buy or produce more green energy as a way of reducing their carbon footprints, creating a potentially lucrative market for companies like NRG. This week, for instance, Ikea announced it had bought a second wind farm in the United States, part of its goal of, by 2020, producing as much renewable energy as the company consumes globally.

?We are working with these companies on putting solar panels all over their facilities, and it?s helpful for them to know that we?re heading in the right direction,? Mr. Crane said.

Robbie · 11-30-2014, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

The markets + supply and demand is what controls the price of energy, not the government or the president.

What hurts poor people the most isn't just high energy prices. It's lack of opportunity, access to education, crime, health, lack of proper social assistance, and of course the export of job opportunities to other countries etc, the list goes on.

Peace...

Yep the market does control the price of energy.

And so do the TAXES placed on that energy. And the exorbitant LICENSING fees:

"Oil and natural gas production royalties on federal lands are one of the largest sources of income to the federal government, delivering $86 million in rents, royalties and bonus fees every single day."

All those added on costs drive the price up even further than it would be otherwise. Not to mention that IF the federal govt. were to stop blocking new drilling on federal lands...the supply would go up and the prices worldwide would come down.

You and I both know that the U.S. federal govt. has openly said that it is doing this to keep Green Energy competitive in the market place in hopes that it will "catch on".

In the meantime, poor people can't afford fucking food because the price is so high thanks to energy costs. You're talking social issues like education...I'm talking about the daily REAL world effect it has on people. Cost of clothing, cost of keeping warm in the winter and cool in the summer, cost of driving a vehicle to and from work or out to job interviews to find work, cost of FOOD, cost of every last thing you buy in the store.

High energy costs hurt people.

In case you never watch business networks...they have been incredibly optimistic because the overall economy has improved and people have more money in their pockets over the last several months as fuel prices went DOWN.

The opposite happens when they go up.

And YES, the govt can do things to drive the price of fuel. The OPEC nations do it all the time.

We have the ability to turn the spigot "on" or "off" of U.S. production. But we never do.

2MuchMark · 12-01-2014, 01:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dyna mo

then why did you direct it at me?

That's the thing... I didn't. You're losing it man.... Read my first post again. No mention of you whatsoever.

Like you, I'm thrilled that a couple of governments will finally to take (baby) steps towards fixing the problem. That's it. You attacked me for no reason. What you think you read in my post, came from your own imagination. Now once again, leave me alone. I don't want to be your BFF, ok?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

Yep the market does control the price of energy.

And so do the TAXES placed on that energy. And the exorbitant LICENSING fees:

"Oil and natural gas production royalties on federal lands are one of the largest sources of income to the federal government, delivering $86 million in rents, royalties and bonus fees every single day."

Ok, maybe you have a point when it comes to the taxes. Here in Montreal, taxes on gas are right around 50% of the total cost.

What I think would help the situation is to let the consumer pay less taxes at the pump, AND raise taxes on big oil. I heard somewhere that they pay no taxes at all, and Salon reports that they pay only 11% Effective Tax Rates of Oil & Gas Companies: Cashing in on Special Treatment | Taxpayers for Common Sense. Since they are already the most profitable industry on the planet, wouldn't raising their taxes make sense?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

All those added on costs drive the price up even further than it would be otherwise. Not to mention that IF the federal govt. were to stop blocking new drilling on federal lands...the supply would go up and the prices worldwide would come down.

Ack! No you're got this one wrong...first drilling is already way up in the US and oil production is very high (Continuing a Winning Formula for 2014 - U.S. Global Investors). . Next if your government opened up drilling on federal lands, gone would be tens of thousands of acres of wildlife refuges, national forests and other lands. Right now the US has over 650 million acres according to The National Map: Small Scale . Did you know that places like the rock canyons of Utah, Appalachia and other awesome places could be drilled, polluted and destroyed if it weren't for for the federal land management service?

It makes no sense to me to drill and destroy so much land, when there are potentially so many alternative energy sources that at least deserve to be explored.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

You and I both know that the U.S. federal govt. has openly said that it is doing this to keep Green Energy competitive in the market place in hopes that it will "catch on".

Not just in hopes that it will catch-on.. It is catching on... the US may be a little slow to adopt the change but many places in the rest of the world is already far ahead when it comes to cleaner energy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

In the meantime, poor people can't afford fucking food because the price is so high thanks to energy costs. You're talking social issues like education...I'm talking about the daily REAL world effect it has on people. Cost of clothing, cost of keeping warm in the winter and cool in the summer, cost of driving a vehicle to and from work or out to job interviews to find work, cost of FOOD, cost of every last thing you buy in the store.

You're talking as if the entire country is poor, which it isn't. What you have is economic disparity. Entire towns of people lose their jobs when the factory they gave their lives to move overseas. The town struggles for years, even decades, to catch up. Families grow up poor, and kids drop out of school to try to earn money but end up getting nowhere. Low education means low paying jobs means less money to spend means less stores, etc etc.

Sure reducing fuel costs may help but it doesn't fixes the many other problems that create and keep economic depression.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

In case you never watch business networks...they have been incredibly optimistic because the overall economy has improved and people have more money in their pockets over the last several months as fuel prices went DOWN.

The economy has been improving since the housing crash, and the price of fuel has been increasing right along with it - only in the past few months have gas and oil prices dropped.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

The opposite happens when they go up.

While fuel prices can have some affect, it is not the only thing that drives the economy. Of course if there were a drastic shortage of fuel then the economy would suffer like crazy, on that I would agree with you... but in this case, high fuel costs don't cause all people to become poor.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

We have the ability to turn the spigot "on" or "off" of U.S. production. But we never do.

I'm not sure, but I'd venture to guess that this is probably a good thing....

peace.

dyna mo · 12-01-2014, 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

That's the thing... I didn't. You're losing it man.... Read my first post again. No mention of you whatsoever.

i guess the problem here is we need to get you to understand words like *you* because when YOU say the word YOU to someone, that means them. example sentence:

Do YOU understand that? that is directed at you because I used the word you and was addressing you. you.

Quote:

Originally Posted by **********

a couple of governments will finally to take (baby) steps towards fixing the problem. That's it.

next, thanks again for proofing me correct that you global alarmists are debbie downers.

and just more proof that you are not even keeping up with the facts and reality. the hand wave off the USA and China in regards to pollution as simply a couple of governments? Combined these countries = 50% of greenhouse gas emmissions and lead the other countries to change.

Not to mention the fact 90% cut by 2050 is the worldwide fucking goal o reach the 2 degree celsius max limit, which apparently you are not even aware of. but that's the goal. and that's a baby step to YOU.

and in light of that being a baby step, you come here expecting us to change our lives while you think THAT is a baby step?

again, womp woooooooomp.

and more proof you are truly not interested in the issue.

Robbie · 12-01-2014, 10:20 AM

Mark, high fuel prices affect the ENTIRE economy.

They cost everybody money and affect employment and salaries.

You just aren't taking this into account.

As for drilling on federal lands...it's just EMPTY space. I'm not talking about oil gushers in the middle of a national park. I'm talking about millions of acres of desolate uninhabitable land that serves no purpose.

You are also discounting technology. This isn't 1890 with wooden oil towers gushing dirty crude oil all over the ground anymore.
And even when that DID happen in Texas...it didn't destroy nature there. I was in Texas back in May for a wedding. The place is beautiful...and that's despite the fact that there used to be an oil rig every 10 feet there. lol

You are just plain out WRONG if you don't think that these high fuel prices don't hurt the economy and especially destroy the lives of poor folks.
For them it is literally living meal to meal. And it's real, real hard to get a good job when companies are cutting back because of the higher overhead that high fuel costs bring.

I've known a lot of guys who are truckers in my time. Diesel fuel was running around 50 cents and they were making money. Think about that...giant semi trucks having to travel thousands of miles. That's a LOT of fuel.

This week, diesel fuel is on average $3.68 a gallon.

Don't you comprehend what that does to the cost of EVERYTHING? And how that affects the economy?

We literally have more energy than we will ever use right underneath our feet. And millions of acres of DESOLATE land that nobody ever "enjoys" or even steps foot on.

At least your govt. finally wised up and started doing something instead of just being victimized by insane Muslim oil sheiks.

And your other "solution" (to what "problem" I don't know)...is to tax oil companies. Yeah...because fuel isn't too expensive already.

Mark, don't you understand that companies DON'T pay taxes...consumers do. The price is passed on to the consumer.
And for what? So the U.S. federal govt. will have even MORE money to spend on killing people around the world with our military?

I don't think that you realize how corrupt the govt. is. Why on Earth would you want to take money from companies that actually employ people and provide a product that we all need...and give it to a bunch of lazy, shifty bureaucrats who didn't earn a damn thing?

12-01-2014, 10:20 AM	#62
Robbie Leaner, Meaner, Faster Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Vegas Posts: 20,958	Mark, high fuel prices affect the ENTIRE economy. They cost everybody money and affect employment and salaries. You just aren't taking this into account. As for drilling on federal lands...it's just EMPTY space. I'm not talking about oil gushers in the middle of a national park. I'm talking about millions of acres of desolate uninhabitable land that serves no purpose. You are also discounting technology. This isn't 1890 with wooden oil towers gushing dirty crude oil all over the ground anymore. And even when that DID happen in Texas...it didn't destroy nature there. I was in Texas back in May for a wedding. The place is beautiful...and that's despite the fact that there used to be an oil rig every 10 feet there. lol You are just plain out WRONG if you don't think that these high fuel prices don't hurt the economy and especially destroy the lives of poor folks. For them it is literally living meal to meal. And it's real, real hard to get a good job when companies are cutting back because of the higher overhead that high fuel costs bring. I've known a lot of guys who are truckers in my time. Diesel fuel was running around 50 cents and they were making money. Think about that...giant semi trucks having to travel thousands of miles. That's a LOT of fuel. This week, diesel fuel is on average $3.68 a gallon. Don't you comprehend what that does to the cost of EVERYTHING? And how that affects the economy? We literally have more energy than we will ever use right underneath our feet. And millions of acres of DESOLATE land that nobody ever "enjoys" or even steps foot on. At least your govt. finally wised up and started doing something instead of just being victimized by insane Muslim oil sheiks. And your other "solution" (to what "problem" I don't know)...is to tax oil companies. Yeah...because fuel isn't too expensive already. Mark, don't you understand that companies DON'T pay taxes...consumers do. The price is passed on to the consumer. And for what? So the U.S. federal govt. will have even MORE money to spend on killing people around the world with our military? I don't think that you realize how corrupt the govt. is. Why on Earth would you want to take money from companies that actually employ people and provide a product that we all need...and give it to a bunch of lazy, shifty bureaucrats who didn't earn a damn thing? __________________ -Robbie ClaudiaMarie.Com

11-30-2014, 11:31 AM	#54
dyna mo The People's Post Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: invisible 7-11 Posts: 63,906	double post

11-30-2014, 12:08 PM	#58
dyna mo The People's Post Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: invisible 7-11 Posts: 63,906	my post from earlier, more optimism for the debbie downer gfy global warming alarmists to ignore or discount Quote: NRG, which built a leading electricity business from coal and other conventional power plants, is aiming to reduce its carbon emissions 50 percent by 2030 and 90 percent by 2050, the company said on Thursday. David Crane, the company?s chief executive, made the announcement at a ceremony breaking ground for the company?s new headquarters in Princeton, N.J., conceived as a green-energy showcase that will open in 2016. ?The power industry is the biggest part of the problem of greenhouse gas emissions, but it has the potential to be an even bigger part of the solution,? Mr. Crane said in an interview before the announcement. Businesses like Coca-Cola, Google and Walmart are increasingly looking to buy or produce more green energy as a way of reducing their carbon footprints, creating a potentially lucrative market for companies like NRG. This week, for instance, Ikea announced it had bought a second wind farm in the United States, part of its goal of, by 2020, producing as much renewable energy as the company consumes globally. ?We are working with these companies on putting solar panels all over their facilities, and it?s helpful for them to know that we?re heading in the right direction,? Mr. Crane said.