pimpmaster9000

Debt = prosperity LOL

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thommy

it CAN be - up to a point and it was the ONLY chance obama had to bring fresh money in the system while the old one was gone offshore.

but us dept to gdp is meanwhile in the near of countries like portugal, italy or congo.
even the "crash country" cyprus is meanwhile better the the US.
USA made it to number 12 of the most bancrupt countries in the world - even jordan have a better economy and a much better debt to GDP.

but it does not make sense to discuss that with people with NO skills in economy. they want to see what they got told adn what is logic for small brains. this is why it is MUCH easier to get into power with the stupids - they eat all and everything and they love to eat shit as long as there is enough catchup on it.

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ruff

People still loving the taste of that tRump cock. Yummy! Squirt please.

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thommy

not all - just a special species. i do not even have to read political threads anymore to know who is belonging to it.
it´s funny how many things they have in common.

try it out - it´s funny !

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OneHungLo

Debt is good. Of course the wrong kind of debt is bad i.e. credit card debt or car loans for example are bad, but debt for investment properties where tenants are paying it down or debt to buy or grow a businesses good.

See how fucking stupid you are? Damn peasant...

directfiesta

hummmmm, where did I hear that before .... hummmmm ?????

bronco67

Camacho probably has more sense than Donald Trump.

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MFCT

Dow being 25,000 is clearly racist. And before you scoff at me, hear me out.

All these earnings by all these corporations could be collected as taxes. And given to Mexicans through welfare, as reparations for the USA making Mexicans into slaves way back during the Alamo. All this extra welfare would mean Mexicans wouldn't be poor anymore. They'd be living easy for the rest of their lives, owning houses and cars with their welfare.

By making corporations prosper, and trickling down into the pockets of workers, is doing nothing but fueling racism. Because the only kind of people that Trump will allow to have any kind of jobs in this country are white supremacists.

Let's hope Trump gets impeached soon, for tweeting mean things or something. So Hillary can step up and be president!

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pimpmaster9000

the USA is not an investment property, the money did not go towards building a future business it went to fund fake wars and pay for bankers raping you with sandpaper around their dicks...

its not like the 20 trillion went towards creating any jobs

trump as a politician is the equivalent of a fat fitness instructor

oh and the debt always comes due...always...

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Sarn

How debt work))

thommy

quite clear - and now show me the dept curve of US and tell me on wich point it went down.
as you see very good in this explanation cycles are waves. as you can not see waves in the US economy - only more dept what does not go along with the productivity you see a bankruptcy curve what is ONLY drifting in one direction.

so if you wanted to tell me something about economy you are a bit late because i am a economist and know those rules. but if you watch that video again and again you might be also able to see where the problem is when a country have a lot of debts, less income by
decreasing the taxes and even more spendings by increasing the interest rates what
effects the debts again in a negative matter.

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thommy

in fact THAT IS what is behind the idea of global economy.

no economy can survive without buyers and if you want to increase this number the only chance are in that regions of the world where people still can´t afford to buy.

if you want to make them buyers you have to give them income first.

this is what trump supporters logic do never get because their world ends at the walls of their own living room (or at the end of the bridge they are living under).

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thommy

ok now i understand your reason.

obviously you did that all your life and now you are pissed because you do not get any more loans - now you need someone to blame for it.

i tell you a secret: look in the mirror - there is the guilty one !

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Sarn

USA risked with debt - no one argues with this.but when huge risk then more profit can be, or not can be. Crisis - it is structure problem, in EU "planned" economy with production quotas by the countries, it gives less growth and less risk.


Capitalist Cycle. the continually repeating movement of capitalist production from one economic crisis to another. It includes the phases of crisis, depression, revival, and boom. In the development of each phase, the conditions are created for the transition to the next phase of the cycle.
https://encyclopedia2.thefreediction...pitalist+Cycle

thommy

there is nothing like a production quota in the EU. that would never make sense because the market is what makes the quota of a product or service.

the growth of the EU economy is btw now MUCH faster ast the US. The US economy was pushed by HUGE debts what can never be paid back.
the european economy took a bit longer to recover but in many european countries the debt clocks are already going backward and debts getting lower.

for me there is too much marx in it.
the communist countries are proved that they can not work because more effort there does not lead to more prosperity. that makes people lazy.

on the other hand a 100% free market with no control can also not work because the individual person there has just a value as consumer and not as human.

as in many issues the truth is somewhere in between - but there will be never a perfect system.

the conditions what are actually leading to the next crisis are are the result of missing rules. people missunderstand that 100% freedom for everyone will lead to the fact that just the strongest, the most unscrupulous, the most corrupt and most rich can survive.

and this will destroy any kind society because you should never kill the cow you milk.

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Paul Markham

It may have passed you by. The rise of the DOW has little effect on 90% of the people, they only feel the pain when it falls.

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thommy

that might be right for other countries but not for usa. A HUGE number of citizens using the stockmarket to secure their income after their working life.

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Sarn

wto quotas(agriculture control), climate change(quotas on CO2 - control production)

WTO panel set up on China-U.S. fight on grain import quotas
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-u...-idUSKCN1BX27B

Tariff quotas EU (export-import control) - it can give control by profitability of production of EU neighbors
https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_custom...riff-quotas_en

The concept of global warming was created by and for the Chinese in order to make U.S. manufacturing non-competitive.
https://twitter.com/realdonaldtrump/...95292191248385

As I know Russia sell CO2 normas from climate change agreement for EU.
Of course, it quotas hiding for control market.)

If belief in Wikipedia.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...y_GDP_(nominal)

Credit money cheaper for use, not have tax costs as money from profit. It not bad but have the risk not paid back, then balance money profit/credit optimal it 50/50 - As the USA has.

Else if you have debt 10 thousand $ for bank - it is your problem, if 20 trillion $ it is bank's problem))
And if debtor have good army it another question

This is true.

OneHungLo

Tommy I said debt is good.. why would I be pissed? I took out about 1.2 million in loans from 2002-2006 now that has turned into over 3.2 million in equity and a 6 figure passive income stream with zero taxes paid on that equity. I only wish I took out 10 million in debt. Yes Tommy, debt is good. And you're a babbling retard.

DeadFidel

ibill has all my money.

thommy

question is WHAT was the value in 2008 and 2009 ?

do you think your bank would let you go when you would have 10 million in loans against 6 million of equity?

dept is good as long as you can pay back but it is unrealistic to think that U can ever pay back - and open 2 new holes to close one old is simply bad maths.
it is a question of time til they have to take you your equity to pay the debts of the country.

trump and his mafia will already have left the country with the money YOU AND THE OTHER CITIZENS are owing. but you will still be there because you can´t move real estate to another country.
btw: the german word for real estate is immobilie because they are taking your mobility.

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OneHungLo

I know your shriveled up foreskin starts to twitch when you hear about the US national debt, but the fact is, the government’s interest payments to service 20 trillion dollars was $225 billion, which is only 7% of its income (3.2 trillion). And that 225 billion was the same amount back in 1997 which i'm sure is actually 20-30% more that when you factor in 20 years of inflation.

Now I know you're just a lowly goat herder in serbia, but do you think a company with 3.2 trillion in revenues with 225 million in debt service is in trouble?

OneHungLo

Tommy the value of the property fluctuates and is unimportant in the short term. What is important is the debt service being covered by income. I'm not talking about buying a house and living in it, I'm talking about investment properties where the renters pay my debt service, maintenance, property taxes etc. The debt is sustainable by others.

Tommy your problem is your babbling on about shit you're clearly clueless about. What the fuck are you going on about I can't move my real estate to another country?

Sarn

globalization ended , mobility not needed now IMHO

Acepimp

^^ HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! Sick burns, bro!

When the weather warms up, let's get beers next time you're on the east coast

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thommy

i would tell that the millions of house owners who lost their property in the real estate crisis.

here we go.
in a financial crisis you will not be able to cover it with FUTURE income because in such a periode all previews are just fog.

so if you take debts in a good time and you can not guarantee those debts with anything else as the investment you bought you are fucked.

i think I have a few more clues as you do because I am in economy scientific since nearly 40 years.

there was a time when a house or a piece of land in detroit was 50 times more valuable as it is now. an investor with "mobil assets" can simply move them and will not lose anything. how can you do that with a piece of land in detroit?

the same thing happens to the complete country because the debts are not secured. even the countries assets aren´t secured because there is no value in 20 year old tomahawk missiles what are part of the us assets.

the country is financially fucked and the really big boys know that and invest the money they still can make inside the US (as long as banks will give consumer loans) outside from the country. if you take the global activities from US companies out of this game the USA is already poorer than bangladesh.

trump makes you think that america can live without this global market and cuts every tie what was holding the us economy over centuries.
he fucked already big chances and he will fuck more of them and that will inspire companies to move to the markets what they can´t reach.

so what you will see in the future is the OPPOSITE of what your "stable genius" is telling you. I do not even say that he does that on purpose. he is just that stupid that he sees the world only from his perspective and he is so arrogant that he thinks that the world will spin around him.

when the day will come when USA have to declare bankruptcy you have only 2 choices left:

1. go into a war against the world what you can not win or
2. being sold to china

however this can not have a good final - all logic speaks against it.

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thommy

if globalization ends ALL of you would be fucked.

how stupid sounds the end of the globalization in a board where 99% of the members living from the mechanics of the global market ?

if you want to cut global ties the first thing what have to go is the internet, you genius.

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pimpmaster9000

dude you have 20 trillion debt, 3.2 trillion revenues...its not how much it costs to service the debt, its the debt itself that is the problem...

you would need like 7 years of spending $0 and eating nothing just to repay the debt...oh and the debt is going nowhere but up...lets get real here, in 10 years the debt will be 30 trillion...

+possible 1 trillion deficit by 2020
+possible and very likely 1.5 trillion deficit by 2027

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/10/24/budg...man-sachs.html

optimistic version:
https://www.cbo.gov/system/files/115...017outlook.pdf

"CBO does not see the deficit passing the $1 trillion mark until 2022, when it is estimated at $1.03 trillion, then expects it keep rising to $1.46 trillion by 2027."




not looking good

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thommy

too many zeros for him....

i explain you how he calculates.

on a number with 14 zeros he adds the 14 zeros together what leads to zero.
plus the 2 in the start. is not much.

they lost the reality - they do not even realize that a person is not be able in his entire live to count from one to 1 billion - even when he would do that 24 hours per day.

to count from 1 to 20 trillion you would need 20.000 generations of human what never sleep and only count every second of their entire life.

but it is nothing ;-)

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Sarn

here have an image with steps globalization process
https://www.investmentbank.barclays....e-know-it.html

The problem is, while globalization tends to increase overall wealth ? the pie gets bigger ? not everyone gains equally, and some actually lose. The angry U.S. blue-collar workers plumping for Trump and the rural anti-EU voters in Britain, for instance, see globalization as a project that benefits the elites at their expense. There is some truth to this. In the U.K., this contributed to the Brexit vote, and in the U.S., this helped bring Trump to the presidency. While Brexit has not yet happened, and while there is no telling what Trump will do when actually in office, the political debate has clearly shifted against economic openness.



WWW it is only one part - it starting to broken now

Net neutrality: what the US overhaul of internet laws will mean for the web
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technolog...ws-affect-web/

Russia follows China in tightening internet restrictions, raising fresh censorship concerns
https://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/31/russ...-concerns.html

WTO - will be destroyed through sanction, Swift too under risk of sanction because was used against Iran. In finance institutes trust and reputation important, no one does not give its money not-trusted instruments.


For most of the past 25 years, globalisation was seen as an unstoppable force, as sure to advance as the sun rises in the east. But increasingly, it looks more vulnerable than inexorable. Causes for concern are easy to find. For instance, the last set of World Trade Organisation negotiations over further trade liberalization, the Doha Round, was a failure; Donald J. Trump has disavowed free trade agreements such as NAFTA and the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP); Brexit will reduce economic integration between the United Kingdom and the European Union, and possibly between the U.K. and the world; and regional opposition almost scuppered the Canada-EU Comprehensive Economic and Trade Agreement (CETA). Is the age of globalisation coming to an end?

Read more at https://knowledge.insead.edu/economi...TicJrsR3O0l.99

China is Non-competitive with the USA, without tomahawk especially.
War with NK can down Asian economies few countries SK,JP CN etc.. 20 year old tomahawk missiles will work well)))

thommy

but the point is that WE DO KNOW IT now already because trump IS in office since a year and all he did are mistakes...

what you also mention in your next quote:

what this part is telling is that NOBODY ever believed that the motor of globalization can be stopped by ignorants. it is such an obvious (and one and only chance) to grow and it was the only motor in thousands of years experience in economy.

worlds wealth STARTED by trades with other countries and to stop that trades will have the opposite effect. it is silly to think that it can work different - prosperity would implode. we have THOUSANDS OF YEARS of approval for that.

and it does not matter if a country makes more and another less in one century because the laws of economy are waves with ups and downs. there can not be a winner if there is not a looser on the other hand. but a looser is not good for the economy so the others will automaticly take care that the loser can go back into the game.

this is what actually happening in greece, spain, portugal and even in countries what haven´t been on the list a few centuries ago.
look the growth of india - look what they imported from other countries 10 years ago and look what they import today. and imagine HOW MANY they are !!!
the same we can see in china and even russia with all the sanctions they are suffering is doing ok because they simply ignore the markets where they got blocked. the only one who suffer from this sanctions are the countries who can not sell to them.

it is fucking stupid to think that force will not result in back force.
if we use our energy to force each other it can not result in prosperity.
we should compete but respect when someone else does some things better.

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2MuchMark

Are you aware that you , like JoshuaMo, laugh at everything you yourself say? You have a constant nervous giggle. A nervous tic. It's a self deprecating laugh. It indicates insecurity and poor self image and submissiveness to avert punishment.

Just pointing that out...

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The Porn Nerd

This argument of free trade and globalization has been going on since before Columbus and will continue endlessly. Northwest Passage anyone? Silk Road anyone?

People want shit from other places, end deate.

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MaDalton

it is really hilarious to watch: 8 years Obama = debt is bad!!!! despite the fact he became president at the brink of collapse and without the bailouts companies like General Motors would not exist anymore.

Now - 8 years of economic growth and sinking unemployement later - at a point where the really wealthy most certainly could afford paying their taxes (not even higher taxes, just close loopholes) - another 1.5 trillion debt are cool because an orange gibbon says so (sorry to all gibbons).

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thommy

they are more familar with walls.
let´s talk about a silk wall.

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Rochard

So when the stock market comes crashing down.... Will we all blame Trump?

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Sarn

It was not a mistake.
All going into a big war, not a big deal.

thommy

as long it is your ass and not mine you are free to go in any war you want.

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CoolMikey

Yea, DOUBLING of debt from $10T to $20T = "No big deal, Obama did what had to be done" While increasing debt from $20T to $21.5T, a 7.5% increase over the next DECADE = "That idiot doesn't know what he is doing! Debt is bad and will lead to the collapse of the US!"

Hilarious to watch indeed.

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RedFred

Hell noooo. They'll blame Hillary and open another investigation.

MaDalton

it's additional - adding to the debt that is created anyways. Like another 33 billion for a uselss border wall. or a 10% increase in a defense budget that is already bigger than the next 10 countries combined

let's watch it and i'll hear your excuses later

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thommy

don´t forget the heaviest stone:
all that must be paid with LESS tax income !

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Sarn

I mean will be 1. point ))



You can see likes under video for understand what people want))
Eastern Europe or North Korea+China or the Middle East Iran+SA+Israel
Potential places for use tactical nuke.


Russia and the United States are wrecking a landmark treaty

TO APPRECIATE the significance of the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty, signed in 1987 by the Soviet Union and United States, just gaze up at the Pioneer and Pershing II missiles on display at the National Air and Space Museum in Washington. The Soviet missile looms nearly 55 feet tall, with a bulbous reentry vehicle for three nuclear warheads, and the more svelte U.S. missile, nearly 35 feet, with one warhead. These menacing weapons were at the center of an intense arms race in Europe in the late 1970s and early 1980s. Then it was reversed.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...=.484b398ae50a

OneHungLo

Absolutely

pimpmaster9000

-1175

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slapass

Clinton.

OneHungLo

it's called a correction..relax...and stick to your far-in-jar coins

Bladewire

Trump sycophant

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BaldBastard

Today is not a crash wake up its just a correction based on rumours.

2nd fed rise is when all hell breaks loose, and clear as day Trumps policies have organised this for mid year. And even then its a nothing burger because its the rate hikes after that, and after that, and after that, and after that... that will do the damage.