Adult Friend Finder position statement - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

Pete-KT · 10-13-2006, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GonZo

.... CLEAN UP PETE-KT!!!

whats that supposed to mean?

poisson · 10-13-2006, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by minusonebit

Ah, this thread is a great read.

Good job, Lars. You just added your program onto my personal blacklist of programs that I'll never fly an ad for as long as I'm around. There is no legit reason for supporting spam, adware, spyware or any of this other crap, and certainly no excuse for buying your affiliate's traffic on the cheap through the back door. And yeah, its legal. All kinds of unethical things are legal, dosent mean they should be done.

Sometimes, I wonder if there is any money at all left in this whole affiliate/program model. It seems like anymore the affiliate does all the work and the program does everything they can to fuck the affiliate out of thier megar earnings (shaving, slow payments, bankruptcy, the shit described here) and at the end of the day you have done one helluva lot of work to earn a few peanuts.

Like if every sponsors should put an investigator on every hit they purchase.

Come on grow up.

GonZo · 10-13-2006, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete-KT

whats that supposed to mean?

Im helping FREE PETE KT's NOSE!!!

Dont worry its on me...gratis!

Pleasurepays · 10-13-2006, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GonZo

Oh Im serious Lars. I have much respect for your purple pimp hat!

Dont worry Ill be posting a thread on my board too so that we can all help fight the opression and FREE LEGENDARY LARS!!!

And in light of recent posts in this thread we will be taking additional donations to buy Pete some nice hankies so he can clean up his nose too!

FREE LEGENDARY LARS .... CLEAN UP PETE-KT!!!

haha.. this biz is about smoke, mirrors, posturing and fake wealth. if you busted these guys drugging and raping a 10 year old boy, with Osama bin Laden holding the video camera, 3 editors preparing footage for distribution, 3 suitcase nuclear bombs in the room with the rest of the crew standing in the background, screaming "death to infidels" while shooting old people in the face - there would still be no shortage of people saying "hey man, i like them, real standup guys for sure"

Pete-KT · 10-13-2006, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GonZo

Im helping FREE PETE KT's NOSE!!!

Dont worry its on me...gratis!

your a crackhead you know that

Mr Pheer · 10-13-2006, 10:47 PM

All I have to say is that this really wouldnt bother me, EXCEPT that I have an exclusitivity contract with AFF that I cant advertise other dating sites. So yes it pretty much pisses me off that these ads can pop up and have the potential of taking a sale from me when I'm not allowed to send a sale away from AFF.

minusonebit · 10-13-2006, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poisson

Like if every sponsors should put an investigator on every hit they purchase.

Come on grow up.

Of course not, but once they know what is going on, continuing to support it (yes, buying is supporting) takes away all plausable deniability.

GonZo · 10-13-2006, 10:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete-KT

your a crackhead you know that

Aww is that anyway to talk to a guy trying to help you out?

poisson · 10-13-2006, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by minusonebit

Of course not, but once they know what is going on, continuing to support it (yes, buying is supporting) takes away all plausable deniability.

What Lars said, i s that they wont buy there anymore.

Why would you stop sending them some business? They are the second or third that made an official statemnt.

Edit: Re-reading, i'm no t seing it.

GonZo · 10-13-2006, 10:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pleasurepays

haha.. this biz is about smoke, mirrors, posturing and fake wealth. if you busted these guys drugging and raping a 10 year old boy, with Osama bin Laden holding the video camera, 3 editors preparing footage for distribution, 3 suitcase nuclear bombs in the room with the rest of the crew standing in the background, screaming "death to infidels" while shooting old people in the face - there would still be no shortage of people saying "hey man, i like them, real standup guys for sure"

You know all that matters to some is whos buying the next round at a show...

me Id rather be a crackhead than a crack kisser.

Pete-KT · 10-13-2006, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GonZo

Aww is that anyway to talk to a guy trying to help you out?

I can talk anyway I want its a free world isnt it?

GonZo · 10-13-2006, 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete-KT

I can talk anyway I want its a free world isnt it?

Where I live it is.

Pete-KT · 10-13-2006, 10:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GonZo

Where I live it is.

Must be the good US of A ha ;) anyways goodnight Gonzo

GonZo · 10-13-2006, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete-KT

Must be the good US of A ha ;) anyways goodnight Gonzo

BUt you havent said if you will help us FREE LEGENDARY LARS!!! from the people that are forcing him to do this horrible things...

or were you just working a traffic angle?

Pleasurepays · 10-13-2006, 11:07 PM

in all seriousness.... i can sympathize with all of this. i used to rob banks because other people were robbing banks. i was forced into it. well, some people called it "armed robbery". i called it "agressive withdrawal in a pre-emptive measure to protect my financial position".

Nookster · 10-13-2006, 11:11 PM

I will now take this oportune moment to pull all aff and related links and halt all promotions. Thank you for clearing that up.

Xenophage · 10-13-2006, 11:12 PM

hot hot hot

poisson · 10-13-2006, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LegendaryLars

hot hot hot

Lars can i buy your sig for a month?

Xenophage · 10-13-2006, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poisson

Lars can i buy your sig for a month?

That would cost a lot

For like $50K you can buy my sig but I have tyo approve of the ad

poisson · 10-13-2006, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LegendaryLars

That would cost a lot

For like $50K you can buy my sig but I have tyo approve of the ad

Name a price.

Jace · 10-13-2006, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poisson

Name a price.

he already did

datatank · 10-13-2006, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete-KT

Lars got a minute to talk about some traffic trades?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Sergy or Larry can you please ICQ me about my adwords account

poisson · 10-13-2006, 11:23 PM

And how much for the sig? I mean not for yo to approve it first?

Pete-KT · 10-13-2006, 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by datatank

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Sergy or Larry can you please ICQ me about my adwords account

sorry my icq was already answered now you have to wait till monday

Xenophage · 10-13-2006, 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by datatank

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Sergy or Larry can you please ICQ me about my adwords account

I actually did hit him up on ICQ and a funny story I used to deal with David Filo of yahoo to get my submissions listed there

in 1994 on akebono.stanford.edu for those of you who dont know that was yahoo before they got yahoo.com

Xenophage · 10-13-2006, 11:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poisson

And how much for the sig? I mean not for yo to approve it first?

Like I said $50,000 paid up front and I get to approve the ad.

poisson · 10-13-2006, 11:29 PM

I'm asking,,, how much for you not to approve it first. "Carte blanche"

Xenophage · 10-13-2006, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by poisson

I'm asking,,, how much for you not to approve it first. "Carte blanche"

Wouldnt do it ok ok for like 10 million I might but no one would pay that so its a moot point

GonZo · 10-13-2006, 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LegendaryLars

I actually did hit him up on ICQ and a funny story I used to deal with David Filo of yahoo to get my submissions listed there

in 1994 on akebono.stanford.edu for those of you who dont know that was yahoo before they got yahoo.com

I KNEW IT!!!
Those fuckers from Yahoo are responsible!

Lars you should have never trusted them just because they had a cool mailing list with all the great sites on the cyberweb!

How can we get back at them? We have to FREE you from Adware!

TampaToker · 10-13-2006, 11:35 PM

Nice i just pulled my aff links and cams.com links and switched to dating gold. So i click a link on my site and sure enough look at this shit. Now i cant even send traffic to datinggold now

Click the pic twice...........

poisson · 10-13-2006, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LegendaryLars

Wouldnt do it ok ok for like 10 million I might but no one would pay that so its a moot point

10 MILLION, that's not a fair asking price for your sig on gfy.

Seriously... Money on the table. For how much would you sale your gfy reputation for1 little month?

datatank · 10-13-2006, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete-KT

sorry my icq was already answered now you have to wait till monday

Larry logged off?
I think Sergey is on invisible dude

KrisKross · 10-13-2006, 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LegendaryLars

AdultFriendFinder from time to time as a small part of its advertising budget places ad buys with companies which some people might call ?adware?. Adware is software that is installed on a user?s computer with notice and consent by the user. In some instances such adware will use contextual ads - for example it may scan web pages for references to certain keywords and then pop up relevant ads from its advertisers. Typical keywords for AdultFriendFinder may include ?dating? and ?friend?. One of the motivating factors in AdultFriendFinder placing such adware ads is to effectively compete in the online dating marketplace - namely if AdultFriendFinder does not place such ads our competitors will make deals with the adware companies to place such ads to our detriment.

It has come to our attention that some affiliates are unhappy about some uncommon and unintended side effects of adware advertising ? in some instances the adware will scan a web page and pop up an ?in context? AdultFriendFinder ad in a browser window next to an affiliate?s ad for AdultFriendFinder in another browser window. This scenario certainly makes us uncomfortable and creates a catch-22 for us ? if we stop buying the contextual adware ads our competitors? sites will pop up and we may lose sales and if we keep buying adware ads we may find from time to time our ads will pop up near our affiliate?s ads for our sites.

While it is perfectly legal for us to place ads with internet software providers like adware companies, specialized browser providers, and search engines that place our ads near our affiliates ads (for example this happens often with keyword buys on search engines) this notion of the adware ad ?collisions? that has recently been raised does make us feel somewhat uncomfortable ? in other words we find ourselves sympathetic with those who have not been happy with this bizarre result.

So we decided to look further into the adware issue. While we are at least partially at the mercy of the programmatic techniques of the given adware companies we are already exploring and experimenting with technology solutions to try to figure out ways to reduce the number of ?adware collisions?. Our primary method of tracking affiliate traffic is not by using cookies (as has been wrongly suggested on some board postings) but rather by coded URLs ? this may have to change. Suffice it to say that for now we appreciate the comments that have been made on the boards to date by our affiliates (yes even the adverse ones) and we will attempt to address this unforeseen consequence of adware ad buys in the near future. If AdultFriendFinder affiliates have any comments or proposed solutions you may e-mail me at lars at legendarylars.com

While I understand and appreciate your position, what you're doing with this post is essentially attempting to justify stealing from your own affiliates.

Rochard · 10-13-2006, 11:54 PM

Is it not possible that Lars bought traffic from a source without knowing exactly where the traffic is coming from? And now that he's shut it off he can't stop this from happening?

Furious_Female · 10-13-2006, 11:57 PM

It seems like Zango and companies alike are basically for program/site owners to compete with each other. They create the battlefied and surfers/affiliates get killed in the war.

Jon Clark - BANNED FOR LIFE · 10-13-2006, 11:59 PM

thanks for the post lars....

KrisKross · 10-14-2006, 12:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

Is it not possible that Lars bought traffic from a source without knowing exactly where the traffic is coming from? And now that he's shut it off he can't stop this from happening?

If that was the case, why wouldn't he have said so? The wording of his post suggests that not only was he well aware of the source, he hasn't discontinued using the source.

His post boils down to "We buy traffic from adware companies so that our competitors don't. We're aware that a side effect of these traffic buys is that we end up stealing sales from our affiliates. We're looking into solutions for this."

TampaToker · 10-14-2006, 12:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rochard

Is it not possible that Lars bought traffic from a source without knowing exactly where the traffic is coming from? And now that he's shut it off he can't stop this from happening?

They can shut it off any time they want

XPays · 10-14-2006, 12:08 AM

One interesting thing in this thread is the cookie talk.

if webmasters really want to see their sales drop- they can use programs that do not hardcode their links. be careful what you wish for- revolving methods around cookies is a smokescreen. keep a year or lifetime cookie- whatever, sales still are not going to track accurately because cookies are good for a lot of things- but not for core affiliate tracking.

fetishblog · 10-14-2006, 12:28 AM

Tracking anything via cookies is so 1995. Why not use sessions or URL tracking rather then cookies and be done with this whole mess?

Xenophage · 10-14-2006, 12:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fetishblog

Tracking anything via cookies is so 1995. Why not use sessions or URL tracking rather then cookies and be done with this whole mess?

Umm thats what we do URL tracking

TrafficHog · 10-14-2006, 01:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LegendaryLars

Umm thats what we do URL tracking

It appears that Will76's biggest point of all this is about cookie tracking and no one is using cookies alone to track sales. Will76 has some learing to do and his intelligence is very questionable because of his false accusations. In another thread someone posted webpower being promoting as a URL in Zango. Will76... When will that affiliate URL be banned? It appears to still be active and debunking EVERYTHING your opinionating about.

teomaxxx · 10-14-2006, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pleasurepays

haha.. this biz is about smoke, mirrors, posturing and fake wealth. if you busted these guys drugging and raping a 10 year old boy, with Osama bin Laden holding the video camera, 3 editors preparing footage for distribution, 3 suitcase nuclear bombs in the room with the rest of the crew standing in the background, screaming "death to infidels" while shooting old people in the face - there would still be no shortage of people saying "hey man, i like them, real standup guys for sure"

great description of gfy boys

will76 · 10-14-2006, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrafficHog

It appears that Will76's biggest point of all this is about cookie tracking and no one is using cookies alone to track sales. Will76 has some learing to do and his intelligence is very questionable because of his false accusations. In another thread someone posted webpower being promoting as a URL in Zango. Will76... When will that affiliate URL be banned? It appears to still be active and debunking EVERYTHING your opinionating about.

Funny you are the only one saying this stuff. Where are my accusations false ?

cookies being over written is just part of the problem. So what if I am using session tracking and my visitor clicks a link on my site to Ifriends signup page. Let's say they are using session tracking, well the person on zango has purchased the keyword ifriends.com so as soon as my page comes up the person buying that keyword pops up his signup page with his session tracking in it over mine. Who makes the sale ? so this problem is not just with cookies.

Cookies are easier to mess with because they could overwrite your cookies without popping up a page if they wanted to. For session tracking all they have to do is pop up their page over yours and it servers the same purpose. Most of the surfers will not even know that it wasn;t you causing that page to come up, they will think that is the one they clicked to see in the first place. The popup comes up real fast.

I don't know who's fake nick you are but it is obvious you are a fake nick, or one of those " buddies" that kept telling DH to post retarded comments here. Keep up your hate, all you are doing is keep giving me an oppertunity to make you look stupid with your post.

If you see clickcash affiliates doing this report them, they will be banned.

Machete_ · 10-14-2006, 02:27 AM

"Adware is software that is installed on a user?s computer with notice and consent by the user"

who do you thing you are fooling with that?

Brujah · 10-14-2006, 02:27 AM

Where's the SexSearch thread? Have they responded?

ilsoph · 10-14-2006, 02:28 AM

until we see legislation, there's no easy or obvious solution..

imo there's a bandaid fix which requires profiling how affiliate sales are generated... the problem is piggyback referral info that supercedes the original referrer.. as the merchant you have the ability to identify this behaviour... the hard part is determining proportions (ie, legitimate elapse time for same referral, etc.).. for that i suggest you take the CRA\IRS's approach: go for the obvious big fish..

while not an ideal solution.. there will be some that slip through the cracks, not to mention another added operating expense... but never forget that respect and goodwill go a long way..

good luck.

rigrunner · 10-14-2006, 02:47 AM

can't you get camsdotcom trademarked or something so no assholes can bid on it?

elasticatedman · 10-14-2006, 03:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TampaToker

Nice i just pulled my aff links and cams.com links and switched to dating gold. So i click a link on my site and sure enough look at this shit. Now i cant even send traffic to datinggold now

Click the pic twice...........

It's like a shark feeding-frenzy, with the affiliate's referral-link acting as the rubby dubby.

Clearly, ethical affiliates and sponsors are on a hiding to nothing.

SpeakEasy · 10-14-2006, 04:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LegendaryLars

I would not say support I would more say forced into read this

You are NOT being forced into supporting and using adware? You are CHOOSING to do it on your own free will. This is sickening to hear. Basically you are a slimey greedy pig and your actions are hrting the entire adult community in so many ways it's unreal.

10-13-2006, 11:07 PM	#65
Pleasurepays BANNED - SUPPORTING TUBES Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: I live in a pile of boogers Posts: 11,913	in all seriousness.... i can sympathize with all of this. i used to rob banks because other people were robbing banks. i was forced into it. well, some people called it "armed robbery". i called it "agressive withdrawal in a pre-emptive measure to protect my financial position". Last edited by Pleasurepays; 10-13-2006 at 11:08 PM..

10-13-2006, 11:11 PM	#66
Nookster Confirmed IT Professional Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Hollywood, CA Posts: 3,744	I will now take this oportune moment to pull all aff and related links and halt all promotions. Thank you for clearing that up. __________________ The Best Affiliate Software, Ever.

10-13-2006, 11:23 PM	#73
poisson Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Sea Posts: 6,474	And how much for the sig? I mean not for yo to approve it first? __________________

10-13-2006, 11:29 PM	#77
poisson Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Sea Posts: 6,474	I'm asking,,, how much for you not to approve it first. "Carte blanche" __________________

10-13-2006, 11:35 PM	#80
TampaToker Confirmed User Join Date: May 2006 Location: Tampa Posts: 5,827	Nice i just pulled my aff links and cams.com links and switched to dating gold. So i click a link on my site and sure enough look at this shit. Now i cant even send traffic to datinggold now Click the pic twice........... __________________ Icq 247-742-205

10-13-2006, 10:47 PM	#56
Mr Pheer Living inside your head. Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: In your AirBNB Posts: 20,503	All I have to say is that this really wouldnt bother me, EXCEPT that I have an exclusitivity contract with AFF that I cant advertise other dating sites. So yes it pretty much pisses me off that these ads can pop up and have the potential of taking a sale from me when I'm not allowed to send a sale away from AFF.

10-13-2006, 11:12 PM	#67
Xenophage Registered User Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2001 Posts: 12,122	hot hot hot

10-13-2006, 11:54 PM	#84
Rochard Jägermeister Test Pilot Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: NORCAL Posts: 72,931	Is it not possible that Lars bought traffic from a source without knowing exactly where the traffic is coming from? And now that he's shut it off he can't stop this from happening? __________________ “The choice is no longer between right or left. The choice is between normal and crazy.” - Sarah Huckabee Sanders YNOT MAIL \| THE BEST ADULT MAILING SOLUTION

10-13-2006, 11:57 PM	#85
Furious_Female Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Upstate, New York Posts: 8,187	It seems like Zango and companies alike are basically for program/site owners to compete with each other. They create the battlefied and surfers/affiliates get killed in the war. __________________ Skype: j3nn.com ICQ 160370494 My current favorite high-converting sponsor: CrakRevenue

10-13-2006, 11:59 PM	#86
Jon Clark - BANNED FOR LIFE North Coast Pimp Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: 304-534-757 Posts: 9,395	thanks for the post lars....

10-14-2006, 12:08 AM	#89
XPays Team Player Join Date: May 2004 Location: Inside the most accurately counting and reporting affiliate system in the world at XPays.com Posts: 13,002	One interesting thing in this thread is the cookie talk. if webmasters really want to see their sales drop- they can use programs that do not hardcode their links. be careful what you wish for- revolving methods around cookies is a smokescreen. keep a year or lifetime cookie- whatever, sales still are not going to track accurately because cookies are good for a lot of things- but not for core affiliate tracking. __________________ InterNext Expo Domain Auction Live Now thru Feb 5 HuntingMoon GFY Domains Marketplace is LIVE XPays always pays! Top Site: * RealJasmine.com * + HotelHeiress® with The Paris Hilton Sex Video Insert the HotelHeiress® HD FEED into your members areas XPin.com Opening for Pin Partners Soonish Mainstream Offers For Emailers and DomainersNONADULT.COM Like Us!

10-14-2006, 12:28 AM	#90
fetishblog Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Your mom is my favorite pornstar!#% Posts: 5,995	Tracking anything via cookies is so 1995. Why not use sessions or URL tracking rather then cookies and be done with this whole mess? __________________ Fling.com doesn't steal your traffic and sales unlike some other dating companies. I promote them, and so should you!

10-14-2006, 02:27 AM	#95
Machete_ WINNING! Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 14,579	"Adware is software that is installed on a user?s computer with notice and consent by the user" who do you thing you are fooling with that?

10-14-2006, 02:27 AM	#96
Brujah Beer Money Baron Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: brujah / gmail Posts: 22,157	Where's the SexSearch thread? Have they responded? __________________ Free Premium Domain Lists and Tools at Clickmojo.com For Sale: Obscenity.com

10-14-2006, 02:28 AM	#97
ilsoph Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 225	until we see legislation, there's no easy or obvious solution.. imo there's a bandaid fix which requires profiling how affiliate sales are generated... the problem is piggyback referral info that supercedes the original referrer.. as the merchant you have the ability to identify this behaviour... the hard part is determining proportions (ie, legitimate elapse time for same referral, etc.).. for that i suggest you take the CRA\IRS's approach: go for the obvious big fish.. while not an ideal solution.. there will be some that slip through the cracks, not to mention another added operating expense... but never forget that respect and goodwill go a long way.. good luck.

10-14-2006, 02:47 AM	#98
rigrunner Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: UK Posts: 877	can't you get camsdotcom trademarked or something so no assholes can bid on it? __________________ Get Nasty - Make Bank Here