2257 Scams- have you seen them? & How do we avoid them? - GoFuckYourself.com

Fukcdoll · 08-22-2009, 07:59 AM

I've just recived an email from clips4sale.com, where I have some of less popular clips available for purchase.

And it was to alert me to a phishing scam, seeking 2257 Docs and model info, Here's a copy of what I got:

*C4S-WARNING ABOUT PHISHING SCAMS‏*

"It has been brought to our attention that there have been some attempts to get your personal information. The most recent one has come from [email protected] (asking a series of 2257 questions, address questions, expense question). Please note that we will not send you email from gmail or any other domain not owned by clips4sale.com. These types of social engineering scams occur all the time. If anyone ever emails you and requests any information and claims to be from clips4sale.com, please CALL our support team and provide us with the information regarding the possible scammer. We ALREADY have your information. We would NEVER need you to email it to us. If we need you to update it, we would tell you to log into our site. We would NOT send you a link to our site (that is another scam where people use similar addresses or links that do not point to us). You know how to get to your administration page! Please be vigilant in safeguarding your personal/corporate dat! a.

Thank you,

The Clips4Sale.com Team "

I had recived several emails prior to this asking for my information & I never responded to any them. When I got this message I was glad that I didn't!!!

Have you seen scams like this, looking for information & docs?

I know most places we sell content, we have pre submit the required information, but for instances where we own the site & have to be the holder of info- how do we know when to supply the docs and when it's just a scam?

I'm bit scared of this myself, being not only the 'producer' but the modle as well- I don't want my personal info to be out there for all the world to see.

With so many experiences webmasters here, I'd like to know how you all deal with release of 2257 Doc's.

How do we know when it's an official request?

Thnx 4 any and all help
~Pam

pornlaw · 08-22-2009, 08:13 AM

This actually happened to my client.

Never give out this type of information. After talking with Clips4Sale, they indicated that any request would only come from an official C4S email address. Anyone else seeking any information should be reported immediately.

As for protecting your 2257 information and keeping your name and address off the net -- we offer that type of privacy through www.2257Safe.com. We act as your custodian of records and you use our address and name for notice purposes. So far the solo models signups have been strong. Models like the idea of being anonymous.

Fukcdoll · 08-22-2009, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornlaw

This actually happened to my client.

Never give out this type of information. After talking with Clips4Sale, they indicated that any request would only come from an official C4S email address. Anyone else seeking any information should be reported immediately.

As for protecting your 2257 information and keeping your name and address off the net -- we offer that type of privacy through www.2257Safe.com. We act as your custodian of records and you use our address and name for notice purposes. So far the solo models signups have been strong. Models like the idea of being anonymous.

Thnx Michale

I've sen a few of these types of buisnesses where you guys handle the records and stuff for us & it's something I'm gonna be looking into down the road, when the site is up and running, generating some revinue etc...

But for the time being, it's just not in the budget unfortunately.

So may I ask you,

How do you know when it's a real request and not some scammer?

Where would an 'official' request come from?

Is there a way to tell it's the real thing and not some scam?

thnx
~Pam

pornlaw · 08-22-2009, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fukcdoll

Thnx Michale

I've sen a few of these types of buisnesses where you guys handle the records and stuff for us & it's something I'm gonna be looking into down the road, when the site is up and running, generating some revinue etc...

But for the time being, it's just not in the budget unfortunately.

So may I ask you,

How do you know when it's a real request and not some scammer?

Where would an 'official' request come from?

Is there a way to tell it's the real thing and not some scam?

thnx
~Pam

As for budget -- www.2257Safe.com lowest priced tier is $29.99 a month and you also get access to my other site www.AdultBizLaw.com with that price. Its very reasonable.

As for requests for 2257 docs -- the only request you have to worry about is from the DOJ/FBI and if you are in Canada, it is highly unlikely that you will ever have law enforcement show up for an inspection at your office or home.

Unless you have an affiliate program or are selling content you never have to give out 2257 information to anyone other than the DOJ/FBI.

If you do have affiliates in the US, you have provide them with a copy of all records/IDs with the content. Also if you sell your content to US based companies you have to provide a copy of 2257 docs and IDs.

Jim_Gunn · 08-22-2009, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornlaw

This actually happened to my client.

Never give out this type of information. After talking with Clips4Sale, they indicated that any request would only come from an official C4S email address. Anyone else seeking any information should be reported immediately.

As for protecting your 2257 information and keeping your name and address off the net -- we offer that type of privacy through www.2257Safe.com. We act as your custodian of records and you use our address and name for notice purposes. So far the solo models signups have been strong. Models like the idea of being anonymous.

pornlaw, the FAQ on your site has the 2257Safe, LLC company name and Woodland Hills address that 2257Safe clients may use for the 2257 statements on their web sites or movies, but there is no custodian's name per se listed. For years nearly everyone was using a specific human individual's name like "J. Doe" as part of their 2257 statements along with a physical address. Is that no longer required by the law, and if so, was that one of the changes they made the last time they amended the 2257 law? If not, what name, if any, should 2257Safe clients be using for their statements along with the address?

pornlaw · 08-22-2009, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim_Gunn

pornlaw, the FAQ on your site has the 2257Safe, LLC company name and Woodland Hills address that 2257Safe clients may use for the 2257 statements on their web sites or movies, but there is no custodian's name per se listed. For years nearly everyone was using a specific human individual's name like "J. Doe" as part of their 2257 statements along with a physical address. Is that no longer required by the law, and if so, was that one of the changes they made the last time they amended the 2257 law? If not, what name, if any, should 2257Safe clients be using for their statements along with the address?

Yes with the new changes in the regs an actual person is not needed to be named as the custodian, if you are using a third party custodian. You can simply use 2257Safe LLC.

Fukcdoll · 08-22-2009, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornlaw

As for budget -- www.2257Safe.com lowest priced tier is $29.99 a month and you also get access to my other site www.AdultBizLaw.com with that price. Its very reasonable.

As for requests for 2257 docs -- the only request you have to worry about is from the DOJ/FBI and if you are in Canada, it is highly unlikely that you will ever have law enforcement show up for an inspection at your office or home.

Unless you have an affiliate program or are selling content you never have to give out 2257 information to anyone other than the DOJ/FBI.

If you do have affiliates in the US, you have provide them with a copy of all records/IDs with the content. Also if you sell your content to US based companies you have to provide a copy of 2257 docs and IDs.

I do actually sell my content to US based companies and webmasters & provide them with the requires Doc's & ID's

I'm thinking of making affiliate promotions on my websites as well, so would that mean any & all afiliates would have access to my personal info? Or only if needed by the government?

Thank you so much Michale for all your help on this. When I get the point where I'm loooking for 3rd patyrecords I will definately be getting in touch with you- k?

pornlaw · 08-22-2009, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fukcdoll

I do actually sell my content to US based companies and webmasters & provide them with the requires Doc's & ID's

I'm thinking of making affiliate promotions on my websites as well, so would that mean any & all afiliates would have access to my personal info? Or only if needed by the government?

If you are giving out docs and IDs when you sell your content you should be redacting the personal info off the IDs.

When you decide to set up affiliate program you should set up an account with us. Many programs dont realize that you have to give docs and IDs when you give out content to affiliates. Failure to give the docs and IDs is a violation of 2257 since secondary producers (affiliates) now have to keep records as well. So it is not only a violation for the affiliate not to have records, its a violation by the program to distribute content without transfering the records.

If you like, you can get around this with hosted galleries and videos that stay on your servers. Or, you can act as a third party record keeper for all your affiliates but it cannot be a simple link back. There actually has to be a contract between you and the affiliate wherein you take responsibility to maintain their records for your program.

If those options are not sufficent what we can do, if you do not want the affiliates to have the docs and IDs, is to set up an account that will remained locked down with your affiliate content in it. hen you can require your affiliates to have an account with us. It will cost them $19.99 a month, and you will receive a 50% rev share on those accts for the life of the affiliate.

The affiliates will not have access to the docs and IDs, UNLESS, they are inspected. Which at that time we will handle the inspection and open the account and provide the DOJ/FBI with the necessary records. No hassles for you or the affiliate and everyone's info stays private - all while generating a monthly rev share profit for your program.

The affiliate can use our address and name for their 2257 Notice as well.

epitome · 08-22-2009, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornlaw

Yes with the new changes in the regs an actual person is not needed to be named as the custodian, if you are using a third party custodian. You can simply use 2257Safe LLC.

That is so good to know. As a happy customer of 2257safe.com, I never fully understood that. I asked at one point, but the answer I got didn't really square it away too well and I know it's because company's gotta be careful on that fine line between being informative and/or providing legal advice.

If you can think of a way to indicate the above to customers, I think it will go a far way. I've been using my name, the 2257safe.com name and the address on statements. No harm done, of course, because it was more information than needed, but I always thought "what happens when they show up and ask for me?"

Time to get some statements changed on my end. LUCKILY, I have done pretty much nothing on that side of the biz, which is why I wasn't overly concerned or even got around to asking my own lawyer.

In other news, if you produce anything and are not using 2257safe.com, you are working too hard and not as smart as you could be. The solution is so simple and intuitive that a caveman can use it. Everything you'll ever need will always be right there, in one place, at any time it's needed and always overseen by people who do this kind of stuff for a living.

Jim_Gunn · 08-22-2009, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornlaw

If you are giving out docs and IDs when you sell your content you should be redacting the personal info off the IDs.

When you decide to set up affiliate program you should set up an account with us. Many programs dont realize that you have to give docs and IDs when you give out content to affiliates. Failure to give the docs and IDs is a violation of 2257 since secondary producers (affiliates) now have to keep records as well. So it is not only a violation for the affiliate not to have records, its a violation by the program to distribute content without transfering the records.

If you like, you can get around this with hosted galleries and videos that stay on your servers. Or, you can act as a third party record keeper for all your affiliates but it cannot be a simple link back. There actually has to be a contract between you and the affiliate wherein you take responsibility to maintain their records for your program.

If those options are not sufficent what we can do, if you do not want the affiliates to have the docs and IDs, is to set up an account that will remained locked down with your affiliate content in it. hen you can require your affiliates to have an account with us. It will cost them $19.99 a month, and you will receive a 50% rev share on those accts for the life of the affiliate.

The affiliates will not have access to the docs and IDs, UNLESS, they are inspected. Which at that time we will handle the inspection and open the account and provide the DOJ/FBI with the necessary records. No hassles for you or the affiliate and everyone's info stays private - all while generating a monthly rev share profit for your program.

The affiliate can use our address and name for their 2257 Notice as well.

Thanks for the answer above. This is interesting information. In practice, I don't think that any more than a very small fraction, if any, of sponsors actually give affiliates any documents. I mean how many free sites, blogs and other sites that promote single or multiple sponsors have asked for or received any docs and could convince a sponsor to give them out if they did ask? Probably almost none from what I hear.

Jim_Gunn · 08-22-2009, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by epitome

That is so good to know. As a happy customer of 2257safe.com, I never fully understood that. I asked at one point, but the answer I got didn't really square it away too well and I know it's because company's gotta be careful on that fine line between being informative and/or providing legal advice.

If you can think of a way to indicate the above to customers, I think it will go a far way. I've been using my name, the 2257safe.com name and the address on statements. No harm done, of course, because it was more information than needed, but I always thought "what happens when they show up and ask for me?"

Time to get some statements changed on my end. LUCKILY, I have done pretty much nothing on that side of the biz, which is why I wasn't overly concerned or even got around to asking my own lawyer.

In other news, if you produce anything and are not using 2257safe.com, you are working too hard and not as smart as you could be. The solution is so simple and intuitive that a caveman can use it. Everything you'll ever need will always be right there, in one place, at any time it's needed and always overseen by people who do this kind of stuff for a living.

I agree Pornlaw, you should mention that no custodian name needs to be is listed in the 2257Safe FAQ, because a lot of us were or are unclear that this change was made. I signed up as a 2257Safe customer this week and I was unsure about this as well. In any case, that is good news, glad I am using your service!

epitome · 08-22-2009, 11:18 AM

Hey Michael, will you hit me up on ICQ/AIM/email/Yahoo when you get a chance? I've got something for you...

TheAmericanCannibal · 08-22-2009, 11:43 AM

In other news, if you produce anything and are not using 2257safe.com, you are working too hard and not as smart as you could be. The solution is so simple and intuitive that a caveman can use it. Everything you'll ever need will always be right there, in one place, at any time it's needed and always overseen by people who do this kind of stuff for a living.

Thanks so much for your testimonial!

"The solution is so simple and intuitive that a caveman can use it"

Well I think GEICO cornered that market, but I get what you are saying
lol!

Anyone needing any more assistance can email me at [email protected]

epitome · 08-22-2009, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAmericanCannibal

In other news, if you produce anything and are not using 2257safe.com, you are working too hard and not as smart as you could be. The solution is so simple and intuitive that a caveman can use it. Everything you'll ever need will always be right there, in one place, at any time it's needed and always overseen by people who do this kind of stuff for a living.

Thanks so much for your testimonial!

"The solution is so simple and intuitive that a caveman can use it"

Well I think GEICO cornered that market, but I get what you are saying
lol!

Anyone needing any more assistance can email me at [email protected]

Thanks!

I did want to clear something up...I was not saying that people aren't smart if they aren't using 2257safe, I was trying to say that you can work hard and/or smart and it's less work and thereby smarter if you use this simple solution for 2257 compliance.

pornlaw · 08-22-2009, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim_Gunn

Thanks for the answer above. This is interesting information. In practice, I don't think that any more than a very small fraction, if any, of sponsors actually give affiliates any documents. I mean how many free sites, blogs and other sites that promote single or multiple sponsors have asked for or received any docs and could convince a sponsor to give them out if they did ask? Probably almost none from what I hear.

Thanks guys -- I will have Dan change the FAQs page and the welcome email to indicate that no personal name is necessary when using our service - just 2257Safe LLC.

As for the affiliate situation, no program that I know of actually gives any of their affiliates docs and IDs. This could be a huge problem if there is ever an inspection of the program or affiliate. Most affiliates blogs do not even have a 2257 compliance notice on their sites.

No compliance notice is a violation and each piece of content without records is another violation. And each violation carries up to a 5 year sentence. Why people arent getting compliant is beyond me. www.2257Safe.com is too easy and too cheap not to use.

Mr. Billy · 08-22-2009, 04:18 PM

2257safe works for me!

Mr. Billy · 08-22-2009, 04:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornlaw

Thanks guys -- I will have Dan change the FAQs page and the welcome email to indicate that no personal name is necessary when using our service - just 2257Safe LLC.

As for the affiliate situation, no program that I know of actually gives any of their affiliates docs and IDs. This could be a huge problem if there is ever an inspection of the program or affiliate. Most affiliates blogs do not even have a 2257 compliance notice on their sites.

No compliance notice is a violation and each piece of content without records is another violation. And each violation carries up to a 5 year sentence. Why people arent getting compliant is beyond me. www.2257Safe.com is too easy and too cheap not to use.

That is the reason I have stopped using sponsor content on my sites. The sponsors are not providing the documents, nor are they communicating with affiliates to comply with the 3rd party allowance, as to the fact that they would maintain the records in a way that would allow the affiliates to say that the affiliates have verified that the 2257 documents actually exist, and that the sponsor will keep the records for the appropriate time periods etc.

Sponsor provided content could prove to be a large headache for affiliates unless better attention is given to 2257 as it is written.

JustDaveXxx · 08-22-2009, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornlaw

Thanks guys -- I will have Dan change the FAQs page and the welcome email to indicate that no personal name is necessary when using our service - just 2257Safe LLC.

As for the affiliate situation, no program that I know of actually gives any of their affiliates docs and IDs. This could be a huge problem if there is ever an inspection of the program or affiliate. Most affiliates blogs do not even have a 2257 compliance notice on their sites.

No compliance notice is a violation and each piece of content without records is another violation. And each violation carries up to a 5 year sentence. Why people arent getting compliant is beyond me. www.2257Safe.com is too easy and too cheap not to use.

I recommended that Porno Dan use your services as i think his door will get kicked in soon for something or other because of him pissing off OSHA or some state agency.lol

pornlaw · 08-22-2009, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Billy

That is the reason I have stopped using sponsor content on my sites. The sponsors are not providing the documents, nor are they communicating with affiliates to comply with the 3rd party allowance, as to the fact that they would maintain the records in a way that would allow the affiliates to say that the affiliates have verified that the 2257 documents actually exist, and that the sponsor will keep the records for the appropriate time periods etc.

Sponsor provided content could prove to be a large headache for affiliates unless better attention is given to 2257 as it is written.

I posted a thread on a webmaster/blog owners forum asking just this question. I would really like to know if any of the large sponsors/programs are giving out the proper docs & IDs. I know these programs have some of the best lawyers in the biz representing them so I cannot understand why they arent following the new regs.

I know that www.AEBN.com is changing their policies with regards to 2257 and even their notices. They have notices on each page under the box cover indicating that the production company is the custodian of records. Now when a company signs up to sell their titles via VOD AEBN is requiring them to be custodian of records on their own titles. And they are doing the proper way, in the contract - not just through a link back.

If one the largest companies are protecting themselves, why arent the affiliates demanding the same protection. They are sending the traffic and sales but they are being left out to dry on this issue.

pornlaw · 08-22-2009, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustDaveXxx

I recommended that Porno Dan use your services as i think his door will get kicked in soon for something or other because of him pissing off OSHA or some state agency.lol

I just think Dan likes living on the edge. Despite the Cal-OSHA situation it looks like he is going forward with the next Fuck-A-Fan. I wonder if this one will also be sans condom.

Fukcdoll · 08-23-2009, 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pornlaw

Thanks guys -- I will have Dan change the FAQs page and the welcome email to indicate that no personal name is necessary when using our service - just 2257Safe LLC.

As for the affiliate situation, no program that I know of actually gives any of their affiliates docs and IDs. This could be a huge problem if there is ever an inspection of the program or affiliate. Most affiliates blogs do not even have a 2257 compliance notice on their sites.

No compliance notice is a violation and each piece of content without records is another violation. And each violation carries up to a 5 year sentence. Why people arent getting compliant is beyond me. www.2257Safe.com is too easy and too cheap not to use.

Michale you've been such a great help clarifying so many things, thank you so much!!!

When I do get to the point of having affilkates to promo the new site I will do just what mentioned and have all my documents hosted by you guys and instruct affiliates to go to you.

Now I did notice you mentioned something here about blogs though, and it does raise some questions on 2257 in terms of blogging:

Do all graphic written blogs or Pod Casts need 2257 Documentation? ( I am currently experimenmting with a radoi broadcast at this time where I do talk about past sexual experiences and up cumming sexual events ie. My Gang Bang at the end of the month- do I need to write up docs for te broadcasts?)

And for written work- I do have a very graphocly writeen blog on Sensualwriter that I'll be linking to my site as well, do I need Docs for my BLOG TOO???
And if so how does that work exactly?
Do the docs contain the date of the writting or the date in which the subject occured?
I write about things going back YEARS, in my past sexual exabitions, I couldn't even begin to remember the date as to some of the events- how would I go about documenting that if it is nessisary to do so?

I know I'm new to 'the biz' and pretty small potatoes at this point\
lol

But I intend on doing everything 100% legit from the start & amintaining that through out my bussiness & career.

Also a question reguarding your billing, if you don't mind:
Do you bill per account (individual account holder) or by individual website?

I currently have 2 websites under construction & will be building at least 3 more over the next few months. So would one account handle the content docs for ALL 5 of my pending sites? and what would the cost in that be, if you have an idea?

This is something I'm deffinately gonna be doing in the future- coming to you and sighning up myself, and a few friends too perhaps!

thnx so much you're Grrrrrrreat!

pornlaw · 08-23-2009, 08:49 PM

Thanks Pam!!!

As for 2257 you only need it for videos and/or photos. You can talk about anything you like, no docs are necessary for the written or spoken word. Pics and videos where someone is engaged in sexual activity or lacivious exhibition of the gentials you will need docs and IDs.

As for our billing, its charged by the amount of content that we host. Not by the account or the website. Our pricing starts at $29.99 and goes up to $149.99 per month for the largest sites. We also compress your content down to 10% of what it is on your servers. So if you have 100Gigs we would compress that down to 10gigs and you would pay $29.99 a month.

Quote:

I know I'm new to 'the biz' and pretty small potatoes at this point\
lol
But I intend on doing everything 100% legit from the start & amintaining that through out my bussiness & career.

Not potatoes are too small for us !!

Fukcdoll · 08-24-2009, 03:59 AM

Thnx Michale

I'm glad I don't need to have docs for my writting that would totally suck
lol

and the pricing for your service sounds great!!!

08-22-2009, 07:59 AM	#1
Fukcdoll Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Toronto Area Posts: 211	2257 Scams- have you seen them? & How do we avoid them? I've just recived an email from clips4sale.com, where I have some of less popular clips available for purchase. And it was to alert me to a phishing scam, seeking 2257 Docs and model info, Here's a copy of what I got: C4S-WARNING ABOUT PHISHING SCAMS‏ "It has been brought to our attention that there have been some attempts to get your personal information. The most recent one has come from [email protected] (asking a series of 2257 questions, address questions, expense question). Please note that we will not send you email from gmail or any other domain not owned by clips4sale.com. These types of social engineering scams occur all the time. If anyone ever emails you and requests any information and claims to be from clips4sale.com, please CALL our support team and provide us with the information regarding the possible scammer. We ALREADY have your information. We would NEVER need you to email it to us. If we need you to update it, we would tell you to log into our site. We would NOT send you a link to our site (that is another scam where people use similar addresses or links that do not point to us). You know how to get to your administration page! Please be vigilant in safeguarding your personal/corporate dat! a. Thank you, The Clips4Sale.com Team " I had recived several emails prior to this asking for my information & I never responded to any them. When I got this message I was glad that I didn't!!! Have you seen scams like this, looking for information & docs? I know most places we sell content, we have pre submit the required information, but for instances where we own the site & have to be the holder of info- how do we know when to supply the docs and when it's just a scam? I'm bit scared of this myself, being not only the 'producer' but the modle as well- I don't want my personal info to be out there for all the world to see. With so many experiences webmasters here, I'd like to know how you all deal with release of 2257 Doc's. How do we know when it's an official request? Thnx 4 any and all help ~Pam

08-22-2009, 08:13 AM	#2
pornlaw Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 1,851	This actually happened to my client. Never give out this type of information. After talking with Clips4Sale, they indicated that any request would only come from an official C4S email address. Anyone else seeking any information should be reported immediately. As for protecting your 2257 information and keeping your name and address off the net -- we offer that type of privacy through www.2257Safe.com. We act as your custodian of records and you use our address and name for notice purposes. So far the solo models signups have been strong. Models like the idea of being anonymous. __________________ Michael www.AdultBizLaw.com

08-22-2009, 04:18 PM	#16
Mr. Billy Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 467	2257safe works for me! __________________

08-22-2009, 11:18 AM	#12
epitome So Fucking Lame Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: St. Petersburg, FL Posts: 12,158	Hey Michael, will you hit me up on ICQ/AIM/email/Yahoo when you get a chance? I've got something for you...

08-22-2009, 11:43 AM	#13
TheAmericanCannibal Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 3,085	In other news, if you produce anything and are not using 2257safe.com, you are working too hard and not as smart as you could be. The solution is so simple and intuitive that a caveman can use it. Everything you'll ever need will always be right there, in one place, at any time it's needed and always overseen by people who do this kind of stuff for a living. Thanks so much for your testimonial! "The solution is so simple and intuitive that a caveman can use it" Well I think GEICO cornered that market, but I get what you are saying lol! Anyone needing any more assistance can email me at [email protected]

08-24-2009, 03:59 AM	#23
Fukcdoll Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Toronto Area Posts: 211	Thnx Michale I'm glad I don't need to have docs for my writting that would totally suck lol and the pricing for your service sounds great!!!