ccbill still scrubbing? - GoFuckYourself.com

marktruman · 12-18-2010, 08:55 PM

A while back I heard conversions and ratios were crap, any improvement? Looking to get a merchant account from them

hawkadu · 12-18-2010, 09:50 PM

Extremely crap this week!

Fat Panda · 12-18-2010, 09:52 PM

ccbill has been crap the last few weeks

Frasier · 12-18-2010, 09:53 PM

interestingly, ccbill has been on fire for me

NETbilling · 12-19-2010, 12:18 AM

While CCbill is great for third party processing, we are happy to help you obtain a merchant account and will provide scrubbing and processing with a great amount of flexibility that you will have complete control of at some of the lowest rates in the industry.

Please contact us for more information. We invite you to compare.

Questions?

Thank you, Mitch Farber

Chezter · 12-19-2010, 04:11 AM

I have extremely bad conversions on ccbill this whole month...

marktruman · 12-19-2010, 04:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NetBilling

While CCbill is great for third party processing, we are happy to help you obtain a merchant account and will provide scrubbing and processing with a great amount of flexibility that you will have complete control of at some of the lowest rates in the industry.

Please contact us for more information. We invite you to compare.

Questions?

Thank you, Mitch Farber

Emailed you

biskoppen · 12-19-2010, 05:02 AM

Yeah, tough sales right now

marktruman · 12-19-2010, 05:34 AM

Yeah, shame, ccbill used to be good but I hear it scrubs like crazy now

wehateporn · 12-19-2010, 05:55 AM

Wait for the 22nd, from there things will be good. For me this is always the slowest time of the month

signupdamnit · 12-19-2010, 06:30 AM

It might depend on who you are. Some people believe affiliates and small sponsors get scrubbed hard to offset charge backs and refunds from high volume customers. I don't ever recall seeing a denial. Overall ratios aren't bad here though. It's just frustrating to see ratios go up and down so much in patterns. It makes you wonder what you could be doing if things ran at full blast during the lulls.

Jakez · 12-19-2010, 09:19 AM

ccbill is always shitty and then suddenly one day there will be a rush of sales, makes no sense.

MobiusMike · 12-19-2010, 10:36 AM

Mark, NetBilling and CCBill are both good choices. There are other direct account routes you can take as well that you can add scrubbing to as a layover or turn off as you need to.

Also, I would suggest taking a look at implementing some non-scrubbing payment acceptance best practices that can help you stay under the threshold while minimizing your need for scrubbing.

The fluctuation in scrubbing perceived at CCBill is interesting. I wonder if it could be them "tuning" their scrub at certain times to allow more transactions through to reduce their chargeback ratios.

BFT3K · 12-19-2010, 11:02 AM

I primarily use CCBill, and Nov and Dec have been very good. Their affiliate program is very credible as well, and my affiliates do not have to worry if they will be getting paid.

I also offer an alternate tour for a couple of my sites, which use Verotel.

Verotel converts better, but inevitably 50% of all of my Verotel sales come back as credit transactions. In other words, an average of HALF of my Verotel sales get reversed, so what did I gain?

I would rather prioritize a billing processor that rejects questionable transactions, even if the numbers don't initially look so good, than use one that approves everyone and then reverses half of the sales anyway.

Plus, with Visa charging a $500 p/year annual renewal fee for EACH processor, on the heels of their $750 initial application fee, I just can't justify the expense of numerous processors, as my program is too small to justify all of the expenses.

signupdamnit · 12-19-2010, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BFT3K

Verotel converts better, but inevitably 50% of all of my Verotel sales come back as credit transactions. In other words, an average of HALF of my Verotel sales get reversed, so what did I gain?

As an affiliate I've never seen that that with them. Credits are very rare from Verotel. Is this credit cards or also checks?

BFT3K · 12-19-2010, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

As an affiliate I've never seen that that with them. Credits are very rare from Verotel. Is this credit cards or also checks?

I don't know what you see on reports as a Verotel affiliate. Are the transactions available to you in realtime, or have the transactions already been vetted by the time you read your stats?

To answer your question though - it is generally the Verotel check transactions that are most frequently reversed.

BareBacked · 12-19-2010, 12:23 PM

All processors scrub

bns666 · 12-19-2010, 02:24 PM

yeah ccbill sucks for me too lately

NETbilling · 12-19-2010, 02:34 PM

]

Quote:

Originally Posted by marktruman

Emailed you

Sounds great

SwirlsGirl · 12-19-2010, 05:45 PM

These threads are not diminishing in frequency or merit.

One thing that has diminished is the pr guys coming in every thread trying to defend the indefensible.

HCBabes · 12-19-2010, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jakez

ccbill is always shitty and then suddenly one day there will be a rush of sales, makes no sense.

Ditto... I get nothing for days on end and then suddenly a burst of sales out of nowhere.

zormaks · 12-19-2010, 09:12 PM

Same here. Shitty CCBill sales since December 6th. Looks like someone took a knife and made a deep cut.

TiaLing · 12-19-2010, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BareBacked

All processors scrub

True .... but i've used ccbill, epoch and zombaio . Epoch was by far the best choice. Ccbill has sucked for me for a long time..... For some reason just get more sales when using Epoch.

NETbilling · 12-19-2010, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BareBacked

All processors scrub

Scrubbing is an important part of every processor's tools.

Having control over the scrubbing for a merchants type of sites and demographics is equally as important and merchants that are able to see the settings and have control and flexibility over them have a greater chance of success. Why should a merchant have to guess as to what is going on?

cwd · 12-20-2010, 07:18 AM

For check processing, give a try to WTS http://www.achdebit.com/ .
No CC processor I used can be compared to then when it come to online checks.

seeandsee · 12-20-2010, 07:58 AM

for some is good for some is bad time but for all will be changed :D

marktruman · 12-21-2010, 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BareBacked

All processors scrub

some harder than others, and I'm hearing ccbill is scrubbing lot's!

chrisceo · 12-21-2010, 03:03 AM

One of CCBill's ex-Senior Executive VPs is a sales rep at a CDN company

tabasco · 12-21-2010, 03:09 AM

Constant see saw as an affiliate. The other day out of the blue 9 sales roll in in the space of like 7 hours then back to usual shit... no rhyme or reason in terms of what I promoted or traffic.

Davy · 12-21-2010, 03:46 AM

Craparoo!

Samantha_xox2000 · 12-21-2010, 06:29 AM

Must say i have very good conversions on ccbill this month, sales are even better than in November.

wehateporn · 12-21-2010, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tabasco

Constant see saw as an affiliate. The other day out of the blue 9 sales roll in in the space of like 7 hours then back to usual shit... no rhyme or reason in terms of what I promoted or traffic.

There must be a certain type of sale that looks suspicious so it sits in quarentine until an admin comes in and approves them all. That's what I think. As long as we still get them then that's fine. We've now just hit the 10 days of the month when I take over half of my sales, always the same every month, perhaps the majority of people get paid around now

signupdamnit · 12-21-2010, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wehateporn

We've now just hit the 10 days of the month when I take over half of my sales, always the same every month, perhaps the majority of people get paid around now

This is what I am seeing as well. It used to be that the first ten days were best. Now that's crap and it's the last ten days which are good.

If it keeps up and these aren't batched perhaps I need to start showing only other sponsors besides ccbill from the 1st to the 19th?

marktruman · 12-21-2010, 06:49 AM

First 5 days I notice are good, rest is average with some hikes, last 10 days are pure gold, especially last weekend of the month

jhmovie · 12-21-2010, 06:50 AM

That's a little bit unusual

Penny24Seven · 12-21-2010, 07:14 AM

how can you guys judge on just your own traffic, i'm not trying to be an ass buy you can't base a company by how your stats were for the last two weeks when your not even talking about 10 joins a day. With that amount of traffic it will never just be the same each day. If you were doing 100 joins a day you would see a difference.
I have seen it many times affiliates and programs

signupdamnit · 12-21-2010, 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian837

how can you guys judge on just your own traffic, i'm not trying to be an ass buy you can't base a company by how your stats were for the last two weeks when your not even talking about 10 joins a day. With that amount of traffic it will never just be the same each day. If you were doing 100 joins a day you would see a difference.
I have seen it many times affiliates and programs

Well, could it also be that sending a certain volume on one ID tends place you in a different tier as far as how processing (scrub) is done? Don't forget that we also use other billing companies and have an idea of what is normal and what is not. You're correct though about statistical averages.

corvette · 12-21-2010, 07:29 AM

hi all, just saw this thread, we will run some reports when i get in and check recent trends out to make sure everything is ok, things fluctuate around the holidays a lot

roganoli · 12-21-2010, 07:32 AM

Nornal here... CCBILL convert more than another NATS sponsor! And the retentions is amazing!

signupdamnit · 12-21-2010, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by roganoli

CCBILL convert more than another NATS sponsor! And the retentions is amazing!

Overall I have to say this is true for me as well on average. I bitch about the lulls but at the end of the month the numbers are usually consistent.

wehateporn · 12-21-2010, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by signupdamnit

This is what I am seeing as well. It used to be that the first ten days were best. Now that's crap and it's the last ten days which are good.

If it keeps up and these aren't batched perhaps I need to start showing only other sponsors besides ccbill from the 1st to the 19th?

Yes, exactly the same, in 2008 I used to make half my money in the first 10 days of the month, whereas now it's in the last 10 days. The worst period has always been 11th to 20th, that hasn't changed

marktruman · 12-21-2010, 09:23 AM

hows verotel doing nowadays?

MobiusMike · 12-21-2010, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NetBilling

Scrubbing is an important part of every processor's tools.

Having control over the scrubbing for a merchants type of sites and demographics is equally as important and merchants that are able to see the settings and have control and flexibility over them have a greater chance of success. Why should a merchant have to guess as to what is going on?

I completely agree with Mitch here. Merchants should have access to both their "hard" declines (card failed authorization) and "soft" declines through a scrubbing filter. Both should have identifiable reason codes for the decline.

Further, being able to tune the scrubbing as part of a mutual goal between Merchant and Provider to minimize risk while maximizing sales is essential. A blanket setting on fraud scrubbing for all Merchant Types is not good customer service.

CCBill Paul · 12-21-2010, 10:17 AM

Every processor scrubs. Scrubbing simply means to verify the information the customer has given. If we did not do this we would have been out of business a long time ago due to credit card fraud. We have been doing this for over 12 years and have gotten very good at it.

Our job is to ensure as many transactions are processed as possible while still keeping the fraud to a minimum. Contrary to what some people think we are not constantly adjusting our scrub or allowing more transactions one day compared to the next. We are in the business of accepting transactions.

If anyone has any questions about our system or why certain declines were issued, all they have to do is ask.

signupdamnit · 12-21-2010, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CCBill Paul

If anyone has any questions about our system or why certain declines were issued, all they have to do is ask.

I think this is a great offer and shows that ccbill is a solid open company. I'll take the opportunity then to ask some questions which might help settle some rumors and questions people have.

1. Does the scrub normally vary depending on the active affiliate?
2. Does the scrub normally vary depending on the active sponsor or program?
3. Is pure volume (not merely CB ratio) a normal factor in determining the scrub factor for a transaction?
4. Approximately how often is the scrub factor adjusted per program/affiliate?
5. Are affiliate and program stats shown in normally real time?

It's completely understandable if you can't answer all of these questions in a lot of detail for security reasons. Whatever you can share would be appreciated.

CCBill Paul · 12-21-2010, 02:50 PM

Scrubbing a transaction is typically based on the information the customer provides, along with our proprietary rule sets.

Our transaction scrubs are consistent and rarely change. If we can change something that will allow more throughput with minimal risk, then we will thoroughly test that change on a small beta group, and then possibly expand it out to our entire system. Please remember that our system is optimized to accept as many transactions as possible.

Please see my contact info below if anyone wishes to discuss in further detail. Thanks.

The Porn Nerd · 12-21-2010, 05:03 PM

We must remember the economy and the changes to credit cards that happened in 2010. Many consumers, who were used to "going over" and dealing with that later (or charging back) have had to alter their buying behaviors, which is why we see sales later in the month, I think. So the economy is still bouncy, new credit card regs, the fallout from epassports that affects a lot of webmasters and, by extension, cc processors picking up the slack and flucuations should be expected.

As long as the overall tide is rising, so to speak, I'm happy. Ish. LOL! :D

Shap · 12-21-2010, 06:26 PM

Ccbill has been great for us lately

carzygirls · 12-21-2010, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shap

Ccbill has been great for us lately

What happened for those days where your stats where 30% off the norm?

Nurgle · 12-21-2010, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shap

Ccbill has been great for us lately

it wasnt that long ago you were saying how bad they are.. what changed?

12-18-2010, 08:55 PM	#1
marktruman Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 1,025	ccbill still scrubbing? A while back I heard conversions and ratios were crap, any improvement? Looking to get a merchant account from them

12-18-2010, 09:53 PM	#4
Frasier Confirmed User Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 377	interestingly, ccbill has been on fire for me __________________ ICQ 452 one six 7 five 41

12-19-2010, 12:18 AM	#5
NETbilling Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Huntington Beach, CA Posts: 8,573	While CCbill is great for third party processing, we are happy to help you obtain a merchant account and will provide scrubbing and processing with a great amount of flexibility that you will have complete control of at some of the lowest rates in the industry. Please contact us for more information. We invite you to compare. Questions? Thank you, Mitch Farber __________________ Mitch Farber CEO - NETbilling, Inc. Email / Phone: 888-357-8166 / 661-252-2456 Transaction processing & 24/7 call center services with exceptional rates and flexibility, since 1998!

12-19-2010, 05:02 AM	#8
biskoppen Confirmed User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Very small penis Posts: 5,809	Yeah, tough sales right now __________________ Submit my videos to make bank, tons of 5 minute videos offered right here

12-19-2010, 05:55 AM	#10
wehateporn Promoting Debate on GFY Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 27,173	Wait for the 22nd, from there things will be good. For me this is always the slowest time of the month __________________ Sexy Girls Teasing

12-18-2010, 09:50 PM	#2
hawkadu Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 276	Extremely crap this week!

12-18-2010, 09:52 PM	#3
Fat Panda Porn is Dead. Move along. Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 13,295	ccbill has been crap the last few weeks

12-19-2010, 04:11 AM	#6
Chezter Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Brno, Czech rep. Posts: 565	I have extremely bad conversions on ccbill this whole month...

12-19-2010, 05:34 AM	#9
marktruman Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 1,025	Yeah, shame, ccbill used to be good but I hear it scrubs like crazy now

12-19-2010, 06:30 AM	#11
signupdamnit Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 6,697	It might depend on who you are. Some people believe affiliates and small sponsors get scrubbed hard to offset charge backs and refunds from high volume customers. I don't ever recall seeing a denial. Overall ratios aren't bad here though. It's just frustrating to see ratios go up and down so much in patterns. It makes you wonder what you could be doing if things ran at full blast during the lulls.

12-19-2010, 09:19 AM	#12
Jakez Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: oddfuturewolfgangkillthemall!!!!!!! Posts: 5,656	ccbill is always shitty and then suddenly one day there will be a rush of sales, makes no sense. __________________ [email protected] - jakezdumb - 573689400 Killuminati

12-19-2010, 10:36 AM	#13
MobiusMike Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 123	Mark, NetBilling and CCBill are both good choices. There are other direct account routes you can take as well that you can add scrubbing to as a layover or turn off as you need to. Also, I would suggest taking a look at implementing some non-scrubbing payment acceptance best practices that can help you stay under the threshold while minimizing your need for scrubbing. The fluctuation in scrubbing perceived at CCBill is interesting. I wonder if it could be them "tuning" their scrub at certain times to allow more transactions through to reduce their chargeback ratios. __________________ www.2MPAY.com www.MobiusPay.com ICQ: 601750183 Skype: MobiusPay Twitter: MobiusPay Payment Industry Subject Matter Expert

12-19-2010, 11:02 AM	#14
BFT3K Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Narnia Posts: 10,764	I primarily use CCBill, and Nov and Dec have been very good. Their affiliate program is very credible as well, and my affiliates do not have to worry if they will be getting paid. I also offer an alternate tour for a couple of my sites, which use Verotel. Verotel converts better, but inevitably 50% of all of my Verotel sales come back as credit transactions. In other words, an average of HALF of my Verotel sales get reversed, so what did I gain? I would rather prioritize a billing processor that rejects questionable transactions, even if the numbers don't initially look so good, than use one that approves everyone and then reverses half of the sales anyway. Plus, with Visa charging a $500 p/year annual renewal fee for EACH processor, on the heels of their $750 initial application fee, I just can't justify the expense of numerous processors, as my program is too small to justify all of the expenses. Last edited by BFT3K; 12-19-2010 at 11:07 AM..

12-19-2010, 12:23 PM	#17
BareBacked Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: www.BareBacked.com Posts: 3,685	All processors scrub __________________ NEW SITE PAYING $30 for a $1 TRIAL Selfies

12-19-2010, 02:24 PM	#18
bns666 Confirmed Fetishist Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Fetishland Posts: 11,521	yeah ccbill sucks for me too lately __________________ ⭐ CAM SODA ⭐ STRIPCHAT ⭐ ⭐ CHATURBATE ⭐ X LOVE CAM ⭐

12-19-2010, 05:45 PM	#20
SwirlsGirl So Fucking Banned Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: between east coast and vegas Posts: 2,067	These threads are not diminishing in frequency or merit. One thing that has diminished is the pr guys coming in every thread trying to defend the indefensible.

12-19-2010, 09:12 PM	#22
zormaks So Fucking Banned Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 32	Same here. Shitty CCBill sales since December 6th. Looks like someone took a knife and made a deep cut.

12-20-2010, 07:18 AM	#25
cwd Confirmed User Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: In a dream Posts: 1,955	For check processing, give a try to WTS http://www.achdebit.com/ . No CC processor I used can be compared to then when it come to online checks.

12-20-2010, 07:58 AM	#26
seeandsee Check SIG! Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Europe (Skype: gojkoas) Posts: 50,945	for some is good for some is bad time but for all will be changed :D __________________ BUY MY SIG - 50$/Year Contact here

12-21-2010, 03:03 AM	#28
chrisceo Registered User Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 12	One of CCBill's ex-Senior Executive VPs is a sales rep at a CDN company

12-21-2010, 03:09 AM	#29
tabasco Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: In a van down by the river Posts: 2,624	Constant see saw as an affiliate. The other day out of the blue 9 sales roll in in the space of like 7 hours then back to usual shit... no rhyme or reason in terms of what I promoted or traffic. __________________ "There is no other way to see a thing except to look at it" - fatfoo

12-21-2010, 03:46 AM	#30
Davy Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Germany Posts: 4,323	Craparoo! __________________ --- ICQ 14-76-98 <-- I don't use this at all

12-21-2010, 06:29 AM	#31
Samantha_xox2000 Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 866	Must say i have very good conversions on ccbill this month, sales are even better than in November. __________________ Older Women Club - Get maximum from your Granny/Mature traffic! 255 Days Cookie \| VOD \| FLVs \| CCBILL Questions? Hit me up on ICQ: 442218096

12-21-2010, 06:49 AM	#34
marktruman Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 1,025	First 5 days I notice are good, rest is average with some hikes, last 10 days are pure gold, especially last weekend of the month

12-21-2010, 06:50 AM	#35
jhmovie Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 141	That's a little bit unusual Last edited by jhmovie; 12-21-2010 at 06:53 AM..

12-21-2010, 07:14 AM	#36
Penny24Seven So Fucking What Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: USA Posts: 6,289	how can you guys judge on just your own traffic, i'm not trying to be an ass buy you can't base a company by how your stats were for the last two weeks when your not even talking about 10 joins a day. With that amount of traffic it will never just be the same each day. If you were doing 100 joins a day you would see a difference. I have seen it many times affiliates and programs __________________ Our site is coming soon. It will be one of the best ever! I know so. Brian and Penny

12-21-2010, 07:29 AM	#38
corvette Confirmed User Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: scottsdale Posts: 7,880	hi all, just saw this thread, we will run some reports when i get in and check recent trends out to make sure everything is ok, things fluctuate around the holidays a lot __________________ If you need a good company for check writing services, then check out checkissuing, and for webhosting, check out Phoenix NAP Last edited by corvette; 12-21-2010 at 07:31 AM..

12-21-2010, 07:32 AM	#39
roganoli Confirmed User Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 757	Nornal here... CCBILL convert more than another NATS sponsor! And the retentions is amazing!

12-21-2010, 09:23 AM	#42
marktruman Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Europe Posts: 1,025	hows verotel doing nowadays?

12-21-2010, 10:17 AM	#44
CCBill Paul Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Cardinal Nation Posts: 1,005	Every processor scrubs. Scrubbing simply means to verify the information the customer has given. If we did not do this we would have been out of business a long time ago due to credit card fraud. We have been doing this for over 12 years and have gotten very good at it. Our job is to ensure as many transactions are processed as possible while still keeping the fraud to a minimum. Contrary to what some people think we are not constantly adjusting our scrub or allowing more transactions one day compared to the next. We are in the business of accepting transactions. If anyone has any questions about our system or why certain declines were issued, all they have to do is ask. __________________ Paulk @ CCBill.com \| icq 248615940

12-21-2010, 02:50 PM	#46
CCBill Paul Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Cardinal Nation Posts: 1,005	Scrubbing a transaction is typically based on the information the customer provides, along with our proprietary rule sets. Our transaction scrubs are consistent and rarely change. If we can change something that will allow more throughput with minimal risk, then we will thoroughly test that change on a small beta group, and then possibly expand it out to our entire system. Please remember that our system is optimized to accept as many transactions as possible. Please see my contact info below if anyone wishes to discuss in further detail. Thanks. __________________ Paulk @ CCBill.com \| icq 248615940

12-21-2010, 05:03 PM	#47
The Porn Nerd Living The Dream Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Inside a Monitor Posts: 19,496	We must remember the economy and the changes to credit cards that happened in 2010. Many consumers, who were used to "going over" and dealing with that later (or charging back) have had to alter their buying behaviors, which is why we see sales later in the month, I think. So the economy is still bouncy, new credit card regs, the fallout from epassports that affects a lot of webmasters and, by extension, cc processors picking up the slack and flucuations should be expected. As long as the overall tide is rising, so to speak, I'm happy. Ish. LOL! :D __________________ My Affiliate Programs: Porn Nerd Cash \| Porn Showcase \| Aggressive Gold Over 90 paysites to promote! Skype: peabodymedia

12-21-2010, 06:26 PM	#48
Shap Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: May 2001 Posts: 8,313	Ccbill has been great for us lately