New Visa Regs Beg For A Change In Payouts - Page 7 - GoFuckYourself.com

Pornkings · 07-18-2003, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DamageX

Agreed.

And I agree that a free business model can co-exist with a paid model, in a healthy relation.

The biggest problem with most TGP's is that many of them hit the surfer with the title/heading tag already, making sure he knows that he can find 100000000000000 free pics and movies on there. Now the amount may vary and it's not always as huge as they want to tell the surfers, but it's there. And if a surfer hits 10-20 TGP's via tradelinks, he's pretty much indoctrinated with the fact that there's shitloads of free porn out there and that he probably never have to pay for porn again. This behaviour pretty much conditions the surfer into an anti-pay mindset and makes any remotely potential sale even harder to make.

Add to that all the galleries advertising free memberships and whatnot, and you've got yourself a veritable, lean, mean, freeloader-creating machine.

Porn caters to a repeated, easy-to-satisfy need. The need to get off. It's not like watching an old movie on a free network and planning on getting HBO so you can get all the premieres. The surfer wants to get off, period. And if he's found something to get off to on ANY TGP, good luck selling him a porn membership.

I totally agree

We don't need to remove the Free stuff just censor it and not show pink. maybe the TGP owners and paysite owners need to get together and work it out.

it would just mean better conversions and more sales if we put a squeeze on the free hardcore

docjohnson · 07-18-2003, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Fiction

HBO and Showtime seem to do fine even with NBC, ABC, and CBS available for free.

Surfers ca not get all the porn they want for free. If they want, for example, full length name brand MILF Hunter movies, they will have to pay. If they want Jenna Jameson content they will have to pay. If they want to see a Hustler Centerfold, they will have to pay. You might be able to find that content somewhere on the web stolen, but that's irrelevant to the free vs. pay debate.

This is the most flawed analogy I've heard in a while. The business model NBC and major networks have been using since the 50's is based on product advertising. They make money from advertising, not the shows themselves. HBO makes money from advertising, but mostly from memberships.

The difference with the porn industry is that within mainstream television, an advertiser can promote ANY product. While within the porn industry, we can promote only porn related products. If NBC was trying to make money by promoting it's OWN shows, while still airing them free of charge, they would have been out of business a long time ago.

I'd like to issue a request to any sponsor who has the data available on tgp traffic. What are your average conversions as compared to other types of non-free traffic? What are your Chargeback rates as compared to non-free traffic? If tgp traffic is playing a role in high chargeback ratios, I'd certainly be interested to hear it. I think many of us don't want to be thrown into the same boat as webmasters that give it away for free. If the data proves this traffic source to be a contribution to the problem, I'd definately agree with damage: Stop paying out for this type of traffic, because at the same time you are penalizing those webmasters with quality traffic.

fatbaby · 07-18-2003, 05:43 PM

Quote:

There are many factors involved in programs paying the high rate per sign up they do now. These factors include

$39.99 monthly charges
2 FREE cross sells per page rebilling at $30 to $40 / mo

there are other factors as well but its these factors in specific I would like to address.

Chargebacks occur for a number of reasons but a lot have to do with very high monthly charges. Obviously these prices bring in more money which allows a much higher payout.

In an effort to reduce chargebacks, free cross sells will become single micro $1 payments that rebill at a much lesser rate. Much more importantly monthly rates must drop from the rate of $39.99 to $29.99

Obviously this will drastically hit the top of line of many sponsors (those who choose to take the path of 'correcting' some of the problems in the industry. Because of this cut in revenue payouts of $35 and $40 per trial will no longer exist (again for that group of sponsors who attempt to make the proper changes)

Payout will drop below the $30 range. Also FREE trials (which ARS recently began offering) will no longer exist. These changes will take place in the coming days.

Webmasters use this post as for warning of things to come.

This was the original post on this tread... or at least the majority of it...

This is from the ARS website members area:

Quote:

In an effort to keep charge-backs to a minimum in light of Visa's new ruling of 1% domestic c/b levels effective 10/1/03, we will have to discontinue free trials. Free trials will automatically be set to a $1, 3 day trial payment option. There will still be (4) membership options for you to promote. They are the $1, 3 day trial, $2.99 trial which will now be a 4 day trial, the $4.99, 5 day trial and the $39.99 monthly memberships. Payouts reamain unchanged with the $1 trials receiving what the free trials were paying. The effective change date has not yet been determined, but it will happen before Oct 1.

I'm confused....

I thought the $39.95 Monthly was supposed to drop to help with this issue

Quote:

Much more importantly monthly rates must drop from the rate of $39.99 to $29.99

I'm sure I'm missing something.. so figured I'd ask....

I asked elsewhere, but got no response.. figured someone around here could help me with it...

KidCock · 07-18-2003, 06:00 PM

I don't see this as much of a big problem....build your own processing system instead of using a 3rd-party (as you'll have to follow whatever rules they put in place).

Now obviously this means more hassles for you, but in the long-run even without the fact you can pretty much do as you wish (long as you keep those cb % down), most processors/gateways charge quite a bit less % than 3rd-party billing.

Something to think about ;p

This is not to bash any 3rd-party processors out there, as you do your jobs well as a "service". I'm just wondering why more people (especially who have the money), just don't invest a little in their future.

Mr.Fiction · 07-18-2003, 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by docjohnson

This is the most flawed analogy I've heard in a while. The business model NBC and major networks have been using since the 50's is based on product advertising. They make money from advertising, not the shows themselves. HBO makes money from advertising, but mostly from memberships.

People pay for HBO when a free advertising supported version of the same thing (with different content) already exists. That is not an analogy, it's a fact. Your argument actually would seem to be that free sites should exist, but that they should be advertising a wider variety of products. Nowhere do you make any argument that takes away from the idea that free and pay versions of the same service can (and do) co-exist successfully.

Would you also argue that HBO should never buy ads on broadcast TV because they would supporting the free version of themselves?

As far as free sites selling other products or services, Sleazy Dream made plenty of money without selling porn site memberships for a long time. He sold personals memberships. The reason he changed his system was because there was (obviously) more money in selling the advertising to the highest bidder. That highest bidder today appears to mostly be porn sites.

The fact that cable TV and broadcast TV co-exist shows that free and pay entertainment content can make money simultaneously. Perhaps free sites need to expand what the promote and pay sites need to make sure that their content is, like HBO, of such high quality, that people are willing to pay for it.

07-18-2003, 06:00 PM	#304
KidCock So Fucking Banned Join Date: May 2003 Location: San Pedro, Costa Rica Posts: 788	I don't see this as much of a big problem....build your own processing system instead of using a 3rd-party (as you'll have to follow whatever rules they put in place). Now obviously this means more hassles for you, but in the long-run even without the fact you can pretty much do as you wish (long as you keep those cb % down), most processors/gateways charge quite a bit less % than 3rd-party billing. Something to think about ;p This is not to bash any 3rd-party processors out there, as you do your jobs well as a "service". I'm just wondering why more people (especially who have the money), just don't invest a little in their future.