Important Copyright Ruling: LimeWire Crushed in RIAA Infringement Lawsuit - Page 2 - GoFuckYourself.com

DamianJ · 05-15-2010, 03:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

That is TOO easy. If the legislation were changed tomorrow...you better believe those sites would take that shit down INSTANTLY. If they didn't, me and every content producer on the planet would be salivating to get our lawyers on them and I'd own their ass.

OK, so if they passed a bill you'd close a few private servers in the US. Woop.

How do you figure you will stop piracy though?

American law applies in America. Not the rest of the world. Not yet, anyway.

DamianJ · 05-15-2010, 03:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by will76

Easy, the "policing" should be done by the site owners. The person uploading the content has to provide proof they own it. Obviously 95% of the shit up there now, is stolen and no proof can be provided.

If everything has to be approved by the site then there is no excuse of " we didn't know".

If the govt then gives out harsh fines, and with too many violations blocks the site at the ISP level, then it is resolved. Let the sites get hit with $500 fine everytime content theft is found on their site and see if they comply or not.

It's easy to police if the fines are harsh.

Wow. OK. So you are a pornographer and you are advocating giving the GOVERNMENT power to censor what internet sites you (as a free American citizen) are allowed to look at?

Can you not see the precedent that sets for when then religious right get enough power to lobby for porn to be banned?

Also, how does this stop piracy anyway? It might close a few US servers down. But it won't stop piracy as it cannot touch anything outside the US. Unless you want your ISPs to block you accessing anything outside America too? Sounds like the Great Firewall of China to me...

Caligari · 05-15-2010, 07:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamianJ

Same with videogames

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28682836
http://vgsales.wikia.com/wiki/NPD_sales_figures

My pov, backed up with real facts from real sources.

Your msnbc Source is from January 2009-

Video game sales take sudden plunge - May 14th, 2010
"On the whole, sales were off 26 percent to $766 million, with software sales (the most closely followed of the numbers) plunging 22 percent to $398.5 million, according to NPD Group, which tracks video game sales. Because April 2009 had relatively light sales (and thus, an easy comparable) industry insiders and investors were hoping to at least tow the line.

It was the industry?s fourth worst year-over-year decline?and it puts overall sales 11 percent behind last year?s sluggish pace."

Of course pirating has nothing to do with the continuing decline in game sales, its just the recession folks

DamianJ · 05-15-2010, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Caligari

Your msnbc Source is from January 2009-

Video game sales take sudden plunge - May 14th, 2010
"On the whole, sales were off 26 percent to $766 million, with software sales (the most closely followed of the numbers) plunging 22 percent to $398.5 million, according to NPD Group, which tracks video game sales. Because April 2009 had relatively light sales (and thus, an easy comparable) industry insiders and investors were hoping to at least tow the line.

It was the industry?s fourth worst year-over-year decline?and it puts overall sales 11 percent behind last year?s sluggish pace."

Of course pirating has nothing to do with the continuing decline in game sales, its just the recession folks

Sure, videogame piracy was only invented in January this year. That explains it.

And that totally negates the cinema and music revenue increases.

Meh, whatever.

If you all want to waste your time whining about tubes being the death of the industry, cool. I'm gonna use the time I would have wasted arguing more on this thread to set up a few blogs, do some twitter work, get a few nice soft slideshows up on some youtube channels and, well, you know, do some marketing instead of moaning like a girl about something you can do nothing about.

Do let me know in a week how many sales this thread gets you all.

xxx

Caligari · 05-15-2010, 07:50 AM

You can rationalize pirating all you want, but at the end of the day it is theft. Even if as you say pirating has no impact on sales, it is still theft.

Theft is a crime in most countries and punishable by law.

Any company which has had their content stolen has every legal right to do whatever it is in their power to stop theft of their products.

They are doing so now and the large cases against piracy are mounting week by week.

If a company like Warner Brothers thinks they can net a DIME after all is said and done, they will and are going to pursue every possible means to get said dime, and they WILL get said dime.

This is inevitable like the seasons, and while piracy will never be totally crushed, it will be hobbled to the point of being just another curiosity.

Robbie · 05-15-2010, 08:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamianJ

OK, so if they passed a bill you'd close a few private servers in the US. Woop.

How do you figure you will stop piracy though?

American law applies in America. Not the rest of the world. Not yet, anyway.

I'm really referring to the international treaty that is being worked on as we speak amongst several nations.

And on a couple of your other comments...you are absolutely right. The movie industry is making record money. And there are a few great reasons for that...

I went to see Iron Man 2 the other day. I wanted to see it on the big screen in all it's glory with the big theater sound system. I paid for that experience.

The tickets were $8 each for a MATINEE show!

I was reading where Hollywood is putting out more and more movies in IMAX 3D because they can charge more for it.

In a bad economy the movie theaters, bowling alleys, bars, etc. have great business as people want to get out of the house and forget their troubles.

None of those factors help online porn in any way.

The music industry:
You said it had an increase in online sales. That's nice.

NOTHING compared to the money the music industry made before piracy.

That's like saying that you made $1000 this week so it's an increase from the $900 you made last week. But you're leaving out that before piracy you made $5,000 a week.

SmokeyTheBear · 05-15-2010, 08:56 AM

Just a sidenote.

Whether an industry is making more money or less money has no real factor on how copyright theft directly affects sales.

Lets say i am a singer/artist/video game maker/etc , i produce a piece of work and sell 1 million copies the first year and 2 million the second year, i am doing twice as good. It doesn't matter what number of people stole it, i still did twice as good as the year before. Stolen product affects sales , but you cant go in reverse ind say " because you made twice as much money , copyright theft doesnt affect sales"

Sure i made twice as much money , but without copyright theft i might have made 10 times as much money

Dirty Dane · 05-15-2010, 09:01 AM

Similar court ruling is now made against the ISP of Piratebay:

http://torrentfreak.com/hollywood-ge...te-bay-100512/

Quote:

From the information currently available, in order to satisfy the Court it appears that CyberBunker have to either disconnect The Pirate Bay from the Internet, or the operators of the site have to do something that has never happened in the site’s history – remove the torrents listed in the injunction on copyright grounds.

The penalties for failing to comply appear to be very severe indeed.

The Court can fix a fine of up to 250,000 euros for each recorded case of infringement on the above movies. In the event that the fine cannot be enforced, it appears that Sven Olaf Kamphuis is being threatened with up to 2 years in jail.

Robbie · 05-15-2010, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirty Dane

Similar court ruling is now made against the ISP of Piratebay:

http://torrentfreak.com/hollywood-ge...te-bay-100512/

Jesus Christ! Don't post that on here! Don't you realize that gideongallery might read that and have a heart attack!

Oh the humanity...

Dirty Dane · 05-15-2010, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Robbie

Jesus Christ! Don't post that on here! Don't you realize that gideongallery might read that and have a heart attack!

Oh the humanity...

It's a German ruling. German court ruled opposite regarding Rapidshare. But that's the difference I tried to explain gideongallery few days ago; If you ignore something criminal in your backyard, you will eventually pay for it. That's logical and fair, don't you think?

Caligari · 05-15-2010, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dirty Dane

Similar court ruling is now made against the ISP of Piratebay:

http://torrentfreak.com/hollywood-ge...te-bay-100512/

Great news, thanks for posting this.

daviking · 05-15-2010, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamianJ

And music too!

The digital music business internationally saw a sixth year of expansion in 2008, growing by an estimated 25 per cent to US$3.7 billion in trade value. Digital platforms now account for around 20 per cent of recorded music sales, up from 15 per cent in 2007. Recorded music is at the forefront of the online and mobile revolution, generating more revenue in percentage terms through digital platforms than the newspaper (4%), magazine (1%) and film industries (4%) combined.

you need to take a look at the big picture:
"Total revenue from U.S. music sales and licensing plunged to $6.3 billion in 2009, according to Forrester Research. In 1999, that revenue figure topped $14.6 billion ... the trend has been very clear: RIAA has reported declining revenue in nine of the past 10 years, with album sales falling an average of 8% each year."
D.Goldman; (2010); money.cnn.com/2010/02/02/news/companies/napster_music_industry/index.htm?hpt=Sbin

also you can't compare the movie industry to adult. Its a completely different product. Even if all movies would be available for free online, and you could download a Blu-Ray within a minute, people would still go to the theater, to "experience" the movie in all its glory with friends or family.

will76 · 05-15-2010, 09:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamianJ

Wow. OK. So you are a pornographer and you are advocating giving the GOVERNMENT power to censor what internet sites you (as a free American citizen) are allowed to look at?

Can you not see the precedent that sets for when then religious right get enough power to lobby for porn to be banned?

Also, how does this stop piracy anyway? It might close a few US servers down. But it won't stop piracy as it cannot touch anything outside the US. Unless you want your ISPs to block you accessing anything outside America too? Sounds like the Great Firewall of China to me...

That is a solution. I believe you asked "HOW" and I gave you a simple answer, and your reply to that is "I CANT BELIEVE YOU WOULD WANT THAT". Did I say I wanted that? I was explaining to you how it wouldn't be hard for the govt to crack down on sites (tube,file sharing, etc...) that harbor, promote, and profite from stolen content.

We are talking about COPYWRITE AKA THEFT, not PORN and what is obscene or not. I've never been a big fan of the slippery slope applied to everything. The "user submitted shit" loop hole needs to be removed, then the EXISTING laws of copywrite violations can be inforced and they should be inforced harshly.

ottopottomouse · 05-15-2010, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daviking

also you can't compare the movie industry to adult. Its a completely different product. Even if all movies would be available for free online, and you could download a Blu-Ray within a minute, people would still go to the theater, to "experience" the movie in all its glory with friends or family.

There is something in that. I do make an effort to go and see certain films at the cinema and you always end up dragging someone else along too.

Robbie · 05-15-2010, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ottopottomouse

There is something in that. I do make an effort to go and see certain films at the cinema and you always end up dragging someone else along too.

Yep, and when you're married and have 2 kids you take the entire family. A trip to the movies for us is a $100 adventure with the over-inflated ticket prices and outrageous concession stand prices. But it's an activity that I can do with my whole family so it's worth it to me.

That's another thing that Damian is missing in the big picture (no pun intended)

People don't "take the family" to join a porn site. lol

NetHorse · 05-15-2010, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DamianJ

My bad. I assumed you would want to stop piracy throughout the world. Clearly, if you do not do this, then piracy doesn't stop. You can use the internet to connect to servers on other countries. Maybe you haven't thought your position through. Pal.

I don't want to stop piracy through-out the world, I'm just posting about the fight going on in congress right now and how it can effect piracy today. Why are you taking this so personal? I get a crack out of people who defend piracy to the death, makes you wonder what kind of sites they're operating..

Quote:

These include a FBI estimate that US businesses lose $200 to $250 billion annually due to counterfeiting. These figures were originally found in a FBI press release, but the agency, "has no record of source data or methodology for generating the estimate." "

http://www.afterdawn.com/news/articl...s_ga o_report

You see, All the other content producing industries act like ours does about piracy. Yet they are all making record sales.

Interesting, but I don't think it's a conspiracy. I look at the alexa ratings for torrent, file sharing forums and I put two and two together. Piracy is costing these industries billions, how can they NOT be?

Warez-bb.org
Traffic rank - http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/warez-bb.org - 487

Pornhub.com
Traffic rank - http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/pornhub.com - 54

Youporn.com
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/youporn.com# - 62

ThePiratebay - 100
Isohunt - 200

Quote:

So maybe, just maybe, it isn't copyright infringement that has fucked porn. Maybe we fucked it ourselves with bad business practises. Shady xsells. Circle jerks. Dialiers. Poor customer service and frankly, bad products?

Well I agree that the shady business practices have definitely fucked this industry, but to say the huge availability of full length free porn hasn't affected it is absurd.

Quote:

Love to read a citation from the ISPs asking if they can please filter their customers' internet service.

Let's assume, rather than make money selling internets, they want to spend any money policing them for the government. So, how do they pay for the infrastructure? Putting consumers bills up! How else? Brilliant so far. So everyone has to pay more for their internet. It gets better... How do they determine what is copyright infringement and what isn't? They would have to do low level packet analysis. So that means any privacy you had is gone. There will be a team at your ISP searching through EVERY PACKET of data you have to see if THEY THINK it MIGHT be infringing copyright. Then of course, there is the tricky situation with open wifi, spoofed IPs, etc etc.

Do you see? Even if they catch you, they then have to prove the person paying for the internet connection was responsible for downloading a file that is CLAIMED to be copyrighted. Then you would have to prove he DID download it. And it IS what it claims to be.

Jesus. Can you imagine that process?

You're not understanding how it works. The ISP isn't going to do a "packet analysis", they're going to do what THEY'VE ALREADY BEEN CAUGHT DOING! Filtering traffic, they have the ability to shutdown the ability for people to access entire sites, EASILY. Do some reading man, seriously..

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21376597/

http://gizmodo.com/5052628/comcast-o...r-your-traffic

http://www.savetheinternet.com/

How far fetched is it now? The biggest ISP in the United States has already been caught doing it!

Quote:

You can never stop piracy. Denting it is pointless. OK, close rapidshare. Who cares? Did closing Napster kill music piracy? No. In fact, the high profile court cases only prove time and time again to INCREASE awareness of how easy it is to pirate stuff and therefore increase piracy.

Spend your time worrying about something you might be able to change. IMHO.

Have a lovely saturday. I'm off to do the gardening

You have a comprehension problem, LOL. This isn't talking about a high profile court case, or closing a single site like rapidshare or what happened with Napster. This is about the possibility of the LAW changing, the internet CHANGING. Go read about what's going on congress, go read about the on-going fight to protect Network neutrality.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Network_neutrality

Robbie · 05-15-2010, 12:10 PM

Guys there's no reason to get angry with each other.

Here's my take: Business comes down to this: SUPPLY AND DEMAND

By protecting my content and keeping the supply "low" (by keeping it on my members area) I keep the demand high. That's why CM is having the best month since Jan. of 2008 this month.

All the other sites I promote? Every one of them is DOWN for the 25 month in a row EXCEPT AEBN (video on demand) and webcam programs. Those don't make anywhere near as much as they used to, but they have been growing again from the depths they fell to.

And what does that tell me? It tells me there still is a demand for DVD porn that the customer can get cheap and still feel "safe" (as opposed to going to torrents and not really knowing what could happen...virus, FBI knocking on your door, etc.)

And the webcams go back to SUPPLY AND DEMAND. If a guy becomes enamored with a certain cam girl and he wants to take her into private he has to pay for it.

All this other talk is just bullshit and fairy tale land. Supply and Demand is the foundation for business. Period. Giving it all away for free is the antithesis of supply and demand.

Class dismissed.

05-15-2010, 07:50 AM	#55
Caligari Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: At The Mountains Of Madness Posts: 5,414	You can rationalize pirating all you want, but at the end of the day it is theft. Even if as you say pirating has no impact on sales, it is still theft. Theft is a crime in most countries and punishable by law. Any company which has had their content stolen has every legal right to do whatever it is in their power to stop theft of their products. They are doing so now and the large cases against piracy are mounting week by week. If a company like Warner Brothers thinks they can net a DIME after all is said and done, they will and are going to pursue every possible means to get said dime, and they WILL get said dime. This is inevitable like the seasons, and while piracy will never be totally crushed, it will be hobbled to the point of being just another curiosity. __________________ ATTN Webmasters Cruel Bucks - LIVE Gonzo Does Not Pay ------------------------------------------------ Animal Rescue Click Here to Feed An Animal for Free

05-15-2010, 08:56 AM	#57
SmokeyTheBear ►SouthOfHeaven Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: PlanetEarth MyBoardRank: GerbilMaster My-Penis-Size: extralarge MyWeapon: Computer Posts: 28,609	Just a sidenote. Whether an industry is making more money or less money has no real factor on how copyright theft directly affects sales. Lets say i am a singer/artist/video game maker/etc , i produce a piece of work and sell 1 million copies the first year and 2 million the second year, i am doing twice as good. It doesn't matter what number of people stole it, i still did twice as good as the year before. Stolen product affects sales , but you cant go in reverse ind say " because you made twice as much money , copyright theft doesnt affect sales" Sure i made twice as much money , but without copyright theft i might have made 10 times as much money __________________ hatisblack at yahoo.com Last edited by SmokeyTheBear; 05-15-2010 at 08:58 AM..

05-15-2010, 12:10 PM	#67
Robbie Leaner, Meaner, Faster Industry Role: Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Vegas Posts: 20,959	Guys there's no reason to get angry with each other. Here's my take: Business comes down to this: SUPPLY AND DEMAND By protecting my content and keeping the supply "low" (by keeping it on my members area) I keep the demand high. That's why CM is having the best month since Jan. of 2008 this month. All the other sites I promote? Every one of them is DOWN for the 25 month in a row EXCEPT AEBN (video on demand) and webcam programs. Those don't make anywhere near as much as they used to, but they have been growing again from the depths they fell to. And what does that tell me? It tells me there still is a demand for DVD porn that the customer can get cheap and still feel "safe" (as opposed to going to torrents and not really knowing what could happen...virus, FBI knocking on your door, etc.) And the webcams go back to SUPPLY AND DEMAND. If a guy becomes enamored with a certain cam girl and he wants to take her into private he has to pay for it. All this other talk is just bullshit and fairy tale land. Supply and Demand is the foundation for business. Period. Giving it all away for free is the antithesis of supply and demand. Class dismissed. __________________ -Robbie ClaudiaMarie.Com