V_RocKs

Hmm... I just bought a subscription... you sure they turned it off?

shwsrvcs

We posted our own content on megarotic as free advertising and got some good sales from it.

Obviously, we couldn't track the traffic very well, but everytime we posted a video, our days were stronger.

I wonder if they will pull our videos as a result?

That will be interesting to see.

Dave G

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RudeBoy

my membership is still active. wtf are u talking about ?

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Humpy Leftnut

A brief regurgitation:

Things take time.

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RawAlex

your memberships may stay active. Not all billing companies pull the users out of the files on cancel. I tried to signup before and got an endless wait. Potentially they may have some processing that works only in certain countries, or they may be just faking and batching.

We will see.

Klen

They dont give a damn as longest it provide them good profit.Also,if you ask them they can approve you for proccess adult.There is adult store which proccess adult,i dont remember exact name but it was something about eve and adam,also trafficadept.com which sells adult traffic have approval to use paypal.

munki

Good schitt... bout damn time...

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Brujah

I wouldn't give them my credit card info, etc.. the owner is a known scammer, and was involved in credit card fraud I believe. Did jailtime for it.

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will76

Not really, there might be a million sites out there but i would bet that the tp 20 account for about 95%+ of the damage.

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chupacabra

quoted for truth. as always, follow the money... once it isn't profitable there is much less reason to facilitate the theft. the truly private trackers are the exception, as many of them don't even fly ads, AFF or otherwise..

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Jace

congrats, you are contributing to the downfall of the internet porn industry

at least we know now, thanks!

KrisKross

Didn't you used to be a big supporter of Pornotube? You even advertised there, IIRC. Change of heart?

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quantum-x

Sam is actually on summer vacation presently, working as much as she can though.

Sausage

I looked at their site, and didn't see where they were anything worse than your traditional tube site with a membership layer (seemed similar to xtube). Am I missing something ?

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Skype : blance8888
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commonsense

do you support sites that post content that does not belong to them?

DWB

Kudos.

One site at a time.

Paul Markham

Good start and the way to go.

Now we need as an industry to employ someone via subscriptions to work on this full time. It's not fair or the most effective to rely on others to do it for free.

Who will put their hands in their pockets and step up?

I will and if it happens.

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Luscious Media

Woot!

Big ups to VG.

Who's next on the list?...or is it a surprise?...I love surprises...and pie.

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»Rob Content«

I take time out of my day each day to do it make phone calls do research etc. There are a few others as dedicated.

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»Rob Content«

Reason 1 they steal content from paysites like brazzers, perfectgonzo, and many many others, and make it to where you need a membership to view them.

So basically it's all stolen content that they are making a huge profit from.

They have animal sex, beasty girls fucking horses, rape, incest, stuff you would think is CP where people say this girl is way too young, scat and people eating shit, piss etc.

Their entire model is based on stealing your content and charging people to view it. How is this ok?

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seeric

LOLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL

at the attempted justifications of megarotic and others jacking hard working content producers for their wares.

fucking amazing.

Bastone

Been working on getting our content removed from that site for about a month now. Most of our content had been pulled off except for one scene that always remains for some reason!

I'm happy you've managed to pull off their billers; these guy's not only were using stolen content but selling paid membership for content that is not theirs!

I'll get the info you need for Skinvideo.com as well by tomorrow. Let me know if there's anything more we can do to help out

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Bastone
Online Product Director
Wicked.com and DigitalPlayground.com

Bastone

this one deserves another bump

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Bastone
Online Product Director
Wicked.com and DigitalPlayground.com

fluffygrrl

Sausage

Nice try...

...but I support tube sites, as long as the sponsor is ok with their content being used, or the uploader has rights to the content.

If you think that web2 style social networking sites can be squashed you really have your head in the sand. These types of sites are the future and most of the present tube sites are merely a step away from being mgps. Hell the conversions are better than we have seen on tgp/mgp for a long time, so we upload our content on to them and happily take their traffic.

I can think of things far worse than adult tube sites, and at least most of the tube sites let you use their traffic for free!

This reminds me of the big dramas when tgps first started hitting the scene, and picposts were phased out. You can't stop the net evolving.

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sonofsam

Arn't you guys celebrating a little early? Still seems like they are processing just fine for me...

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Sausage

Yeah cp, beastie etc is pretty crappy stuff, and I'm not sure about charging for access. Its my understanding looking at their site they do content deals much like xtube does where they only bill for content they have the rights to or permission for.

You say "they steal" ?

Its also my understanding that just like a massive number of other web2 style sites its the users who upload the content, not "them".

Does this mean you are going after the likes of xtube etc? If so I feel compelled to suggest you should talk with your lawyer before making a habit of this.

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tenderobject

wow nice work guys!

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TeenCat

ok, small people can do big things as you can see, now everyone have to do the same anyway why is there still segpay? nobody told them? i cant prove anything mine stolen there, only point them to this thread ... next thing is why you still talk about that there are aff ads? just shut down their billers so they will have only aff left, aff will be overloaded all around warez and will be useless for adult webmasters ;) oh sorry another smoked keep up the good work man!

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u-Bob

bump bump

Trixxxia

Just to correct you Sausage, I know, for a fact, there are full scenes on there with no consent from the producer. Also, the production company will get paid only if they signup - so I assure you there are many companies still oblivious to their (Megarotic's) existance, & therefore their (producers) works are being used without proper accreditation, license, authorization or compensation.

Jace

pornotube is basically a big mgp with playable videos on the site

those 3 minute clips WITH AFFILIATE CODES IN THEM aren't doing much damage

and yes, I still am a supporter of legal and legit tube sites

RawAlex

Jace, there is no way that anyone can sanely support 3 minutes plus "clips" as promotional material. The fucking punters get off in that amount of time. Most of them don't need to pull out a CC because they blew thier load on the "sample" content and left the building.

Most of the tube style sites are HIGHLY dependant on non-related sponsorships / ad spaces to pay for their bandwidth bills. Pornotube appeared to be running Etology ads on their sites to pay the bills. As an affiliate, I cannot run that type of site with that type of design because it is AGAINST THE AFFILIATE AGREEMENTS OF ALMOST EVERY PROGRAM.

What I see are many program owners getting onto the "tube bandwagon" and undercutting their own affiliates, granting to a few sites rights that other affiliates don't get. Looking at the 3 mintues or 5 minute clip from a site means that it is that much harder for me to sell with a 16 picture gallery or even a 6 20 second clip gallery. Converting buyers into guys with limp dicks off playing poker (one of the sponsors on pornotube) isn't exactly a way for the porn business to make money.

Too many short sighted people trading future dollars for today's dimes, and the people making the real money are the dating and other "not porn" sites that take the ad spaces.

If TGPs were the escalator to hell for porn, tube sites are the express elevators.

Sausage

Thanks for the correction. I noticed a few posts in this thread regarding that and in that case they do deserve some negative attention (especially refusing to remove clips!).

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Jace

sorry, I was in the middle of a tv show when I typed that, I meant to say 30 second clips...LOL

and you are 100% correct

but pornotube is mostly 30 second clips, at least last time I checked, I have not been there since I had that featured video on the front page that did nothing

Trixxxia

I checked today - the maximum for PornoTube is 5 minutes or 100mb. I don't know about any of you, but my clips are minimum 75mb and about 30 seconds long.

RawAlex - I agree with all of you on some of these sites, but I don't categorize PornoTube close to that and here's why:
For the most part, Pornotube's parent company has agreements with approximately 75% (probably more) producers in the industry for their PPV/VOD program. Secondly, they have no interest in losing money which means that other than 'trailers' or the like, they wouldn't allow it because it takes away from their cash cow - what it does do though is drive traffic to their 'moo-moo train' AND it also allows others to make more. The other thing is being a 'free' tube site (surfer does not pay to view it) it does not put the surfer in the 'I already paid for movies' mode. It's a teaser and if they want more - they buy.

Megarotic, being a paid membership (to watch more than XX movies a day) puts the surfer in the 'all you can eat buffet' mode - even if they aren't hungry, they will eat and not leave any tip cuz they think it's their paid right & cuz the buffet offers entire scenes/episodes/sites practically.

Anybody that promotes on both - following sponsor rules and testing the traffic for comparison reasons will agree that the Pornotube client is not averse to buy a membership to the sponsor whereas the Megarotic client is.

Just my 2Canadian cents worth.

RawAlex

I went to look today. Off the front page, I found WEG uploaded videos at 2:30 seconds and longer. I found some other videos at over 4 minutes. I can't see that being very good for business.

Trixxxia, I understand that pornotube has agreements with many of these producers. But what those agreements have done is undercut the affiliate model. These agreemnts allow pornotube to work as a super affiliate, running longer clips than I would be allowed to run, and to place advertisements for third parties of the page that I am not allowed to do normally by my agreement.

Newest videos: Twisty's at 2:51, POV BJ's at 1:07, gay solos at 0:58, Fuck Her Right at 2:54, and an amateur blowjob clip at 2 minutes even. There was more than enough long playing content for a guy to get going and likely get off without an issue, plus direct links on most of those pages to another 10 minutes plus free video.

I don't think pornotube is as bad as the obvious illegal file share / user upload sites, but it is still edging the business closer and closer to giving almost all of it away. The costs of marketing go up this way, and the number of potential clients is slowly pulled off, teaching them to look harder for free porn.

At least in the TGP deal, surfers have to click back and click a new clip every 20 secords or so, with the idea being that taking out the CC is less punishment than what they have to do to get off that way.

Sausage

Though this is just another step in the evolution of both the web and this business.

When there was nothing for free you got picposts, then along came these tgps which offered 12+pics, then a couple of years back they demanded more pics and more videos of higher quality. This is just another step in a direction we have been heading for probably 12 years now.

Nobody regardless of how much power or influence they command in this industry can stop this or force a change of direction. It goes right back to when movements were afoot to try and limit tgps, and surprise they were ineffective because for every tgp that limited its free content there were 3 willing to step up and take their traffic.

At least the responsible tube sites are largely trying to engage and work with the adult webmaster community, which is more than can be said for most of these social networking sites.

I would love to go back to the days where a picpost submit would generate me 2-3 sales, and getting a site on persiankitty's link list was enough to quit your day job, but those days are gone. Tube sites and media on demand sites with 1+ min clips (hell many have 20+ min clips) are the future, simply because thats where the traffic is heading. You can't fight the fact that web2 style sites are the new craze.

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RawAlex

Sausage, too many people confuse "web2.0" with a license to steal content. Youtube and Google video have a business model which essentially gets the users to go out and steal the content and share it with each other with the site getting in the middle and trying to make money.

web2.0 at best is a marginal business model, and certainly one that goes against the idea of the adult business. Adult is a margin business, 30-50% margin on everything, if not more. Web2.0 sites appear to be about a 1% margin business, and judging by the amount of advertising many of those sites feel they need to jam on the pages, I would suspect even less.

It is as if there is a rush to make adult into a business with a margin similar to prime rate. 6% profits aren't going to make this business very attractive to anyone except the largest of companies that are willing to grind it out.

DVD producers are screaming: They are lucky now to move 250 pieces on a new release, where they were moving 1000 pieces not a few years ago. The retail prices haven't gone up either, leaving them with at times a 75% drop in retail income on their products. Many of them are making that money back up either by licensing scenes from their movies for web use, or licensing entire DVDs and catalogs to VOD houses, hoping to pick up some money that way. Their buisness use to be high margin, now it isn't. The DVD guys are the canary in the coal mine for us, some of them are suffering very hard indeed. Some are doing well, but many are having a hard time of it.

Don't make the mistake of thinking tube sites are the future. They are an evolutionary dead end, as they seek to give more and more of the product away until there is nothing left to sell. If a porn video runs 60 minutes, how much can you give away before nobody bothers? 30 minutes? 40 minutes?

The only people making real money off the tube sites, IMHO, are the dating, cam, and other non-adult sites that are buying the post-orgasmic traffic. These guys are smart too, paying what appears to be big payouts but in reality they have bought out 75% of the market already and now they pay a huge finder fee for the last crumbs on the table, meanwhile they gorge on recurring members they will never pay for again, even if the member quits and comes back. A large percentage of dating traffic is driving back people who are already members and getting them to spend money again - without the refering site making money.

Sorry to ramble, but "web2.0" isn't evolution, it is slash and burn "I can give more for nothing" mentality that has quite likely already pushed this business model off the cliff.

Sausage

Fair comments RawAlex, and I definitely agree with your reasoning. I think of web 2 as "You do all the work, we keep all the money".

Though my thoughts are with the massive explosion of popularity with web2 style sites, I don't see how this can be stopped. You stop and punish the early ones seeking to work with and actively engage the adult industry, then you end up with a whole heap who just distance themselves from us and give nothing back. Porn advertisers will always chase those who have traffic, whether they admit to it openly or not... so revenue will never be a problem.

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seeric

back to the top.

RawAlex

Well, my thought has been that smart operators would move to sites that LOOK web2.0, but deliver a level of content more in keeping with what we have developed in the past for promotional sites.

My fears at this point is that it is the dating sites and similar that are paying for this to happen. They have no downside and all upside in sponsoring these sorts of sites, and even the "good" sites like pornotube and snizzshare are dependant on the dating sites to make the revenue model work out. For me, that revenue there is paying to dillute the porn product. So yeah, there is traffic, but a bunch of it isn't going to the porn sites, but somewhere else - net loss to porn, because the people ate your samples and had dinner somewhere else.

It is an interesting situation. Getting the obvious ripoff sites out of the same is key if there is any hope that this stuff will work out at all.

»Rob Content«

Can you e mail me the subscription number for a membership via segpay?

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zand_stein

finally!!you have a pretty
good news you got there..
definitetly a great succes!!

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Meloman

Basically the same as an fortune 500 company. Didn't Walmart earn like 5 billion net last year on 250 billion gross. That's like 2% profit margin.

I agree that tube sites should only have licenses approved content not stolen rip offs. I completely agree that tube sites are killing the current business model and pushing regualar affiliates out. The proliferation of these sites does dilute the value of a porn membership to certain degree and does make porn membership more difficult to sell.

But this is just the evolution of this biz and I seriously doubt anything can be done about it.

The evolution is that affiliates are being pushed out and the affiliate companies are getting traffic direct through the various methods u've mentioned. The studios/affiliate programs are going to just submit there clips direct to these types of sites and there will no room for a regular affilaite.

I don't think anything can be done about this anymore other than just keep tube sites legit with licensed content. But they aren't going away and the strong will survice....those that can handle the 6% profit margin.

Regular affilates may one day need to purchase exclusive video so that they can submit them with there own watermark to tube sites.

Shitty reality...but it's reality.

RawAlex

meloman, the problem is that the programs haven't realized that they are shooting themselves. They are producing more and more content and giving more and more of it away for free. Membership prices aren't going up, and with the US dollar in the toilet, there aren't that many "cheap" places to make porn anymore. So they are trading a decent bottom line business for a run to be the lowest margin business on the web.

Programs that don't go this route will likely get a huge boost in traffic over time as affiliates with traffic but no web20 sites will choose to send their traffic to places where they don't have to compete in an unbalanced situation.

Robbie

Excellent job VG I would like to meet you at one of the shows and shake your hand!

And reading all these posts about "evolution" and the industry "dying" is kinda perplexing to me. LOTS of people are still buying memberships. There is always a segment of society that doesn't settle for going "coach" and likes to go "first class".

And affiliate money? Never better.

It's not as easy to make as it was in 1997. But that's because the net was new and porn was almost rare.

Anybody else remember those days? We all joked that there were really only about 8 porn pictures on the entire net...they were just presented on 30 different sites in 30 different ways! LOL!

Yeah, back then you could run a banner and make a fortune. Then some "geniuses" started throwing pop ups all over the fucking place and soured surfers away from clicking banners.

So we came up with ways to market that re-gained the surfers trust. It takes originality and creativity. And quite frankly there are really only a handful of guys who are good at it. The biz is just over run with "webmasters" who think they are in the porn biz.

The stealing of content has to be stopped. Hell, forget about what it does or doesn't do to sales....It just pisses me off to see my shit being stolen. Just like if somebody came up and wanted to drive my car. Even if they were going to return it....I'd still kick their ass. Cause it's MINE! LOL!

Fuck thieves. Great job VG!

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ClaudiaMarie.Com

Meloman

That's the evolution of capitalism. The biggest companies in the world run on the smallest margins as I mentioned before. It is what it is. Yes they are shooting themselves in the foot, but the strong will survive.

Programs that don't go this route will probably eventually die out. The free sites with the most traffic are the ones ranking at the top of the search engines. The sites at the top of the search engines are the tgps, mgps, blogs & now tube sites. Affiliate programs dont' have a choice but deal with who has the traffic and unfortunetly the lowest margin producing sites are now them.

Free sites giving away content are the ones search engines like and rank well.

So my theory is that the evolution is:
1. The sites with traffic will be the tube/blog sites with the most given away content.
2. These sites will take over all the se results.
3. Paysites will have no choice but to deal with them.
4. The paysites that don't, won't get traffic...

I firmly believe that the regular affiliate/sponsor relationship is slowly dieing off and those that survive will be the biggiest of the biggest that can survice on the lowest margin.

Believe me, i don't like where this is heading...I just don't see a solution.

By no means do I think people should stop the good fight though. If tube sites can be kept in check I'm all for it. Good job to the thread starter and good luck with this all!

Serge Litehead

content is they key, content producers won't be left without work, the model is shifting as we are witnessing it, instead of content being used to promote more of similar content, content will be used merely as an attraction to promote every and anything else except the content itself. who will stops me from buying content or shooting my own and use it as fill-in to promote something else? think of TV shows they exists only to fly ads (most time unrelated to the shows) in between. this could work it user uploaded copyrighted content would be eliminated.

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quantum-x

you guys need to look up a definition of web 2.0
Jesus.