AVNChris says it was silly of XBIZ to give away free registration, what do YOU think? - GoFuckYourself.com

HELMY · 07-16-2008, 11:08 AM

I'd like to hear what others thought about XBIZ's free registration promotion, because what YOU think matters to XBIZ.

Chris,

You go out of your way to come and shake my hand at every show, then turn right around and talk smack about XBIZ to my staff and others in the biz. That's really weird man.

Alec

jact · 07-16-2008, 11:09 AM

I wasn't able to make it to the show, but I suspect that the waived registration fees brought out a lot of faces who haven't come out for years. With so many shows, and so many expenses to cover it's a nice change not to get slapped with hundreds of dollars for a badge that does you no good anyway.

TMM_John · 07-16-2008, 11:10 AM

See Sig!

Sly · 07-16-2008, 11:12 AM

I don't really see that it's anybody's business but your own... it's your show. If you want to give out free registration, by all means, go for it. If some people do not like the atmosphere that free registration may fester, they have 20 other shows they can go to... :-)

TheAmericanCannibal · 07-16-2008, 11:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HELMY

I'd like to hear what others thought about XBIZ's free registration promotion, because what YOU think matters to XBIZ.

Chris,

You go out of your way to come and shake my hand at every show, then turn right around and talk smack about XBIZ to my staff and others in the biz. That's really weird man.

Alec

Not sooo weird as I am finding out lately, he may not only have just a big nose, but he just might have two faces as well...

:-((

TMM_John · 07-16-2008, 11:12 AM

On a serious note. Free passes are great, but qualify them somehow.

JFK · 07-16-2008, 11:12 AM

I think it opened up the show to a lot of new attendees. To qualify them as potential clients, would up to the webmasters who want to do business with them.

KRosh · 07-16-2008, 11:14 AM

I thought it was great..and a total success. I personally did a lot of business at the show!

There was only Two incidents isolated to ONE party at the XBIZ show so you can't say that the free registration brings in the riff raff.

munki · 07-16-2008, 11:15 AM

Free or no... I had a blast at XBiz, and got a ton of biz done as well... could never ask for more from a show.

kmanrox · 07-16-2008, 11:15 AM

avn should mind their own business... how long have they been in the biz? and why is xbiz kicking their asses? lol

Xrated J · 07-16-2008, 11:17 AM

parked...

C H R I S · 07-16-2008, 11:17 AM

I did not say XBIZ giving away free badges was silly.

I replied to a thread Mitch posted suggesting we give away free badges and said that it would be silly - I did not say that it was silly for you to do it.

I get along great with everyone on your team and I do not talk smack - I had a great time at your show.

Where is this coming from Alec.

D-Money · 07-16-2008, 11:18 AM

Sig placement...

BradM · 07-16-2008, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PBucksJohn

On a serious note. Free passes are great, but qualify them somehow.

Would be a lot of work but may be needed.

kmanrox · 07-16-2008, 11:20 AM

http://www.alexa.com/data/details/tr...00&y=r&z=3&z=3

media · 07-16-2008, 11:21 AM

I thought it was a good show.. With attendance dropping at alot of the shows I think the free registration is a good incentive to get more people there that normally would not show up..

I miss the good ole days of the two story booths and thousands and thousands of attendees.. those were the crazy days..

TheAmericanCannibal · 07-16-2008, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kmanrox

avn should mind their own business... how long have they been in the biz? and why is xbiz kicking their asses? lol

They kinda have to mind other people's business, they have competition now.
While I am friendly on both sides, I'd have to say that as much as AVN hates when XBIZ implements ideas they have, how can they get mad when XBIZ comes up with a good marketing idea like free registration?

Maybe it has to do with $$$ left on the table?
AVN has been smart for many years however by not leaving money on the table...

Where will this lead us?

I think in a good direction for both parties- it's time to get creative like Sweet T and Ron C did with their Forum shows...

Diversify or die

HELMY · 07-16-2008, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PBucksJohn

On a serious note. Free passes are great, but qualify them somehow.

We had both an automated and human process in place - wasn't perfect, but very effective.

JFK · 07-16-2008, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAmericanCannibal

They kinda have to mind other people's business, they have competition now.
While I am friendly on both sides, I'd have to say that as much as AVN hates when XBIZ implements ideas they have, how can they get mad when XBIZ comes up with a good marketing idea like free registration?

Maybe it has to do with $$$ left on the table?
AVN has been smart for many years however by not leaving money on the table...

Where will this lead us?

I think in a good direction for both parties- it's time to get creative like Sweet T and Ron C did with their Forum shows...

Diversify or die

Good post

You're more than just a pretty face

Jens Van Assterdam · 07-16-2008, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kmanrox

http://www.alexa.com/data/details/tr...00&y=r&z=3&z=3

You are a bad bad man...

HELMY · 07-16-2008, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVNChris

I did not say XBIZ giving away free badges was silly.

I replied to a thread Mitch posted suggesting we give away free badges and said that it would be silly - I did not say that it was silly for you to do it.

I get along great with everyone on your team and I do not talk smack - I had a great time at your show.

Where is this coming from Alec.

Nice try.

SykkBoy · 07-16-2008, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KRosh

I thought it was great..and a total success. I personally did a lot of business at the show!

There was only Two incidents isolated to ONE party at the XBIZ show so you can't say that the free registration brings in the riff raff.

Agreed.
As the company affected by those two issues, its not a big issue because other than those two incidents, I met a lot of newer webmasters who could not have otherwise been able to afford to attend. Are these guys going to turn into major players or just become TGP submitters with a sale or 2 a day? I don't know, but at least they had a chance to attend and maybe meet someone they could make money with.

That said, I don't care one way or the other if the badges are free or paid, all I care about is are we going to see any sort of ROI on our investment?

LAJ · 07-16-2008, 11:27 AM

Interesting drama thread.

Since I run a show it's hard for me to be objective on this one.

Sig spot. And it'll be interesting to see who is on the posse bandwagon in either camp.

C H R I S · 07-16-2008, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAmericanCannibal

Not sooo weird as I am finding out lately, he may not only have just a big nose, but he just might have two faces as well...

:-((

Better than 6 egos

Voodoo · 07-16-2008, 11:30 AM

When is AVN going to start giving away free passes?

KRosh · 07-16-2008, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LAJ

Interesting drama thread.

Since I run a show it's hard for me to be objective on this one.

Sig spot. And it'll be interesting to see who is on the posse bandwagon in either camp.

Taking the 5th amendment are we?

TheAmericanCannibal · 07-16-2008, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVNChris

Better than 6 egos

I got 12 ego's, three nicknames, and one hot piece of ass now thanks to you
So I am not hating-

I am appreciating.

Believe me when I say APPRECIATING

C H R I S · 07-16-2008, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAmericanCannibal

I got 12 ego's, three nicknames, and one hot piece of ass now thanks to you
So I am not hating-

I am appreciating.

Believe me when I say APPRECIATING

Enjoy it brother.

Connor · 07-16-2008, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HELMY

I'd like to hear what others thought about XBIZ's free registration promotion, because what YOU think matters to XBIZ.

Chris,

You go out of your way to come and shake my hand at every show, then turn right around and talk smack about XBIZ to my staff and others in the biz. That's really weird man.

Alec

Since you're asking for honest opinions Alec, I'll give you an honest answer.

As someone who also runs and organizes a show, I think it's a mistake for you to give away free passes. I'm talking in general, since I've never been to your show and can't comment on it specifically. But in general, paying to attend a show means you're serious about getting something out of the show... and charging means your show will attract the most serious attendees. And IMHO, it isn't just about the numbers at the end of the day. When I attend a show, what's important to me is that I'm there with people who are serious about getting some business done. Parties are great, I love them as much as the next guy -- but they belong in the evenings, IMHO.

The Los Angeles Dodgers did a promotion once. They offered $2 tickets on Tuesday nights in the outfield. The people who showed up only because they were $2 tickets turned out to more trouble than they were worth. They were rowdy, and were basically there to raise hell instead of watch baseball. They had to cancel the promotion for the sake of the people who WERE serious about watching baseball.

So I know the "free passes" approach will win you a lot of friends, I mean who doesn't like free right? But since you asked this question I thought I'd give you my honest opinion.

JFK · 07-16-2008, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVNChris

Better than 6 egos

what flavour eggos ? I like mine with whipped cream on

Odie · 07-16-2008, 11:33 AM

with over-saturation of shows, I think that the organizers must do whatever works for them to increase attendance. AVN is a staple and XBiz is up and coming.

There's still tons to be done in adult where shows are concerned.

C H R I S · 07-16-2008, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Connor

Since you're asking for honest opinions Alec, I'll give you an honest answer.

As someone who also runs and organizes a show, I think it's a mistake for you to give away free passes. I'm talking in general, since I've never been to your show and can't comment on it specifically. But in general, paying to attend a show means you're serious about getting something out of the show... and charging means your show will attract the most serious attendees. And IMHO, it isn't just about the numbers at the end of the day. When I attend a show, what's important to me is that I'm there with people who are serious about getting some business done. Parties are great, I love them as much as the next guy -- but they belong in the evenings, IMHO.

The Los Angeles Dodgers did a promotion once. They offered $2 tickets on Tuesday nights in the outfield. The people who showed up only because they were $2 tickets turned out to more trouble than they were worth. They were rowdy, and were basically there to raise hell instead of watch baseball. They had to cancel the promotion for the sake of the people who WERE serious about watching baseball.

So I know the "free passes" approach will win you a lot of friends, I mean who doesn't like free right? But since you asked this question I thought I'd give you my honest opinion.

Great points connor.

TheAmericanCannibal · 07-16-2008, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AVNChris

Enjoy it brother.

I am and I will...

PS- Don't keep telling people I am a douchebag, when you know I just played one on TV.

I learned a long time ago when people talk negative about others, it only drives the people who they are speaking to closer to the fire.

I learned that when I shit talked the car dealer across the street from my car dealership when I was 21.

everytime I called the guys across the street douchebags...I lost the sale.

LAJ · 07-16-2008, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KRosh

Taking the 5th amendment are we?

Hell no LOL... I knew Connor was gonna be posting something far more eloquent than I'm capable of.

KRosh · 07-16-2008, 11:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Connor

Since you're asking for honest opinions Alec, I'll give you an honest answer.

As someone who also runs and organizes a show, I think it's a mistake for you to give away free passes. I'm talking in general, since I've never been to your show and can't comment on it specifically. But in general, paying to attend a show means you're serious about getting something out of the show... and charging means your show will attract the most serious attendees. And IMHO, it isn't just about the numbers at the end of the day. When I attend a show, what's important to me is that I'm there with people who are serious about getting some business done. Parties are great, I love them as much as the next guy -- but they belong in the evenings, IMHO.

The Los Angeles Dodgers did a promotion once. They offered $2 tickets on Tuesday nights in the outfield. The people who showed up only because they were $2 tickets turned out to more trouble than they were worth. They were rowdy, and were basically there to raise hell instead of watch baseball. They had to cancel the promotion for the sake of the people who WERE serious about watching baseball.

So I know the "free passes" approach will win you a lot of friends, I mean who doesn't like free right? But since you asked this question I thought I'd give you my honest opinion.

Connor,

I agree with you and and at the same time disagree with you.

The XBIZ show brought in over 1000 people. As someone who attends pretty much every show out there, I can tell you that the XBIZ show brought out the Owners/Webmasters that have NOT been attending shows lately.

It is not about winning friends but more about the sign of changing times as mentioned above. The majority of the people at this show were there to do SERIOUS business.

Connor · 07-16-2008, 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KRosh

Connor,

I agree with you and and at the same time disagree with you.

The XBIZ show brought in over 1000 people. As someone who attends pretty much every show out there, I can tell you that the XBIZ show brought out the Owners/Webmasters that have NOT been attending shows lately.

It is not about winning friends but more about the sign of changing times as mentioned above. The majority of the people at this show were there to do SERIOUS business.

I can't comment on that, I wasn't there. I've heard though it was 400-600 people max from a bunch of different people. But in terms of the owners, the serious people, etc., are you saying they wouldn't attend if they had to pay? I bet they would. So in that regard, I doubt the freeness of the badges were the reason for that.

For example, who stopped attending TPF because they started to charge? Anyone here?

Iro · 07-16-2008, 11:47 AM

parked ... again

KRosh · 07-16-2008, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Connor

I can't comment on that, I wasn't there. I've heard though it was 400-600 people max from a bunch of different people. But in terms of the owners, the serious people, etc., are you saying they wouldn't attend if they had to pay? I bet they would. So in that regard, I doubt the freeness of the badges were the reason for that.

For example, who stopped attending TPF because they started to charge? Anyone here?

I am not saying that the owners would not attend. Sorry if that is the way my post came across - i was saying that this was a good marketing move that worked very well for xbiz

Cory W · 07-16-2008, 11:50 AM

It makes sense in Vegas. It doesn't make sense at The Diplomat.

seeric · 07-16-2008, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAmericanCannibal

I think in a good direction for both parties- it's time to get creative like Sweet T and Ron C did with their Forum shows...

Diversify or die

The Atlanta Forum will most certainly confirm the "Forums" place in the trade show hierarchies.

No doubt about it.

HELMY · 07-16-2008, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Connor

I'm talking in general, since I've never been to your show and can't comment on it specifically.

I respect your opinion Connor.

But as you said, you haven't attended our shows yet (I hope you do eventually) - and I'm sure you'd agree that general rules don't always apply to this industry.

AaliyahLove · 07-16-2008, 11:54 AM

I heart GFY drama

munki · 07-16-2008, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kmanrox

http://www.alexa.com/data/details/tr...00&y=r&z=3&z=3

at least be a lil fair...

http://www.alexa.com/data/details/tr...00&y=r&z=3&z=3

Due · 07-16-2008, 11:56 AM

When people is anyway paying $1500-$2000 per person for the hotel, I doubt $100-$200 for registration would make a difference, to be honest I don't even take registration fees into consideration when deciding if I would go to a show or not.
A worthy promotion could be including free registration to people staying at the show hotel

I skipped xbiz myself since it is in the month of july and probably a lot of people would head on vacation just after and I got 2 shows to go to in august.

JFK · 07-16-2008, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A1R3K

The Atlanta Forum will most certainly confirm the "Forums" place in the trade show hierarchies.

No doubt about it.

Looking Forward to that one! Innovation is the key to bring out the people, who would otherwise stay at home

hypedough · 07-16-2008, 11:59 AM

I've been in the video side of the business since '03 and I can tell you AVN (magazines) think what they do controls the business. If you're not advertising with AVN, you're nothing in their minds. There are plenty of companies that don't use AVN and are hugely successful (Anabolic, Diabolic, etc.). I guess this holier than thou thing goes for staff too.

Of course it'd be silly for AVN to give badges for free, they'd be actually doing something positive for the business.

TheAmericanCannibal · 07-16-2008, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JFK

Good post

You're more than just a pretty face

That's what that fuckin midget keeps sayin

JFK · 07-16-2008, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheAmericanCannibal

That's what that fuckin midget keeps sayin

into midgets now ??

Sebastian Sands · 07-16-2008, 12:06 PM

It was a great show. moving it to May will be a good move as well. Internext I have a love/hate relationship with but it has nothing to do with the fee, although sometimes a bt high for what you get.

Anthony · 07-16-2008, 12:09 PM

Helmy,

XBIZ Vegas 2008 was a success.

Thank you!

07-16-2008, 11:08 AM	#1
HELMY Confirmed User Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 494	AVNChris says it was silly of XBIZ to give away free registration, what do YOU think? I'd like to hear what others thought about XBIZ's free registration promotion, because what YOU think matters to XBIZ. Chris, You go out of your way to come and shake my hand at every show, then turn right around and talk smack about XBIZ to my staff and others in the biz. That's really weird man. Alec __________________ XBIZ™ \| The Industry Source

07-16-2008, 11:09 AM	#2
jact Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Oakville, Canada Posts: 9,134	I wasn't able to make it to the show, but I suspect that the waived registration fees brought out a lot of faces who haven't come out for years. With so many shows, and so many expenses to cover it's a nice change not to get slapped with hundreds of dollars for a badge that does you no good anyway. __________________ Free agent

07-16-2008, 11:10 AM	#3
TMM_John Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 6,658	See Sig! __________________ Skype: JohnA1078 Too Much Media - Makers of the Industry's Leading Payite Management Platform, NATS!

07-16-2008, 11:12 AM	#4
Sly Let's do some business! Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 31,291	I don't really see that it's anybody's business but your own... it's your show. If you want to give out free registration, by all means, go for it. If some people do not like the atmosphere that free registration may fester, they have 20 other shows they can go to... :-) __________________ Vacares - Web Hosting, Domains, O365, Security & More - Paxum and BTC Accepted Windows VPS now available. Wanted: CCBill pay sites for sale

07-16-2008, 11:12 AM	#6
TMM_John Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 6,658	On a serious note. Free passes are great, but qualify them somehow. __________________ Skype: JohnA1078 Too Much Media - Makers of the Industry's Leading Payite Management Platform, NATS!

07-16-2008, 11:12 AM	#7
JFK FUBAR the ORIGINATOR Industry Role: Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: FUBARLAND Posts: 67,382	I think it opened up the show to a lot of new attendees. To qualify them as potential clients, would up to the webmasters who want to do business with them. __________________ FUBAR Webmasters - The FUBAR Times - FUBAR Webmasters Mobile - FUBARTV.XXX For promo opps contact jfk at fubarwebmasters dot com

07-16-2008, 11:14 AM	#8
KRosh So Fucking Outlawed Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 5,114	I thought it was great..and a total success. I personally did a lot of business at the show! There was only Two incidents isolated to ONE party at the XBIZ show so you can't say that the free registration brings in the riff raff. __________________ ICQ 115433750

07-16-2008, 11:15 AM	#9
munki Do Fun Shit. Industry Role: Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OC Posts: 13,393	Free or no... I had a blast at XBiz, and got a ton of biz done as well... could never ask for more from a show. __________________ “I have the simplest tastes. I am always satisfied with the best.” -Oscar Wilde

07-16-2008, 11:15 AM	#10
kmanrox aka K-Man Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: The Gutter Posts: 29,282	avn should mind their own business... how long have they been in the biz? and why is xbiz kicking their asses? lol __________________ Crypto HODLr Crypto mining Angel investor

07-16-2008, 11:17 AM	#11
Xrated J Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Daytona Beach Posts: 4,347	parked...

07-16-2008, 11:17 AM	#12
C H R I S Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Marina Del Rey Posts: 10,845	I did not say XBIZ giving away free badges was silly. I replied to a thread Mitch posted suggesting we give away free badges and said that it would be silly - I did not say that it was silly for you to do it. I get along great with everyone on your team and I do not talk smack - I had a great time at your show. Where is this coming from Alec. __________________ C H R I S Retired Porn Veteran BH4L

07-16-2008, 11:18 AM	#13
D-Money Too lazy to set a custom title Industry Role: Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Player Del Ray Posts: 9,716	Sig placement... __________________ Still Ballin'

07-16-2008, 11:20 AM	#15
kmanrox aka K-Man Industry Role: Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: The Gutter Posts: 29,282	http://www.alexa.com/data/details/tr...00&y=r&z=3&z=3 __________________ Crypto HODLr Crypto mining Angel investor

07-16-2008, 11:21 AM	#16
media Confirmed Moneymaker Industry Role: Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Eugene, OR It's Like Jail, Only with Trees! Posts: 9,851	I thought it was a good show.. With attendance dropping at alot of the shows I think the free registration is a good incentive to get more people there that normally would not show up.. I miss the good ole days of the two story booths and thousands and thousands of attendees.. those were the crazy days.. __________________ I'm here for the violence!

07-16-2008, 11:27 AM	#23
LAJ Gingerific Industry Role: Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Austin Posts: 5,568	Interesting drama thread. Since I run a show it's hard for me to be objective on this one. Sig spot. And it'll be interesting to see who is on the posse bandwagon in either camp. __________________ YNOT.com - The original industry resource email jay at ynot dot com or skype LAJConsulting

07-16-2008, 11:30 AM	#25
Voodoo ♥ ♦ ♣ ♠ Industry Role: Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Porn Valley, CA Posts: 10,590	When is AVN going to start giving away free passes? __________________ "I'm selflessly supporting the common good, but only coincidentally looking out for No.1." Last edited by Voodoo; 07-16-2008 at 11:32 AM..

07-16-2008, 11:33 AM	#31
Odie Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: The WATER BABY! Posts: 7,040	with over-saturation of shows, I think that the organizers must do whatever works for them to increase attendance. AVN is a staple and XBiz is up and coming. There's still tons to be done in adult where shows are concerned. __________________ Odie [email protected] Are you Mobile???? MMACanada ICQ # 166208354 See Who I Am At AdultWhosWho.com!

07-16-2008, 11:47 AM	#37
Iro Registered User Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 42	parked ... again

07-16-2008, 11:50 AM	#39
Cory W Deeply shallow Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Hollywood, Ca. Posts: 9,133	It makes sense in Vegas. It doesn't make sense at The Diplomat. __________________ ICQ: 292310358 Offering writing and content services (mainstream). Marketing for L3 Payments

07-16-2008, 11:54 AM	#42
AaliyahLove Confirmed User Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: AaliyahLove.com Posts: 2,722	I heart GFY drama

07-16-2008, 11:56 AM	#44
Due Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Murrieta, CA Posts: 3,620	When people is anyway paying $1500-$2000 per person for the hotel, I doubt $100-$200 for registration would make a difference, to be honest I don't even take registration fees into consideration when deciding if I would go to a show or not. A worthy promotion could be including free registration to people staying at the show hotel I skipped xbiz myself since it is in the month of july and probably a lot of people would head on vacation just after and I got 2 shows to go to in august. __________________ I buy plugs Skype: Due_Global /Due

07-16-2008, 11:59 AM	#46
hypedough Confirmed User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Now running NATS4: HypeDough.com! Posts: 3,743	I've been in the video side of the business since '03 and I can tell you AVN (magazines) think what they do controls the business. If you're not advertising with AVN, you're nothing in their minds. There are plenty of companies that don't use AVN and are hugely successful (Anabolic, Diabolic, etc.). I guess this holier than thou thing goes for staff too. Of course it'd be silly for AVN to give badges for free, they'd be actually doing something positive for the business. __________________ Ricky D :: Hype Dough President \| XBIZ.net \| ICQ 172-939-826 AIM+Skype HypeDough \| [NATS4] Kayden420: ['09 '10 '11 XBIZ Nominee \| Exclusive & HD] \| ThePornScout: [Exclusive + Reality \| Amateurs Want to Become Pornstars]

07-16-2008, 12:06 PM	#49
Sebastian Sands Confirmed User Industry Role: Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: ICQ: 211-417-740 Posts: 5,223	It was a great show. moving it to May will be a good move as well. Internext I have a love/hate relationship with but it has nothing to do with the fee, although sometimes a bt high for what you get.

07-16-2008, 12:09 PM	#50
Anthony Keyboard Warrior Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: One of the outer rings of Hell Posts: 9,653	Helmy, XBIZ Vegas 2008 was a success. Thank you! __________________